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-   -   Here come the lesbians, here come the leaping lesbians... (http://www.butchfemmeplanet.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1469)

Gayla 08-01-2011 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tapu (Post 390168)
I am not used to the heightened fragility that pervades the threads. I haven't suffered enough, or I'm not holding over enough past suffering now. I've been encouraged to post as I do--that at least it's interesting and different--but it does seem that an awful lot of people are getting hurt rather than just going with it.

There's an honest answer. I haven't decided if I'll stick with it or leave here. I'm hoping to be able to stick with it, but it's a little nerve-wracking.

I thought my question was fairly direct and, honestly, I was hoping for a direct answer. If your intention was not to be disrespectful and I just, as I've been told in multiple rep comments, "misunderstood", then I would hope you would say that.

I find your comment about the fragility of members here to be deflective and dismissive of the fact that some people enjoy serious discussions and don't feel the need to just couch everything in humor.

One of the great things about this community is that there is room here for everyone, in whatever way they like to participate, as long as it's done in a respectful manner. Poking at folks, throwing the blame back at them and then threatening to flounce out, doesn't really come across as respectful.

Daktari 08-01-2011 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anya/Georgia (Post 390251)
I try very hard to only use "I" statements on the planet, I get less flack that way. Though I had even been misunderstood when I posted something that I read as completely positive.

That said, I feel I must comment and let the chips fall where they may.

For some reason, this thread as well as the other Lesbian thread, is pushing a lot of our buttons. I think we can all agree that it is a subject near and dear to our hearts.

I think that many of us can agree that the fact that there are so many former lesbians (I can hear the shit now for saying former but for me, if you were a woman-identified woman, not on T, loving and having sex with women, to ME, that is the definition of a lesbian) transitioning stirs up lots of feelings for us.

Those of you that do not agree with my definition, no problem, you do not need to agree with me. It is simply my opinion and perception. Yours may be different. You can disagree but do not attack me for seeing it differently than you do.

Many of may feel negated (I do sometimes). Many of us feel like our herstory is being negated (I do sometimes) and underneath all of the feelings that get stirred up is FOR ME and I speak for myself here is:

Fear and Anxiety.

When I feel fearful and anxious, it is much easier for me to get angry. Anger makes me feel much stronger than fear does.

I read lots of things on these threads that I do not agree with. I try really hard to not be reactive but to be thoughtful to try to figure out why something is bothering me.

We owe that to each other don't we? We are all lesbians here are we not, commenting on lesbian issues? We do not have to agree but we do have to be polite, respectful and thoughtful when we read something that hits us wrong or makes us upset.

Out in the world people give us shit all day long for who and what we are and for what we believe. I really do not want to do that to my Lesbian sisters, whether you are butch or femme and I hope everyone can take a step back so that we can continue to learn from each other.

:goodpost:, nay make that A Great Post!

tapu 08-01-2011 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayla (Post 390263)
I thought my question was fairly direct and, honestly, I was hoping for a direct answer. If your intention was not to be disrespectful and I just, as I've been told in multiple rep comments, "misunderstood", then I would hope you would say that.

I find your comment about the fragility of members here to be deflective and dismissive of the fact that some people enjoy serious discussions and don't feel the need to just couch everything in humor.

One of the great things about this community is that there is room here for everyone, in whatever way they like to participate, as long as it's done in a respectful manner. Poking at folks, throwing the blame back at them and then threatening to flounce out, doesn't really come across as respectful.

Okay. Well, I don't feel like I can say anything more about that.

OS Butch 08-01-2011 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tapu (Post 390141)
How 'bout those Red Sox, huh?


Booooo!!!! How about those Nats.....:blink: Ok maybe not.:jester:

Chancie 08-01-2011 11:58 AM

Does it always end up being about the butches?

Martina 08-01-2011 12:38 PM

i had made some heartfelt angst-ridden comment before the lightness ensued and did do a double take. But that happens all the time. And some of the participants i noted were (to me) trusted members. So i just let it go. i don't feel that reacting to that makes me someone with heightened sensitivities. i didn't respond (though i did react) because i do not think we can manage people's participation to the degree that at least i would sometimes want.

On a music site i have been part of for many years, this sort of thing is constant. And then when you call people on it -- usually young bio men -- the ensuing uproar makes it so not worth it. Talk about sensitive. God the number of times i have been called politically correct over there.

i guess it's partly the thread title, etc. i don't know.

One comment i have about the BV thing -- and this is entirely frivolous on my part -- is how glad i am that i am not involved. i think it may be productive discord, but it's just not worth it to me. i am glad there are young people and more political people who are willing to surrender some of their peace of mind to fight these battles. i am not right now.

dark_crystal 08-01-2011 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anya/Georgia (Post 390251)
I try very hard to only use "I" statements on the planet, I get less flack that way. Though I had even been misunderstood when I posted something that I read as completely positive.

i know what you mean- before i post anything in any thread that is not specifically "fluff," i quintuple-check every single word for anything that anyone might possibly be offended by.

then, i worry and worry about it and half the time find myself rushing back to the computer hoping it hasn't been 30 minutes yet and i can still edit

even taking these precautions, i've landed in hot water a few times and there is at least one of those incidents i STILL don't understand

i am not sure what it is. even going into a board meeting with all five of my bosses i wouldn't get as anxious as i do posting in "serious" threads

tapu 08-01-2011 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dark_crystal (Post 390328)
i know what you mean- before i post anything in any thread that is not specifically "fluff," i quintuple-check every single word for anything that anyone might possibly be offended by.

then, i worry and worry about it and half the time find myself rushing back to the computer hoping it hasn't been 30 minutes yet and i can still edit

even taking these precautions, i've landed in hot water a few times and there is at least one of those incidents i STILL don't understand

i am not sure what it is. even going into a board meeting with all five of my bosses i wouldn't get as anxious as i do posting in "serious" threads

It's hard to say anything of value under that kind of pressure or social risk. I either can't or won't monitor myself to that extent. Not sure what to do with that.

BullDog 08-01-2011 02:05 PM

I've been quite baffled. To me discussing what's going on with BV in here was quite natural, since it is a topic of interest to butch women, lesbians and our partners, friends and allies. I personally think of the Lesbian Zone that way- open to whatever lesbians and our friends are interested in talking about. I didn't care for being told it shouldn't be discussed here.

However the fluffiness and leaping certainly seems appropriate to me too and actually more in keeping with the original intent of the thread.

To those who don't want a serious discussion interrupted, I would think it would be more appropriate to voice those concerns in a thread dedicated to that specific serious discussion than here. That's just my opinion of course.

For threads not specifically devoted to one defined topic I don't see why multiple conversations can't be going on at the same time.

Melissa 08-01-2011 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liam (Post 116212)
Some of our members are having a difficult time seeing the lesbians in our community. Please step up, and let them know you are here.

Lesbian in the house :)


Melissa

Heart 08-01-2011 02:50 PM

As someone who was involved in the serious BV discussion in this thread,(and I don't think that was just about butches), I had NO issue with the light posts that were interjected. They didn't bother me one bit. Seems like a lot of energy has now been spent back-and-forth making assumptions about people's intent and scolding them.

But eh, happens all the time.

I can remember occasions when I did feel that someone's thread flirting was intruding on the conversation when I did feel fragile in threads, when I did police discussions, when I did storm off in a huff, when I did feel unfairly chastised or moderated, and when I most certainly did decide never to post on the boards again.

lol.

tapu 08-01-2011 03:12 PM

Quote:

Tapu -- Your recent posts seem (to me) a little tantrumy, like "If I can't say what I want, then I don't want to say anything at all".

June--I don't think I should be allowed to say anything I want and I never even began to throw a "tantrum" about that. I said "Hey, how about them red sox?" and delivered it in a way that fit in perfectly with the flow of the thread. I wonder if the one person who took offense at that had been following the thread. It didn't seem that she got the context at all.

And then here's just something I ask you to consider: Was my saying that about the red sox really as offensive as you telling me I'm "tantrumy"? My remark was not to any one person, and was not an insult couched in terms of "to me."

I think that what's going on here is subtle in a lot of ways and I plan to reread and think about it, to see if there's something I think I should have done differently. Presently, I'm not feeling at fault.

tapu 08-01-2011 03:34 PM

No, not really. I see no distinction between 'tantrumy' and 'take your toys and go home.' And i think it's a side issue anyway. I would be more concerned about people feeling like they can't post without someone jumping down their throats. Regardless, I am planning to stick around and get more of a feel for things. I don't like to judge based on just a few experiences. I also believe that people can learn. Thank you for your responses.

tapu 08-01-2011 03:38 PM

I did pick up on that. Which is amazing since usually I'd be saying, "Red Sox, that's baseball, right? The round white ball with the pretty red stitching?"

Daktari 08-01-2011 03:39 PM

Baseball? Is that like rounders? :|

tapu 08-01-2011 03:42 PM

You have to remember that it's not the teeny white ball that people hit with the skinny stick. It's the bigger white ball that people hit with the larger stick.

Wait, what's the thread topic?

girl_dee 08-01-2011 03:46 PM

I am taking offense to the BEST baseball team in the history of baseball being used and abused in said June joke.


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