True. Not to make it sound like I think I am stupid. But, I am uneducated about a great many things. But, that is becomming a thing of the past as well. I have almost finished my AA in Business, loving that btw. But, I am also taking the time to learn about my own experiences and how I have been shaped by them. Good or bad. Introspective, retrospective, whatever. It has been a freeing experience especially in my inner view. While I still have fits of anger, lash out sometimes and express my "toolness", I do see marked improvement. Nothing at all wrong with that.

I often feel the same way. Or fear that it will be so. Especially if I'm speaking from my heart or about something I'm passionate about. There are lots of times when I realize after the fact that I could have said something better, more succinctly, but I have to hope that the readers will know my intent.

OMG. Bob is dreaming. He is barking in his sleep. Wiggling around too. Punk ass.

Anyhow, I cannot tell you how much I hate the fact that discussing things online can lead to hurting someone without meaning to. Tone or what you THINK is someone's tone is totally subjective. I hate the fact that you cannot see a person's eyes when you are speaking with them. It is a difficult thing to deal with sometimes. We have all had occasion to be offended by someone. They may or may not have meant anything by what was written. For me it is all about how much coffee I have in my tank that many times is the catalyst of if I feel hurt by something. rofl Not enough and I am just pissed. There, I've said it. I am ruled by the bean.

Can i ask some advice here?? When is appropriate to tell some that you are stone?? early in the relationship or wait until you get to know them better??

every time I enter this discussion my head feels like a pin ball machine.

for me its a type of dynamic I share with a stone butch. I dont want to touch hym/her in a feminine way yet I want to be touched that way. But really isnt this a butch-femme dynamic in a way? Maybe with a layer of stone?

but if my stone butch rolled over and asked me to fuck them them sideways I'd do it. It might not rock my world or float my boat but as a partner I'm more then happy to provide. :)

I like to tell woman I am dating right up front, because being with a stone isn't for everyone.

I prefer this conversation when its about to get intimate as far as connected chemistry goes. I would not have it just meeting someone. In fact I'm put off, turned off when a new interaction, getting to know someone becomes too sexual. If I'm interested, feelings mutual then before we proceed we do need that talk.

Ok, all good advice thanks! But surely, now call me old fashioned, people should get to know each other slowly, and let things develope. Sexual preferences are not what early dating conversation should be about??

I agree completly

Chris, I think that the type of "date" or encounter determines the circumstances. If one is into bdsm, IMO only, one explores the boundaries and limitations of the other as prelude to possible play. For *me*, this would mean that I divulge my stone id. Perhaps this is not necessary in that I am a Dominant, but I always want to be clear, up front, and understood about My boundaries. I expect my "date" to do the same, and will ask pointed questions about hers. For me, it is not only understanding her medical condition/s or play preferences/aversions. It is deeper than that. Then again, I am speaking of something outside of a "vanilla" experience (I don't know that I like that term. It feels derogatory, yet it is nearly universally understood ...) and my response might not be appropriate for discussion here with respect to your question.

Having said this, in a "vanilla" situation, a date, depending upon the energy that transpires between us, my disclosure as stone would come forth if I felt there was something developing between us. I can almost "smell" the other's desire ... Otherwise, if it "feels" more like friendship material instead of something more, I don't see any reason to discuss this with her. I have a lot of femme friends. Eventually, the topic comes up ... but not because it needs to be discussed ... it is more the level of friendship. The level of sharing, which brings this up during the deep exchanges between two close friends.

Hmmm. :seeingstars: I may have muddied the waters here! :bolt:

I beleive it should be shared once you know the relatiosnhip is heading to a level of romance and sex.


Vanilla, It feels derogatory, yet it is nearly universally understood ..

I agree the tern Vanilla has always sound derogatory to me.. I am stone and consider myself exciting with over flowing passion not afraid to express myself. Vanilla sounds borrowing and limited. but I guess not being part of the BDSM community I would be called Vanilla.

I agree with you completely, Wax. (That is, except that I think vanilla is as fine a flavor as any other, and not at all derogatory.) When I'm at a BDSM party and flirting with a potential playmate I state my boundaries right up front. That includes my stonefemme boundaries if it seems as if the play we're negotiating could lead to or include sex.

When I'm in a less sexually explicit environment I disclose the information as early as is polite, and I only do so on a need-to-know basis. Stone boundaries aren't the only ones I state up-front. I'm also non-monogamous, and I make sure that information comes up early on, too. Unfortunately for me, that info acts as really effective 'butch-repellent', so I can skip to the disappointment stage before I start to get emotionally involved. Sigh.

For me saying that I am stone is not sexualizing a conversation or discussing sexual preferences. To me, sexual preferences are: Do you like vibrators?

That isn't similar to stone. Stone is: I do not allow someone to touch my genitals or chest. Are you interested in touching your partner in those areas? If the answer is yes, then I would not be able to meet that person's needs sexually. Subsequently, it would make no sense for us to date....why begin the process if it can not go anywhere?

I agree 100% Dapper.

In the real world there are many types of “engagements” we can have. There are those that involve an unplanned flirtation that leads to a mutually rewarding though relatively brief physical encounter- where having a discussion concerning the intricacies of stone would be as inappropriate as exchanging phone numbers.

In the same vein, if someone had a regularly planned “date” where the relationship didn’t exist outside of the designated time and place, again the need to discuss stone may be considered a poor use of the allotted time.

Both of these examples assume that the stone is also a Top, or Dominant in some way and is “leading’ the encounter, if this is not the case then I would presume that the stone would need to be very explicit before anything physical occurred.

However, as both a Dom and a Top, I personally believe that in situations other than the two just given that stone needs to enter the conversation earlier rather than later.

Perhaps I am unique in my thinking but as a stone, when in a committed and monogamous relationship, concern is always “am I depriving her of something that she will eventually need/want?” so before heading even close to that direction I need to have the discussion, I need to know whether I’m simply being accommodated or whether it is actually her preference.

For me, this is a very significant point. I do not want to date someone who is "ok" with me being Stone or can "give up" being able to touch someone's chest. I want to be with someone who does not want to touch my chest. I don't want someone to give up their desires for me. I want to BE their desire.