I get that, and guess what, I'm a new crafter. Enough said on that.

I've never told you that to do, nor do I intend to. .. im not interested in a fuss with you. But your intent to insult my integrity has struck a nerve. my Girl is very capable of defending herself. But you just put a very sour taste for a beginners like me in general.
So take it as you want. Crafting was fun, until now.

Kill joy.

I understand as we've been talking-

So I'm going to ask the group- do you feel that being 1 day late of sending causes a restriction?

Also- can everyone just drink some tea and calm down. I don't think Gemme was "attacking" Besame*, just simply asking if we could wait a few days between swaps and to see if anyone else wanted to put something forth to the table.

But I also feel that Gemme if you feel that the project is too soon- don't sign up, wait til another comes forth or if you really like what you passed up- do another.

Another thing, Blaze, if you don't often come into said thread and want a welcome I feel the best way to do so is not by jumping all over someone- take a step back and deep breath. Communication on the net is hard, especially when your trying to protect someone you care for.

Quoted from an earlier message.. For 2015, the rule is if one of us is more than a week late or drops out of a project for whatever reason, that person is welcome to continue posting but is not allowed to sign up for a project again until 2016. No exceptions. This rule must be posted at the bottom of all new projects that are being wrangled so that members can thoughtfully consider whether we wish to commit to a new project.

I believe according to the rules.. one day late does not equal a week or more..

Oh, thank you so much for looking that up and referencing the rule! I feel so much better now. :)

I accept your word for that Gemme, since I was not around for those discussions. I just want to mention, since we seem to be discussing it again, that the decision we recently made to allow two different projects to run simultaneously affects this directly. As a reminder, we discussed if it was okay for some of us to do the Summer Recipe Project, since part of the group was already involved in something else. As I recall, it came up partly because there have been a couple of projects lately with participation limited to just a few. Maybe the guidelines should be tweaked a bit more.

I think it was fine for Gemme to tell how she felt based on her understanding and experience and similarly fine for Besame to come in and express that she felt it was a bit harsh and was left feeling hurt. For those who have missed, here are some of the discussions we've had:

1) We've discussed how people should participate in 2-3 recent rounds as members successfully before wrangling. Why? Because it makes members confident that the wrangler is reliable. Why? Because when we haven't done that, we've all sent our stuff to a wrangler and had never received our projects!

2) We've discussed how it helps to give space between projects- to wait until the next is received so that it doesn't confuse new folks, and also because we were having a a problem with projects falling apart because too many were going at once.

3) We've also discussed how it's fine to have simultaneous projects going at once because there's a sense of fun and freedom to have this thread be a place where anyone can start a project anytime, and those not interested simply don't have to sign up. I know this seems contradictory to #2 but it isn't since neither are a set rule, just thoughtful input from participants for all to consider when making decisions on this thread.

As long as we speak to each other respectfully, we are cool here!

Breathless, thanks for going back and doing the research on this! I would have sorely missed CCB's contributions the rest of the year. It would probably be helpful if we, as a group, got back on track and got the list of thread rules in one location and for wranglers to post the whole list along with their round rules. That way, the current crafters have some say in it and everyone's on the same page with what is acceptable and what is not.

We could put the list together over the next few days and then, when it is finalized, Besame could have her sign up for the mosaic project. I think it's safe to say that a lot of people are interested in this project, so we should progress with it.

Does that sound fair to everyone?

That was discussed as a group and the rule was made if you participated in one, you could not participate in the other. I think that was a valid rule as the shrines were very time intensive. I have no problem with changes being made AS A GROUP. That's part of the ebb and flow of the thread.

My main points were that:

1. The current project hasn't even been received by the wrangler yet so we should not begin a new project right. this. second.

2. We did not, as a group, agree to who the next wrangler would be. No one asked anyone else.....it wasn't diplomatically done.

Thanks, ahk. I totally get your points and thanks for the :tea:

I'm holding firm to not wanting projects to get started until after the current project is mailed out by you. That's something we all discussed previously and I don't see what has changed to affect that. The mosaic project isn't a train. If we wait a few days, it won't leave without us. If anything, it gives people a little more time to get their stuff together for the mosaic sign up.

I think the whole 'if you don't like it, don't participate' is dismissive and feels very 'it's my way or the highway'. It basically bows down to groupthink. None of us are really yes men/women so why should we be here?

I'm saying that we should agree on time lines and projects as a group. In a diplomatic manner where everyone interested has a point of view.

I did ask that every time a new project is posted formally- that the rule about not following through and it's consequences be copy/pasted at the bottom of the post every time. I agree that that is important or else its specifics get forgotten.

It's my understanding re: multiple projects that it's not a rule that one can't participate in multiple projects at once but that the wrangler makes that decision. For instance, I forget who, perhaps CCB, said: If you are in my shrine project you cannot sign up for another project at the same time. It seems reasonable to me that the wrangler can have the power to make this decision.

We don't make these rules to be assholes. It's because we've been burnt in the past. Some people are eager to sign up for everything and then don't follow through. That's why we have these discussions and make rules when it seems they are needed.

Ideas.
 

To the Group:

I think a list of rules and regulations should be posted for each swapper to be aware of. Show the post every week for new comers to see and for us oldies to recall on. (I'm sure this was done along time ago, but some of us have come back later and some of us are new) But I think as a group we should all put something together, don't you think? And we should have an updated list of folks who are considered flakers (known as folks who don't send projects out or drop out at the last minute) as this should be posted to.

I don't like the idea of a list, either. We all get a clean slate on Jan. 1 every year.

The wranglers need some way of knowing who's on restriction, though, unless we're going to use the honor system. I would be okay with that; we seem to have pretty honorable folks here.

Some feedback and ideas (picked apart from various posts) for the general rules or whatnot for the thread