The Price of Necessity

[Sachita]

I started thinking one day about the waste and money I spend on convenience or "necessity". It wasn't just about the money but the impact I make having this "convenience" and what if I had to live without. So I thought it would be an interesting thread to talk about impact money and should you suddenly find yourself unable to buy the "simple things"

Let's start with toilet paper. Of course this article was several years ago and like anything else wiping your ass has even gone up due to inflation.

http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/SavingandDebt/SaveMoney/TheEconomicsOfToiletPaper.aspx

lets share some cost and statistics.

[Sachita]

btw wiping your ass in 2007 cost you 140.00. Of course this is for a family BUT I know I probably use this much alone.

[Blade]

I'll tell ya what got me. I noticed a few weeks ago "Green" toilet paper. So I was thinking, who the hell well never mind what I thought. Guess it is recycled other types of paper.

How about water and sewer? I don't have to pay for either and can't imagine paying for either, though I know probably the majority of people pay for them and think nothing about it. Wonder how much it cost the average family of 4 to take a bath wash dishes and clothes and use the toilet a month?

[Waldo]

btw wiping your ass in 2007 cost you 140.00. Of course this is for a family BUT I know I probably use this much alone.

I just had to run to buy some last night and was pondering the notion of where I fall on the usage continuum. Clearly I'm at the low end.

[Medusa]

I just had to run to buy some last night and was pondering the notion of where I fall on the usage continuum. Clearly I'm at the low end.

When you towel off after a shower, do you consider it "wiping your ass" :P

[Waldo]

When you towel off after a shower, do you consider it "wiping your ass" :P

Nope.

But when I cash my paycheck and spread the bills around the house and scoot along on my bottom? you bet.

*shudder*

[Sachita]

Nope.

But when I cash my paycheck and spread the bills around the house and scoot along on my bottom? you bet.

*shudder*

lol I can see that

[apretty]

what about wiping yourself on all of those circulars that come in the mail?

after, you could wash, dry and reuse them!

[Rockinonahigh]

Many years ago I knew an old lady that was very tight with money,she always got the daily news paper and would cut it into strips and use it for tp.She grew a guarden every year that would feed an rmy then caned it all,when we use to get paper bags at the grosey store she saved then and used them for insulation over window to keep out the cold and foil to reflect the hot weather.When she passed at 98 she had so much $$$ in the bank and in sandwich bags that her estamated worth was over a million bucks.

[Sachita]

no doubt we gotta eat but what are we really spending money on? We're spending money of shit that makes us sick cost us more money to purchase medical care and it cost us the quality of our life.

I mean come on do we really need disposable storage containers and it's a billion dollar industry. Most of the time we re-use them and eventually throw out. Doesnt it make more sense to buy glass storage containers and keep using them forever? PLUS glass isn't leeching harmful chemicals. Or at least buy plastic's you can use a while.

[Glenn]

Well..er.. I was enjoying my coffee and donut this mornin...

[asphaltcowboi]

i was reading this and it made me wonder???
so what about the rubber butch necessities? do you get a new one with every g/f? or do you use a condom and recycle?
if you get a new one with a new g/f what happens to the old one? do they use it to pave the hiways like they do old tires? :blink:

[AtLast]

i was reading this and it made me wonder???
so what about the rubber butch necessities? do you get a new one with every g/f? or do you use a condom and recycle?
if you get a new one with a new g/f what happens to the old one? do they use it to pave the hiways like they do old tires? :blink:

LOL... you have a damn point!

Personally, I recycle unless that is not kewl with a lover. Then, again, I am way past the age of multi-gfs! And frankly, dildoes are not the main event and certainly not a necessity for me. simply An accessory that is always one to be negotiated and just not required.

[Sachita]

omg! lol

I insist on my own but I'm with Susan.. I don't change lovers that often and it's not a major priority. when it becomes one then we decide together.

but really is a dildo a necessity? What say you?

[betenoire]

i was reading this and it made me wonder???
so what about the rubber butch necessities? do you get a new one with every g/f? or do you use a condom and recycle?
if you get a new one with a new g/f what happens to the old one? do they use it to pave the hiways like they do old tires? :blink:

I hope to god you don't buy ones made of rubber. Do you know how porous and cootie-hold-on-to rubber is?

[Diva]

HA!
I have my own.....I know where they've been.

And I'm SO not wiping with strips of newspaper.....I just must draw the line SOMEwhere....

I'm looking into getting a small wind turbine to generate electricity....I love the idea of having so much electricity, the electric company would pay ME for a change!

[Rockinonahigh]

I agree with ALH about dildos not being a nesary unless its something agreed apon by the one ur with.I have found over they years that wasnt as big a deal as I was led to belive when I first came out years ago..I just go by the adage that the lady gets what the lady wants and when.As for recycleing ..no I dont.

Diva.. as for the wind turbine,its a great idea,my son wanted to put solar panels ond the house but the expense is huge..but the wind turbine will work out fine.Besides its nice to get money back from the electric company after paying the bill for years.

[AtLast]

omg! lol

I insist on my own but I'm with Susan.. I don't change lovers that often and it's not a major priority. when it becomes one then we decide together.

but really is a dildo a necessity? What say you?

I'll say it again... no it is not. I know this is a personal thang for each of us.... which is kewl. What can get me miffed is having the dildo as every butches necessity stereotype. We are (as well as femmes) different about this stuff.

LOL... yup, thinking choosing one's own is part of positive self-care! Plus, shopping together can be a very erotic and sensual part of the dance between us. And one that can reveal a lot of important information that any lover would like to know about someone they are sharing intimacy with.

OK... yes, I am a monogamous, pretty much vanilla, non-stone, FIB... and am aware of the fact that everyone is different about this stuff. Enjoy whatever you find enjoyable! Bar none!

[Miss Scarlett]

Nope.

But when I cash my paycheck and spread the bills around the house and scoot along on my bottom? you bet.

*shudder*

Trying soooooooooooooo hard to not get a mental image...LOL

[Sachita]

I hope to god you don't buy ones made of rubber. Do you know how porous and cootie-hold-on-to rubber is?


lol- cootie grabbers

[Sachita]

HA!
I have my own.....I know where they've been.

And I'm SO not wiping with strips of newspaper.....I just must draw the line SOMEwhere....

I'm looking into getting a small wind turbine to generate electricity....I love the idea of having so much electricity, the electric company would pay ME for a change!





maybe where you are there's good wind. Here there isnt but a combination of things and having them pay you for a change is good.

So that leads us to a real necessity "ELECTRICITY"

Its one of those things that truly is luxury that we turned into a necessity. So much so that many power bills equal a mortgage payment for others. Is the cost of being cool or warm when it's cold worth a few hundred a month?

[CherylNYC]

omg! lol

I insist on my own but I'm with Susan.. I don't change lovers that often and it's not a major priority. when it becomes one then we decide together.

but really is a dildo a necessity? What say you?


It's necessary for me, and that's why I have my own. It fits just right, too. If someone were to have a problem using mine we could go shopping together.

Derail:
I'm non-monogamous, and a big advocate of safer sex for lesbians. I always use a condom. That way it's fresh every time. Gloves, too. There are many women in our community who have Hepatitis C. Please don't scrimp on safety in the pursuit of minimising waste.

[AtLast]

It's necessary for me, and that's why I have my own. It fits just right, too. If someone were to have a problem using mine we could go shopping together.

Derail:
I'm non-monogamous, and a big advocate of safer sex for lesbians. I always use a condom. That way it's fresh every time. Gloves, too. There are many women in our community who have Hepatitis C. Please don't scrimp on safety in the pursuit of minimising waste.

I am SO glad to see you post about Hep C!!! The stats most certainly back you up! Derail here, not a problem to me at all!

And I agree absolutely that safer-sex techniques ought to be and remain on our necessity lists! Sometimes, I am baffled at the neglect in our community concerning our responsibilities with sexual activity. And this has no bearing whatsoever on being poly, monogamous, stone, liking BSDM.. not one thing! Hep C is alive and well in terms of its threat. New data was recently published that we really need to pay attention to.

Also, you are actually bringing something I tyried to gety across in another post---- each of us have our sexual necessities and I really a woman/femme that I am or might want to be sexual with to make her desires, likes, dislikes known. I may not find dildoes/strapping, et. al. necessary (for myself), but a lover might. Just because I don't does not mean I don't enjoy a lover's joy with getting what she wants and likes.


Gloves are grand.... and hey, can be a great part of sensuality... and hotness! They come in long, short... different colors with patterns that rawk, flavors, and it is always good to have some non-latex gloves, dental and damns around! Some people are alergic to latex. Once, I did see a woman that had reactions to silicone... and there are dildoes made of other products available.


LOL.. be prepared!

[christie]

omg! lol

I insist on my own but I'm with Susan.. I don't change lovers that often and it's not a major priority. when it becomes one then we decide together.

but really is a dildo a necessity? What say you?

Just a thought -

To me, its a dildo. To Jess, its a cock. Specifically, Hys cock.

To me, not a necessity. To Jess, yep, it is.

Does that make any sense? We identify the same object very differently which makes it an accessory (as AHL mentioned) to me yet its a necessity for Jess.

I think that also brings about necessity vs. luxury as being very subjective. What I might deem a luxury might be quite necessary for someone else.

I do like the idea of the thread - I think it will be interesting to see the different perspectives.

Here's one for you - Swiffer. To me, a necessity. To someone else, it might seem a luxury and a waste. I have pointed out to someone specifically that if they would like to bring that dust rag and furniture polish over and have at it, I certainly wouldn't stop them! :dance2::dance2:

[AtLast]

maybe where you are there's good wind. Here there isnt but a combination of things and having them pay you for a change is good.

So that leads us to a real necessity "ELECTRICITY"

Its one of those things that truly is luxury that we turned into a necessity. So much so that many power bills equal a mortgage payment for others. Is the cost of being cool or warm when it's cold worth a few hundred a month?

I agree in part with this. I have been able to cut my electric and gas bills by about 50-60 percent with CFI's, less use, timed thermostat, insulation, new windows, more energy efficient appliances, etc. I like candle and oil lamp light anyway. Have a very small house anyway and my PG & E runs maybe $40/month on the average. LOL, but I recently rented out a studio I have on my property in which the tenet has to use the bathroom/shower and kitchen in the main house. Sooooo... we will see!

I compost, chip (make gardening mulch) and recycle. Big savings and I like doing these kinds of things. Besides, stirring and flipping compost builds muscles! And kick butt in my garden- getting a lot of great veggies this year! Of course, the drought ended in CA... Last couple of years having a garden was not the thing to do.

One thing to remember is that some people do have to use electricity for medical appliances. Here, in CA, PG & E will give an electricity break for this. can be things like oxtgen machines, C-PAPs, special vaporizers and humidifiers, etc. Home health-care for Hospice patients have certain power needs. Not a luxury for some folks or in some situations. The elderly as well as litle babies have some very real needs with heating and cooling, too.

Overall, I really wish we all did more to use less power and oil based products like gasoline. It does make a difference! And there are a lot of things I find I really don't need that use power.

[Rockinonahigh]

after a fue months out of the closet I met a femme who said all butches had to have sex toys,so I went to Dejavu (strip club/sex toy store) spent a ton of bucks on some very expensive toys and safe sex materals.Yes,ive ued them but I have always been possitive that whom ever I was with at the time understoood that I used safe sex.What has amazed me is at the women who think im nuts....really...some have been down right put out about it.All I can say is sorry ladies this is how it is.

[Rockinonahigh]

P.S...Some of he most mind blowing sex ive had was without the additions...no doubt about it.

[asphaltcowboi]

I hope to god you don't buy ones made of rubber. Do you know how porous and cootie-hold-on-to rubber is?
yes im sure of this... i dont know what they are made of.. i was just wondering what do they do with um are they a recycle item? or is there a huge pile of them at the dump like the plastic bottels.. lol no cooties here.. and no its not nessecary to use them all the time.
it would be weird to think i was driving on them

[Selenay]

yes im sure of this... i dont know what they are made of.. i was just wondering what do they do with um are they a recycle item? or is there a huge pile of them at the dump like the plastic bottels.. lol no cooties here.. and no its not nessecary to use them all the time.
it would be weird to think i was driving on them


Please please please investigate what they are made of...
Some sex toy materials are REALLY unsafe.

For example...
Pure silicone, glass, metal, acrylic, ceramic, wood and plastic are way at the top of the safety index.

After that is nonprous TPR, elastomer and silicone comosites.

Down at the bottom is thermoplastic rubber, rubber and jelly.

With anything below plastic really NEEDING condoms for every single use.

You can check out a materials guide >here (http://www.edenfantasys.com/sex-guides-and-tips/guides/materials/)<

[SuperFemme]

I'll say it again... no it is not. I know this is a personal thang for each of us.... which is kewl. What can get me miffed is having the dildo as every butches necessity stereotype. We are (as well as femmes) different about this stuff.

LOL... yup, thinking choosing one's own is part of positive self-care! Plus, shopping together can be a very erotic and sensual part of the dance between us. And one that can reveal a lot of important information that any lover would like to know about someone they are sharing intimacy with.

OK... yes, I am a monogamous, pretty much vanilla, non-stone, FIB... and am aware of the fact that everyone is different about this stuff. Enjoy whatever you find enjoyable! Bar none!

What irks me about the whole strap-on/dildo thing is that it is equated with masculinity and maleness. As if a woman cannot enjoy it as a woman.

It also irks me that it is a shocker for a Femme to use.

With that said, I am not sure that I'd call it a necessity. I'm creative, and could sustain quite the healthy sexual relationship w/o one, but I do *likey*.

So I suppose that makes it a luxury since it's not in the do or die category.

On the other hand, my beloved is a lot like Jess in regards to the necessity portion.

How's that for an explanation?

I also feel like computers and cell phones are a luxury. I am a mean mean mommy who laughs when her children ask for cell phones. My rule is that nobody on earth under 16 needs a cell phone. Too much b/s happens with them and children to the point that I feel 16 to be the youngest (and a mature 16 at that) a kid should have a phone. It can be a good financial lesson for a teen as well as convenient because you can GPS where the child is.

We've had to pay attention to necessities due to high dollars spent on medication for me.

So: no "convenient" food. that means no stick it in the microwave for 3 minutes and have dinner. instant gratification in the kitchen is costly. i like to plan meals anymore and have the family work together to cook the meal plans. it saves us over $100 a week and gives us good family time.

No fancy cable channels. You'd be amazed at how much more time the kids spend with us when there are not so many choices. We end up playing board games.

Vacations. Not a necessity. Staycations have become fun, which can include camping in the backyard, slumber parties, and free things close to home,. I can't even tell you how much we save.

Newspapers and magazines: luxury (use the library)

Super fancy hair dresser: luxury. same for mani-pedi., it's fun to do at home with the girls and just go to a salon once every three months.

Extra Hot Double Mocha Upside Down Skinny Caramel Macchiato: Luxury.
I quit Starbucks and saves over $25 a week.

Using appliances any old time: Luxury. We wait it out for non-peak hours.

Movies: luxury to go to theater. we wait for dvd's to come out rather than spend $13 per person. With the exception of that damned Twilight because my kid got the grades necessary to make me utilize an exception.

i am rambling now. blah blah blah i could go on for hours. and hours.

[Waldo]

What irks me about the whole strap-on/dildo thing is that it is equated with masculinity and maleness. As if a woman cannot enjoy it as a woman.


Two things. First this.

I hear this trotted out now and again and I have to wonder who is equating it with masculinity and maleness? I ask because I just ran through my mental dating data bank and well over half of the femmes I've dated have had their own dildo(s) and probably about half had their own harness.

Second. Really? Even for folks who very intimately associate with their cock, dick, etc... it's a necessity? Cause, last time I checked a cock wasn't even a necessity for a bio-male: See Eunuch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eunuch).

A necessity is that which without, would significantly hamper our ability to make it through our lives, our day to day, as it were. A cock doesn't really seem to fall into this. You may say "but I can't have sex with out..." to which I will say that people the world over take vows of chastity and/or live a celibate life. Sex, despite what we all might like to think, is not a necessity to live. (But ugh, can you imagine a life without it?)

Now, feeling that a cock or anything else is significant to your life and enhances or supplements it in a way that means you put a priority on it... that's still a want, but it's something that you prioritize because you feel it's significant to the way in which you live.

For me those WANTS which I prioritize include a computer and Internet access. I might even go as far as to say they are a necessity considering that this is how I make my living. However, I could make a living in another way which did not include these items. Of course my standard of living would change dramatically but that's another thread.

Finally (oops, guess it wasn't just two things after all, was it?) - years ago I dated a woman who'd lived for a time in Africa doing peace corp work. At the time I had a real shoe thing. I bought shoes ALL THE TIME. I probably had going on 40 pair or so. She had three pair. A pair of sneakers, a pair of Chaco sandals and a pair of boots. It really bothered her that I had so many shoes. She asked why and I said "well, you need shoes". To which she answered... "Do you?. There are countless people the world over who not only don't have shoes and they get along just fine. And the shoes that we consider a necessity are really just luxury. We need something to protect our feet, sure - but could we not just strap some rubber to our feet and call it good?"

Needless to say, that gave me much to think about. I live an extremely comfortable life. I want for very little. But the best part about that is that it's not because I have every toy under the sun, it's because I do not desire every toy under the sun.

[betenoire]

Cellphones are a huge luxury, I haven't had one in about 3 years and I haven't died. And, really, they are fairly new. Those people who absolutely "need" a cellphone - what do they think people did before motorola started kicking out those giant brick-shaped things? Seriously.

Bottled water is an unnecessary luxury. I shouldn't even have to make a case for that, it should be obvious.

And I know people hate when I get harping on about this....but. If you live in an area that has public transit and are physically able to make it to and from the bus stop - cars are a luxury. There, I said it. A huge percentage of car owners do not need them. Not owning a car EASILY saves me between 200-500 a month (between gas, car payments, insurance, parking). All the walking I do adds a zillion years to my life, and I've got really athletic legs. I win.

[Waldo]

Cellphones are a huge luxury, I haven't had one in about 3 years and I haven't died. And, really, they are fairly new. Those people who absolutely "need" a cellphone - what do they think people did before motorola started kicking out those giant brick-shaped things? Seriously.

Bottled water is an unnecessary luxury. I shouldn't even have to make a case for that, it should be obvious.

And I know people hate when I get harping on about this....but. If you live in an area that has public transit and are physically able to make it to and from the bus stop - cars are a luxury. There, I said it. A huge percentage of car owners do not need them. Not owning a car EASILY saves me between 200-500 a month (between gas, car payments, insurance, parking). All the walking I do adds a zillion years to my life, and I've got really athletic legs. I win.

For me? It's the other way around. I haven't had a land line in so many years I can't remember them. Now, I have an iPhone and that is a luxury. I *could* get by with a standard phone. But my life lives in that phone. Thankfully my work no longer does. For now.

And WORD! about cars. I have my six year old Honda in the drive and have been thinking seriously about getting rid of it. I put more miles on it getting to and from the airport than I do the rest of the month. I live in an extremely walkable neighborhood and I ride my bike. But I've decided not to sell it because I'd hate to find myself in need of one and having to buy an unknown entity. I bought this one new and it's paid off. I know everything about it and (knock on wood) it's a perfectly good car.

[CherylNYC]

I agree with much that has been said here, but I do take exception to the idea that sex is not a necessity. People do take vows of celibacy, but keeping those vows often proves difficult or impossible. Unexpressed sexuality can lead to really sick, twisted psyches. Pedophilic Catholic priests, for example.

Even though I live in the city I have a beautiful garden, I compost religously, and I recycle everything I can. I try my best to keep from wasting at home. I don't buy anything new if I think I can get it used. I don't replace electronics until they're well past their useful life span. Even though I loathe the quality of light they give, I've been switching over to CFL's.

I'm extra conscientious about all this because I am an environmental criminal at work. I make sculptural scenery for theatre, film and television. I'm most likely to make that scenery out of styrofoam. Big giant blocks of styrofoam, 2'w x 9'l x 6" thick. There is no other product that can replace it, and this is what I get paid to do. I can create a dumpster full of non-biodegradable waste before lunch. If I wanted to make a ton of money I would invent an environmentally sustainable, yet economical product to replace styrofoam. Sigh.

[betenoire]

Finally (oops, guess it wasn't just two things after all, was it?) - years ago I dated a woman who'd lived for a time in Africa doing peace corp work. At the time I had a real shoe thing. I bought shoes ALL THE TIME. I probably had going on 40 pair or so. She had three pair. A pair of sneakers, a pair of Chaco sandals and a pair of boots. It really bothered her that I had so many shoes. She asked why and I said "well, you need shoes". To which she answered... "Do you?. There are countless people the world over who not only don't have shoes and they get along just fine. And the shoes that we consider a necessity are really just luxury. We need something to protect our feet, sure - but could we not just strap some rubber to our feet and call it good?"

I so get this.

Now that I'm an adult (up until age 25 I bought stuff all the time - but there's a whole thread's worth of discussion concerning what that was all about) I very rarely buy new clothes for myself - to the point where I had to get frog-marched to Old Navy to pick up jeans for myself a few months ago (both of my pairs of jeans had worn thin at the thigh and I was talking about patching them). I can count on two hands the new articles of clothing I have purchased in the last 12 months. (A pair of black capris, a pair of jeans, a new sundress, 2 shirts, a winter coat, a new pair of sneakers for work, a pair of converse chuck taylors) And, really, most of that stuff was purchased with gift cards that I got for Christmas or my Birthday. (the chucks, the sundress, and the winter coat I bought for myself - that's it.)

I just don't see new clothes as a necessity all the time. I really don't. I own exactly 7 pairs of shoes. Two pairs of flipflops, a pair of Mary Janes, my giant scary black platforms, my work sneakers, my red faux snakeskin heels, a pair of charcoal grey chucks. That's it. And sometimes I even feel like THAT is excessive.

When you're still growing you need clothes all the time, I get that. But as an adult? Most (not all, I get that there are exceptions to that) people have bodies that don't make drastic changes from the time they are 25 onward. I have clothes that fit me 10 years ago that still fit me now - and since I take care of them they are still in good condition. Since I don't shop "trendy" and have very specific "rockabilly" tastes in clothing - I don't have to worry about how silly I'll look 4 years from now wearing some god-awful shirt that people thought was cool in 2010.

I do admit, however, that I own like 30 pairs of underware. It's a sickness.

[Waldo]

I agree with much that has been said here, but I do take exception to the idea that sex is not a necessity. People do take vows of celibacy, but keeping those vows often proves difficult or impossible. Unexpressed sexuality can lead to really sick, twisted psyches. Pedophilic Catholic priests, for example.

Even though I live in the city I have a beautiful garden, I compost religously, and I recycle everything I can. I try my best to keep from wasting at home. I don't buy anything new if I think I can get it used. I don't replace electronics until they're well past their useful life span. Even though I loathe the quality of light they give, I've been switching over to CFL's.

I'm extra conscientious about all this because I am an environmental criminal at work. I make sculptural scenery for theatre, film and television. I'm most likely to make that scenery out of styrofoam. Big giant blocks of styrofoam, 2'w x 9'l x 6" thick. There is no other product that can replace it, and this is what I get paid to do. I can create a dumpster full of non-biodegradable waste before lunch. If I wanted to make a ton of money I would invent an environmentally sustainable, yet economical product to replace styrofoam. Sigh.

Ouch. That is a hard thing to try to offset. Good for you for trying.

I'm not entirely comfortable with your assertions tying celibacy to pedophiles. I believe the overwhelming number of people who have taken such vows or who voluntarily live a life free of sex are good upstanding people. It's a shame that the relative few "bad apples" have made us question chastity in this manner.

[SuperFemme]

Two things. First this.

I hear this trotted out now and again and I have to wonder who is equating it with masculinity and maleness? I ask because I just ran through my mental dating data bank and well over half of the femmes I've dated have had their own dildo(s) and probably about half had their own harness.

Maybe we hang out in different crowds? Because I see it and I'm not crazy. Well...

Second. Really? Even for folks who very intimately associate with their cock, dick, etc... it's a necessity? Cause, last time I checked a cock wasn't even a necessity for a bio-male: See Eunuch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eunuch).

While I am aware of the Eunuchs (mostly in China and India) I kind of question your comparison of necessity. It's not like Eunuchs live a life of your every day bio-male.

A necessity is that which without, would significantly hamper our ability to make it through our lives, our day to day, as it were. A cock doesn't really seem to fall into this. You may say "but I can't have sex with out..." to which I will say that people the world over take vows of chastity and/or live a celibate life. Sex, despite what we all might like to think, is not a necessity to live. (But ugh, can you imagine a life without it?)

Respectfully, I might disagree with you here. I am not transgender, but from my understanding when one is born into the wrong body and something is missing? Replacing it very well my be a necessity. Not necessarily for sexual reasons, but I don't think we're going to tell an amputee to skip the artificial limb because it's not necessary, are we?

Now, feeling that a cock or anything else is significant to your life and enhances or supplements it in a way that means you put a priority on it... that's still a want, but it's something that you prioritize because you feel it's significant to the way in which you live.

See above.

For me those WANTS which I prioritize include a computer and Internet access. I might even go as far as to say they are a necessity considering that this is how I make my living. However, I could make a living in another way which did not include these items. Of course my standard of living would change dramatically but that's another thread.

What about cell phones?

Finally (oops, guess it wasn't just two things after all, was it?) - years ago I dated a woman who'd lived for a time in Africa doing peace corp work. At the time I had a real shoe thing. I bought shoes ALL THE TIME. I probably had going on 40 pair or so. She had three pair. A pair of sneakers, a pair of Chaco sandals and a pair of boots. It really bothered her that I had so many shoes. She asked why and I said "well, you need shoes". To which she answered... "Do you?. There are countless people the world over who not only don't have shoes and they get along just fine. And the shoes that we consider a necessity are really just luxury. We need something to protect our feet, sure - but could we not just strap some rubber to our feet and call it good?"

Needless to say, that gave me much to think about. I live an extremely comfortable life. I want for very little. But the best part about that is that it's not because I have every toy under the sun, it's because I do not desire every toy under the sun.

I admire your minimalism and strive to get there myself. One useless thing at a time (and sometime much more).

[Waldo]

I do admit, however, that I own like 30 pairs of underware. It's a sickness.

See this makes perfect sense to me. Again, it's all in what is valuable to me. I used to loathe doing laundry because I had to go to the laundry to do it. So I got in the habit of keeping 20+ pair. Same with socks. To me my time is more valuable. It made more sense to me to save up X number of pair and do them all at once than having to go do laundry just because I needed knickers.

[betenoire]

And WORD! about cars. I have my six year old Honda in the drive and have been thinking seriously about getting rid of it. I put more miles on it getting to and from the airport than I do the rest of the month. I live in an extremely walkable neighborhood and I ride my bike. But I've decided not to sell it because I'd hate to find myself in need of one and having to buy an unknown entity. I bought this one new and it's paid off. I know everything about it and (knock on wood) it's a perfectly good car.

Not having a car is a pretty big lifestyle choice. When I first got rid of the car (forever ago!) I was living a 2 hour bus commute from work - not such a great idea. But since then I've gotten smarter and have intentionally chosen apartments that are within reasonable distance of work, a grocery store, on the bus route, etc.

Even in the town where I now live (which is a far cry from Toronto, I tell you) where the bus stops running at 11 Monday-Friday and 6 on Saturdays and Sundays I'm doing more than fine. The money I save each month by not owning a vehicle can certainly afford me the luxury of taking a taxi once or twice a month if I'm going to be out real late and in an area of town that I can't walk home from.

[Mister Bent]

Two things. First this.

I hear this trotted out now and again and I have to wonder who is equating it with masculinity and maleness? I ask because I just ran through my mental dating data bank and well over half of the femmes I've dated have had their own dildo(s) and probably about half had their own harness.

Second. Really? Even for folks who very intimately associate with their cock, dick, etc... it's a necessity? Cause, last time I checked a cock wasn't even a necessity for a bio-male: See Eunuch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eunuch).

A necessity is that which without, would significantly hamper our ability to make it through our lives, our day to day, as it were. A cock doesn't really seem to fall into this. You may say "but I can't have sex with out..." to which I will say that people the world over take vows of chastity and/or live a celibate life. Sex, despite what we all might like to think, is not a necessity to live. (But ugh, can you imagine a life without it?)

Now, feeling that a cock or anything else is significant to your life and enhances or supplements it in a way that means you put a priority on it... that's still a want, but it's something that you prioritize because you feel it's significant to the way in which you live.

For me those WANTS which I prioritize include a computer and Internet access. I might even go as far as to say they are a necessity considering that this is how I make my living. However, I could make a living in another way which did not include these items. Of course my standard of living would change dramatically but that's another thread.

Finally (oops, guess it wasn't just two things after all, was it?) - years ago I dated a woman who'd lived for a time in Africa doing peace corp work. At the time I had a real shoe thing. I bought shoes ALL THE TIME. I probably had going on 40 pair or so. She had three pair. A pair of sneakers, a pair of Chaco sandals and a pair of boots. It really bothered her that I had so many shoes. She asked why and I said "well, you need shoes". To which she answered... "Do you?. There are countless people the world over who not only don't have shoes and they get along just fine. And the shoes that we consider a necessity are really just luxury. We need something to protect our feet, sure - but could we not just strap some rubber to our feet and call it good?"

Needless to say, that gave me much to think about. I live an extremely comfortable life. I want for very little. But the best part about that is that it's not because I have every toy under the sun, it's because I do not desire every toy under the sun.


I agree with you wholeheartedly that it's a tired stereotype and all around assumption to associated cock solely with male/masculinity.

I also agree with the way you've determined necessity vs. want.

But I disagree that anyone can tell me my cock isn't a necessity, as if it were only something purchased at a store, as if it were only some appendage who's sole purpose is sex. My cock isn't store bought, but it's existence is fundamental to mine. One might just as well as if breasts are a necessity (to other than nursing mothers).

I'm tired, and not entirely certain this is coming across as I wish it, but there it is. Nor did I mean to turn this into a conversation about dick, but I really wanted to address that little nugget.

[betenoire]

See this makes perfect sense to me. Again, it's all in what is valuable to me. I used to loathe doing laundry because I had to go to the laundry to do it. So I got in the habit of keeping 20+ pair. Same with socks. To me my time is more valuable. It made more sense to me to save up X number of pair and do them all at once than having to go do laundry just because I needed knickers.

Haha! That's how I ended up with so many pairs of underware! The building I live in only has one washer and drier, and you're not allowed to do laundry after 10pm - so it's like a big battle to get the machines. PLUS a few of the units have families with young children living in them - and apparently children create a lot of laundry. There are some people in the building who do laundry Every Fucking Day.

After a couple of times of having to handwash and blowdry my knickers just so I could go to work (because someone else was hogging the machines) I lost my mind and bought a tonne of underware.

[Waldo]

Not having a car is a pretty big lifestyle choice. When I first got rid of the car (forever ago!) I was living a 2 hour bus commute from work - not such a great idea. But since then I've gotten smarter and have intentionally chosen apartments that are within reasonable distance of work, a grocery store, on the bus route, etc.


There's been a lot of discussion lately, and I've done a bit of research myself as well, on the "demise of suburbia". Much talk about how the tide is finally turning now that people are losing their homes they are realizing that it wasn't their home that was the problem. It was their transportation costs.

I don't remember what show it was but the other day I watched a special about retrofitting shopping malls and other big box stores in suburban areas and they were talking to a few people who work in Manhattan but chose to buy a home in eastern Pennsylvanian because it was "more affordable". What they hadn't considered was the fact that they would turn around and spend *more* on transportation than they were spending on their mortgage. And their quality of life with all that driving? In the toilet.

I feel strongly, and hope fervently that I'm right, that the big trend in the next twenty years is a new urbanism to go hand in hand with a better understanding of the importance of living and working in close proximity.

[Waldo]

I agree with you wholeheartedly that it's a tired stereotype and all around assumption to associated cock solely with male/masculinity.

I also agree with the way you've determined necessity vs. want.

But I disagree that anyone can tell me my cock isn't a necessity, as if it were only something purchased at a store, as if it were only some appendage who's sole purpose is sex. My cock isn't store bought, but it's existence is fundamental to mine. One might just as well as if breasts are a necessity (to other than nursing mothers).

I'm tired, and not entirely certain this is coming across as I wish it, but there it is. Nor did I mean to turn this into a conversation about dick, but I really wanted to address that little nugget.

I hear you. I don't agree, but I hear you. I imagine there are more than a few people who feel the same.

My question to you is: if you couldn't have your cock would you cease being able to live? Water, food, shelter, oxygen... does it fall into that category for you?

I'm not trying to say it isn't important, please understand. I'm merely trying to clarify the hard line that I look at necessity with. I live with plenty of things that are not at all a necessity and there are a few of those I really wouldn't want to be without. But I could. That's all.

[betenoire]

There's been a lot of discussion lately, and I've done a bit of research myself as well, on the "demise of suburbia". Much talk about how the tide is finally turning now that people are losing their homes they are realizing that it wasn't their home that was the problem. It was their transportation costs.

I don't remember what show it was but the other day I watched a special about retrofitting shopping malls and other big box stores in suburban areas and they were talking to a few people who work in Manhattan but chose to buy a home in eastern Pennsylvanian because it was "more affordable". What they hadn't considered was the fact that they would turn around and spend *more* on transportation than they were spending on their mortgage. And their quality of life with all that driving? In the toilet.

I feel strongly, and hope fervently that I'm right, that the big trend in the next twenty years is a new urbanism to go hand in hand with a better understanding of the importance of living and working in close proximity.

I hope you are right.

I read a study years ago about how people who live in the suburbs are in general less "happy" than people who live in the city. They also die younger.

[Mister Bent]

I hear you. I don't agree, but I hear you. I imagine there are more than a few people who feel the same.

My question to you is: if you couldn't have your cock would you cease being able to live? Water, food, shelter, oxygen... does it fall into that category for you?

I'm not trying to say it isn't important, please understand. I'm merely trying to clarify the hard line that I look at necessity with. I live with plenty of things that are not at all a necessity and there are a few of those I really wouldn't want to be without. But I could. That's all.


I get where you're coming from, but also, from that perspective, most of this thread would be irrelevant. I believe it opened with toilet paper, am I right? I wouldn't die without that, either.

As I see it, it's a quality of life issue. After oxygen, water, food, shelter, not having shit on your hand is fairly high up there on some basic standard of quality of life. As would having one pair of good shoes, as opposed to say, 40, which is getting into the luxury standard for quality of life. The eunuch has made a choice to be cockless (or had it made for him), but still he lives. A man having his dick removed non-consensually might suffer a diminished quality of life, on a very basic level.

But then, "quality of life" is not the title of the thread.

[Waldo]

I get where you're coming from, but also, from that perspective, most of this thread would be irrelevant. I believe it opened with toilet paper, am I right? I wouldn't die without that, either.

As I see it, it's a quality of life issue. After oxygen, water, food, shelter, not having shit on your hand is fairly high up there on some basic standard of quality of life. As would having one pair of good shoes, as opposed to say, 40, which is getting into the luxury standard for quality of life. The eunuch has made a choice to be cockless (or had it made for him), but still he lives. A man having his dick removed non-consensually might suffer a diminished quality of life, on a very basic level.

But then, "quality of life" is not the title of the thread.

Agreed on all fronts.

Says the big fan of not having shit on her hands.

[betenoire]

I get where you're coming from, but also, from that perspective, most of this thread would be irrelevant. I believe it opened with toilet paper, am I right? I wouldn't die without that, either.

As I see it, it's a quality of life issue. After oxygen, water, food, shelter, not having shit on your hand is fairly high up there on some basic standard of quality of life.

But, you know. Not having shit on your hand -can- be a life or death situation. There are bacteria present in your bowels that can make you ill or even kill you if they end up in your stomach.

I'm not even being difficult. I am completely serious.

[CherylNYC]

There's been a lot of discussion lately, and I've done a bit of research myself as well, on the "demise of suburbia". Much talk about how the tide is finally turning now that people are losing their homes they are realizing that it wasn't their home that was the problem. It was their transportation costs.

I don't remember what show it was but the other day I watched a special about retrofitting shopping malls and other big box stores in suburban areas and they were talking to a few people who work in Manhattan but chose to buy a home in eastern Pennsylvanian because it was "more affordable". What they hadn't considered was the fact that they would turn around and spend *more* on transportation than they were spending on their mortgage. And their quality of life with all that driving? In the toilet.

I feel strongly, and hope fervently that I'm right, that the big trend in the next twenty years is a new urbanism to go hand in hand with a better understanding of the importance of living and working in close proximity.


I live in a part of NYC where public transportation is difficult and very time consuming. But two wheels and an engine make it so easy to bungee my tools on the back and ride to the far flung studios where I work. I ride my bicycle when it's feasible, but mostly I commute via motorcycle. My biggest, least fuel efficient bike gets 43 mpg. The rest of them get 50 mpg or better. If I wanted to get even better mileage I could go shopping today and come home with a scooter that gets 123 mpg! And then there's the world of electric scooters which cost less than a dollar a day in electricity to operate. What is more, up to seven two wheeled vehicles can park in a spot normally taken by one car. A car will take up the space occupied by up to four two wheeled vehicles in city traffic, and that doesn't include lanesplitting.

Cities in Europe are way ahead of us here in the U.S. when it comes to encouraging fuel efficient, congestion reducing two-wheeled motorized transportation. London has notably good policies. Sydney, Paris, and countless other European cities provide great facilities for us. Toronto, Vancouver and Austin Tx give free parking at Muni-Meters. San Francisco has a very well structured system. Unfortunately, we are subtly and overtly discouraged from riding motorcycle and scooters here in NYC.

Check out www.nymstf.org

[Waldo]

But, you know. Not having shit on your hand -can- be a life or death situation. There are bacteria present in your bowels that can make you ill or even kill you if they end up in your stomach.

I'm not even being difficult. I am completely serious.

Actually. And don't even go there with me... you know where the custom of shaking with our right hand stems from, yes?

Just sayin'.

[Mister Bent]

But, you know. Not having shit on your hand -can- be a life or death situation. There are bacteria present in your bowels that can make you ill or even kill you if they end up in your stomach.

I'm not even being difficult. I am completely serious.

I know you are, I paused over that one as I wrote it and decided to leave it. I considered that humans/humanoids didn't have toilet paper for a long ass time (I had to) and survived. Albeit some might have died from bacterial illness, but it could well be argued the planet was a healthier place with fewer humans, and the ultimate necessity is this planet, healthy.

[Waldo]

I live in a part of NYC where public transportation is difficult and very time consuming. But two wheels and an engine make it so easy to bungee my tools on the back and ride to the far flung studios where I work. I ride my bicycle when it's feasible, but mostly I commute via motorcycle. My biggest, least fuel efficient bike gets 43 mpg. The rest of them get 50 mpg or better. If I wanted to get even better mileage I could go shopping today and come home with a scooter that gets 123 mpg! And then there's the world of electric scooters which cost less than a dollar a day in electricity to operate. What is more, up to seven two wheeled vehicles can park in a spot normally taken by one car. A car will take up the space occupied by up to four two wheeled vehicles in city traffic, and that doesn't include lanesplitting.

Cities in Europe are way ahead of us here in the U.S. when it comes to encouraging fuel efficient, congestion reducing two-wheeled motorized transportation. London has notably good policies. Sydney, Paris, and countless other European cities provide great facilities for us. Toronto, Vancouver and Austin Tx give free parking at Muni-Meters. San Francisco has a very well structured system. Unfortunately, we are subtly and overtly discouraged from riding motorcycle and scooters here in NYC.

Check out www.nymstf.org

Denver is very two wheel friendly as well. Even though there have been some high profile accidents of late we're home to the BCycle program. It's doing quite well. I see people on them all the time and it makes me smile each time.

In many places in Albuquerque the parking spots for scooters and motorcycles are closest to the entry.

I have it too easy though. Working from my home means I don't have to worry about transportation at all until I have to go on the road. I, like you, try to do my part because I have such a big carbon foot print due to my travel. 3x or more a month on a plane. Often times long hauls.

[betenoire]

My biggest, least fuel efficient bike gets 43 mpg. The rest of them get 50 mpg or better. If I wanted to get even better mileage I could go shopping today and come home with a scooter that gets 123 mpg!

Nice! I was gonna mention scooters and motorcycles and forgot. :)

I'm actually planning to get a scooter (the Honda Jazz, specifically - because I like the way it looks and I trust Honda) eventually.

I can't have one where I live now, because it'll get stolen. No, really. It -will- get stolen. If I ever live in an apartment with an elevator so I can store the scooter inside (I live on the 3rd floor and I just can't see carrying it up 3 flights of stairs) it's SO on.

Actually. And don't even go there with me... you know where the custom of shaking with our right hand stems from, yes?

Just sayin'.

Yes. :(

I know you are, I paused over that one as I wrote it and decided to leave it. I considered that humans/humanoids didn't have toilet paper for a long ass time (I had to) and survived. Albeit some might have died from bacterial illness, but it could well be argued the planet was a healthier place with fewer humans, and the ultimate necessity is this planet, healthy.

NO we will all die! (I am obsessed with poop, just ask Nick. You don't want to know how many times a day I wash my hands. Make that "how many times an hour I wash my hands".)

[Sachita]

Finally (oops, guess it wasn't just two things after all, was it?) - years ago I dated a woman who'd lived for a time in Africa doing peace corp work. At the time I had a real shoe thing. I bought shoes ALL THE TIME. I probably had going on 40 pair or so. She had three pair. A pair of sneakers, a pair of Chaco sandals and a pair of boots. It really bothered her that I had so many shoes. She asked why and I said "well, you need shoes". To which she answered... "Do you?. There are countless people the world over who not only don't have shoes and they get along just fine. And the shoes that we consider a necessity are really just luxury. We need something to protect our feet, sure - but could we not just strap some rubber to our feet and call it good?"

Needless to say, that gave me much to think about. I live an extremely comfortable life. I want for very little. But the best part about that is that it's not because I have every toy under the sun, it's because I do not desire every toy under the sun.

One day I decide to finally go through lots and lots of boxes I've been storing and dragging around the country. I remodeled a 110 year old Victorian home I bought in the Adirondacks. Stuff got packed and stayed that way thru that project, my sanctuary hidden in the florida everglades and finally to my farm here in Va. These boxes revealed a long journey and how I evolved and changed over that 15 year span.

You think you have shoes??? lol- omg did I have shoes and not just any shoes. Shoes and boots I (or someone) paid way to much money for. Shoes I wore once or twice. Unpractical 6 inch stilettos, platforms, etc. I wouldnt dare attempt today. Clothes- 400.00 suits, 600.00 dresses, belts, accessories. I looked at all this "stuff" as I sat on the floor in my pull up walmart shorts and over sized men's V neck t-shirt. Even on a farm I rarely wear shoes and when I do its flip flops, crocs or cowboy boots. I couldnt believe how much I'd changed. There was a time when I wouldnt go out of the house without makeup and heels.

So many other things became a priority and lets face it, 500.00 today is a lot harder to come by then it was at the start of the internet boom. Although there are some things I miss I know the quality of my life has changed along with my priorities. Here's the interesting thing tho... if I could do it all over again I would be her. I regret it took so long to listen to my heart and follow my real dreams. I spent too much time being afraid to take that leap and although quite the challenge, it has been an incredible journey.

[Sachita]

I hope you are right.

I read a study years ago about how people who live in the suburbs are in general less "happy" than people who live in the city. They also die younger.

That study I'd have to read to believe that but maybe its the burbs and not rural living. I couldnt live in the suburbs or city anymore. City living is definitely a personal lifestyle choice as well as rural country living.

[Sachita]

Not having a car is a pretty big lifestyle choice. When I first got rid of the car (forever ago!) I was living a 2 hour bus commute from work - not such a great idea. But since then I've gotten smarter and have intentionally chosen apartments that are within reasonable distance of work, a grocery store, on the bus route, etc.

Even in the town where I now live (which is a far cry from Toronto, I tell you) where the bus stops running at 11 Monday-Friday and 6 on Saturdays and Sundays I'm doing more than fine. The money I save each month by not owning a vehicle can certainly afford me the luxury of taking a taxi once or twice a month if I'm going to be out real late and in an area of town that I can't walk home from.


I think if you live in the city or you can go without or share a car it's a very smart move. I personally know people that share a car but like Waldo and myself work at home so it's not a huge issue.

Could I go without my big ass 250 Cargo Van living out here on the farm? Maybe I could if I set myself up right. I'd have to rely on delivery for feed for animals. The vet makes house calls. I could grow quite a bit of produce. Yeah if I had to I could. But since my van is a write off for my farm I considered it a cost of overhead.

I've done a lot of things in my life and this whole rural downsizing luxury has been quite a challenge for me. My next step, if I can get up the courage is to start moving towards full sustainability or as close as one could get. I often think about the things I MUST have and what I could do without to slip fully into that transition. Internet and cell phone would be hardest for me. Toilet paper I could do without because I have. When I'm in the woods I try not to bring it. I fill a bottle of water wash and dry. In fact I might do that more here. Not because of the savings but to start using less paper and now that I think of it I'll be much cleaner!

[christie]

You think you have shoes??? lol- omg did I have shoes and not just any shoes. Shoes and boots I (or someone) paid way to much money for. Shoes I wore once or twice. Unpractical 6 inch stilettos, platforms, etc. I wouldnt dare attempt today. Clothes- 400.00 suits, 600.00 dresses, belts, accessories.

Have you been peeking in my closet???? :sunglass:

Seriously, I get what you are saying. I am certainly guilty of being excessive. I think a good deal of this comes from the struggles of being a 20something single mother where every penny had to be a "necessity" purchase - food, basic clothing, shelter and medical.

At this point in my career (and at my income level), we probably DO spend more on "stuff" than at any other time in our lives, combined. But, for me, its about making life easier. I refuse to do the mental self flagellation over things I want. I feel that I deserve it. I feel that Jess deserves it. We've both struggled and I don't think there is a reason for us to do with less now because we don't have to.

Could we live with less? Certainly. Are there times when we do? Yep.

The 25 yr+ dishwasher exploded all over the kitchen floor about a month ago. We had our handyfella haul it away. We haven't rushed to purchase another because when we do, I am likely to replace the existing range with a mondo matching mack-daddy gas range and new fridge. There is nothing wrong with the range or fridge other than we both prefer cooking with gas and we both think the mammoth older side-by-side is just too big and not practical for us.

Until we come to the "justification" part of the mental purchase process, we will continue to be well acquainted with the dishpan and dish drainer. Where's good ole Madge and her Palmolive???

[Sachita]

I think that also brings about necessity vs. luxury as being very subjective. What I might deem a luxury might be quite necessary for someone else.

I do like the idea of the thread - I think it will be interesting to see the different perspectives.

Here's one for you - Swiffer. To me, a necessity. To someone else, it might seem a luxury and a waste. I have pointed out to someone specifically that if they would like to bring that dust rag and furniture polish over and have at it, I certainly wouldn't stop them! :dance2::dance2:

lol- OMG I was addicted to swiffer floor thingy's. I went thru a ton of vacuum cleaners with all this damn dogs. I bought this Eureka Pet Lover vacuum and have been preaching about it like crazy. Theres a recent post on dancingcreekfarm.com This is turning into a NECESSITY for sure! I can hold it in my hand, put whatever nozzle I'm using and start sucking away. Trust me when I tell you that you'll replace Swiffer even for dusting. This thing rocks. Nothing I've ever used sucks up pet hair like this. C the girl that cleans my house, which you also know, loves it too and uses it everywhere.

[RockOn]

I am feeling somewhat guilty this morning ...

I bought $18.00 and some change worth of ice cream and yogurt for my dog and I yesterday afternoon at WalMart. I was so hot, irritable and sweaty by the time I made it to WalMart. Plus, I hate running out. It is a bitch to have to wade out into this liquid steam (humidity) and make a special ice cream run on a mid-week evening. Good thing I only bought one small container of the no fat kind - thought I would try it. Trust me, it is not workable. :(

[Sachita]

Have you been peeking in my closet???? :sunglass:

Seriously, I get what you are saying. I am certainly guilty of being excessive. I think a good deal of this comes from the struggles of being a 20something single mother where every penny had to be a "necessity" purchase - food, basic clothing, shelter and medical.

At this point in my career (and at my income level), we probably DO spend more on "stuff" than at any other time in our lives, combined. But, for me, its about making life easier. I refuse to do the mental self flagellation over things I want. I feel that I deserve it. I feel that Jess deserves it. We've both struggled and I don't think there is a reason for us to do with less now because we don't have to.

Could we live with less? Certainly. Are there times when we do? Yep.

The 25 yr+ dishwasher exploded all over the kitchen floor about a month ago. We had our handyfella haul it away. We haven't rushed to purchase another because when we do, I am likely to replace the existing range with a mondo matching mack-daddy gas range and new fridge. There is nothing wrong with the range or fridge other than we both prefer cooking with gas and we both think the mammoth older side-by-side is just too big and not practical for us.

Until we come to the "justification" part of the mental purchase process, we will continue to be well acquainted with the dishpan and dish drainer. Where's good ole Madge and her Palmolive???

I definitely now what you mean. Being raised poor and from the ghetto I thought I was a billionaire when I bought my first car. It was a hard ass climb and no one gave me nothing. I raised my son alone and when I start making big money I spoiled myself like crazy. Things are just different now for me. Don't think I didnt keep a "few" things. (wink) I kept a few push up lace bra's, matching panties, stockings and I don't wear bra and panties. (evil grin) Doesnt mean I won't put 'em on for the right person. I also kept a few shoes and bags. I do spoil myself and plan on getting away more. Is a day at the spa necessity? No but every now and then I think maybe. If it brings me joy and takes away stress its part of my health plan, however its highly unlikely you'll find me shopping again for $300.00 shoes.

[Rockinonahigh]

Shoes and clothes...I have one pair of tennis shoes,1 pair of dress shoes,2 pair of work shoes and one pair of lace up motorcycle boots over the years I have bought four suit coats and have many mix and match slacke/shirts/ties.Mostly I wear blue jeans so I have several pair from faded oldies to a coupla of new pair I havent worn.I gess the thing I have in abundance is chef uniforms from the basic one to fancy ones when I need them.Nearly everything I buy is qulity cause it will last a long time but I do watch for sales to save money.I drive a ten yro cadi wich is in great shape.Now I live not far from most places I go to,tho a fue places I have to go across town for.What I miss is the country liveing I had..quieter and way less stressfull,where I now live is a nice place and has lots of pluses at times I feel hemed in..when I bought this place it was cause I worked in town and driveing an hour both ways was really expensive with at the time gas at near 3.50 a galon with me at the time driveing a huge suv.The suv was nessary at the time but has gone to better parking lots in the scrap yard.
I have lived with way less and I mean way less than I have now.haveing a fue luxeries is a big plus to me that I doint squander by over use or being careles.One of the bigges lessons in life I learned was how little I could have to eek out exsitance...it was a hard one to learn.