you're wrong..grrls want nice butches in the street, a Tiger in the sheets...it's what in your heart that matters most, are you kind, intense, give her your undivided attention that's sexy.. :clover:

No way. They only finish last with the type of femme nobody needs anyway. Better to find out before investing too much time, energy, $$$ - or whatever else on them. There are good femmes out there. They're worth the wait.

I respectfully disagree. They do not only want nice butches, Tomcats in the sheets, and undivided attention. They want to be wined and dined, and the butches to foot the bill. I'm with Stone on this one.

P.S. I am sorry that happened to you Stone.

What a shit,sorry that happened mate.

I trust one person-ME

as a homeless street kid,I grew up knowing,their is one person here for me all the time.ME

Also I have heaps of red flags now
And actually like being single.
4 yrs of therapy helped,but I enjoy being alone and I'm 100% content and happy.
I actually feel sad for folks who can't be alone
Ive had 4 r'ships in my life,with sometimes 7 and 10 yr breaks.

For me money you can replace,but the feeling of being betrayal, that leaves a bad taste.
anyway dude,says more bout her than you.

I do trust my dog though LOL

once again,your story sux man.

Hmm, I don't know who you're dating, but I would say to head in another direction. That's not the way any of my friends or I think. I'm sorry about your experiences, but that's not indicative of a whole segment of the population.

I have a lotttt of relationship anxieties, particularly related to a previous abusive relationship. Looking back, I feel dumb for being so easily manipulated and controlled, but I still struggle to trust myself enough to trust others. What if my judgment is wrong again?

I wonder if that line of thought has to do with blaming myself for the abuse that took place, but I do still feel so stupid for not ending things earlier, especially when every single one of my family and friends expressed concern.

It's interesting that trusting oneself can be a huge issue, not only trusting others.

waking from a bad dream..but i feel i should say at least a few things..first i can't argue with a person's experience..we've all made mistakes and should fine tune our expectations and disappointments...hopefully moving forward and trying to do better..i'm an old school femme in a Gen X world i don't expect butches to play by my rules nevertheless, i'm deeply appreciative of being able to choose what is perfect for me..may we all find our way into paradise:candle:

I am wound so tightly it seems I’m scared of almost everything when it comes to a relationship.

And that’s okay.

For now.

Perhaps you are right, and I am dating the entirely wrong demographic. Maybe I made the mistake of dating too old school.. you know where women stayed home and took care of her man? I think I just might start dating more my age range. Thanks clementine!!!

you date old school?!?:| then i agree with clementine, stay in your lane:eatinghersheybar: ok....(more then)a little amused..i actually think it's lit when you figure out what turn's you on...and off Peace

Bridge(in your honor)

Relationship fears
 

OMG Build A Bridge. Buddy you got a lot wrong there I hate to say. I myself profess to be old school and proud of it. I had a wonderful 22 yr relationship back in the day and we lived 100%-100%. My lady sure did not stay home and cook for any man or any butch LOL. We both looked after things needing to be done. (I am a pretty good cook eh). I do dishes. I do laundry (hate it). I walked the dogs. I grocery shop. All this and took time after my work day to bring home flowers to my woman. My other butch friends were about the same. Any butch who downed their ladies were given a good snarl. My old school woman was hard working, smart, funny, a damn good cook and she even let me vaccum once in a while.

Stone? really? how do you assume I have a lot going on?? buddy you're the one who had a dame leave you a $10,000 credit card bill. Now you defend her? hmm bro.. really? Such a great gal right.

~
 

we all have had experiences that didn't work out ~ don't blame yourself ~ look at the things about your partner at that time that you were attracted too ~ see their eyes in your mind and send them love ~ make sure you are looking through your soul ~ the the hurt part but the part that knows how to love and will share that love you have again. ~ don't be hard on yourself know you know what you want ~ that's what experiencing life offers, experience.:bunchflowers: stay safe ~

Oh wow, I really didn't mean to start drama with my comment lol. I actually prefer to date more old school myself, but with my being so young, it's not really possible. But old school to me maybe means something different, since I am from a different generation... I do feel that taking advantage of someone is taking advantage of them, period, regardless of roles/mores.

This whole topic of who foots the bill is interesting, though, because I was fully supporting my ex for the entire duration of our relationship. I didn't think much of it because I've always been self-sufficient, so it wasn't a huge burden to take on a dependent (although on a teacher's salary it wasn't exactly the ideal situation!). Anywho it made me think of how in the olden days femmes would typically be the breadwinners due to butches not often being able to work office jobs that necessitated gender conformity. (But in my case, the butch was just lazy lmao.)

Anyway, all in all, finances can be difficult to navigate relationship-wise and I figure open and honest communication at the get-go would resolve at least some issues - if the person isn't intentionally trying to take advantage, that is.

This one is a bit intimate, but has anyone ever had a partner use sex as a manipulation tactic? I am easily... persuaded and previous partners have absolutely used that to get whatever they wanted out of me. So now I'm hyperaware of it in relationships.

We've had a few reports from this thread. So a few things to please keep in mind:

(1) Try not to make generalizations about femmes vs. butches or transmen. Speak in the "I" and not about a vast group of people. There are good and bad femmes, butches, and transmen, and many in the middle. It irks people to hear generalizations about any group.

(2) If someone is taking issue with someone else, don't pile on. It just increases the drama.

(3) It's fine to discuss things but this is a vulnerable topic, and we really shouldn't be throwing people's words back at them. It's okay to discuss but please be sensitive that this is a place where people are sharing some painful experiences.

Thanks.

Jennifer, Moderator

First, I really enjoyed your posts.

Being an older butch, may I add this to the topic and role of breadwinners.

Back in the day, more often than not, I and a lot of us had factory jobs and those paid very well. Jobs at places in Milwaukee like Briggs & Stratton, Allis-Chalmers Kearney & Trecker, Allen Bradly, Master Lock, Harley-Davidson and of course breweries Pabst, Miller, Schlitz, all offered top pay.

It's a shame American lost most of its manufacturing jobs...

Relationship fears
 

Build A Bridge, buddy they were two different women. One about 20 yrs ago and one about 2 yrs ago. Not even close to the same women. I was young and grew with the first woman (well not my first, my longest lol) and the last was the last for sure.

Relationship fears
 

To anyone that was upset with my part of this topic of "old school" I was speaking of me, my women and my friends. I think that was clear. It was not inclusive of all old school thoughts or other peoples women or anything else and frankly, I am tired of apologizing for making an entry. I will not personalize again unless it is for what I had for dinner.

~
 

lol is the sex good sex ? lol have fun then lol as long as you know !!! your smart ~ ty I needed a good laugh @ myself actually. I know exactly what you mean :)

I'm glad I gave you a good laugh! :) I also love your encouragement. Thank you for that. <3

But I don't necessarily mean in a good way... like someone deliberately using sex as a tool to manipulate you, you know what I mean?

I wrote a letter to an ex from 25 yrs ago

the love of my life
I was dreaming of her all the time
The last time I saw her,her husband threw a major silent tantrum at the gym,it was awful,that was maybe 7 yrs ago.

I had had contact with her prior,to tell her I transitioned,I felt she should know,it was fine we talked for an hour.I cried for an hr after LOL

Anyway talking with my therapist,he thought,writing may be good,as long as it was positive.
And as I have been really sick,it was kinda like tying up loose ends.
I never included any intimate stuff,or reffered to it,nor left my contact details,mainly to make sure I was not manipulating her.

I wrote,how much her loving me changed me,how she taught me to read and now I love books and bookcases of them.
How she was so gentle and kind to me and switched on a light I never knew existed,and said good things about me,I had never heard.
And that I'm so happy and proud that she had reached the heights she had in her career,and that I know,it would not have happened with me,as I'm working class and at that time,I never really understood carrers,but I don't regret for one min having her in my life and she was the love of my life BUt I know I was not hers.

I did end 4 lines dedicated to the gym,and how he is threatened by me and how fucking fragile white heterosexual toxic men are.

I told her I don't need a response and also,that I knew she is not allowed contact with me,but left a link to my music.

I was in a band when I met her
She lived in the apartment above me and I had put a song on a cassette ,with a post it"play me".I left it at her door.LOL
I felt like a teenager,really corny syrupy.lol

the soundcloud my songs are on has had so many plays and it tells you where you are popular,she is in Sydney.So I'm popular in Sydney


I just needed to tell someone
And I will have no contact or ever see her,I know that.


I can write this here coz its kinda annonymous
And I feel fine and glad I wrote it,so our last contact was positive and he cannot destroy what we had,and therapy is healing my scars,from life,there are no scars from Jenny.
,but I do need a thearapy session.

Life is good

Grace
 

This. This. This. THIS.

Except no one that had suspicions came to me. I would have listened if they had.

I love hearing about relationships like this, Stone. I'm so glad that you had the opportunity to experience it and for such a big part of your life.

Sage advice.

In my younger days, I have been guilty of directing the energy to more primal avenues once in while in order to end an argument or to stave off one but I know what you mean and I've never done that. I have seen it done, though. The times that I know it's happened, it's usually the dominant person in the relationship doing it and it's...in my mind...just as bad as gaining 'consent' when someone is inebriated. It's hard to think critically when your hormones are raging like white rapids, you know? Definitely unfair tactics.

Relationship fears
 

I have had good and bad relationships in my life and my biggest is getting involved with someone who does not take the relationship seriously. I have been involved with a few hit and miss and it really sucks. I prefer to be single than to be involved with a hit and run woman. When I get involved I take it very seriously and endeavor to make my partner happy and content and to work together to make it work for a long time, not a good time.

Constant abandonment fears!

I definitely share the same sentiments as you Cheryl. You’ve been missed here so I hope you’re safe and well. :rrose:

I like your last few lines about how “…love is not about rainbows and fairy wings, it’s about science”. So true. Loved reading your posts in this thread today. (f)(f)

Thanks for expressing your experience with femmes who can be violent too. I think that this is very true. I’ve seen women (femme or otherwise) with massive mean streaks and inclinations to be mean, ruthless, and violent, and as bullies. These types of people seem to be of the sort like a heat seeking missle… looking for the next person to brutalize with their sordid controlling ways. I’m sorry this happened to you, Chad. It’s happened to me too. Take heart that you were lucky enough to see them for who they are and that there is no room in your life for people who intentionally or otherwise mistreat you. :rrose:

I’ve been hoodwinked too. It hurts to be victimized by a predator type person. I get it, due to being victimized before. :rrose:

Thanks ocean for your timely views. Very sweet and understanding of you!! Where are you? How’s your family and you? I’m thinking of you today, my sister friend. :rrose:

Showing scars: what are your relationship fears?
 

Been a few years since I have had a serious relationship and a while before I had that onle. Met in a chat room, seemed like a nice lady around my age. Her son had recently died and she was having a hard time living where he had passed and said she needed a break. SO, I had an empty bedroom and told her to come if she wanted to to get a breather. Well, she breathed for almost two years, went with me to bury my sister, things going well. Gone, yes gone with more than she came with. My things, some new, some treasures. Her name was not her name, neither was her address. Live and learn eh.
Living alone since then with a couple of dates, nothing spacific. Needing to learn to trust again. I am not looking for sweetness , I am looking for honesty and it seems hard to get these days. If I am to be alone then I will learn to live with the good past and not the evil this woman brought to my home. Yes I would like a partner that I can share with. I am old school and Stone and not all femmes care for this. So, I will wait here and if she comes into my life the better for both of us. I will treat her well and attempt to contribute to her happiness as this is within each person. I say BLAH to the pretenders.