Butches and bindings and breasts, oh my

[Redsunflower]

Hello my fabulous femme sisters. :stillheart:

I was wondering if you could help me out with something; I would really love to hear a few femme opinions on this. If you want to pull up a chair and grab a glass of wine, all the better. :wine:

I've been pondering sex (like you do when you're not getting any) and having a think about what's been good and what I might want more of in my next relationship.

As a result, I've started to acknowledge a few things about my own preferences such as:


I've never been turned on by my partner's breasts
I'm never motivated to touch them
Mostly I'm pretty good at ignoring my partner's breasts completely
Unless they're in a binding vest and suddenly I'm all over them
I still need my partner's body to be female even if they ID as male

So, what I would like to ask you all is:


How do you feel about your partner's breasts?
Are they a turn on or not?
Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them?
Do binding vests turn you on?
If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you?

This is not a discussion about different definitions of stone or transitioning or anything like that, although that's all very important and well covered elsewhere on here. I'm really just wondering what you make of your partner's boobs.

*Just to be clear, my breasts require a dive-esque starring role in any goings on. That's how it is and always will be.*

Thanks in advance to anyone who can help me out in thinking about this. You're all great! :rose:

[silkepus]

Hm, interesting. I'm probably not the best to answer this, but personally I like breast -a lot!-

I dont care as much about how they are contained or not, binded, in a bra, running wild and free- I think they're great!

[Julie]

I love breasts!
If *allowed* I would play with them, taunt them, bite them and make them bleed.
Truly I would.
But, this is not my partner's pleasure... So, it is my breasts that are taunted.
Lucky ME!

[The_Lady_Snow]

I am a fan of....., I like it all, so with that said, once I am clear on what the boundaries are, game on!

[tantalizingfemme]

How do you feel about your partner's breasts? My partner has had top surgery, but before the surgery I didn't feel any way about his breasts, they were just there.


Are they a turn on or not? Not a turn on


Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them? I didn't ignore them, they just didn't exist as breasts. Even if I saw them they I made no mental connection that they were breasts. Sounds strange I know, but it's the truth.


Do binding vests turn you on? Nope just another piece of clothing like socks. (which don't turn me on)


If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you? The chest being flat is physically attractive to me but what really is the turn on how he finally feels happy with his body. That extra self confidence (because we all know he wasn't lacking any to begin with ;) ) is pretty hot.

[Redsunflower]

Hm, interesting. I'm probably not the best to answer this, but personally I like breast -a lot!-

I dont care as much about how they are contained or not, binded, in a bra, running wild and free- I think they're great!

Thanks for this Silkepus, I think the thing about binding vests is that they make breasts almost disappear. So kind of different to a sports bra or something. Hmmm. How do you like your partner's breasts to be dressed?! :-)

I love breasts!
If *allowed* I would play with them, taunt them, bite them and make them bleed.
Truly I would.
But, this is not my partner's pleasure... So, it is my breasts that are taunted.
Lucky ME!

Thanks Julie, yes, lucky you indeed! Do you not mind that your partner doesn't want you touching? I wonder how much this matters, one thing amidst all the loads of stuff we all get up to. Hmm, just trying to figure it all out. :-)

I am a fan of....., I like it all, so with that said, once I am clear on what the boundaries are, game on!

Yep, the boundaries, all important, what's ok and what's not. Think it's better to find that out before anything happens, or feel your way as you go (so to speak!)? Thanks for this. :-)

I was also thinking about how we do things to please our partner, we all do, whether it turns us on or not doesn't matter 'cos we want them to feel good.

I have touched a fair amount of breasts in my time. The thing is, if I never did again, then that would be fine.

[*Anya*]

I absolutely love, love, everything about breasts-nipples in particular.

My love,

loves mine in every way

but not her own.

Hers are unbound and off limits, not in a "don't you dare touch" but in a "it does not turn me on, I would rather ignore them" kind of way.

Out of respect and love,

I do.

[Julie]

Thanks Julie, yes, lucky you indeed! Do you not mind that your partner doesn't want you touching? I wonder how much this matters, one thing amidst all the loads of stuff we all get up to. Hmm, just trying to figure it all out. :-)

No I do not mind at all. If my partner is uncomfortable or does not enjoy me touching hys breasts, than I don't want to. I want to do what pleases hym, not what is going to displease hym. What would be the pleasure in that for me?

[The_Lady_Snow]

Yep, the boundaries, all important, what's ok and what's not. Think it's better to find that out before anything happens, or feel your way as you go (so to speak!)? Thanks for this. :-)

I was also thinking about how we do things to please our partner, we all do, whether it turns us on or not doesn't matter 'cos we want them to feel good.

I have touched a fair amount of breasts in my time. The thing is, if I never did again, then that would be fine.



I find it best to talk about what people like before jumping into an awkward situation, that's if there is time to talk, sometimes you meet and no talking is done so it's important to be in tune to what is happening around you and pay attention to body language and soft no's. Talking while exploring is good, there is nothing wrong with asking what feels good and what doesn't..

I have not done anything I have not wanted to do I am not fond of unconsensual anything.


Here's the thing about stuff like this, if you don't like breasts, then don't get with someone who likes their breasts touched, I say this because as adults we should be talking, A LOT, cause when we talk (even if it's a quick fuck you can talk) we find out what people are like, what they like, what they want, what they desire. If they express a desire you are not into, walk away, or be honest and say well I am not into that so maybe it's best we not even fuck or go any further mentally. I think this will be an GREAT discussion to have with each other, not only because it will help us explore our desires, but it will maybe help and teach us to be more verbal and not just do things cause we think we have to, to keep a fuck or relationship around, thanks for starting it off Red!

Great discussion:)

[Redsunflower]

How do you feel about your partner's breasts? My partner has had top surgery, but before the surgery I didn't feel any way about his breasts, they were just there.

I can relate to this, a lot. They just exist but have no special significance. *nods*


Are they a turn on or not? Not a turn on

Yup.


Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them? I didn't ignore them, they just didn't exist. Even if I saw them they I made no mental connection that they were breasts. Sounds strange I know, but it's the truth.

Nope, not strange to me, but you're making me think about the difference between ignoring and just not acknowledging them. Hmmm, need to give that some more thought.


Do binding vests turn you on? Nope just another piece of clothing like socks. (which don't turn me on)

Haha! I loved it! Have NO idea why!


If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you? The chest being flat is physically attractive to me but what really is the turn on how he finally feels happy with his body. That extra self confidence (because we all know he wasn't lacking any to begin with ;) ) is pretty hot.

That is the sweetest thing, feeling good in your own body is so important for all of us.

Thank you so much for this tantalizingfemme! Your response has been a massive help to me in many ways. :)

I'm going to keep mulling this over...

[CherylNYC]

I wasn't always a stonefemme. It sort of... came over me. I formerly liked touching my partner's breasts well enough, but they were never a huge fireworks event for me. I'm no longer comfortable playing with my partner's breasts, so I don't. I make that clear right up front now.

I'm a lesbian and a sculptor. I love women in all their forms, and I love to look at a woman's body at least as much as the next dyke, so I do not prefer a surgically flattened chest. I really enjoy the look of a butch in a sports bra, or none at all. A butch in a binder is ok, but they always look so… uncomfortable!

That said, I'm profoundly sexually submissive. I find that I'm comically shy about looking at my top's body when we're first getting to know each other. Perhaps I'm responding to their almost universal preference to remain at least partially clothed once things get intimate? For whatever reason, I'm very careful to not stare at my partner/top now.

[~baby~doll~]

i enjoy even love and adore breasts. i fantasize about nipples and clamps and such. i like to cuddle, coddle, kiss, lick and suckle them. i am with a femme partner. i have been with butches and treat their breasts as they prefer. i still like them under any circumstances.

[fatallyblonde]

I'm not turned on by breasts and have no desire to touch them or otherwise play with them... it makes me uncomfortable like I don't know what I'm doing and am doing the wrong thing... lol... I don't mind if they are out or whatever, they certainly don't repulse me (and I'm be concerned about myself if they did), but I guess it makes me feel weird and like positions are reversed in a way that fucks with my head if I'm asked to touch/kiss/suck/whatever. I guess, to ME, it feels a bit too dominating or feminising my partner. I would never expect my partner to give up something she likes for my sake but most of the time I end up in bed with people where the boundaries have been made clear. And if I were unsure, I would initiate conversation.
What my partner does with her body is her business, I would be mortified if I were so shallow or selfish that my partner were to become less attractive to me if she did something with HER* body that SHE wanted to do. As someone else said in the thread, confidence is attractive and my partner feeling good about herself and being able to communicate her desires is the most attractive thing of all.

*or other pronouns as individual directs

[little_ms_sunshyne]

Breasts are beautiful and sexy! With that being said, I am in agreement with it depending on my partner. I am very much a pleaser and that is what turns me on above anything else. Respecting boundaries is at the very top of the list.


Great Topic!

[candy_coated_bitch]

I think Butch breasts are really, really hot and sexy. I also really love breasts in general and find myself mesmerized by Femme breasts as well, though I am not really sexually attracted to them. Kind of more of an appreciation kind of thing.

I have been partnered with more FTMs than Butch women, so I am used to flat chests and find them very sexy as well.

I don't have a one size fits all kind of thing going when it comes to attraction and what I find turns me on with my partners' bodies. (Which is not to say there is anything wrong with having strong and particular preferences.)

Boundaries and are really important and doing something to a person they don't like just is not sexy. I have had folks on the transmasculine spectrum let me touch and fondle their chests prior to top surgeries and I found it freaking HAWT and have been with folks who either already had top surgery or wanted that area ignored and that was fine as well. :)

Short answer: I love it all and nothing is really a deal breaker for me!

[Gemme]

My partner doesn't have breasts in the way that we usually define them. He has a chest. That said, I've never been a breast person though, like CCB said, I appreciate them. My appreciation isn't sexual really. More like a fascination. Given that boy and butch breasts aren't a major turn on for me, they have not been a huge factor in choosing my partners. In fact, the less they think about theirs breasts and chests, the happier I am. That gives me more time to devote to other body parts that do turn me on.

[Bèsame*]

What ever the desires and/or boundaries I really enjoy wiggling on skin on skin contact.

[Redsunflower]

Just wanted to say thanks to everyone who has posted.

I love your comments, so interesting and so honest, I'll be back to respond when I've had some sleep, it's been the longest, busiest day ever.

Thank you all. :rrose:

Rxx

[vagina]

How do you feel about your partner's breasts?

I love 'em. I want to suck on them for hours. Sometimes I have been allowed to suck on them for hours... lets just say it makes me tingle down there!

Are they a turn on or not?

Huge turn on. I used to like small breasts and after being with someone with Double D's I am now a HUGE fan of C and D cups :)

Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them?

The more I ignore them, the more I want to play with them.

Do binding vests turn you on?

No, they are a turn off for two reasons: 1) the butch is causing damage to own body with all that compression on rib cage. 2) I can no longer tell if that's a butch or a man.

If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you?

I would never stay with someone if they mutilated their breasts.

[C0LLETTE]

well, this should prove interesting.

[DapperButch]

well, this should prove interesting.

:|

No worries, I have tied myself down to my chair and my laptop is out of reach...

[*Anya*]

How do you feel about your partner's breasts?

I love 'em. I want to suck on them for hours. Sometimes I have been allowed to suck on them for hours... lets just say it makes me tingle down there!

Are they a turn on or not?

Huge turn on. I used to like small breasts and after being with someone with Double D's I am now a HUGE fan of C and D cups :)

Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them?

The more I ignore them, the more I want to play with them.

Do binding vests turn you on?

No, they are a turn off for two reasons: 1) the butch is causing damage to own body with all that compression on rib cage. 2) I can no longer tell if that's a butch or a man.

If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you?

I would never stay with someone if they mutilated their breasts.


Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and we all have preferences but this post bothers me very much.

I read a lot of judgment here with words like mutilate, can't tell if that's a butch or man, etc.

We just do not do that here at the Planet.

It is called acceptance for the diversity that our community has.

We have butches that are transgendered and some bind and some have had top surgery.

Please be mindful of the choices of others-even if those choices are not ones you would make or would be attracted to.

[Medusa]

How do you feel about your partner's breasts?

I love 'em. I want to suck on them for hours. Sometimes I have been allowed to suck on them for hours... lets just say it makes me tingle down there!

Are they a turn on or not?

Huge turn on. I used to like small breasts and after being with someone with Double D's I am now a HUGE fan of C and D cups :)

Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them?

The more I ignore them, the more I want to play with them.

Do binding vests turn you on?

No, they are a turn off for two reasons: 1) the butch is causing damage to own body with all that compression on rib cage. 2) I can no longer tell if that's a butch or a man.

If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you?

I would never stay with someone if they mutilated their breasts.




vagina-

Your post was reported for Transphobia.

So, a couple of things. Anya made some good points about being mindful of other people's choices and I want to reiterate that we have *all* kinds of folks as members of the Planet. We have Butches who are Trans and Transmen who are still Butch-identified. We have Transwomen. We have Femmes who strap. We have bi Butches and Femmes. All different kinds of people make up this community so it is super important that we are being respectful of everyone's lives here.

It feels ugly to me to refer to binding or breast surgery as "mutilation". It implies that people should not have domain over their own bodies if they do anything to remove the feminine aspects. That's actually really old school Feminism before it learned that gender is not binary.

Would it be "mutilation" to you if a Femme wanted breast implants?

Here's the thing, some folks don't want their breasts. And if they make the choice to bind them down or remove them, it's none of our business.

I've heard a lot of anti-Trans sentiment on the internet refer to breast manipulation as "mutilation". As if these people are so steeped in self-hatred that they are grabbing the first rusty kitchen knife they can find and hacking away at themselves while crying in the corner and eating a bucket of chicken.
It assumes that any woman (or person born with female parts) who wants to alter her body *must* be doing so out of self-hatred.

Again, to assume that a woman (or person born with female parts) who wants to change her body must be doing so out of self-hatred is sexist. It also reinforces that bullshit where we need other people's permission to live in our own bodies the way we see fit.

In short, be super careful around the language used to talk about other people's bodies. We don't want this space supporting Transphobia, woman-hating sentiment, or the idea that women (or female-parted people) can't decide for themselves what to do with their bodies.


Thanks, now let's get the discussion back to the topic!

Angie

[vagina]

Mutilation or maiming is an act of physical injury that degrades the appearance or function of any living body, sometimes causing death.

The traditional Chinese practices of língchí and foot binding are forms of mutilation that have captured the imagination of Westerners, as well as the now tourist centered "long-neck" people, a sub-group of the Karen known as the Padaung where women wear brass rings around their neck. The act of tattooing is also considered a form of self-mutilation according to some cultural traditions, such as within Christianity. A joint statement released by the United Nations and numerous other international bodies opposes female genital cutting (female circumcision) as a form of mutilation. Whether or not male circumcision amounts to mutilation is a subject of active academic debate.

[Medusa]

Mutilation or maiming is an act of physical injury that degrades the appearance or function of any living body, sometimes causing death.

The traditional Chinese practices of língchí and foot binding are forms of mutilation that have captured the imagination of Westerners, as well as the now tourist centered "long-neck" people, a sub-group of the Karen known as the Padaung where women wear brass rings around their neck. The act of tattooing is also considered a form of self-mutilation according to some cultural traditions, such as within Christianity. A joint statement released by the United Nations and numerous other international bodies opposes female genital cutting (female circumcision) as a form of mutilation. Whether or not male circumcision amounts to mutilation is a subject of active academic debate.

And there is the sticking point in red. Define "degrades the appearance or function of" without resorting to holding the breast up as some sort of herald of femaleness.

Again, women (or folks with female parts) can remove their breasts if they want to.

Did Angelina Jolie "mutilate" herself when she had a bilateral mastectomy in response to Cancer?

It becomes Transphobic when it's only mutilation if the person born with the breasts wants them removed or bound for gender purposes.

[vagina]

It's LESBOPHOBIC to tell me that I am wrong for wanting a BUTCH and not a man.

[*Anya*]

It's LESBOPHOBIC to tell me that I am wrong for wanting a BUTCH and not a man.

Good grief no one said anything of the sort.

I'm a lesbian for god's sake.

We are talking judgmental!

[Medusa]

It's LESBOPHOBIC to tell me that I am wrong for wanting a BUTCH and not a man.


vagina-

It is very telling to me that you resort to "someone telling you are wrong for wanting a Butch" when we are merely asking you to be respectful of Transfolks.

You can want any Butch or woman you desire. What you cannot do is bust up on this website and spout transphobic bullshit as if it is a recipe for chicken soup and then back it up with us somehow harming you when we tell you to stop using disrespectful language.

It is EASY AS FUCK to say "this is what I desire" without resorting to dissing what you don't desire.

I'm always agog when people say something racist, sexist, or transphobic and then when people call them out on it, they are somehow being victimized.

I am directing you not to post in this thread again or you will face a time-out.

Now, back to business.

Thanks,
Angie

[vagina]

JUDGEMENT

the ability to make considered decisions or come to sensible conclusions.


If I am judgmental and have the ability to make considered decision or to come to a sensible conclusion, I'll take it.


If foot binding in China was mutilation because of expected beauty standards for women to have small feet....

Then cutting off one's breasts is mutilation because of expected beauty standards to appear as a male and to have a flat chest....




Let's not bring up Angelina Jolie and the cancer scare- that's a whole other ball game.


I will not apologize for loving BUTCH bodies instead of Butchered bodies. I mean, people have the right to make their own decisions and do whatever they want with their own bodies. And at the same time People are allowed to have a judgement and a dissenting opinion. If someone says I am not attracted to breasts, then I can say, well, I am attracted to breasts. If someone says I love how FTMs look with flattened breasts, then I can say that I do not enjoy people cutting off their breasts.

[Medusa]

JUDGEMENT

the ability to make considered decisions or come to sensible conclusions.


If I am judgmental and have the ability to make considered decision or to come to a sensible conclusion, I'll take it.


If foot binding in China was mutilation because of expected beauty standards for women to have small feet....

Then cutting off one's breasts is mutilation because of expected beauty standards to appear as a male and to have a flat chest....




Let's not bring up Angelina Jolie and the cancer scare- that's a whole other ball game.


I will not apologize for loving BUTCH bodies instead of Butchered bodies. I mean, people have the right to make their own decisions and do whatever they want with their own bodies. And at the same time People are allowed to have a judgement and a dissenting opinion. If someone says I am not attracted to breasts, then I can say, well, I am attracted to breasts. If someone says I love how FTMs look with flattened breasts, then I can say that I do not enjoy people cutting off their breasts.



Sigh.


vagina - You are now on a 30-day time-out from the site. During that time you are not to access our resources in any way.


Thanks,
Angie

[Nadeest]

I would love to play with my partner's breasts. However, I will respect her/hys/his boundries, just as I would want them to respect my own.

That being said, I love playing with breasts. I also love pleasing my partner, all to hell and back.

[Redsunflower]

*speechless*

Thanks so much to everyone who managed to reply in such a calm way and to Medusa for doing what needed to be done.

:rrose:

[Ginger]

I've been with someone who had top surgery, someone who had a mastectomy and someone who had a big butch chest.

I loved each of them and have memories of how tender and hot our sex was, but the second person was the love of my life, so to speak, and ours was the most mind-blowing sex.

It was because of her energy and our emotional connection, not her body necessarily, though I adored her body type.

[Femmadian]

How do you feel about your partner's breasts?
Are they a turn on or not?
Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them?
Do binding vests turn you on?
If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you?

I am currently un-partnered so this is all theoretical:
1) I love 'em.
2) Huge turn on.
3) Touch and play, definitely. I love the way they feel so tender and soft, love the jiggle they do during certain activities... Love nibbling on them and feeling the nipples grow hard under my tongue or between my teeth! If one of us is on top of the other and facing each other during sex, that feeling of having our breasts mashed together in a hot, sweaty mess is really arousing. When I embrace them, it's nice to feel their breasts up against mine and be reminded of their physicality since all breasts are pretty unique and no two sets feel or look the same! Maybe it's an animalistic response, like being able to pick out your partner's distinctive smell? I dunno.
4) I'm currently undecided about binding. I won't say it's an active turn-off but not a turn on at this point.
5) Hmmmm, I don't know that they'd be less attractive to me but to be totally honest, I'd probably be a bit disappointed to not be able to see, touch, play with, or snuggle up to them anymore. They're just so lovely! :-)

All that being said, if a partner preferred they not be touched or they felt the desire for top surgery, I would completely respect that. The only thing we really ever own is our own bodies and I'm not about to tell anyone what they can or can't do with theirs.

[Christina]

For myself personally… If I don’t know your boundaries before we become intimate… then I don’t know you well enough to be in bed (also read as… floor/table/car/grass etc… you get the idea here) with you… 9 times out of 10, I have engaged in some level of communication which includes verbal (can also be read as sexual) play… prior to the giving of my essence… My preference is Stone… though in my very early years I have experienced the various levels of Butches… that being said, I am not a breast seeking Femme… although I will press against a bound and or surgically enhanced chest in a hot minute… if it brings pleasure for my partner…

Now just to comment on a few things I’ve read… If a Butch (to any degree on the spectrum) chooses to wear a binding vest… common sense instructs them to be properly sized, so if damaged is being done to their body, I say try another distributor… further more I would think that if a Femme can’t tell the difference between said Butch and a “man” perhaps a lesson in B/F energy needs to be reviewed… because there is a difference… again in my sole opinion… I know this may (or perhaps may not) sound harsh being expressed from one Femme to another… but I cannot abide by the judgment that equates surgically enhanced with mutilation… that’s like saying one Femme is more Femme than the other… because she is Stone versus Soft Femme Butch…

By the way… mutilation is the act of Disfigurement… Marring… Defacing… Injuring… crap just out an out HURTING oneself…

I hope this is making sense I just got home from work… and haven’t had my coffee yet…

[GeeGina]

Not that anyone asked, but I think the point I connected with most was from our friend tantalizingfemme, who said that the real turn on was how confident her partner felt with their body.

This excellent point makes clear the fact that if someone isn't feeling confident or comfortable in their own skin sex/intimacy will always be a limited experience because there will be boundaries, reservations, hesitations, etc.

As a femme and as a lover, I want to encourage, empower, and embolden my partner - so I accept them as they are and for who they are.

[Words]

My preference is Stone… though in my very early years I have experienced the various levels of Butches…

Aaaaaaaaaaaggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Could we please, please, pleeeeeeeeease not refer to 'levels of butch'? There are types of butches, just as there are types of femmes, but levels? Um, no.

Words

[Christina]

[QUOTE=Words;907660]Aaaaaaaaaaaggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Could we please, please, pleeeeeeeeease not refer to 'levels of butch'? There are types of butches, just as there are types of femmes, but levels? Um, no.

Words[/QUOTE

Apologies... various TYPES of butches... although I have read the term "level" used throughout the site... I was not attempting to grade anyone...

[Kimpooh]

So, what I would like to ask you all is:
How do you feel about your partner's breasts?
Are they a turn on or not?
Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them?
Do binding vests turn you on?
If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you?

I love her breasts!! She however, does not. In fact until we got together, she hadn't been intimate without a shirt or sports bra on in 20 years!! This was one of many "rules", as a butch, she laid out to me. But she quickly realized how much I TRULY loved them & gradually relaxed completely without covering them up. I realize that initially she did this for me but now she loves that I worship her entire body! Why wouldn't i? Even tho they disrupt her mannish appearance to her, to me they are a part of her & a potential source of pleasure for us both & I love every single inch of her!!
As for top surgery....it would make me sad (cuz I really am a boob girl 😊) but ultimately it's HER that I love, not only her breasts

[thedreamerin]

Breasts make me happy :). Not mine but hers.... still if she didn't want me to touch them I could respect that...
But if she'd let me.. I'll be very happy :D
Binding vests.. I am not sure...
I just find that if I am attracted to someone I just am... that would include the little things about them. If she had top surgery well...are we talking because she's going to transition or are we talking in terms of, she's had some sort of illness that requires it? It's two different things... I would think though if I am already in love with that person it wouldn't matter.

hmm...

[Borneheld]

How do you feel about your partner's breasts? My partner has had top surgery, but before the surgery I didn't feel any way about his breasts, they were just there.


Are they a turn on or not? Not a turn on


Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them? I didn't ignore them, they just didn't exist as breasts. Even if I saw them they I made no mental connection that they were breasts. Sounds strange I know, but it's the truth.


Do binding vests turn you on? Nope just another piece of clothing like socks. (which don't turn me on)


If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you? The chest being flat is physically attractive to me but what really is the turn on how he finally feels happy with his body. That extra self confidence (because we all know he wasn't lacking any to begin with ;) ) is pretty hot.

Very good answers, your guy is a lucky man!

[Deborah*]

Hm, interesting. I'm probably not the best to answer this, but personally I like breast -a lot!-

I dont care as much about how they are contained or not, binded, in a bra, running wild and free- I think they're great!
I have no problem with a butches breasts. The fact is, I'm attracted to that person.. it isn't like I thought hmmm.. breasts I don't want you. I like butches who bind and those who have big breasts.. medium breasts.. small breasts. It's the whole package of who a person is on the inside & outside that does it for me.

Of all the butches I've ever dated, the one I wish I still knew was..
Janna W., a butch intellectual. She had a flat top hairstyle, when I met her (it was instant attraction for both of us), she had her large breasts bound. On our first date, she was wearing a pale pink long sleeved shirt and jeans and had big breasts.

Her breasts were no big deal to me... I just knew she was hot, hot. Very scholarly, assertive, and honestly hot. A very butch woman.

Unfortunately, our relationship ended when she moved far away to the east coast under a prestigious academic program.

Deborah

[Femminator]

I am sharing my story because that whole "top surgery is mutilation" thing really set my teeth on edge.

Yes I like Butch breasts, but I am not a breast woman and have always liked Butches who are smaller busted and have not minded if they bind.

I fell in love and was blessed to have married the Butch of my dreams. We have been together over 13 years now. They have never been thrilled with their breasts, but pretty much ignored them. However, I began to notice that they were becoming more and more dysphoric about their breasts, and so it was not a shock that they came to me one day and said they had some figuring out to do about their gender presentation.(my exact words were 'well, go figure it out and let me know, I'm not going anywhere') and so for the last few years we have been on a journey as a couple through therapy and them determining who they are and how they want to present.

We have been binding for over a year and they have gotten more dysphoric with their binder off, as time has gone on to the point they are actually anxious about it. I seriously have a love/hate relationship with those damn binders, they are anxious without it, and miserable and hot with them on under layers of clothing in an effort to hide their breasts. Finally I lost it this Fall and said "Look, take some of our savings, and get top surgery, I can't stand watching you be miserable any longer." So, that is what we are doing. After the initial consult and set up of the appointment, the change that has overcome my Butch is amazing. They are more loving, sexual and assured that their pain will be soon ending. That steps to make the outside match how they feel on the inside are happening.

We ALL change how we look to be who we see ourselves as. Femmes wear makeup, people gauge their ears, people reduce or increase their breasts, they get tummy tucks and rhinoplastys. They shoot Botulism into their faces to get rid of wrinkles, and they inject collegen into lips and cheeks to make them full and plush. People who talk about top surgery as mutilation, that is a very myoptic view of something that is being done for emotional and mental well being, not just to look better for what society perceives as 'pretty' or 'sexy'. If anything it is MORE important than all that.

[girl_dee]

Hello my fabulous femme sisters. :stillheart:

I was wondering if you could help me out with something; I would really love to hear a few femme opinions on this. If you want to pull up a chair and grab a glass of wine, all the better. :wine:




How do you feel about your partner's breasts?
Are they a turn on or not?
Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them?
Do binding vests turn you on?
If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you?



How do you feel about your partner's breasts? They are part of hym and so i love them!

Are they a turn on or not? Yes, in the same way that the rest of hym turns me on

Do you want to touch them? Ignore them? Play with them?Yes yes and YES

Do binding vests turn you on? Not at all

If your partner had top surgery, would they become more or less attractive to you? Of course not, i would be very supportive. However, hy would not become *more butch* to me, or more desirable.

My thoughts:

As a femme it is always a VERY sensitive subject with a butch, the subject of butch breasts. Some butches are very much against the thought of being touched, even by accident on their breasts. Some hate their breasts and want them gone. While trying to learn and respect those boundaries, some of us tread lightly. i do hope butches are aware of this.

i do know that i do better with a butch who isn’t apprehensive about parts of their butch body. It helps me be less apprehensive about mine. i do better with someone who doesn’t feel feminized by their butch breasts being touched. They are part of their butch anatomy, and i love the human body as is, butch femme or otherwise.

IMO if they exude butch energy, breasts won’t deflate that energy in my eyes. Even if they let me touch, kiss and bite!

[DapperButch]

I am sharing my story because that whole "top surgery is mutilation" thing really set my teeth on edge.

Yes I like Butch breasts, but I am not a breast woman and have always liked Butches who are smaller busted and have not minded if they bind.

I fell in love and was blessed to have married the Butch of my dreams. We have been together over 13 years now. They have never been thrilled with their breasts, but pretty much ignored them. However, I began to notice that they were becoming more and more dysphoric about their breasts, and so it was not a shock that they came to me one day and said they had some figuring out to do about their gender presentation.(my exact words were 'well, go figure it out and let me know, I'm not going anywhere') and so for the last few years we have been on a journey as a couple through therapy and them determining who they are and how they want to present.

We have been binding for over a year and they have gotten more dysphoric with their binder off, as time has gone on to the point they are actually anxious about it. I seriously have a love/hate relationship with those damn binders, they are anxious without it, and miserable and hot with them on under layers of clothing in an effort to hide their breasts. Finally I lost it this Fall and said "Look, take some of our savings, and get top surgery, I can't stand watching you be miserable any longer." So, that is what we are doing. After the initial consult and set up of the appointment, the change that has overcome my Butch is amazing. They are more loving, sexual and assured that their pain will be soon ending. That steps to make the outside match how they feel on the inside are happening.

We ALL change how we look to be who we see ourselves as. Femmes wear makeup, people gauge their ears, people reduce or increase their breasts, they get tummy tucks and rhinoplastys. They shoot Botulism into their faces to get rid of wrinkles, and they inject collegen into lips and cheeks to make them full and plush. People who talk about top surgery as mutilation, that is a very myoptic view of something that is being done for emotional and mental well being, not just to look better for what society perceives as 'pretty' or 'sexy'. If anything it is MORE important than all that.

Just a FYI, if your partner's insurance does not have trans health benefits, they do have the option to fight for coverage for this surgery. Michigan is a state that does not allow private insurance or Medicaid to EXCLUDE trans health care in their benefits.

https://transequality.org/issues/resources/map-state-health-insurance-rules

[Femminator]

Just a FYI, if your partner's insurance does not have trans health benefits, they do have the option to fight for coverage for this surgery. Michigan is a state that does not allow private insurance or Medicaid to EXCLUDE trans health care in their benefits.

https://transequality.org/issues/resources/map-state-health-insurance-rules

Thank you. We simply had a terrible time finding a good top surgeon who takes insurance near us. By the time we travel out of state, to find a Doc who takes insurance, we will have to stay a week to get a recheck, so the cost of hotels, travel and food.. etc and so on...it is actually just cheaper for us to pay up front. Wish we loved somewhere that had more options nearby.

[DapperButch]

Thank you. We simply had a terrible time finding a good top surgeon who takes insurance near us. By the time we travel out of state, to find a Doc who takes insurance, we will have to stay a week to get a recheck, so the cost of hotels, travel and food.. etc and so on...it is actually just cheaper for us to pay up front. Wish we loved somewhere that had more options nearby.

Yes, unfortunately, a lot of the good top surgeons don't take insurance. Good luck to your partner. They are lucky to have you.

[cathexis]

Thank you. We simply had a terrible time finding a good top surgeon who takes insurance near us. By the time we travel out of state, to find a Doc who takes insurance, we will have to stay a week to get a recheck, so the cost of hotels, travel and food.. etc and so on...it is actually just cheaper for us to pay up front. Wish we loved somewhere that had more options nearby.

Know how you feel about going an out of state surgeon. I've gone to VT round trip once now I have another appointment for a follow-up (why I don't know why whatever couldn't have been done the first visit), then the top surgery and immediate post-op follow up. How long will that last? I am a SICU RN, and know how to pull a drain. I just won't know at what point he will want it pulled. Can't really afford to spend a week at a motel or hostel (if I can find one).

Wonder how many office visits before the surgery. It costs me $100 a pop for each trip, and the driver is iffy. Like I have an appt. at the end of the month, and she still hasn't given me an answer as to whether or not she can take me. It's 2 hrs. away so I can't just get a ride at the drop of a hat. Not only do I have to worry about the appt. but how I'm going to get there. and what's going to happen after surgery. I have 2 cats to worry about, too. My Partner won't just leave me in Burlington, and go back home to care for the cats. I know Her.

Dapper, what usually happens from this point? Do I have the surgery on the appt. after this one? How long will I need to hang around Burlington? It takes how long until the drains come out...the sutures? How much pain should I be in? Do I need pain meds.? I'm a little scared right now. Please! Oh, and by the way you were right about GQ, just not talking about it with anyone, yet.
cathexis

[DapperButch]

Know how you feel about going an out of state surgeon. I've gone to VT round trip once now I have another appointment for a follow-up (why I don't know why whatever couldn't have been done the first visit), then the top surgery and immediate post-op follow up. How long will that last? I am a SICU RN, and know how to pull a drain. I just won't know at what point he will want it pulled. Can't really afford to spend a week at a motel or hostel (if I can find one).

Wonder how many office visits before the surgery. It costs me $100 a pop for each trip, and the driver is iffy. Like I have an appt. at the end of the month, and she still hasn't given me an answer as to whether or not she can take me. It's 2 hrs. away so I can't just get a ride at the drop of a hat. Not only do I have to worry about the appt. but how I'm going to get there. and what's going to happen after surgery. I have 2 cats to worry about, too. My Partner won't just leave me in Burlington, and go back home to care for the cats. I know Her.

Dapper, what usually happens from this point? Do I have the surgery on the appt. after this one? How long will I need to hang around Burlington? It takes how long until the drains come out...the sutures? How much pain should I be in? Do I need pain meds.? I'm a little scared right now. Please! Oh, and by the way you were right about GQ, just not talking about it with anyone, yet.
cathexis

Hey, Bud. I don't know if your surgeon will schedule your surgery after this appointment.
I have never heard of a surgeon asking for a second appointment, so I have no idea. We have already talked about this guy, though. You know my concerns. :)

I was right about GQ? What does GQ mean?

The surgeon may not use drains. If they do, yes they pull them at 7 days post op. Most surgeons expect people to stay in the area for a week. However, if you are only two hours away, maybe you can just stay one night and then go home the day after. Then just travel back for the post op appt. I strongly recommend you stay at least one night.

You can see if you can get this surgeon to let your PCP pull your drains, but I can't imagine a surgeon being ok with not having any post op appointments.

They use dissolvable sutures.

Some people have a lot of pain, some don't. I do not have a high pain tolerance (when looking at other surgeries), yet I only took pain meds for the first few days (don't remember how many days, exactly), and then went to Tylenol. I assume your surgeon will prescribe you pain meds.

[Femminator]

Hey, Bud. I don't know if your surgeon will schedule your surgery after this appointment.
I have never heard of a surgeon asking for a second appointment, so I have no idea. We have already talked about this guy, though. You know my concerns. :)

I was right about GQ? What does GQ mean?

The surgeon may not use drains. If they do, yes they pull them at 7 days post op. Most surgeons expect people to stay in the area for a week. However, if you are only two hours away, maybe you can just stay one night and then go home the day after. Then just travel back for the post op appt. I strongly recommend you stay at least one night.

You can see if you can get this surgeon to let your PCP pull your drains, but I can't imagine a surgeon being ok with not having any post op appointments.

They use dissolvable sutures.

Some people have a lot of pain, some don't. I do not have a high pain tolerance (when looking at other surgeries), yet I only took pain meds for the first few days (don't remember how many days, exactly), and then went to Tylenol. I assume your surgeon will prescribe you pain meds.

Every surgeon does this differently.

Ours is about 3 hours away and he said we could do he re opt check(other than vitals the day of)in over the computer, that he does that for his clients that live more than 1.5 hours away. He did want us to stay overnight in a hotel and not drive back the same day. He does not use drains so that is not an issue either. We have to come back a week later for the post op checkup.