Building a Culture of Empathy

[mariamma]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cioUGccMyHk&feature=youtu.be
I am on a spiritual journey and have been for many years. I'm a nurse by training and have a spirit guide whom I have known since I was 4. My journey has taken me from plant medicine, healing, astrology and tarot to care-giving, motherhood, nursing and the intersection of science and spirituality.
Everything we think/emote/do is because of hormones, neurotransmitters or other trace protein structures. One needs a certain hormonal balance to feel well-being, happiness, empathy, love, anger, psychosis, depression, the need to eat or pee, have sex, avolution (feeling a lack of desire to do anything) shame, pride, etc., etc., etc. This journey has brought me to learning about how people experience the energy of an emotion, hormones, perceptions, etc. (perceptions run mostly via serotonergic and dopaminergic neural network). It is all seen in animals as well since they can have the same hormones and neurotransmitters as humans.
Neuroendocrinology, neurobiology is an exciting and new area of research. It is terribly complex and convoluted. Most of the research is available online or in recent books.
This link is to a non-profit in California working towards raising consciousness about empathy and building a culture of empathy. Because this is an emotional process involving oxytocin and vasopressin in the brain and body (vasopressin and oxytocin are molecularly similar and often work together) it ends up being deeply spiritual and communal. I know others follow spiritual paths. I am curious how others experience emotions, perception, etc. etc. and how empathy works in our lives as women who have bore children or worked with children, or with animals, or with communities at large.
I do believe genders work with feelings differently because of how nature (genetic expression of hormones and neurotransmitters) and nurture (how our emotions guided us and were guided by our environment) works with in the human body, subgroups, and the global community.
Thank you in advance for whatever wisdom you have to share.

[mariamma]

http://psychcentral.com/news/2012/05/25/strong-emotions-put-people-in-sync/39238.html
Went to facebook and a friend linked this to her page. Oxytocin in action!

[mariamma]

Another article on empathy. The author explains well how I feel most of the time.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/sense-and-sensitivity/201205/when-empathy-hurts-how-love-while-looking-after-yourself

[Toughy]

Everything we think/emote/do is because of hormones, neurotransmitters or other trace protein structures.

I wish I knew why the above statement just irritates the bejesus out of me.

[mariamma]

I wish I knew why the above statement just irritates the bejesus out of me.
I do irritate people with my blanket statements. Here is some of the science behind what I say.
Your adrenals make about 50 hormones, some being stress hormones, water balance and mineral balance hormones, the gender inducing hormones, etc http://www.safemenopausesolutions.com/adrenal-insufficiency.html
If you feel like a woman, you will have more estrogen than testosterone and vice verse. If you feel like you are both male and female, you probably have high amounts of both hormones.
http://www.twinspirittribe.com/page/page/4580470.htm
If you are schizophrenic, you have too much dopamine. You can have temp. schizophrenia with meth use or a parasitic infection
http://blog.neura.edu.au/2012/08/07/schizophrenia-and-the-immune-system-an-inflammatory-topic/
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/090311085151.htm
If you are empathic, you are skilled at using oxytocin.
Mirror Neurons - YouTube
mirror neurons part 2 - YouTube
Serotonin engenders well-being and happiness.
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/serotonin.shtml
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14594742?dopt=Abstract
I can do a better job with explaining myself. I've just hear so much about this stuff on the radio that I assume everyone knows by now. There's a new study coming out every week on anxiety and GABA or ACTH, vasopressin and anxiety, etc., etc.
If you saw the previous links, they talk about oxytocin and empathy. Oxytocin also engenders bonding, trust, is a primary hormone involved with love, it is what you 'break' when you break a horse (as opposed to the more modern technique of gentle breaking). You break the horse's trust and get the horse to bond with the trainer (instead of dame or the herd). Dogs also have high oxytocin which is why dogs and horses are therapy animals. They help ADHD and autistic kids read and connect to others better.
I hope this answers anyone's questions. I know it's easier to believe I am a deluded crazy person. My lack of patience doesn't help. But there is a reason why I say and write about what I write about. I'm not pulling dreams out of thin air.

[Glenn]

Mariamma; I believe there are two roads we can go by to rewire and/or rebalance ourselves and our environment, and that is via meditation and medication. This faster paced industrial society creates much less empathy and utilizes more natural resources. We need to slow down. Deep meditation can slow down the breath and heart rate and help us to heal (along with medications)and consume less natural resources, and also raise the level of our spiritual energy. You know that the spiritual energy of one empath can raise the consciousness of many.

[mariamma]

Thank you for your observation Glenn. You are right. Meditation and medication CAN both work. I believe with meditation, one changes the hormonal balance without conscious intention. The intention is for clarity or peace of mind or returning to balance or homeostasis. The hormones and neurotransmitters (and the energy signatures they give off, these signatures are not measured by science but can be felt as Chi, Ki, prana or kundalini by spiritual practitioners) just end up getting balanced out and the person meditating feels a benefit.
Meditation generates more serotonin too. Serotonin is a light-generating molecule, has been on earth for 3 bil years and energetically brings spirit or the Light of God into a body. The word Namaste means "the light within me honors the light within you". I believe the word refers to the energy of serotonin.
I also believe theta brain wave state occurs (that meditative head space artists, musicians, dancers, etc. get into) and re-sets the brain and body hormonally. There is little science behind this YET people report 'feeling attuned' or a return to balance after being in theta brain wave state. In shamanism, this is the brain state you get into to connect with the Great Spirit/Source/God. People can independently learn how to heal in this state but it usually takes a teacher. Only serious bad-asses (Shaman) can figure it out without help. Maybe 1% of the population????
Oxytocin is amazing in that a person with high amounts will see a person with high amounts and energetically respond to that person. At first sight, they feel like "I've known you all my life". If one is going to bond with anyone, there will be oxytocin involved.
Medication CAN change the hormonal level in the body and brain. The person on the medication still has to figure things out and change one's mind-set. Medication does help to change the mind set but you still have to change the mind set. It can take months.
The non-profit I linked this thread to talking about rape and how it is representational of a culture and how it reveals a lack of empathy. Thing is, rape will often have more than 1 perpetrator at a time. There will be a connection between the groups of raping males. They will bond over rape, war, violence, etc. So building a culture of empathy is focused on what this all means.
The bonding that happens in life and with oxytocin, it happens mostly at birth. Oxytocin is what is released in order to deliver a baby. You will have the highest amount at birth (either being born or giving birth) then at orgasm, then with yoga, dance or hugs (it must be the muscle clenching. it's released when you stimulate nipples or clench uterus/prostate in orgasm).
I suspect raping males, warring or violent males have been broken (like one breaks a horse) and cannot bond appropriately. Mirror neurons in the brain makes one feel what another feels. You cannot SEE how you are hurting another if you are raping and enjoying raping. The mirror neurons are not working appropriately.
Off the topic of meditation and medication but salient nonetheless.

[Toughy]

I know the science of brain chemistry. Blanket statements in general irritate the bejesus out of me.

edited to add: my experience tells me that blanket statements about science will absolutely come back and bite you in the ass.

[mariamma]

a pdf on Practical empathy and sexual assault survivors. The author is dealing more with empathy in the acute phase but I like the 7 traits of empathy in action.
I see the kindness that they speak of as the action of estrogen. It also is integral maintaining a healthy and connected relationship.
http://www.cvcn.nl/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/Practical-empathy-SSA.pdf

[Toughy]

I see the kindness that they speak of as the action of estrogen.

I think you have it backwards. I have to want to have empathy in order for estrogen to be produced. If I don't want to have empathy ain't no empathy estrogen gonna be produced.

[Ginger]

I guess I subscribe to the nature/nurture way of looking at things.

I think people have the amount of empathy they have, because of genetic, chemical or other physical elements (including the stuff you're talking about), but also because of how they were socialized and treated when they were infants and children.

That said, how do we go about Building a Culture of Empathy, as your thread is titled? it sounds like a wonderful goal, but I wouldn't know how to get it started.

[aishah]

some tools i have found helpful for learning more about how to practice empathy:
i thought it was just me and the gifts of imperfection by brene brown (her ted videos are also good if you don't have time to read her books, but her books are downright amazing)
non-violent communication - i haven't read the full book by rosenberg but i've read a lot of the free material about it online, and it's definitely worth checking out.
dialectical behavior therapy - also a lot of free information online. emphasizes mindfulness, interpersonal, and emotional regulation skills and stresses nonjudgmental, empathic communication in much the same way as nvc.

[The_Lady_Snow]

I guess I subscribe to the nature/nurture way of looking at things.

I think people have the amount of empathy they have, because of genetic, chemical or other physical elements (including the stuff you're talking about), but also because of how they were socialized and treated when they were infants and children.

That said, how do we go about Building a Culture of Empathy, as your thread is titled? it sounds like a wonderful goal, but I wouldn't know how to get it started.



This ..

I believe that if how we raise our sons changed then we'd have a bit of a less violent world. Teaching our male children differently to what they are being taught now would hopefully eliminate the hate culture towatds woman.

How we treat our young when they are in our care could change the balance.

[princessbelle]

I so agree with that as well....empathy depends on a huge amount of things. Some chemical some not.

If you took two totally diff people and subjected them to something very sad, to one it may be extremely unjust and affect them way different than the next one. Is that all chemically induced? Depends on how far you want to dissect it.

If you have a world where everyone was treated with hormones, the "right amount" of a feel good medication, you would have a world full of stepford people. Yuk.

Our experience, our cultures, the way we were raised, how we live our lives now and heck even how we feel that day depends on the level of empathy we bestow on our worlds....


IMO Empathy is a feeling that is subjective AND objective and it evolves at different times and with different degrees which is one of the primary ways we are all unique. Personally, I like it that way.

[aishah]

i think of empathy as a skill, personally. i believe some people are born with more of a predisposition to it than others (because of neurochemistry, etc.) and also that it's encouraged or discouraged by the environments we grow up in, so maybe some people are naturally more talented with it. but imho it is also something that can be learned and practiced. to me it's more than just a warm fuzzy emotional connection. the warm fuzzy emotional connection may happen because of a neurochemical reaction, and it may help us be empathetic and compassionate, but the neurochemistry alone doesn't teach us the skills we need to relate to other human beings with empathy and compassion.

the issue of how people react to difficult situations is also an issue of resilience. some people are more resilient than others. that's why some people cope better with trauma and stress. resilience is partly chemical and partly due to upbringing, but it can also be learned to some degree. and some aspects of resilience, like having a good support system, do require conscious action.

[nycfem]

On a micro level, how do we build a culture of empathy here on BFP?

One thought I have is that it is important when we post that we think that any member could be reading the post and how will they feel after reading it if they are, for example,

400 pounds
Chinese
Muslim
homeless
elderly
a parent of a differently abled child

etc. etc.

In other words, I think it's important to have empathy for every single member of our site by not assuming that everyone is like us and showing sensitivity towards readers we don't know anything about every time we post. This goes for posting a joke, a rant, or making a statement to all (i.e. considering whether it really fits "all").

[mariamma]

I guess I subscribe to the nature/nurture way of looking at things.

I think people have the amount of empathy they have, because of genetic, chemical or other physical elements (including the stuff you're talking about), but also because of how they were socialized and treated when they were infants and children.

That said, how do we go about Building a Culture of Empathy, as your thread is titled? it sounds like a wonderful goal, but I wouldn't know how to get it started.

I believe you're perfectly right IslandScout. It does matter how you work with it. We are socialized to preform certain actions depending on the culture we were raised in. In Southern Africa, they have a spiritual concept of Ubuntu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_%28philosophy%29) where they encourage sharing and communal living (ideally). I provided a link but it basically means 'I have because we have, if you have needs, then I have needs since we are One.' How they deal with empathy there is different than how Americans deal with it.
If dialogue comes out of this thread, then that's good. Not sure everyone in the world likes the idea of empathy or sharing. It's too hippie and new-aged for some. Too up close and personal for others. I do believe women who are mothers handle it differently since having a baby is a hugely emotional experience. I started this thread to share the idea Building a Culture of Empathy and also because I wanted to see how others feel/sense empathy and how they use it in their lives.
You always have a wonderfully simple and concise way of cutting to the meat of the matter IslandScout and I appreciate reading your observations. You often make me look at things in a different way.

[mariamma]

some tools i have found helpful for learning more about how to practice empathy:
i thought it was just me and the gifts of imperfection by brene brown (her ted videos are also good if you don't have time to read her books, but her books are downright amazing)
non-violent communication - i haven't read the full book by rosenberg but i've read a lot of the free material about it online, and it's definitely worth checking out.
dialectical behavior therapy - also a lot of free information online. emphasizes mindfulness, interpersonal, and emotional regulation skills and stresses nonjudgmental, empathic communication in much the same way as nvc.

Thank you for sharing Aishah. I had not heard about dialectical behavior therapy. *curtseys and does happy dance*

[mariamma]

This ..

I believe that if how we raise our sons changed then we'd have a bit of a less violent world. Teaching our male children differently to what they are being taught now would hopefully eliminate the hate culture towatds woman.

How we treat our young when they are in our care could change the balance.

Yes, absolutely! Thanks for sharing.

[mariamma]

On a micro level, how do we build a culture of empathy here on BFP?

One thought I have is that it is important when we post that we think that any member could be reading the post and how will they feel after reading it if they are, for example,

400 pounds
Chinese
Muslim
homeless
elderly
a parent of a differently abled child

etc. etc.

In other words, I think it's important to have empathy for every single member of our site by not assuming that everyone is like us and showing sensitivity towards readers we don't know anything about every time we post. This goes for posting a joke, a rant, or making a statement to all (i.e. considering whether it really fits "all").

Good point. I know I have an issue with bringing ALL my brain info to most situations. As the practical empathy pdf link revealed, being totally present and not bringing baggage into a therapeutic relationship is number 1 on that list of 7 requirements. You cannot effectively practice empathy if judging, measuring, being overwhelmed to the point of sympathizing.
This is something I know I need to be more mindful of. Thanks for your observation NYCfembbw. Loved your photo on the now closed thread btw. Your happy smile was the best part. You looked content.

[Nomad]

I do irritate people with my blanket statements. Here is some of the science behind what I say.
Your adrenals make about 50 hormones, some being stress hormones, water balance and mineral balance hormones, the gender inducing hormones, etc http://www.safemenopausesolutions.com/adrenal-insufficiency.html
If you feel like a woman, you will have more estrogen than testosterone and vice verse. If you feel like you are both male and female, you probably have high amounts of both hormones.
http://www.twinspirittribe.com/page/page/4580470.htm
If you are schizophrenic, you have too much dopamine. You can have temp. schizophrenia with meth use or a parasitic infection
http://blog.neura.edu.au/2012/08/07/schizophrenia-and-the-immune-system-an-inflammatory-topic/
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/090311085151.htm
If you are empathic, you are skilled at using oxytocin.
Mirror Neurons - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8WV1zAh9zU)
mirror neurons part 2 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmEsGQ3JmKg)
Serotonin engenders well-being and happiness.
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/serotonin.shtml
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14594742?dopt=Abstract
I can do a better job with explaining myself. I've just hear so much about this stuff on the radio that I assume everyone knows by now. There's a new study coming out every week on anxiety and GABA or ACTH, vasopressin and anxiety, etc., etc.
If you saw the previous links, they talk about oxytocin and empathy. Oxytocin also engenders bonding, trust, is a primary hormone involved with love, it is what you 'break' when you break a horse (as opposed to the more modern technique of gentle breaking). You break the horse's trust and get the horse to bond with the trainer (instead of dame or the herd). Dogs also have high oxytocin which is why dogs and horses are therapy animals. They help ADHD and autistic kids read and connect to others better.
I hope this answers anyone's questions. I know it's easier to believe I am a deluded crazy person. My lack of patience doesn't help. But there is a reason why I say and write about what I write about. I'm not pulling dreams out of thin air.


i dont think you're a deluded crazy person or pulling dreams outta the air, thin or not. i just grind my teeth at the idea that chemistry rules our lives. i believe 100% in the power of neurotransmitters. i'm not an idiot. i just cant get behind the whole if you have too much or not enough of xyz hormone you'll do this or be that. i think it's exactly the opposite: our lives rule our chemistry.

neurotransmitters are part of the human recipe. existential memory (experience, culture, self-talk, etc) is the other part. mix the two and people are capable of almost anything to a lesser or greater degree. add in a support system, trial and error experimentation, determination, passion and paradigm shift and the end result is a person who encourages certain behaviors in their neurotransmitters not neurotransmitters that encourage certain behaviors in a person. people become accustomed to the circumstances they create in themselves.

we feed what we need.

[Licious]

Mariamma,

My hat is off to you *okay my hair clip* for such an amazing thread topic!

Subscribing.

[Nomad]

This ..

I believe that if how we raise our sons changed then we'd have a bit of a less violent world. Teaching our male children differently to what they are being taught now would hopefully eliminate the hate culture towatds woman.

How we treat our young when they are in our care could change the balance.


agreed. and how we raise our daughters will contribute to the same balance change. a person with healthy boundaries and an understanding of their personal responsibility and authority has no need to bend others or allow others to bend them unnecessarily. a few generations of children who refused to consent to institutionalized hatred would be a powerful force, and an irrefutably brilliant one.

[Toughy]

I think understanding and practicing non-violent communication would go a long way towards creating an atmosphere of empathy.

Several years back, a group of us studied non-violent communication by using a book and workbook. It was eye opening for me and really helped me understand why and how I was thinking and communicating those thoughts. It is really useful in interpersonal relationships of all kinds.

The book/workbook came from this site: https://www.cnvc.org/ It's the Center for Non Violent Communication.

I need a refresher for sure.........lol

If you want to change your brain chemistry then you have to create new neural pathways to replace the old ones. That can be done many ways, but I think communication is a part of doing that. A change of attitude will also help. You want to encourage your brain to create happy chemicals rather than unhappy chemicals. You can control what you think and how you express it...it takes practice and time. And we should never forget the importance of exercise.

laughin.......damn I wish I was better at it...........

[Licious]

The book/workbook came from this site: https://www.cnvc.org/ It's the Center for Non Violent Communication.

I need a refresher for sure.........lol

...


I appreciate all the links posted earlier regarding hormones and am checking them all out. Great information.

Communication and words are powerful tools as well for creating empathy.

I studied with Marshall Rosenberg when he started up in the 80s, and lived here in Santa Barbara. *Founder of CNVC system of communication*

The communication method was an eye-opener.

We don't always realize how our own words, how we form sentences, and how we speak to others affects our own perception. Well, let me speak for myself, I didn't always realize.

Speaking in an empathetic way, non-attacking way, is good for fostering empathy.

I am not sure how communication styles alter brain chemistry or hormones, but plan to look into that.

And I need a refresher course as well. Tools get rusty if not employed.

Thanks for the reminder, I appreciate it.

[mariamma]

Mariamma,

My hat is off to you *okay my hair clip* for such an amazing thread topic!

Subscribing.

*curtseys* Thank you my sister from another mister

[mariamma]

i dont think you're a deluded crazy person or pulling dreams outta the air, thin or not. i just grind my teeth at the idea that chemistry rules our lives. i believe 100% in the power of neurotransmitters. i'm not an idiot. i just cant get behind the whole if you have too much or not enough of xyz hormone you'll do this or be that. i think it's exactly the opposite: our lives rule our chemistry.

neurotransmitters are part of the human recipe. existential memory (experience, culture, self-talk, etc) is the other part. mix the two and people are capable of almost anything to a lesser or greater degree. add in a support system, trial and error experimentation, determination, passion and paradigm shift and the end result is a person who encourages certain behaviors in their neurotransmitters not neurotransmitters that encourage certain behaviors in a person. people become accustomed to the circumstances they create in themselves.

we feed what we need.

I hear what you're saying. You explain the difference between having an emotion and DEALING WITH an emotion or directing the energy. Let me ask, how much support do we get when we change the course of our lives? When we change the direction hormones and neurotransmitters? Men get very little support. It is possible and many people practice redirecting emotions. It's just not generally supported but accepted, especially when it lowers emotional energy or re-focuses it on others in a beneficial way.
When we have a stress response (or any other hormonal response) it usually lasts 90 seconds. But the 'feelings' will last....longer....2 hours, 2 days, however long we experience that emotion.
Vasopressin is a hormone involved with love. When you see someone you love and have that swooning feeling...that's vasopressin in action. That 'swoon' lasts 10 seconds, 30 seconds, however long but the love continues. It goes thru peaks and troughs. It continues on BECAUSE WE PUSH THE EMOTION THAT WAY. When love fails, it probably is because we did not continue the emotion or we had become unbalanced. Dopamine runs love in the brain. Taking an SSRI (serotonin) can make STAYING in love difficult.
I believe we are saying the same thing. If one looses control of self, it probably will involve dopamine. It doesn't mean if one has X amount of dopamine, one will lose control of self. It just makes it very difficult. Not everyone is strong of will.

[WickedFemme]

I'm a real believer in the theory that thoughts illicit emotions and have done a lot of work within around that particular theory. I guess I just don't want to be in more control of my life and therefore Rational Emotive Therapy (I believe it was Albert Ellis) seems to work for me. Although, I believe that some people are incapable of controlling their behaviors based upon their emotional reactions to certain events due to some underlying mental health issues (especially Asix II diagnosis), I believe that most of us can control our emotions and that they are within our control under normal circumstances. Whatever normal is.... I would say that traumatic events can lead us to behave in ways we wouldn't normally behave. However, for me to come from a purely emotional state is not the answer. I have learned that even under great duress with my training that I can respond to situations with a certain amount of rationality.

I have a ton of empathy for others - it's my job, it's what I do for a living. I teach people how to rationally think before reacting to situations. Of course, I'm no expert and I am human and I certainly do have my moments. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't believe in the theory that chemical releases within the brain chemistry are the cause of certain emotions. I do think that those emotions can be controlled as to not cause undue distress.

[WickedFemme]

and therefore, I believe that 'empathy' can be taught to people who are not psychopaths.

[Novelafemme]

I appreciate all the links posted earlier regarding hormones and am checking them all out. Great information.

Communication and words are powerful tools as well for creating empathy.

I studied with Marshall Rosenberg when he started up in the 80s, and lived here in Santa Barbara. *Founder of CNVC system of communication*

The communication method was an eye-opener.

We don't always realize how our own words, how we form sentences, and how we speak to others affects our own perception. Well, let me speak for myself, I didn't always realize.

Speaking in an empathetic way, non-attacking way, is good for fostering empathy.

I am not sure how communication styles alter brain chemistry or hormones, but plan to look into that.

And I need a refresher course as well. Tools get rusty if not employed.

Thanks for the reminder, I appreciate it.


Thank you for the above in particular, Licious!

[Novelafemme]

On a micro level, how do we build a culture of empathy here on BFP?

One thought I have is that it is important when we post that we think that any member could be reading the post and how will they feel after reading it if they are, for example,

400 pounds
Chinese
Muslim
homeless
elderly
a parent of a differently abled child

etc. etc.

In other words, I think it's important to have empathy for every single member of our site by not assuming that everyone is like us and showing sensitivity towards readers we don't know anything about every time we post. This goes for posting a joke, a rant, or making a statement to all (i.e. considering whether it really fits "all").

AMEN!!!!!!

[mariamma]

The first line (https://www.cnvc.org/about-us) in the mission statement invokes the principals of serotonergic search for well-being and connection to the Great Spirit/Source. A deeply spiritual practice based on Buddhist/Shamanic/Taoist traditions. Thank you for sharing my sis Licious.
Of course one cannot have empathy without well-being and happiness and a world that supports well-being and happiness. You can work empathy with grace and skill but if you live in South Sudan or Syria right now, it won't be your reality.

[aishah]

Of course one cannot have empathy without well-being and happiness and a world that supports well-being and happiness. You can work empathy with grace and skill but if you live in South Sudan or Syria right now, it won't be your reality.

i disagree. i grew up in a situation where most people did not have well-being and happiness (by american standards - well below the poverty line, very little access to resources and a lot of violence) and there was still empathy. people took care of each other, understood each other, and looked out for each other much better than they did when i lived in places where there was a higher rate of well-being and happiness. i certainly don't feel empathy as often in my relationships where i live now, where most people have much more money and time. it's been my experience, and i've read some things, about how communities tend to come together and support each other more through poverty and conflict. i can't dig up any specific articles right now b/c i'm on my way to the doctor, but i'll try to post some later. i think victor frankl may have written about this a bit in man's search for meaning.

[*Anya*]

I read somewhere that for children to learn empathy, parents need to model it but also to teach it.

Encouraging your children to put themselves in another's shoes, to imagine how they would feel if something happened to them in the same way.

Conversely, I grew up in an emotionally and physically abusive home but always could put myself in the shoes of another and have no idea how that happened. My parents never taught it or modeled it.

Perhaps some are born more sensitive and empathetic.

Another variation on the nature vs. nurture conundrum?

[Nomad]

i disagree. i grew up in a situation where most people did not have well-being and happiness (by american standards - well below the poverty line, very little access to resources and a lot of violence) and there was still empathy. people took care of each other, understood each other, and looked out for each other much better than they did when i lived in places where there was a higher rate of well-being and happiness. i certainly don't feel empathy as often in my relationships where i live now, where most people have much more money and time. it's been my experience, and i've read some things, about how communities tend to come together and support each other more through poverty and conflict. i can't dig up any specific articles right now b/c i'm on my way to the doctor, but i'll try to post some later. i think victor frankl may have written about this a bit in man's search for meaning.



:yeahthat:

[nycfem]

Did you have anyone with whom you had meaningful contact while young (a teacher, a neighbor, a relative, a sitter, etc.) that may have fostered empathy in you? I have read that can be a saving grace for kids in homes where empathy is not there to be learned. My own mom was abused and dissociative/fractured, while my dad was abusive. I did have a sitter who made a huge difference to me. Now she is my mom's best friend (After my dad left my mom, unfortunately this was when I had already grown up, my mom became so much more stabilized.).

I read somewhere that for children to learn empathy, parents need to model it but also to teach it.

Encouraging your children to put themselves in another's shoes, to imagine how they would feel if something happened to them in the same way.

Conversely, I grew up in an emotionally and physically abusive home but always could put myself in the shoes of another and have no idea how that happened. My parents never taught it or modeled it.

Perhaps some are born more sensitive and empathetic.

Another variation on the nature vs. nurture conundrum?

[NorCalStud]

The idea that if we were to all express the emotions we feel at the time we feel them or as soon as we can at least acknowledge them...That we are ready and clear to feel empathy and create empathetic environments. We are born cooperative. We get hurt. We are not always supported to deal with pain. We walk through life with this pain. I think as we clear our own trauma; we become available.

[*Anya*]

Did you have anyone with whom you had meaningful contact while young (a teacher, a neighbor, a relative, a sitter, etc.) that may have fostered empathy in you? I have read that can be a saving grace for kids in homes where empathy is not there to be learned. My own mom was abused and dissociative/fractured, while my dad was abusive. I did have a sitter who made a huge difference to me. Now she is my mom's best friend (After my dad left my mom, unfortunately this was when I had already grown up, my mom became so much more stabilized.).

I believe it had to have been my maternal grandmother. Until I was 10 I did spend a lot of time with her on the weekends. She was loving and caring to me.

My mon would have been different had my grandmother raised her but she was thrown out of her orthodox Jewish family for getting pregnant with my mom out-of-wedlock as they called it and her father was a rabbi. She boarded my mom with a very strict, abusive family and my mom was the scapegoat of the other foster kids.

So yes, I guess I learned empathy from my grandmother.

Thanks Nannie. She died at age 95. I still miss her.

[Metro]

The idea that if we were to all express the emotions we feel at the time we feel them or as soon as we can at least acknowledge them...That we are ready and clear to feel empathy and create empathetic environments. We are born cooperative. We get hurt. We are not always supported to deal with pain. We walk through life with this pain. I think as we clear our own trauma; we become available.

NCS -- This is an interesting concept, and may I go out on a limb and guess that you pose it as an ideal?

It is my own experience that each individual processes feelings in their own unique way. For some there is a need or inclination to talk through emotions with another person as a way to come to their own understanding. Others have a need to process emotions in their own head first before expressing or speaking about their emotions (and a spectrum of communication styles in between).

As you say, people get hurt. For some this may influence their communication style and ability to process and communicate their feelings in the moment.

Well, that's my experience anyway.

[mariamma]

i disagree. i grew up in a situation where most people did not have well-being and happiness (by american standards - well below the poverty line, very little access to resources and a lot of violence) and there was still empathy. people took care of each other, understood each other, and looked out for each other much better than they did when i lived in places where there was a higher rate of well-being and happiness. i certainly don't feel empathy as often in my relationships where i live now, where most people have much more money and time. it's been my experience, and i've read some things, about how communities tend to come together and support each other more through poverty and conflict. i can't dig up any specific articles right now b/c i'm on my way to the doctor, but i'll try to post some later. i think victor frankl may have written about this a bit in man's search for meaning.

Thank you for sharing your experience Aishah. I think there are differences between I mean by well-being and happiness and what you are referring to.

YOU ARE RIGHT in that people in poverty share more than people who have abundant wealth. People in poverty share more percentage-wise than their 'richer' fellow American. People who SEE poverty, who live around poverty (for example in a gentrified area) share more than people in insulated communities but less (percentage-wise) than people who live in poverty.

This is probably the evolutionary benefit of empathy and oxytocin. By sharing what we have, we all enjoy together or suffer together. Another evolutionary benefit of empathy and oxytocin is sharing ideas, team building and a probably synergistic effect of 'better outcomes thru working together than working alone'.

When I refer to "well-being" and "Happiness" I am referring to the action of serotonin and something more akin to...a Buddhist's sense of well-being. In the moment, not wanting (dopamine = I want/crave) being at peace and at One.

I did state things in a way that it could seem that I believed there is no empathy in South Sudan or Syria. There is ALWAYS a significant minority that does the opposite of what the general population does. Left-handed people, LGBTIQ people are a few readily seen. There were Catholics who hid and supported Jews in Nazi Germany. There are always those who see 'what is right' and will act accordingly. They are the exception and not the rule.

And it's also my experience that people will act 1 way in public (like they are happy and at peace) yet it's an act. I am empathic and can feel the untruth of their feeling. It's disturbing and is why I actively do energy work. I'm tired of seeing and feeling people who act one way and emote another and the schizophrenic sensation it induces in said person. And then they wonder why they are unhappy or have no love in their lives. I tend to get many who 'confess' to me. They often will say things like "I practice random acts of kindness but I don't feel any happier". When I say "Acting happy and being happy are 2 different things" they often don't get it.

But this is the America we live in now. Truth is ignored because it's too inconvenient and honesty is seen as 'saving face'.

[mariamma]

Did you have anyone with whom you had meaningful contact while young (a teacher, a neighbor, a relative, a sitter, etc.) that may have fostered empathy in you? I have read that can be a saving grace for kids in homes where empathy is not there to be learned. My own mom was abused and dissociative/fractured, while my dad was abusive. I did have a sitter who made a huge difference to me. Now she is my mom's best friend (After my dad left my mom, unfortunately this was when I had already grown up, my mom became so much more stabilized.).

Children are resilient. There's an old longitudinal study and book, Children of the Island State? that discusses this. The resilient kids had a mentor, a teacher, one person who showed compassion and strove to understand the kid where s/he was. In the study, they were the ones who overcame their abusive histories and excelled in life.

There are always exceptions to the rule, always a minority that will do the opposite.

[mariamma]

The idea that if we were to all express the emotions we feel at the time we feel them or as soon as we can at least acknowledge them...That we are ready and clear to feel empathy and create empathetic environments. We are born cooperative. We get hurt. We are not always supported to deal with pain. We walk through life with this pain. I think as we clear our own trauma; we become available.

I'm not understanding what you mean. Can you please clarify?
As Nomad inferred, we CAN express an emotion but just because we have a feeling, we don't have to act upon it. It's much harder with emotions that are born of dopamine (ask a schizophrenic or addict) but it's possible.

[aishah]

i think my discomfort is with the idea that one can make blanket statements about empathy in a society.

i have friends who are from syria and have relatives there. thinking of what they've told me, and talking with people who've lived there (or in other areas with a lot of conflict and poverty such as palestine), i am not sure i could see them saying the same thing about empathy being the exception rather than the rule. i don't want to speak for them, but i do want to challenge the idea that one can make blanket statements about people doing what is good/right/moral or practicing empathy in a society.

if your definition of happiness and well-being has to do with serotonin and being "at peace" or in the buddhist sense, having equanimity, i don't understand how the prevalence of that in the united states is any different than in syria or south sudan.

[mariamma]

NCS -- This is an interesting concept, and may I go out on a limb and guess that you pose it as an ideal?

It is my own experience that each individual processes feelings in their own unique way. For some there is a need or inclination to talk through emotions with another person as a way to come to their own understanding. Others have a need to process emotions in their own head first before expressing or speaking about their emotions (and a spectrum of communication styles in between).

As you say, people get hurt. For some this may influence their communication style and ability to process and communicate their feelings in the moment.

Well, that's my experience anyway.

Thanks for sharing Metro. I like what you said about processing emotions. It's my experience as well but I believe you wrote it better than I could have.

[Prudence]

I think it comes down to left brain, right brain thinking. And I'm sure I will be sorry I made that statement.

[NorCalStud]

Yes interesting words from you. It is idealistic. I am an idealist and am currently correcting how I live my ideals....for instance....living without judging myself and others.

We DO process our feelings differently. Here are three ideal ways we can clear our pain efficiently and with love :
I call it hang out therapy...any place or person where and with whom you feel safe and feel is a safe place to express emotion you know you have buried. That someone agrees to pay complete attention with loving regard for your anger, laughter, tears whatever....They hear you and decide not to get into their own stuff at that time. Being heard lovingly goes a long way ...
I believe if we make every lil thing we do a ceremony that that is another way to live life and that in that contradiction of oh say, capitalism and patriarchy for instance ,we resist the pain and in that resistance we survive from that "way" and in surviving we Create and in creating ...we Heal.

Another way is about a certain type of hypnotherapy I took as a class at Heartwood College...dealing with inner child work etc where it uses transformative and agreed upon guidance to....take this pain and turn it to gold...Alchemical Hypnotherapy.

Ultimately I am way way anti One wayism. I believe in the concept of Widening the Circle...never leaving anyone and their ideals outside...unleaa they are evil. I stand open and ready to receive knowledge and love and I am humbled with what I have learned.

[aishah]

I think it comes down to left brain, right brain thinking.

this is really interesting. i've always understood left brain/right brain thinking to be about reason or logic versus emotion or artistic mind.

i have a hard time with that because i don't really think of it as a dichotomy. i'm empathic and artistic but there are also many parts of me that are very type-a, logically-minded.

in dialectical behavior therapy, it's taught that empathy comes from wise mind (which is a balance of reason + emotion + intuition).

i would love to know more about how you see it because i had not really thought of it specifically in terms of left brain/right brain before.

[mariamma]

The hang out therapy....it's mostly what I do with shades of people who are trying to pass over. It is a most powerful healing. It's why many 'confess' to me and many others in the world. To be heard and understood. Many do not get it in life.

It does take empathic communication. A deep listening with all the senses and not really replying. The worst thing one can do in moments like that is derail the story with questions at the wrong place. Listening with love is probably the most important aspect.

Thanks for sharing your experience NCS

Yes interesting words from you. It is idealistic. I am an idealist and am currently correcting how I live my ideals....for instance....living without judging myself and others.

We DO process our feelings differently. Here are three ideal ways we can clear our pain efficiently and with love :
I call it hang out therapy...any place or person where and with whom you feel safe and feel is a safe place to express emotion you know you have buried. That someone agrees to pay complete attention with loving regard for your anger, laughter, tears whatever....They hear you and decide not to get into their own stuff at that time. Being heard lovingly goes a long way ...
I believe if we make every lil thing we do a ceremony that that is another way to live life and that in that contradiction of oh say, capitalism and patriarchy for instance ,we resist the pain and in that resistance we survive from that "way" and in surviving we Create and in creating ...we Heal.

Another way is about a certain type of hypnotherapy I took as a class at Heartwood College...dealing with inner child work etc where it uses transformative and agreed upon guidance to....take this pain and turn it to gold...Alchemical Hypnotherapy.

Ultimately I am way way anti One wayism. I believe in the concept of Widening the Circle...never leaving anyone and their ideals outside...unleaa they are evil. I stand open and ready to receive knowledge and love and I am humbled with what I have learned.

[mariamma]

Stanley Coren & Edwin Rutsch: How to Build a Culture of Empathy with Dogs - YouTube
The catalyst for this thread is this foundation Building a Culture of Empathy. Dogs are beings with high amounts of oxytocin and often sense things many humans ignore. I am a bitch at heart and love the beautiful connection one can have with dogs.

[mariamma]

Another article discussing the effects of listening.
http://www.sciencewa.net.au/topics/health-a-medicine/item/1657-empathetic-gps-may-reduce-depression-self-harm-in-older-patients

[mariamma]

A quote from a nice article (http://bigthink.com/going-mental/neuroeconomics-in-oxytocin-we-trust) that discusses oxytocin in a society or nation.

One issue that began Zak’s work in this new field was research in the late 1990s that found an unexplored connection between trust and national prosperity. Data showed that high trust exists in countries that are, by and large, rich or fast growing. Countries in which trust is high have effective governments, says Zak: "They have very tight social structures, people interact very nicely with each other, they don’t have a lot of divisions." A 2007 study by the Pew Research Center found 45% of Americans said they trust each other—a large percentage compared to many other countries, which hover in the single percentage points.

Linking the data to the discovery of how oxytocin-led trust cycles can harness or hurt economic transactions toward prosperity, Zak shows how trust becomes the "great summary measure of a society in which things are working well." However, as he notes, lack of trust is also a measure of to what degree things are broken.

[Sachita]

I guess I subscribe to the nature/nurture way of looking at things.

I think people have the amount of empathy they have, because of genetic, chemical or other physical elements (including the stuff you're talking about), but also because of how they were socialized and treated when they were infants and children.

.

I guess that blows reincarnation and past lives out of the water. lol

You know for so many years I've read, explored and studied why things are they way they are. I have honestly tried to make sense, especially when it comes to humans; how some humans can be so fucking cruel and others to pure to believe. I have a hard time statistics and so-called scientific data. I dislike and avoid the medical field as much as possible. I will never buy the whole brain chemical concept. I will never believe that any of us are patterned to the same or that there are genetic switches that dictate who we are.

I do believe that humans LOVE labels and that they often get caught up in demanding an answer for every little thing. I think science sees us coming and pharmaceutical companies draw humans into their market.

Empathy, compassion, love, desire, all the things that make us human is open for interpretation because the funny thing is that none of us expresses it the same way or maybe it is the same yet how we measure it. Does that make sense?

I spent hours crying over a dog that isn't mine because she's old and has to be put to sleep. I don't think I'm programmed any different I'm just a human who's experience "right now" connects with animals. I woke up at 4am and masturbated to fantasies some may consider "taboo" and they were completely against consensus standards. Maybe I have some wires crossed? hahahaha well hell yeah I probably do!

The whole science thing is unsettling to me because there are always exceptions to the rule. Often more then the so called facts will say.

Today I just give it to the universe, try and be present and allow whatever emotions I'm having to flow through me. I just don't question it any more and for me its just all part of my human experience.

[NorCalStud]

I listened to the dog youtube Mariama. It was very interesting. Dogs are a big part of how I roll in life. There is alot to be said about that.

I am simple. I dont believe caucasian america and caucasion science has the universal answer to creating a more empathetic world. That is oh so scary when that kind of thinking is present. It is a priveledge just to have the time to talk in sometimes an intangible language. So when it balls up...when language and emotion mess up; there is love, admiration, and respect to remember.

The first empathy to give....no matter what ...my opinion...smiling. We dont know each other's language???? Even here on this site...we can go toward...lack of trust...or we can stand and face each other from different tribes and different dialects and SMILE...smiling is reassuring to people who lack trust. If that is all we can communicate then it could and has been lifesaving. Example: pretty damn sure Lewis and Clark smiled alot.

I want to take this time to say how much I appreciate the thinking that goes into our language here. It is fascinating to me...all that we express. Such really great people I have the great fortune to know at this time. I do believe in reincarnation and there is no accident we are here now discussing...

[Glenn]

Mariamma; Hormones do powerfully affect our behavior. If we were to strip out all the hormones we have, we'd be docile types, with no drive, and with the magnetism of a piece of wood. Take high testosterone and low serotonin for example, and welcome to the world of the sociopath. Or high sertonin and low testosterone and welcome to the world of a person with no interests or incentives. There's a guy on this site who claims to be athletic, always posts threads, and you can see this guy has testosterone coming out of his ass. Socialization helps this dude keep a balance, but he still shows little sensitivity answering other issues about himself here we have questioned him about. There has to be a mental balance. When I was on Prozac for years, it raised my serotinin.I did'nt feel like doing s***. They give alot of folks in prison that to contol their testosterone also.

[mariamma]

Empathy, compassion, love, desire, all the things that make us human is open for interpretation because the funny thing is that none of us expresses it the same way or maybe it is the same yet how we measure it. Does that make sense?

I spent hours crying over a dog that isn't mine because she's old and has to be put to sleep. I don't think I'm programmed any different I'm just a human who's experience "right now" connects with animals. I woke up at 4am and masturbated to fantasies some may consider "taboo" and they were completely against consensus standards. Maybe I have some wires crossed? hahahaha well hell yeah I probably do!

The whole science thing is unsettling to me because there are always exceptions to the rule. Often more then the so called facts will say.

Today I just give it to the universe, try and be present and allow whatever emotions I'm having to flow through me. I just don't question it any more and for me its just all part of my human experience.
I believe the whole science thing because it's how I've made sense of the world. I sense energy. I've sensed things all my life. It has protected me, trusting my intuition. I have since learned how to harness my 'perception' in order to do spirit work (in the past 2.5 years). The energy I sense is the same energy I sense from animals too. Which is what totally 'converted' me to the concept that all we do/think/feel is based on hormones and neurotransmitters and the other trace protein structures.
The 'giving to the Universe' and 'being present' is traced back to serotonergic activity in the brain. We do this because it feels good, makes life flow and makes it feel like we're at church and counters dopaminergic activity (pleasure seeking or 'I Want'). Animals do it as well. I see it and feel it energetically when a dog lies down, puts h/er nose in the air and smiles at everyone. I even feel the energy from my bunnies.
But this thread is supposed to be about empathy (oxytocin). I believe science because science has known for decades that anti-social personality disorder is connected to lack of oxytocin in the brain. Abuse (nurture) changes things more and makes those with the ASPD diagnosis violent. In fact, there are studies that say 90% of those with a psych diagnosis has abuse in h/er history.
But 80% of studies are disproven so look at meta-studies for better accuracy. In health care, 50% of best practice changes every 5 years. Science is ever-changing and is no absolute authority. It always should be taken with a grain of salt. But there are highly established, accepted truism in science. The hormone thing has been known for many, many years. The stress hormones were seen as the source of medical problems, adrenals removed and people had less stress but died in a few days because it upset water and minerals in the blood stream.
No one has to believe this stuff. But I do because it makes the most sense.

[NorCalStud]

An adrenal depleted society imo. This is about empahy and I will share anyway that I am buying Gabba today.

[mariamma]

I listened to the dog youtube Mariama. It was very interesting. Dogs are a big part of how I roll in life. There is alot to be said about that.

I am simple. I dont believe caucasian america and caucasion science has the universal answer to creating a more empathetic world. That is oh so scary when that kind of thinking is present. It is a priveledge just to have the time to talk in sometimes an intangible language. So when it balls up...when language and emotion mess up; there is love, admiration, and respect to remember.

The first empathy to give....no matter what ...my opinion...smiling. We dont know each other's language???? Even here on this site...we can go toward...lack of trust...or we can stand and face each other from different tribes and different dialects and SMILE...smiling is reassuring to people who lack trust. If that is all we can communicate then it could and has been lifesaving. Example: pretty damn sure Lewis and Clark smiled alot.

I want to take this time to say how much I appreciate the thinking that goes into our language here. It is fascinating to me...all that we express. Such really great people I have the great fortune to know at this time. I do believe in reincarnation and there is no accident we are here now discussing...

I understand about not trusting Caucasian science. I'm mixed. My (white) family were scientists mostly and Xian Scientist in spiritual practice. There is much in grey areas that isn't looked at. But people only go so fast. We humans are (slowly) getting our collective heads out of our asses and seeing that we aren't that special after all.

It's kind of awesome to see humans grow up. I know India has brought significant science and spirituality together as well as great basic science. I love the different perspective and the different interpretation of energy the Indians have brought to the forefront.

I really liked the interview because it dealt with traditionally human behavior in the form of dogs. I really loved the info in the beginning on dog breeds and those that were breed for love and companionship. Many feral child stories have been refuted yet I truly believe some are true. And there are occasional stories like the one from Ethiopia of lions rescuing girls from violent (human) males. It's kind of awesome hearing about a pride of lionesses attacking men and lying around a child until humans come to care for the child. But that may be refuted as well.

[mariamma]

An adrenal depleted society imo. This is about empahy and I will share anyway that I am buying Gabba today.

Is there supposed to be an article attached to this?

[aishah]

It's kind of awesome to see humans grow up. I know India has brought significant science and spirituality together as well as great basic science. I love the different perspective and the different interpretation of energy the Indians have brought to the forefront.

the book prophets facing backward by meera nanda talks about how there has actually been a lot of struggle around this issue in india. the book is not without problems (the author is an avowed atheist) but it's a good overview of the struggle between science and religion in india, which has been the source of a lot of political turmoil in the last few decades.

i am really grateful that scientists are starting to look at the effects of things like meditation on the body. i worry about the cultural appropriation that sometimes results, but it does seem that people are bridging the gap between science and faith more now.

i definitely agree w/both of you (ncs and mariamma) that the privileging of science in the u.s. (especially as it's mostly defined by white folks) can be really problematic. i'm grateful to you ncs for bringing that up.

[mariamma]

Mariamma; Hormones do powerfully affect our behavior. If we were to strip out all the hormones we have, we'd be docile types, with no drive, and with the magnetism of a piece of wood. Take high testosterone and low serotonin for example, and welcome to the world of the sociopath. Or high sertonin and low testosterone and welcome to the world of a person with no interests or incentives. There's a guy on this site who claims to be athletic, always posts threads, and you can see this guy has testosterone coming out of his ass. Socialization helps this dude keep a balance, but he still shows little sensitivity answering other issues about himself here we have questioned him about. There has to be a mental balance. When I was on Prozac for years, it raised my serotinin.I did'nt feel like doing s***. They give alot of folks in prison that to contol their testosterone also.

True. The first time I saw someone with avolition (low hormones therefore no desire to do ANYTHING) it freaked me out. He laid in bed all day long, didn't want to eat, read, do anything. Energetically, he wasn't empty, more of a dwarf. Nothing wrong or weird about him. Just very small (energetically).

SSRIs are interesting. They work for some and but not well enough because they don't 'solve' the underlying issue. And increased serotonin in the brain lowers the dopamine and therefore love capacity in the brain (sometimes that's good, sometimes that's bad). Living in balance it what it's all about.

It's hard to do that with online sites though as most technology will increase dopamine. You know when you get a text or email and you feel that surge...that's dopamine. I usually think "OH! Who loves me?"

Silicon Valley is looking at this as they develop their technology. Colors and light will also affect serotonin in the brain so they make these bright, colorful LCDs screens that will boost both dopamine and serotonin.

[mariamma]

:poc-lol:I keep giggling at the idea of someone with testosterone coming out his ass

[NorCalStud]

Sorry. While
charging my phone; bad spelling occurs. It does look like there should be an article attached. There are plenty for sure. Imo ....there is a problem in US with humans having faulty adrenals ....the way we eat and drink and lack of crop rotation and proper environmental gardening is screwing us. I am way into organic farming and permaculture as a way to live empathtically....going out on a limb here? ...did I make a connection or too oblique?

[mariamma]

Sorry. While
charging my phone; bad spelling occurs. It does look like there should be an article attached. There are plenty for sure. Imo ....there is a problem in US with humans having faulty adrenals ....the way we eat and drink and lack of crop rotation and proper environmental gardening is screwing us. I am way into organic farming and permaculture as a way to live empathtically....going out on a limb here? ...did I make a connection or too oblique?

No, not oblique to me. I fully agree with you. I also believe that by 40, everyone, especially women should check into their adrenals and see if they need support.

On another note, I was amused when I mention a dog smiling as a sign of empathy and you mentioned smiling as the first sign of empathy between people who speak different languages. I think we're on the same page.

[NorCalStud]

Gee it feels good to be on the same page....sometimes..

[mariamma]

A almost meta study on oxytocin and how it acts in humans and other animals. One thing I like about hormones and neurotransmitters is that while they are expressed differently in different species, the behaviors seen in animals are specific to each species yet are similar.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2795557/

[mariamma]

I have only watched the first clip but the information on oxytocin, the autonomic nervous system, the immune system, stress hormones and progesterone enlightens and illuminates why empathy is a functioning part of the mammalian brain and body.

Oxytocin and being empathic reduces stress BUT only when shown how to use the energy in practice. When being OBJECTIVE one does not get the healing effects from oxytocin and being empathic!

http://greatergood.berkeley.edu/article/item/three_insights_from_the_cutting_edge_of_compassion _research

[mariamma]

Dr Deborah Custance and Jennifer Mayer exposed 18 dogs to four separate 20-second experiments in which either the pet's owner or a stranger pretended to cry, hummed in an odd manner, or carried out a casual conversation.

Results showed significantly more dogs looked at, approached and touched the humans as they were crying as opposed to humming, and no dogs responded during talking.

Ms Mayer said: "The dogs approached whoever was crying regardless of their identity.

~a link for those who love the pooches and understand empathy

http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/news/9749091.Dogs_empathise_with_crying_humans_research _shows/

[Ginger]

Dr Deborah Custance and Jennifer Mayer exposed 18 dogs to four separate 20-second experiments in which either the pet's owner or a stranger pretended to cry, hummed in an odd manner, or carried out a casual conversation.

Results showed significantly more dogs looked at, approached and touched the humans as they were crying as opposed to humming, and no dogs responded during talking.

Ms Mayer said: "The dogs approached whoever was crying regardless of their identity.

~a link for those who love the pooches and understand empathy

http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/news/9749091.Dogs_empathise_with_crying_humans_research _shows/


I want to believe that the dogs are attracted to crying people more than casually talking people because they love us and feel concern for us, but another part of me admits it's possible that when people cry they emit certain chemicals and the dogs sense those chemicals and they don't necessarily associate the chemicals with distress but with who knows what state of being, that presents some kind of biological advantage to them.

[mariamma]

I want to believe that the dogs are attracted to crying people more than casually talking people because they love us and feel concern for us, but another part of me admits it's possible that when people cry they emit certain chemicals and the dogs sense those chemicals and they don't necessarily associate the chemicals with distress but with who knows what state of being, that presents some kind of biological advantage to them.

I think I understand what you mean IslandScout. Those chemical would be stress hormones and oxytocin and other hormones and neurotransmitters. Humans can smell the oxytocin in tears and react to them. The study about this had people smelling tears on tissues and talking about the emotions they had from smelling them. I believe they were smelling things like water, saliva and sweat as well as tears.

What this study documented that was that dogs reacted to the emotion, not to the sounds or actions. So, yes, dogs can and do react to the chemicals emitted by others. Humans often pull back when they sense these chemicals or see the emotions. Dogs go to the people crying and empathize (share) with humans.

[DapperButch]

Did you have anyone with whom you had meaningful contact while young (a teacher, a neighbor, a relative, a sitter, etc.) that may have fostered empathy in you? I have read that can be a saving grace for kids in homes where empathy is not there to be learned. My own mom was abused and dissociative/fractured, while my dad was abusive. I did have a sitter who made a huge difference to me. Now she is my mom's best friend (After my dad left my mom, unfortunately this was when I had already grown up, my mom became so much more stabilized.).

I believe it had to have been my maternal grandmother. Until I was 10 I did spend a lot of time with her on the weekends. She was loving and caring to me.

My mon would have been different had my grandmother raised her but she was thrown out of her orthodox Jewish family for getting pregnant with my mom out-of-wedlock as they called it and her father was a rabbi. She boarded my mom with a very strict, abusive family and my mom was the scapegoat of the other foster kids.

So yes, I guess I learned empathy from my grandmother.

Thanks Nannie. She died at age 95. I still miss her.

Yes, nycfembbw. It is truly amazing how that happens. A child having just one person in their lives, even for a short period of time (like one school year), who is emotionally attentive and lets the child know that they matter can "undo" so much "bad stuff" (for lack of a better word).

I'm glad you had that someone like that in your life, Anya.

[Toughy]

Interesting link about empathy vs sympathy

http://www.diffen.com/difference/Empathy_vs_Sympathy

I wonder if different chemicals are produced.........I could not find the answer because the search kept going to the sympathetic nervous system.....


<snip> Sympathy essentially implies a feeling of recognition of another's suffering while empathy is actually sharing another's suffering, if only briefly. Empathy is often characterized as the ability to "put oneself into another's shoes". So empathy is a deeper emotional experience.

Empathy develops into an unspoken understanding and mutual decision making that is unquestioned, and forms the basis of tribal community. Sympathy may be positive or negative, in the sense that it attracts a perceived quality to a perceived self identity, or it gives love and assistance to the unfortunate and needy.

<snip>
Compassion can form a base for both empathy and sympathy, and each may be seen as aspects of wisdom, or the means through which wisdom is synthesized. Sympathy also involves caring, but a compassionate sense of assistance and protection for those who are poor and less fortunate. Empathy is expressed when trying to feel someone else’s feeling who generally is known to you.
<snip>

[mariamma]

I heard this program this morning and was moved by their many points. Not really an episode about empathy but more about how lack of insight eventually effects all people.

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/play_full.php?play=474

[mariamma]

A vimeo clip on empathy, neurons and the dramatic arc. Insightful
http://vimeo.com/50579996