Quote:
Originally Posted by BullDog
For me personally, no I do not view my masculinity as male butchness. I do view male as a biological and not a gender term - some people do use it as both. I don't consider myself to be male - either as my gender or biological sex.
I am a masculine female - which for me is the essence of what butch is (other butches have their own definitions that are different than mine).
To me saying male butchness sounds like imitating male, when I view my female masculinity as being my own and not something I am getting from males. I may look somewhat male, act similar to males in some ways, my sexuality is very similar to males in some ways, etc., but I grew up female and have experienced the world as a lesbian/queer female, which to me is an entirely different experience. I move through the world now as a butch not a man. I am not offended at all, it just doesn't fit for me.
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Interesting, thank you, BullDog! Although I think you may have misunderstood what I wastrying to say, as I emphatically do not see butch women as being male in the slightest. See, to me, saying 'masculine female' seems to imply imitating the male, and now I've come across, albeit very briefly, a few women on the butch spectrum, I'd say that they didn't come across as imitating males at all - they were undeniably butch though. So what I'm trying to get at is that I'm thinking that instead of defining butchness in terms of 'degree of masculinity' (which to me makes it seem as though butch women are aping men), it ought to be that butchness is a thing in and of itself, no masculinity required.
Instead, I would argue, when a woman exhibits butchness she is, quite simply being a butch woman - but when a man exhibits butchness we might think of them as 'a butch man', but more commonly we'd skip that thought and use the term 'masculine', which means 'pertaining to maleness',and that, I would argue, is inappropriate when talking of women. So I am arguing that masculinity is simply the stereotypical expression of butchness in men, because the stereotype, for society as a whole, is that butchness is most often associated with males. There is no word meaning 'the stereotypical expression of butchnesss in women', and I don't think there needs to be, either, because butch women are a minority expression of butchness in society as a whole, and therefore aren't stereotypical in society as a whole.
In short - men are butch in their way, women are butch in their way, and whilst there are similarities, the underlying difference in sex/gender identity makes a difference. No need to imply that butch women are appropriating masculinity or trying to be like men at all. Whereas doing things the other way around, by defining butchness in terms of masculinity, may be, I think, what perpetuates the myth that butch women are somehow trying to be men - which is, of course, utter rubbish.