Sorry to burst your bubble, Sue, but that just isn't true. NOTHING will protect Arizonans who have the wrong skin color or last name---nothing. They will be racially profiled just as they have been for the past century.

The only difference is that now it's legal, so the profiling will step up several notches.


No bubble to burst Cath. Just sharing some info that might prevent someone being taken to a immigration detention centre if they ARE stopped.

DeanRobert, you have asked this question twice, and although you haven't asked me directly, I will address it, as I find it mind blogging.

You asking this question is the equivalent of anyone asking: Where was the “gay people's” voice when the original statutes were being written and signed into law, regarding DOMA/Same Sex Marriage, etc?

Now I can change that question with many other minorities if you wish. At this time I am going to just leave it to see if sinks in.

Dean Robert.

I want to share something with you, it's personal, and a lil painful but maybe it will help you understand that just because they say they do things legally (and when I mean they, I meant border patrol or any cops) it can also lead to...

ready for this

LIES...

My mother till last year was not a US Citizen, she was legally residing here, but her original country of origin is Mexico.. She crossed them illegal perimeters many many a time during my youth...

Once, during them crossings, they got her, some border patrol guys, her and a couple friends.. They did not *detain* them at some building, no, no, no
they gave my mom and her friends special accomidations in the middle of some desert in Arizona..

*I* am a fucking 40 year walking reminder of that time for my mom. (mom is catholic does not do abortion)

So. with that tid bit out there....

I want to share something with you...

If you put down a people long enough can call them roaches, garbage, a burden to this country you will learn to just be quiet and avoid anything that has to do with any kind of law enforcement. (including voting) My mother is a strong ass woman, but lemme tell you nothing breaks her down like the sight of a cop, we talked a bit on her birthday about the AZ thing, I can hear it in her voice the terror.. I am so glad she does not live anywhere near that state..

When I was 15 my mother bumped a car with hers at church, in the parking lot, my dad was out of town on TDY, Arabia I believe don't remember why.

We hid, I shit you not my mother panicked, cause she thought the cops would take her we hid out at stores, and I finally talked her into going home. So you see it is easy to scare people, it's easy to make someone feel unwanted and unwelcomed, and it's easy to terrorize a people..

*I* personally, hate being pulled over, cops are right up there with clowns and spiders, they set off panic in me...

So your thoughts that people are being detained in pretty prison cells is not always true.....

What this woman has done, is put a target on people who are not *white*. So who are they gonna pull over?

Native Americans they have dark skin

Persians they too have dark skins

Chicanos they tooooooo have dark skin

when does it end? So what I see is unless you white.... You can safely drive around the state.. Hasn't it always been like this though?

It's a fucked up law Dean Robert....

How you don't see that is beyond me.......:candle:

Has anyone considered what happens to you if you cross the border in some other countries illegally?

N. Korea jailed 2 hikers and journalists and it took the US govt. to get them back. china? russia? Iran? bet you are never heard from again.

there is not a damn thing wrong with wanting people residing in the country to be known about. ever consider who else is crossing the borders?

Only the USA does little about the illegal problem. I will give you a prime example of why people should be legal. get into a car accident with an illegal and see how quick they disappear and you will be left holding the bag of all the expense.

yes, we should work on a plan to get people legal but until that occurs. we should not give illegals the keys to the country.

wolf

I have been in 3 car accidents..

None caused by people from other countries..

None had insurance...

So is it safe to say, that this whole hit and run thing is not just an *illegal immigrant* issue, how about it's an ass clown issue?:rainbowAfro:

I can also bet you at least knew the name of the person who hit you and their address.

wolf

Thank you so much for posting this Snow! I know it is very personal and difficult to talk about.

It tells the truth about how one family has interacted with the border guards and with the people who are supposed to protect us and why many people do not trust the police.

Until we all remember that we are speaking of people just like us who did not take leaving their families and homes lightly to come to the USA. Just like so many of our ancestors did to be hated just like they were. We have no more right to this land than anyone else does. We are a nation or immigrants. Read about what people said about the Irish, the Italians, the Polish when they arrived here...same exact stuff.

My heart breaks for the 1000's who year who don't make it, who die trying to get here to make a better life for themselves and their families.

This governor says she is on a mission from God to fix things, to stop illegal immigration, to stop partner benefits. I hope this will be a huge wake up call to the rest of the country that this is not acceptable, and that the Federal Government needs to step in. I am very sad that she was next in line to follow the former governor.

Love your fellow human, know that we are all One and that we all deserve dignity and respect.

This law is racist at it's core and need to to be struck down.

Great, so you think this should be handled like North Korea does? Really? They need to be our example?

Also, a person can't be illegal. They are undocumented, not illegal.

We are speaking of people.

Yes, you can take your papers with you everywhere and be stopped for them all the time. But what if it were you and every time you left the house you had to get your papers checked...sounds like North Korea or East Germany (the DDR).

In one instance no...

He did not know who he was....

Spoke perfect *legal* resident talk...

The other two, they ran.......

Stolen cars.

*legal* residents

they are in this country illegally.

wolf

did you miss that part where brown skin is criminalized?

we all have the moral obligation to dis-obey unjust laws (socrates, thoreau, mlk, jr)

and you and I are queer...

and the same folx wanting the browns to be sniped are the same folks that want you and I..

OUT...

:pcthink:

Sign O' The Times
 

UofMfan, I was simply addressing and answering the questions that Apretty had asked me and in return asked her where were the vioces and protests when the orgininal statutes went into law several years ago. SB1070 is simply adding to these already existing laws. It was not met for all of you to answer a second time. {shaking my head} Keeping in mind none of you answerd that question.

I have heard a lot of horror stories over the years. I do not doubt that they happened or do still happen to this day It seems to me that since I am simply trying to voice my opinion here.
If I were to start a thread for those whom are in favor of this bill, you all would be posting your opinions there too. There are two sides to every thing that happens and I had not seen anyone trying to voice the other side.

I will state this again, as many of you just arn't comprehending what I had said. I believe this bill will lead to racial profiling.!

apretty: You asked me to walk you through this thought process. I am not speaking of oppression here. I agree that oppression exists to this very day.
You are very loudly voicing your opinions here and have made it very clear that you are of Hispanic descent. You brought into this the term “brown skinned people” not me. I am simply asking you, where were you or the Hispanic population voices and protests when the original parts of this bill were signed into law several years ago.
Maybe if there had been the protests and loud voices then we would not be here today as the state divided that we are.

I was born in Flagstaff and raised here. So for a little more than 40 years this has been my home. I have seen many changes in the valley and the state. Some for the good and some for the bad.
I sit here willing to listening to both sides of this debate I have not made a decision as to exactly which side I will take, and am trying to keep an open mind.

I was put on notice by several of my friends that come into this site and others that if I posted my thoughts and feelingshere I would be attacked and that is just what has happened.

To those of you that will participate in the boycotts think about this:

Don't buy that new car you want, why??? All of the airbags in that new car are manufactured right here in Arizona.

If you are in law enforcement or carry a tazer, don't use it, its manufactured right here in Arizona.

Thinking of buying a new computer, make sure it doesn't have an INTEL processor, yes they to are manufactured here.

Dude..

No one is attacking you.....

Are we passionate? yes...

Jesus I get so tired of the fucking my friends said I would get attacked *whine*.. No one is picking on you, like you we state our voice and experiences..

Why people are on this site that are back hand warning folks is beyond me.... Why be here then?

end of my fucking rant..:rant:

I certainly am sorry if you or anyone feels attacked because I disagree with you DeanRobert.

But I have to ask, is this therapy? Are we trying to make each other feel good, or are we having a serious discussion here? Is the water too hot?

I agree that boycotting a state is logistically problematic, but I think the point was and is that we are opposed to this obvious example of racial profiling.

My airbags were manufactured in Canada by Union Auto Workers, By the way.

TY Corkey, I posted that quote on Facebook just yesterday.

It's a good one.

Here, another example.

Think, what if it were me. What if I had to be afraid 100% of the time that I might get picked up and taken to jail or worse for my skin color.

What about if you had kids who always forget their stuff....what happens the day they forget their "papers"?

Do White Republican Children have to carry their "papers" around?

What if it were you? Your kid, your Mom, your boyfriend...YOU.

What if you ran to the corner store to get an ice cream and forgot your papers?

I have lived like this, in Argentina. When I was a kid during the Peron years and then military goverment when people dissapeared right and left, I had to carry my "papers" all the time.

Pretty creepy actually.

i'e always kind of enjoyed dirt weed. hard to find, though.

Southern Poverty Law Center: Teaching Tolerance
 

Arizona Legalizes Racial Profiling


Submitted by Sean Price on April 23, 2010

Hundreds of high school and college students gathered around the state capitol in Phoenix, Arizona, on Friday. They were there to convince Gov. Jan Brewer to veto Senate Bill 1070. These young protesters were disappointed though. Brewer signed the bill and instantly set back relations between whites and Latinos in Arizona and other parts of the country.

The law is designed to identify, prosecute and deport illegal immigrants. As outlined by The New York Times:

The police would be authorized to arrest immigrants unable to show documents allowing them to be in the country and the legislation would leave drivers open to sanctions … for knowingly transporting an illegal immigrant, even a relative. It expressly forbids cities from adopting “sanctuary” policies that restrict the police and public workers from immigration enforcement….

In other words, Arizona cops now have a green light for racial profiling—unless anyone seriously thinks that an Irish national with blonde hair and blue eyes who is in Arizona illegally will receive the same scrutiny as an Arizona-born American with darker features.

It was no accident that so many high school students protested the new law. They will be directly affected. Young people are often the chief targets of racial profiling. And this law will almost surely split up families. In many cases, young people who are U.S. citizens have one or both parents who are undocumented workers. These families already cope with enormous economic pressure. The Arizona law will almost surely ratchet up their misery. But since undocumented workers are often driven here by far greater dangers and economic pressures, the law is unlikely to do anything to slow down the flow of illegal immigration.

Opponents are lining up to attack the new law on constitutional grounds. But even if the challenges succeed, the poison has already been introduced to the state’s racial climate. Gov. Brewer argued that new methods of police training would keep police officers from abusing the law. “I will not tolerate racial discrimination or racial profiling in Arizona,” she declared. If that’s the case, she shouldn’t have signed a law that guarantees it will happen.

By the way, educators who’d like to discuss racial profiling in the classroom can use this Teaching Tolerance lesson, which defines it and explains why the subject is so important.

-------------
P.S. Interesting range of post-article comments.

This is so sad.

and she says God told her to do these things.

I can't imagine ANYONE's entity being about hate.... :|

Wow.
 

What's really interesting to me, is that in the movies... any foreign country official always asks "ve vant to see your PaPers". Is it just here that we aren't supposed to ask?
Perhaps because so many European countries "touch" each other, they are more interested in seeing who is crossing their borders. Perhaps, because we are so, oh, I dunno, separate, we are just supposed to allow anyone in at any time.

If the bottom line is, have your papers in hand when they ask for them then go on your merry way, then what is really the problem?

Now.. I will say I am playing Devils Advocate with this, as it seems to be a simple solution and good as hell reason to sue for racial profiling. IF you have proper documentation and get pulled over because "you are brown".. SUE THE FUCK OUT OF THEM. If by chance, you don't, then damn, maybe you should have paid attention to all this shit. IF you are here and are going through the process, then you will have some proof of that. IF you are here ILLEGALLY and don't have proof you are going through the process, then hmmm.. go home and start over.It's really that simple.

Fully expecting bullshit to fall out of this post. Because it is way too simple. Way too easy to see it for what it is. I say, beat them at their game. It's easy. Have your papers ready to shove ever so politely in their face, whichever state of citizenship you fall into.

HuffPo
 

Pima County Sheriff Calls Arizona Law "Stupid," Will Not Enforce It (VIDEO)

Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik, who I am assuming is something of a master of the "complex and demanding craft of policing" seeing as how he's been a policeman for over five decades, begs to differ. Per Amanda Terkel, Dupnik called the law "racist" and "disgusting" and "stupid" and, in his "nuanced judgment" could not be enforced without mandatory racial profiling. Dupnik's reckoning of the legal issue is that he's just as likely to be sued for racial profiling as he is for not doing enough racial profiling, so he's standing pat, and will not enforce the new law.

[WATCH]

I used the "in the movies" statement to stress a point. Most other countries do ask for some sort of ID. Most folks who travel to the UK for example, go through customs. They show their ID/ reason for being there and move on. Folks aren't crawling in through tunnels. Does that make any sense at all?