Butches who don't bind

[stephfromMIT]

Binding was mentioned in my "non-packing" thread. So I thought I'd ask about it. I don't, mostly because I have nothing to bind. (my muscles made my boobs disappear)

[SleepyButch]

Binding was mentioned in my "non-packing" thread. So I thought I'd ask about it. I don't, mostly because I have nothing to bind. (my muscles made my boobs disappear)

I don't bind. Mine are not that big now. They used to be quite large and I hated them but never did the binding thing. Nothing wrong with doing it, it just wasn't something I chose to do.

I had a reduction several years ago and I am much happier and don't mind showing them now. :sunglass:

[Rockinonahigh]

I wear a spandex compresion shirt,I get them at wall mart or acadamy sports store.They cost around$13.00 more or less,they need to be snug enough to hold what you have without hindering you breathing,the body comes to my waist but I cut it short enough to be a half shirt.What works well is if you have a waist ban snug enough to hold the body down if its not croped short.Not long ago I found they were selling spandex suport shorts,I bought a couple of pair t try it out and have found when its a snug fit without being to tight I get good abb and low back suport.Warning these tend to tighten as the day goes on(the pants) so good fit is a must...cutting the blood cicculation off is a nono.I dont think these shirts will do much for someone that is heavy chested but i'm not so it works.Plus they come in several colors.

[Martina]

I don't, mostly because I have nothing to bind. (my muscles made my boobs disappear)

If you were big chested, would you bind?

[stephfromMIT]

Martina-Good question! :D It's the unaswerable question.

[Kobi]

I am a butch woman. I am large chested. I like my female body parts and those femmes who appreciate them. They are parts of the woman I am. I am proud of them. And I like them to show.

Thus, I would never bind them as I have no need or desire to disguise them or hide them.

[Martina]

Martina-Good question! :D It's the unaswerable question.

So basically, you just happen not to bind. The title of the thread is "Butches who don't bind." You said you thought you'd ask about it. What do you want to know? Are you just interested in what people do in general or specifically in the decisions made by butches who don't bind? I assume the latter given your topic. If so, what about that decision interests you, given that you don't have to make it?

Also, pointing out that you don't have to bind because you are muscley is asserting a certain privilege. But maybe you knew that.

[Words]

So basically, you just happen not to bind. The title of the thread is "Butches who don't bind." You said you thought you'd ask about it. What do you want to know? Are you just interested in what people do in general or specifically in the decisions made by butches who don't bind? I assume the latter given your topic. If so, what about that decision interests you, given that you don't have to make it?

Also, pointing out that you don't have to bind because you are muscley is asserting a certain privilege. But maybe you knew that.

What Martina said.

[jac]

I don't bind.

Not that I haven't thought of it. I actually I have wanted to bind in the past and periodically in the present but first and foremost, I can't stand feeling constricted by clothing! I purposefully stretch shirts that feel snug in any way or buy a size bigger for the comfort of feeling loose and free. I just don't like bras and really don't like sports bras either, so I'm in a "bind" so to speak... (play on words). ;)

I guess there are times I want my chest flattened but then again, for the most part, it's okay that it's there. I know if I lost some weight and did some lifting they would drop in size and tone up and I would be very content with that.

I do appreciate that my girl doesn't mind that I don't bind.... and is also okay if I chose to. It is however a part of the physical feminine in me that I am most accepting of. And I have mentioned to my mom, who is a breast cancer survivor for over 5 years, that if it was possible to give a breast transplant to survivors that matched with me, I would gladly give them up, otherwise I guess they're hanging around till the day I die... (another play on words) :D

[The_Lady_Snow]

Binding was mentioned in my "non-packing" thread. So I thought I'd ask about it. I don't, mostly because I have nothing to bind. (my muscles made my boobs disappear)


Are you writing a book!? You ask some deep questions!!!

Do any of the butches you know bind? Does Amanda have an opinion about it if you choose to? Have you thought about or tried binding?

[bkisbutchenuff]

My personal preferance is to not bind....when all is said and done - I'm female and appreciate what I have to offer...my girls are my girls.... :D

[jac]

Are you writing a book!? You ask some deep questions!!!

I have wondered the same thing!! Of course I have also wondered if Steph is doing some sort of MIT research/thesis for that next degree... Hmmmm are ya?
I like the questions... It's brought new perspective to the place and has created conversation and community interaction. Just curious though....

[Words]

Know what I'm really not getting here Steph?

You said somewhere else I believe something to the effect of ''to my annoyance/whatever'' I pass. Yet according to what you write, everything about you speaks to your wanting to look super duper masculine. You don't shave your body hair. You were masculine clothing. You work out to the point where your 'boobs' have disappeared (which, unless you were more or less flat to begin with, I find amazing since even the world's best female bodybuilders still have what appear to be breasts).


So my question is, is there any step you've taken to help folks realize you're female, thereby doing away with any confusion? Not saying you should have to...simply wondering why, if passing is so annoying for you, you might not have.

Words

[The_Lady_Snow]

I have wondered the same thing!! Of course I have also wondered if Steph is doing some sort of MIT research/thesis for that next degree... Hmmmm are ya?
I like the questions... It's brought new perspective to the place and has created conversation and community interaction. Just curious though....



Well that's what I thought, but steph said she's not had any gender studies classes. The topics are definitely loaded and not only has good convos happened but damn some ugly shits been said as well all in the name of opinion.

I'm curious as to how stephs real time experiences with butches are.

[girl_dee]

Well that's what I thought, but steph said she's not had any gender studies classes. The topics are definitely loaded and not only has good convos happened but damn some ugly shits been said as well all in the name of opinion.

I'm curious as to how stephs real time experiences with butches are.

Yes and if my opinion is part of some official research project i'd like to know.

[jac]

Well that's what I thought, but steph said she's not had any gender studies classes. The topics are definitely loaded and not only has good convos happened but damn some ugly shits been said as well all in the name of opinion.

I'm curious as to how stephs real time experiences with butches are.

I find it interesting to be asking such intense questions of the community if not for curiosity of her own accord or for information gathering.... I would like to think that if these questions and answers are being used for anything other than her own personal curiosity and questioning within herself, that Steph has enough integrity and professional ethics to give fair knowledge to those of us participating. Not saying this is the case... but I won't say it hasn't crossed my mind. Exploitation is a serious offense...

[The_Lady_Snow]

Yes and if my opinion is part of some official research project i'd like to know.



I guess if it feels creepy deep down I'd not engage with steph. It's a bit obvious she likes hot topics and that her wording is either a thought out process or she has issues knowing how to post or what verbiage to use(though it's hard to believe considering the MIT background)

If she's using this community as guinea pigs I hope she's got permission from folks before doing so. Reality is that we'll never really know cause computer screens hide a lottttt, for all we know she's a doctor or somethin'..

:|<-- only plays a doctor during consensual scenes

[weatherboi]

I have wondered the same thing!! Of course I have also wondered if Steph is doing some sort of MIT research/thesis for that next degree... Hmmmm are ya?
I like the questions... It's brought new perspective to the place and has created conversation and community interaction. Just curious though....

Funny I don't see these threads she has started as a place for conversation or community interaction. I see them as space that has been created for people to freely say some pretty judgmental opinions about what doesn't work for them instead of just focusing on what does work for them personally.

Binding is hard on the body, and done long term can cause permanent damage. If somebody doesn't have to do it then don't and be happy for it.

[Words]

Official research doesn't bother me as much as the thought of someone getting their jollies by asking questions that bear no relevance whatsoever to their life/their experience. Sorry steph, but this is a bit like me coming in and asking whether big breasted femmes have trouble finding extra large bras when I'm a modest 36B and have no desire to increase my bust size.

I'm really not trying to silence you and I'm trying to be as tactful as possible but in your enthusiasm to facilitate conversation, do you not ever stop to think about the way in which your question will be perceived?

Words

[girl_dee]

I guess if it feels creepy deep down I'd not engage with steph. It's a bit obvious she likes hot topics and that her wording is either a thought out process or she has issues knowing how to post or what verbiage to use(though it's hard to believe considering the MIT background)

If she's using this community as guinea pigs I hope she's got permission from folks before doing so. Reality is that we'll never really know cause computer screens hide a lottttt, for all we know she's a doctor or somethin'..

:|<-- only plays a doctor during consensual scenes

This part exactly, i love hot subjects because i do like thinking beyond the fluff stuff at times, and if not for certain hot subjects i don't think i would have learned as much along the way, i feel i have grown as a person and a femme by reading words of others. i've changed my perspective on things because of this, and now i wonder what took me so long.

i appreciate the conversation, but Steph ya seem to have come out of nowhere with very pointed thread titles without much offer as to why or what your experiences are yourself.

[jac]

Funny I don't see these threads she has started as a place for conversation or community interaction. I see them as space that has been created for people to freely say some pretty judgmental opinions about what doesn't work for them instead of just focusing on what does work for them personally.

Binding is hard on the body, and done long term can cause permanent damage. If somebody doesn't have to do it then don't and be happy for it.

I understand what you are saying... and maybe I should have elaborated more clearly by saying that, the conversation whether good or bad has brought new perspective "to me." I have learned from the interactions within the community and I have found that through this experience there are areas that I will be more cautious of speaking out on and more aware of others' wording. I will openly admit that I am gullible at times and willing to give others the benefit of the doubt... and I absolutely agree with you on the "judgmental opinions" instead of "just focusing on what does work for them personally."

[weatherboi]

I understand what you are saying... and maybe I should have elaborated more clearly by saying that, the conversation whether good or bad has brought new perspective "to me." I have learned from the interactions within the community and I have found that through this experience there are areas that I will be more cautious of speaking out on and more aware of others' wording. I will openly admit that I am gullible at times and willing to give others the benefit of the doubt... and I absolutely agree with you on the "judgmental opinions" instead of "just focusing on what does work for them personally."


You elaborated fine. I was just borrowing your words for a jumping off point. Just the way this thread is titled, to me, creates a negative space and I am not sure why. Maybe because it seems clinical or maybe because, to me, I have never had a negative encounter in a group of peers when we have discussed what we do, to take care of what we all have, in all our own personal ways...until here/online. In all my bowling leagues, softball teams, soccer teams, social, and business networking encounters have I felt such a need to separate, as I do here/online. It is usually just good healthy fun followed by some more drink/food and fun.

[jac]

You elaborated fine. I was just borrowing your words for a jumping off point. Just the way this thread is titled, to me, creates a negative space and I am not sure why. Maybe because it seems clinical or maybe because, to me, I have never had a negative encounter in a group of peers when we have discussed what we do, to take care of what we all have, in all our own personal ways...until here/online. In all my bowling leagues, softball teams, soccer teams, social, and business networking encounters have I felt such a need to separate, as I do here/online. It is usually just good healthy fun followed by some more drink/food and fun.

Again I agree. This is why I said - I have learned from the interactions within the community and I have found that through this experience there are areas that I will be more cautious of speaking out on and more aware of others' wording. It has brought more awaeness and a level of feeling defensive/protective... And I too have that "need to separate" feeling deep down inside. I don't like it...

And yes, it does have a "clinical feel" to the threads

[Tommi]

Well that's what I thought, but steph said she's not had any gender studies classes. The topics are definitely loaded and not only has good convos happened but damn some ugly shits been said as well all in the name of opinion.

I'm curious as to how stephs real time experiences with butches are.

I'm curious as to how stephs real time experiences in journalism may be coming along. What a great research pool. :cigar2:

are we not readng between the lines and titles? We should.

[Martina]

I feel like Words does here. THere has been precious little sharing on Steph's part, but a lot of us have ponied up some intense things (that's on us).

I am assuming some naivete on her part. For one thing, she does not know the divisions in our community that some of these topics bring up.

Weatherboi's post rang true for me that some of the topics are worded in a way to get woman ID'd folks to bring up some stuff that is potentially divisive. That's fine if it's a thread started out of a need from part of a community. If it's just curiousity, and that curiosity is not naive, then yuck. If it is naive, I guess it's on us not to wander in and expose our souls. I certainly did on one thread.

[princessbelle]

I feel like Words does here. THere has been precious little sharing on Steph's part, but a lot of us have ponied up some intense things (that's on us).

I am assuming some naivete on her part. For one thing, she does not know the divisions in our community that some of these topics bring up.

Weatherboi's post rang true for me that some of the topics are worded in a way to get woman ID'd folks bring up some stuff that is potentially divisive. That's fine if it's a thread started out of a need from part of a community. If it's just curiousity, and that curiosity is not naive, then yuck. If it is naive, I guess it's on us not to wander in and expose our souls. I certainly did on one thread.

So agree with this!!! I really still hold out hope that Steph is just a newby and testing the waters, so to speak, learning the ropes. It appears to me that when an idea comes up in another thread, she starts one about that topic. I've seen her do this a lot. Seems to be very perceptive of how others feel and think. Her reasoning why i wouldn't try to guess. I also agree that she does not divulge much of herself. But, that is certainly her prerogative.

I guess bottom line is...respond to her or don't.

It's her choice to start new threads on any idea/ideal or reason she wants within the guidelines of the TOS, it is our choice to respond or not.

Take it or leave it....is how i see it.

[stephfromMIT]

Sorry if I'm upsetting everybody! NOT my intention. I'm not writing a book. I guess I'll just keep things to myself from now on.

[princessbelle]

Sorry if I'm upsetting everybody! NOT my intention. I'm not writing a book. I guess I'll just keep things to myself from now on.

Please don't feel that way.

I'm not speaking for everyone, but from some peeps....

"We" are nice i promise. "We" have just been around the block and sometimes our radar goes up and we question motive, intent. Many times it is true people are not who they seem. BUT not always.

We need new people around here. We won't gobble you up long. Consider it your initiation period of sorts.

Hang in there please. Just be as open as you want to be and mostly...honest...that's all anyone could ask for.

I hope you stay. :bunchflowers:

[The_Lady_Snow]

Sorry if I'm upsetting everybody! NOT my intention. I'm not writing a book. I guess I'll just keep things to myself from now on.

I don't mind your threads.. I'm truly interested about how you and your buds discuss and feel about butch issues!

[BullDog]

OK I get some people don't believe certain things to be true, but I personally don't get why people are so offended by her threads- the content and subject matter. To me they are reasonable questions that I think many young butches and butches new to online would ask. Some of the reactions make me feel unwelcome.

[dark_crystal]

Sorry if I'm upsetting everybody! NOT my intention. I'm not writing a book. I guess I'll just keep things to myself from now on.

Is it just me or is this a tiny bit flouncy?

[Martina]

I would suggest reading more. The tiger cup energy is great, but periodically cubs get roared at.

We are a lot older than you here. There is a history here. And you can definitely offend some folks' sensibilities. If you'd rather blunder through and get yelled at periodically, then that's your risk. Personally, I took a while to get the lay of the land.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Are you writing a book!? You ask some deep questions!!!

Do any of the butches you know bind? Does Amanda have an opinion about it if you choose to? Have you thought about or tried binding?


How do you discuss this in your circle of peeps, I'll be honest the only time I've known about butches binding is here online, most if not all the butches I know don't.

[Sparkle]

I don't know stephfromMIT, so I can't speak to her intentions but reading the first post it seems as though she's stated the question, the rationale for asking it and her experience in the first sentence: binding came up in another thread, let's talk about it, and she goes on to say that she does not bind and why.

I don't know that anyone has the right to expect she should be baring her soul on this topic or any other. She expressed her experience and opened up a conversation.

AND like weatherboi, I have read the titles of the past two threads about butches who do not bind, or pack and I, too, have cringed.

My first reaction was "oh christ, here we go" :| And when I step back and examine my reaction objectively I know I cringe and roll my eyes because I (like most of us who have been around here and b-f.) know what kind of ugly butch- butcher- butchest nonsense is likely to rear its nasty head. Because, I, like many of you, know historically that divisiveness and negativity reign when these topics are raised.

I don't know if stephfromMIT knows that or not. I don't know if she's been around long enough to have witnessed it. I don't know if her intention was to stir the pot. AND Nor do you (general you).

The conjecture regarding her intentions and veracity, the assumption she's stirring a pot IS in and of itself - pot stirring.

If the intention of the OP isn't clear - ask a direct question.

I actually think reading between the lines on a public forum is a dodgy business, i think it leads to all sorts of miscommunication and reaction. And I think we've come to that conclusion 8 gazillion and 1 times.

I believe in clear, concise and direct communication - not presumption.

And if your hackles go up, if you've got a bad feeling, if you have read between the lines and don't like what you've seen - leave it be, ignore the thread, don't participate, block the OP or the posters if you feel really strongly. Because conjecture is not fact. And the invisible intent found between the lines is not a reliable source.

If a conversation becomes ugly and negative it is solely the responsibility of the people who contribute to it. We bring our stuff to each thread we engage in, we are responsible for it. Not the OP. Not the person who said something that offended me/you/him/her. Not the site owners. Or the moderators who did or didn't intervene. Not the poster's partner. Or his ex girlfriends 'cats' foster mom. :P

We are responsible for ourselves and our words.

[BullDog]

I agree that it is usually best to focus on what we do rather than what we don't do. Sometimes, though, it turns into some good discussion. On the discussion of non-packing, many butches have been told or made to feel they are less than if they don't pack. When there is discussion about it, it is clear many butches do not. I do think it is far overstated online in terms of packing being the norm for butches. There is also nothing wrong with those that do pack. Either way is fine.

No one should divulge personal stuff they aren't comfortable with, no matter who the OP is. This is a public forum.

Great post Sparkle!

[Novelafemme]

I don't know stephfromMIT, so I can't speak to her intentions but reading the first post it seems as though she's stated the question, the rationale for asking it and her experience in the first sentence: binding came up in another thread, let's talk about it, and she goes on to say that she does not bind and why.

I don't know that anyone has the right to expect she should be baring her soul on this topic or any other. She expressed her experience and opened up a conversation.

AND like weatherboi, I have read the titles of the past two threads about butches who do not bind, or pack and I, too, have cringed.

My first reaction was "oh christ, here we go" :| And when I step back and examine my reaction objectively I know I cringe and roll my eyes because I (like most of us who have been around here and b-f.) know what kind of ugly butch- butcher- butchest nonsense is likely to rear its nasty head. Because, I, like many of you, know historically that divisiveness and negativity reign when these topics are raised.

I don't know if stephfromMIT knows that or not. I don't know if she's been around long enough to have witnessed it. I don't know if her intention was to stir the pot. AND Nor do you (general you).

The conjecture regarding her intentions and veracity, the assumption she's stirring a pot IS in and of itself - pot stirring.

If the intention of the OP isn't clear - ask a direct question.

I actually think reading between the lines on a public forum is a dodgy business, i think it leads to all sorts of miscommunication and reaction. And I think we've come to that conclusion 8 gazillion and 1 times.

I believe in clear, concise and direct communication - not presumption.

And if your hackles go up, if you've got a bad feeling, if you have read between the lines and don't like what you've seen - leave it be, ignore the thread, don't participate, block the OP or the posters if you feel really strongly. Because conjecture is not fact. And the invisible intent found between the lines is not a reliable source.

If a conversation becomes ugly and negative it is solely the responsibility of the people who contribute to it. We bring our stuff to each thread we engage in, we are responsible for it. Not the OP. Not the person who said something that offended me/you/him/her. Not the site owners. Or the moderators who did or didn't intervene. Not the poster's partner. Or his ex girlfriends 'cats' foster mom. :P

We are responsible for ourselves and our words.

I think we can all agree with much of your post, Sparkle.

I posted something inflammatory this morning and then deleted it because I did not wish to, as you say, stir the pot.

In my eyes there are WAY too many inconsistencies in Steph's posts. Some of them are glaring and others are easy to miss unless you are looking for them.

The thing that bothers me is that I, personally, have asked several times for what I consider to be simple clarifications, and have never received solid answers. Finally, I sent the OP a private message and received what I perceived to be a very juvenile, flippant and disrespectful response. My dad graduated from MIT...I feel like I have a legitimate interest. :)

Steph, you have started some fabulously inquisitive threads and if your intentions are not malicious, then I will be the first to apologize. But right now I question your intentions and quite frankly, I feel a little unsafe having you here. I don't like feeling this way, which is why I came to you personally for clarification.

I for one LOVE new community members and try to roll out the red carpet for all. But I am having trouble here and I feel like there is the potential for hurt when members are being told possible untruths. Especially when it comes to very personal issues like identity and spaces within our hearts.

[stephfromMIT]

Novela-What was wrong with my response to your PM? Sorry to all if I've been lax in answering for myself the questions I ask. I've new to this community, and would hope I'd receive the benefit of the doubt. Since it seems that is not forthcoming, I feel it's best for all if I leave you.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Novela-What was wrong with my response to your PM? Sorry to all if I've been lax in answering for myself the questions I ask. I've new to this community, and would hope I'd receive the benefit of the doubt. Since it seems that is not forthcoming, I feel it's best for all if I leave you.



Ahem,

Sweet, so would I,
Yet I should kill thee with much cherishing.
Good night, good night! Parting is such sweet sorrow,
That I shall say good night till it be morrow








no one's gonna chase you steph, ya may as well stay and continue to come up with extremely popular threads.

[macele]

as for as binding goes, ...

i have binded. but mostly for medical reasons. i'm still dealing with those reasons. i had binded some before the surgery (heart). not much. i've never discussed binding, not on a forum. i don't like large breasts, not on me. so i do it to keep it all still LOL. just to be honest. no other reason. lots of women do it that are involved in sports, say the compression shirt. ever watch the wnba, ... o they are doing some binding. but all of those women are not butches.

[yotlyolqualli]

steph, if your threads do nothing else, they get people thinking.

Often, that is not popular. It makes people uncomfortable, sometimes, to have to look at, examine, or even acknowledge that other's can, quite possibly have, idea's, ideal's and beliefs that so differ from our own. lol

What you've brought to this community... while many don't like it, is thought. You make us think. You make us examine. You make us angry sometimes. You raise our hackles sometimes. But in doing that.. you challenge the status quote, you challenge perception and you challenege our own thoughts and thought processes.

If I did not feel safe with you in this community, I would stay off of your threads. I would block your posts. I would not engage. I would not enter into a lion's den, just in order to let the lion know that I feel unsafe in their den.

Ask away. Post your threads. Keep raising our hackles, because damn it, without someone to churn the waters, the pool would get pretty damned stagnant!

BTW, I don't care who you, where you come you from, who your daddy is, or what you look like. Why? Because, right now, you are a name on a screen. You are more than likely never going to be in my IRL circle of friends or family. Not because I would not include you, but because, realistically, it's just not going to happen.

I do my best to be blatantly honest about who I am. However, there are aspects of me that I would NEVER divulge to an online community, because, frankly, it's not anyone's business but those who are around me, IRL.

So, in closing, steph... I don't care if anything you post about your personal self here, is truth, or not. I appreciate what you bring to these boards and I hope you don't leave. It's not your muscles, your education or occupation, OR lack thereof, that makes me THINK, it's your words.

Take care.

[Parker]

I guess I never really thought Steph had an ulterior motive, I just kinda figured she like the attention and the fun of it all, hence all the posts.

I remember when I first started coming to places like this and I would see threads with hundreds of pages and thousands of responses, I thought how neat it would be to think of a topic so engaging, it kept people interested for years to come or sparked a deep conversation or lively debate. Now, I'm just happy there's a "thanks/like" feature so if I dont feel like typing, I can just agree with and thank people left and right!

-----

Anyway, I dont bind and never did - oh there are times I'd like to strap these puppies down a bit more because they are huge (something like a 54DD :blink:) and can take out an eye; but I dont want to bind in the sense that I am trying to look like I dont have breasts at all .... just a slight reduction or a better bra would be nice for me and my back! :winky:

[tantalizingfemme]

I would actually love for amandatheartist to come over here and start a thread on barefoot running. Do you think she would come over to this site steph? She's really open and friendly and inquisitive like you. I bet she would make a lot of friends and learn a lot too, since it sounds like both if your experiences with butch femme seem really limited!

[Martina]

If the intention of the OP isn't clear - ask a direct question.



I did. I asked several. Never got an answer. It's unusual on this site for people to ask questions/start threads without explaining and sharing more. I did ask before I stirred the pot some. I don't question her identity. Don't care. But the stepped on sensitivities, yeah, I expect her to hear back about that. We all did when we started here.

Until the recent threatened flounces, I didn't have a clear sense of the level of maturity we were dealing with. Now I do. And I won't take it all as seriously. But I expect that she, like anyone, will get stood on when she doesn't pay attention. And honestly, this bright young woman can not claim that she is paying close attention to what is going on around here -- in spite of her apparent curiosity.

[Novelafemme]

Perhaps there is more validity to yotlyolqualli's line of thinking than I had thought.

Perhaps it really doesn't matter if what you write is the truth or not. You aren't directly hurting or influencing me!

I guess you rub the part of me that likes specific answers when I ask what I consider to be a direct question - the wrong way. And I don't feel I received an answer.

Oh well. :)

As far as binding goes; I tried a compression shirt on once and I felt like I was being squeezed by a boa constrictor. I nearly had a panic attack!! :blink:

I'm off to class. Be well!!

[WolfyOne]

I guess if it feels creepy deep down I'd not engage with steph. It's a bit obvious she likes hot topics and that her wording is either a thought out process or she has issues knowing how to post or what verbiage to use(though it's hard to believe considering the MIT background)

If she's using this community as guinea pigs I hope she's got permission from folks before doing so. Reality is that we'll never really know cause computer screens hide a lottttt, for all we know she's a doctor or somethin'..

:|<-- only plays a doctor during consensual scenes


But, do we really know if she has an MIT background or just going by what she tells us?

I am always wary of someone that asks so many questions and is somewhat evasive in giving their own answers to questions others give back.

I shall just kick back and continue to read as I ponder more over the person.

[The_Lady_Snow]

But, do we really know if she has an MIT background or just going by what she tells us?

I am always wary of someone that asks so many questions and is somewhat evasive in giving their own answers to questions others give back.

I shall just kick back and continue to read as I ponder more over the person.





I don't know if she has a degree, went to MIT, has a girlfriend named Amanda, plays for The Militia, has a car, dog or life.

I know she claims to have a lot of the above things, I can't disprove it. I am a bit disconcerted that these things are being questioned yet.... yet when a new Daddy/Dom/Top/Master rolls into town they're NOT.

I'd be more alarmed with the above than a 20 something MIT graduate talking about butch stuff.

[Toughy]

If she explained why she doesn't bind in another thread it would be nice to read that.........would have been entirely logical to start the thread with that post....and I would think logic would be an innate trait in a brain of MIT caliber..

I am always suspicious of anyone who asks tons of questions, asks folks to share and will NOT give of herself or answer direct or clarification questions.

The flouncy part just made me laugh....I was wondering WHEN it would happen....

[The_Lady_Snow]

Steph for future flounces see The TOS:

"I'm Leaving Forever!" posts - Any post or action designed to garner attention where you threaten to leave the site.



:|<- This public service announcement was brought to you by the letters:


Jj




Ll

and the number 9 DAYS TILL LITTLE ROCK!


Good Luck!

[*Anya*]

This might be obvious but no one is forcing anyone to answer her questions!

One thing I really like about the Planet, regardless if anyone is confrontive of a new person or pins them down for an answer or not; if they are not legitimate, sooner or later, they depart as mysteriously as they appeared!

I have seen it happen many time during my short tenure here.

Just say no ( thanks Mrs. B) and move on to the next thread, if you do not want to answer or if it does not feel right.

If someone is legitimate, hopefully, they will not feel too beat up and will stick around.

I used to ask a lot of questions about trans folks. Not because I was a troll but because I genuinely did not know. As we say in nursing: I had a knowlege deficit!

It was not transphobia but I sure was batted about for a bit (figuritively) and I almost left and thought about not returning.

I am glad that I did because I did receive the education that I so sorely needed.

[The_Lady_Snow]

I think what pisses people off is the vague untruths and that Steph doesn't engage when asked a question unless she wants to.

She has that right, she isn't causing harm and unless she's passive aggressively directing something at someone,and they call her out then she can't. Until then she can continue on her merry way having the choice to engage with whomever she pleases.

Like I said earlier, if she triggers you (general) don't engage, it's that simple!

[Nomad]

steph, if your threads do nothing else, they get people thinking.

Often, that is not popular. It makes people uncomfortable, sometimes, to have to look at, examine, or even acknowledge that other's can, quite possibly have, idea's, ideal's and beliefs that so differ from our own. lol

What you've brought to this community... while many don't like it, is thought. You make us think. You make us examine. You make us angry sometimes. You raise our hackles sometimes. But in doing that.. you challenge the status quote, you challenge perception and you challenege our own thoughts and thought processes.

If I did not feel safe with you in this community, I would stay off of your threads. I would block your posts. I would not engage. I would not enter into a lion's den, just in order to let the lion know that I feel unsafe in their den.

Ask away. Post your threads. Keep raising our hackles, because damn it, without someone to churn the waters, the pool would get pretty damned stagnant!

BTW, I don't care who you, where you come you from, who your daddy is, or what you look like. Why? Because, right now, you are a name on a screen. You are more than likely never going to be in my IRL circle of friends or family. Not because I would not include you, but because, realistically, it's just not going to happen.

I do my best to be blatantly honest about who I am. However, there are aspects of me that I would NEVER divulge to an online community, because, frankly, it's not anyone's business but those who are around me, IRL.

So, in closing, steph... I don't care if anything you post about your personal self here, is truth, or not. I appreciate what you bring to these boards and I hope you don't leave. It's not your muscles, your education or occupation, OR lack thereof, that makes me THINK, it's your words.

Take care.

i think this stuff - in purple - about you, without the anger/hackles part. i think it about Martina, Aishah and Lady Snow and Princessbelle. serious. you all bend my brain in ways no complacent brain willingly bends. ok sometimes Martina makes my face go all... O.o ...but i'm still sincerely grateful that she beats up my ignorance from time to time. same is true for the other formidable women i've mentioned, you included. if someone wasnt cracking open my limited perspective by being real with their opinions and generously sharing their experiences i'd be worse for the loss. i've also yet to see any of you not be willing to expound on your thoughts, explain where there's confusion, apologize with sincerity if something comes out wrong or say 'i dont know' when information or knowledge wasnt available to you. none of you avoids the hard work -that i've ever observed- and it's pretty rare that you let shit slide when it shouldnt slide. if i have one beef with Steph it's really just one of preference. i like questions and answers to be a 2 way street. i dont see a lot of that happening. with that said, i agree. who cares if she's real or a shared hallucination? i'm not being harmed. i dont like being lied to but i'm not a perfect person either. i told a lie or two when i was a much younger person. not saying Steph is lying. just not interested in seeing yet another thread deteriorate into another 'is she or isnt she' debate. if Steph is BFPs newest agent provacateur then becoming divisive over her threads and posts simply gives her what she came for. i discovered there's an ignore option for the people who offend me deeply.

as for the subject matter:
i've known butches who bind and butches who dont. i think the OP question should have been "who binds and why or why not?" binding is no more a butch province than wearing a bra is a femme one. hell, i used to think that i was 'binding' any time my bra was too small! :cracked:

[girl_dee]

i don't feel we have a right to demand anyone to divulge information. She is evasive no doubt but who cares? It's up to us whether or not we post in threads. She is very curious for sure, and went about gaining knowledge by starting threads.

i love the critical thinking threads no matter who starts them. What i don't like is when certain threads seem to divide us.

i'd just like to know whether we are part of a research project or not and if so, i sure hope it benefits our community!

[jac]

i don't feel we have a right to demand anyone to divulge information. She is evasive no doubt but who cares? It's up to us whether or not we post in threads. She is very curious for sure, and went about gaining knowledge by starting threads.

i love the critical thinking threads no matter who starts them. What i don't like is when certain threads seem to divide us.

i'd just like to know whether we are part of a research project or not and if so, i sure hope it benefits our community!

See these were my questions and concerns from the beginning of this thread... and never got answered. Well, at least the research question. As for the division of community, this is furstrating to me... but this is not Steph's fault that the community at-large has inner issues communicating over hot topics.

It's a learning experience... and learn I have.

[Nomad]

See these were my questions and concerns from the beginning of this thread... and never got answered. Well, at least the research question. As for the division of community, this is furstrating to me... but this is not Steph's fault that the community at-large has inner issues communicating over hot topics.


It's a learning experience... and learn I have.

well spoken. and ditto about the learning experience.

[spritzerJ]

This has gotten interesting...

I am not butch.
I don't bind...
but I do own a Spanx tank top smooth out the bumps item.

And I love it. It is like a hug all day. And some days I need an all day hug. I doubt it is secure as a compression top.

[weatherboi]

I don't necessarily have a problem with the thread topics themselves or the inconsistencies that come with the OP. Her not me.

I do take a step back from my community when people take threads like this and create the opportunity/scenario to disrespect other peoples ID's or ways of doing things. It doesn't matter what ID they are poo pooing or what activity it might be, they may not be my ID or my activity, but I am sure somebody here that I care about is reading it and feeling pretty shitty about it and that is something to be concerned about.

[femmennoir]

How interesting, all of this, upon which I stumbled by chance! I don't bind, wear a bra not that often either....I know lots of butches who bind, particularly younger ones. I personally love women, with all their attributes, therefore I love breasts....Cartesian logic, perhaps?... I respect butches who bind, and those who don't, and I am also respectful of the various journeys which make us all take such diverse roads.
As for the other matter, my only observation is that it is surprising to me how naive and prone to what I see more as social blunders than anything else MIT graduates can be these days.
I am, however, getting old (can that be it?)!
Some of these threads bring me closer to many of you who share truthfully about yourselves, painstakingly making sure the wording is perfect, the thought you express is clear, apologizing when your words did not exactly match your thought, polishing what you want to say, taking the time, in other words, to be a good interlocutor, literally, one with whom one has a two-way conversation... This is what matters to me, very much, in these halls.

Elle*

[Glenn]

Binding was mentioned in my "non-packing" thread. So I thought I'd ask about it. I don't, mostly because I have nothing to bind. (my muscles made my boobs disappear)

You said you are 6'1 and weigh 225. Unless you are inherently an A or B cup, being that large of a woman , I sincerely doubt your cup size could be that small to begin with or prove me wrong (because I was one of those who fell asleep in biology class). Are you taking any anabolic steroids or testosterone? Because even for most professional female bodybuilders they still have some breast fat, and have to dehydrate themselves for up to three weeks to get their breast size down to looking like all pec muscle just to take pics. And when they rehydrate, their breast size increases. So my question is, "how do you maintain continuous pec muscle, without natural breast fat if you are not on T or roids?"

[Toughy]

Binding was mentioned in my "non-packing" thread. So I thought I'd ask about it. I don't, mostly because I have nothing to bind. (my muscles made my boobs disappear)


It was pointed out to me that MIT did explain why she did not bind. I would like more information because the above statement does not make sense to me.

And...

MIT is not the only person on this web site that makes me feel suspicious....she is not special in that way.....:sunglass:


Oh and no I do not bind nor have I had a bra on in probably 40 years except a sports bra for swimming. I don't really see a reason to bind and there are several reasons not to bind. If I had DDD ta-ta's I might feel differently, maybe but I doubt it......

I like my ta-tas just fine.......I know plenty o femmes who like a little butch cleavage.....that white shirt with the top 3 buttons undone (and the boots and levis of course.....)

[lettertodaddy]

You said somewhere else I believe something to the effect of ''to my annoyance/whatever'' I pass. Yet according to what you write, everything about you speaks to your wanting to look super duper masculine. You don't shave your body hair. You were masculine clothing. You work out to the point where your 'boobs' have disappeared (which, unless you were more or less flat to begin with, I find amazing since even the world's best female bodybuilders still have what appear to be breasts).


For what it's worth, when I lost 150 pounds and worked out 3 hours a day, 7 days a week, I went from a DDD cup to a small B cup. So it is entirely possible to go from being quite busty to rather small-breasted if you work out.

[Zimmeh]

I totally agree! I lost over 60lbs and my boobs did not go away; they remained the same size.

Zimmeh

You said you are 6'1 and weigh 225. Unless you are inherently an A or B cup, being that large of a woman , I sincerely doubt your cup size could be that small to begin with or prove me wrong (because I was one of those who fell asleep in biology class). Are you taking any anabolic steroids or testosterone? Because even for most professional female bodybuilders they still have some breast fat, and have to dehydrate themselves for up to three weeks to get their breast size down to looking like all pec muscle just to take pics. And when they rehydrate, their breast size increases. So my question is, "how do you maintain continuous pec muscle, without natural breast fat if you are not on T or roids?"

[Ginger]

Martina-Good question! :D It's the unaswerable question.

Why is it unanswerable to you? Or is that unanswerable too? :|

[Zimmeh]

Heads up..Don't mention anything from a PM in the threads. :goodluck:

Zimmeh



Novela-What was wrong with my response to your PM? Sorry to all if I've been lax in answering for myself the questions I ask. I've new to this community, and would hope I'd receive the benefit of the doubt. Since it seems that is not forthcoming, I feel it's best for all if I leave you.

[ruffryder]

How do you discuss this in your circle of peeps, I'll be honest the only time I've known about butches binding is here online, most if not all the butches I know don't.


Right. This seems to be more of a thread question for trans if Steph is looking for why people bind, with what, etc.. Once again confused by a thread and what the OP is looking for exactly in an answer or just if she wants to discuss butches binding in general which I would probably say there would not be much info. there. However some butches mentioned that they do and some do so for other reasons than just binding, some for medical, etc.. It has already been mentioned that alot of butches identify as female and that includes breasts, and embracing their female parts so there would really be no reason to bind other than the reasons already mentioned here.

Novela-What was wrong with my response to your PM? Sorry to all if I've been lax in answering for myself the questions I ask. I've new to this community, and would hope I'd receive the benefit of the doubt. Since it seems that is not forthcoming, I feel it's best for all if I leave you.

ahhh I don't think you're that new steph. Afterall you've posted more than some that have been members for years and started threads some haven't even. . .and I think you have been receiving the benefit of the doubt here.

As for the binding, I have and I do sometimes but I ID as trans. Not sure what exactly you want to know about binding. My preference is a compression muscle shirt. I feel I don't always need to bind and most times I don't. Do you also want to know if we "pass" without binding or binding because I do either way and most times not binding.

[yotlyolqualli]

Ummmm I lost over 200 pounds and I went from a DD to an ......... well... I wear a B because I REFUSE to go to an A cup... but it would be doable.

I've also known very tall women, who have very slim hips and are very nearly flat chested and ummm no.. they don't take T and they don't lift weights.

Every human body is different and so is every human experience. No two people experience the exact same thing in the excact same ways.

When some people are in extreme pain, the only IV med that will work is morphine. It's a powerful drug! It's takes away the pain, every time. Right?

Wrong, morphine doesn't do a damned thing for me. In fact, oral vicodan will take care of the pain for me, MUCH better than morphine ever could!

Pain, trauma or stress raises blood pressure, right?

Not for me. Stress, pain and or trauma will cause my blood pressure to lower into dangerous numbers, even if I am NOT bleeding internally lol


No two bodies are exactly the same. What exercise does for one person, may not do the same for the next.

Besides, why do these threads ALWAYS devolve into what the OP looks like?

I also was offended by the insinuation that the OP was on steroids.

WTF? What does that have to do with the subject of the thread? Seriously.

[Novelafemme]

Heads up..Don't mention anything from a PM in the threads. :goodluck:

Zimmeh


I mentioned it in an effort to illustrate that I had reached out to Steph privately. I don't have any other means of contacting her privately. Duly noted.

Well, there is my telepathic ability, but that's for another thread! ;)

[Novelafemme]

This might be obvious but no one is forcing anyone to answer her questions!

One thing I really like about the Planet, regardless if anyone is confrontive of a new person or pins them down for an answer or not; if they are not legitimate, sooner or later, they depart as mysteriously as they appeared!

I have seen it happen many time during my short tenure here.

Just say no ( thanks Mrs. B) and move on to the next thread, if you do not want to answer or if it does not feel right.

If someone is legitimate, hopefully, they will not feel too beat up and will stick around.

I used to ask a lot of questions about trans folks. Not because I was a troll but because I genuinely did not know. As we say in nursing: I had a knowlege deficit!

It was not transphobia but I sure was batted about for a bit (figuritively) and I almost left and thought about not returning.

I am glad that I did because I did receive the education that I so sorely
needed.

Anya, (on bended knee) will you marry me?

[*Anya*]

Anya, (on bended knee) will you marry me?

Novela, the last time I checked, you were already married and I don't think that Katy would like bigamy one little bit!

:)

[Novelafemme]

Novela, the last time I checked, you were already married and I don't think that Katy would like bigamy one little bit!

:)

hehehehehehehehe :)

i was just teasing

:)

[Admin]

Hey Folks-

I just wanted to give a quick update to the community in regards to "StephfromMIT".

We have permanently banned that user.

That user was using a fictitious identity and appeared to have several identities across the internet. Most everything they posted about themselves was not only a lie, but appears to have been designed to integrate themselves into this community with as much familiarity as possible.

Unfortunately, this is the Internet and there are going to be people out there who do these things for entertainment or out of boredom. Sometimes it's even because the person wants to "try on" a different identity to see how it feels.

The one positive from this is that we have several interesting threads that we can continue discussions in and I hope that is exactly what we do.

Much appreciation to you all. Now let's get back to discussing the world!

Thanks,
Admin

[Martina]

Well, I was sure fooled. Makes sense though. God, that flouncing really is manipulative, isn't it?

I am so not feeling bad re any future flouncing on anybody's part.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Well, I was sure fooled. Makes sense though. God, that flouncing really is manipulative, isn't it?

I am so not feeling bad re any future flouncing on anybody's part.


Well, the good thing is we tried, we tried and gave them the benefit of the doubt.

At least we can truly say we are a welcoming community:vigil:

[WolfyOne]

I was not fooled...I had a gut feeling and was really leery with so many threads being started by a newbie. Reading a few of her posts, made me think we were dealing with a man who was clueless and wanting answers from us, but never sure how to answer questions we posed, so skipped past them and onto another thread start.

I am happy to see we can learn and grow from this as a community.
Moving right along as we often do when stuff like this happens.

June, Medusa...thanks for talking it over and looking deeper into this person.
Others that are here and those that come in the future need to know that y'all make BFP as safe as you possibly can for us.

[princessbelle]

I don't feel fooled or duped or anything of the kind.

I tried to hold out for the positive as many others did. Trying to help young-ens in the community isn't a bad thing even when there are red flags, and trying to see the best in people is definitely not a bad trait. I have no regrets.

However, being a sucker isn't a good thing either, especially if it it harms you in some way.

I did not give money, extra energy, love, attention to the point it hurt my family, away.

All i gave was the benefit of the doubt. We live, we learn, we make choices. Such is life in a nutshell.

And i do thank goodness for the admin and mods of this site for watching out for us and watching out for the site. It has to be done.

It takes a lot of different views, perspectives, visions, minds and personalities to make a village and even more to make a planet.

...and....

we move on.

[Tony]

Sometime back I was on a site where the same thing was happening. A lot of discussions being started by one individual, targeting ftms & the OP never really got involved in the responses. I eventually was privated & asked if I would be part of a study; disclosing basically my entire life experiences, supposedly for a thesis. When I asked for some sort of validation & guarantee of anomitity (sp) ( being anonymous) I was informed all I would see is a release form. I politely declined & found out quite a few of us had been contacted.
You never really know who is behind the screen or what their agenda is.

[Tony]

We need to move along now. The entire Mod team had a hand in this, including Linus and Medusa finding out the persons real name, and a lot of other identifiers. If they come back and fuck with us again, we'll take it a step further.

In the meantime, continue to be welcoming to new folks and report any suspicious behavior via PM to one of us to look into.

This case is closed. Move on.

My apologies. I was typing & did not see this before posting.

[Medusa]

I think it is really healthy to let this be a reminder of several things:

1. There are going to be newbies here who do have a lot of questions and we don't always need to treat them with suspicion. Sometimes they just really want to know what they are asking.

2. Other times, we are going to have really unhealthy individuals in our midst who get off on toying with people and we should be aware of this possibility when devoting time to responding to them.

3. We'll do the best we can at the upper level safety-wise but your personal safety level is up to you. Some folks want to know who they're talking to when posting and some folks don't care as long as they are heard. Either scenario is ok! But please consider that you aren't any more "unsafe" posting on this community than you are on Facebook or a random AOL wall. (meaning, there are strange fuckers everywhere!)

4. It is not healthy to hyper focus on paranoid scenarios of someone here to slurp up our knowledge but it is *very* healthy to decide as an adult what you are comfortable sharing.

In short, your ability to create your own experience is very empowering if you let it be so! Create a positive experience by focusing on the idea that you might be saying something that will help someone who is really sincere out there rather than the possible troll who asked. Or don't respond. It's your choice where you put your energy!

Again, we do appreciate the folks who stepped up to offer their thoughts on this scenario!

Appreciate you all, good people!

[Outlaw]

I logged on today looking for a thread entitled.....

"Shopping for bras"

or

"Big Breasted Butches and Bras"

or

"Shopping for bras before the reunion? Anyone? Bueller?"

Alternatively titled "How to induce a migraine"

O

I see a poll and an icon in my future....

[Novelafemme]

I'm confused as to why StephMIT is logged on right now and reading threads?

[Medusa]

I'm confused as to why StephMIT is logged on right now and reading threads?


She is not reading the threads.

When a user is banned and attempts to read the site, they will appear in the Who's Online list until their cookie on their home computer expires.

On their end, they actually receive a message like:

"Your access to BFP has been terminated.
Term: Forever
Reason: Trolling our community"

[Novelafemme]

She is not reading the threads.

When a user is banned and attempts to read the site, they will appear in the Who's Online list until their cookie on their home computer expires.

On their end, they actually receive a message like:

"Your access to BFP has been terminated.
Term: Forever
Reason: Trolling our community"

OK. That was a little shocking to see :) Thanks Medusa!

[Trey339]

I am a butch woman. I am large chested. I like my female body parts and those femmes who appreciate them. They are parts of the woman I am. I am proud of them. And I like them to show.

Thus, I would never bind them as I have no need or desire to disguise them or hide them.



Right on Kobi,,,doesnt change who I am
on another note, bras are a bitch and an instrument of torture! hahhahah

[Tony]

Ok. I need a smarter dumb phone. I'm quoting & deleting without knowing it. My apologies again. I'm just ginna leave this thread. Lol

[firegal]

She is not reading the threads.

When a user is banned and attempts to read the site, they will appear in the Who's Online list until their cookie on their home computer expires.

On their end, they actually receive a message like:

"Your access to BFP has been terminated.
Term: Forever
Reason: Trolling our community"

I dont get this techie cookie stuff.... Jusy another blue collar worker!

Its beyond my grasp!...But i,m ok with that!

[Toughy]

I'm confused as to why StephMIT is logged on right now and reading threads?

I am sending Admin a note.........I see MIT in the 'who's on line'.

[Medusa]

She is not reading the threads.

When a user is banned and attempts to read the site, they will appear in the Who's Online list until their cookie on their home computer expires.

On their end, they actually receive a message like:

"Your access to BFP has been terminated.
Term: Forever
Reason: Trolling our community"


Toughy- Please see above!

[Toughy]

Toughy- Please see above!

did not see that post when I made mine............tanks darlin........

[Martina]

We need to move along now. The entire Mod team had a hand in this, including Linus and Medusa finding out the persons real name, and a lot of other identifiers. If they come back and fuck with us again, we'll take it a step further.

In the meantime, continue to be welcoming to new folks and report any suspicious behavior via PM to one of us to look into.

This case is closed. Move on.

I am not disagreeing with you or defying or anything, BUT I do not think it's a bad idea to discuss this, to process it some. The list that Medusa has given is good. But we have our own ways of coming to "get" what happens to us. Not encouraging us vent or whatever. But I am not sure that it's not a good idea to discuss it some. Just saying.

[Syr]

Okay.... Moving right along. I am 38c. Have never bound/binded? I would prefer smaller tatas. Does it make me feel less Butch? Hell no. I have boobs! They get in the damn way sometimes.
Don't tend to go braless as I feel like Bessie the heifer swinging in the wind without one.

[thedivahrrrself]

Okay.... Moving right along. I am 38c. Have never bound/binded? I would prefer smaller tatas. Does it make me feel less Butch? Hell no. I have boobs! They get in the damn way sometimes.

<---not butch but would also prefer smaller "tatas" :)

[Novelafemme]

I will GLADLY take what anyone has to offer in the boob department!!!

Throw your ta-ta's my way, folks. :)

[macele]

binding is done for different reasons. we could discuss a male butch (gay or straight) who has large breasts and whats to hide them. or a hetero female butch who doesn't like her large breasts. or a transgender woman who is butch and doesn't want her/his breasts to show at all. several butch bindings to discuss. all of this said, i feel like it is a very sensitive subject. some have scars, and not on their skin, from an early age ... having to deal with being picked on and such. i'm not talking about binding for any other reason than to hide large breasts. i just know that it is a sensitive subject for some. and i also think it is a subject that needs attention.

[Greyson]

I will GLADLY take what anyone has to offer in the boob department!!!

Throw your ta-ta's my way, folks. :)


When I went for top surgery, my sister, the nurse was with me. As we waited in the waiting room of the surgery center there was a female/male couple also there. The woman was there to get her breast augmented. I know this because I could not help but overhear their conversation. I thought to myself about the irony of life. I would have gladly donated mine if it had been possible.

Before top surgery, no I never did bind. I was extremely grateful when I found a good sports bra.