[dark_crystal]

[quote=turasultana;153648]

Originally Posted by dark_crystal

it has never been possible for a butch to be masculine enough for me/QUOTE]

This bit here. Really. Really?

Originally Posted by Mister Bent

I have to agree with turasultana.

If I were to post the inverse in an femme oriented thread, "it has never been possible for a femme to be feminine enough for me," I'm reasonably certain I'd have my ass handed to me on a platter.

While you may have never met a butch you considered masculine enough for you (whatever that means, I didn't realize we were qualifying and quantifying now) doesn't mean it isn't possible.

I've met some very effeminate ftms, and some extremely masculine (including female identified) butches, all exist on a spectrum.

Either way, as a masculine person, I'm not offended by this statement, personally, because I'm extremely comfortable with my own masculinity. I am however, kind of disturbed by it.

I want to add that I am posting from the position that I believe it is not only possible, but far kinder, wiser, and more inclusive to talk about what we love in a certain type of person without stepping on the neck of other identities. I think we can celebrate FTMs without speaking negatively with regard to butches or cisgendered men.

Originally Posted by Chancie

I agree.

And 'not masculine enough'?

I sure hope I'm feminine enough.

because the last two words of my sentence were "for me," i can't imagine how the statement could be seen as me qualifying or quantifying anything in the world besides my own response to my past partners.

I am not talking about identities as concepts and i am not talking about specific individuals and i am not talking about potential individuals that may exist within an identity whom i have not yet met. The sentence was in the past tense and referred only to myself.

i am talking about myself and my past. How can anyone possibly be offended by my experience or my description of my experience? it does not involve anyone except me