Butch Femme Planet  

Go Back   Butch Femme Planet > GENDER AND IDENTITY > The Trans Zone

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-10-2009, 10:13 AM   #41
Linus
The Planet's Technical Bubba

How Do You Identify?:
FTM
Preferred Pronoun?:
He/Him/Geek
Relationship Status:
Married to my forever!
 
Linus's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 5,440
Thanks: 2,929
Thanked 10,724 Times in 3,172 Posts
Rep Power: 21474851
Linus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jet View Post
Why is it that we must continually dance around our sexuality either because of discrimination or by way of labeling? This past summer I had plans to go on an outing 4th of July. The person who invited me came over and said that the host of the party didn't want me there because I'm transgendered. His mother and sister were going to be there and he didn't want me to do "anything embarrassing." As if I would? But is was okay for an transitioned FTM to be there with his wife? Where does it stop? You can bet I'll damn well be me and I don't care who I offend. Because it's not me who's offensive. It's the other person's unwillingness to be respect something I was born with. I would have been gracious at the outing, but I wasn't given that chance. I'm dismayed at the prejudices within the GLBT community.
As my namesake says: I love mankind. It's people I can't stand.

There are times when I question whether the T really belongs with the rest of the alphabet (so to speak). I suspect that many people put assumptions about people who transition (not all but some). It's ironic that the same conversation was being had by the LGBTQ community a few decades ago (K and I watched an episode of the Golden Girls where Blanche is introduced to her baby brother's new friend -- and soon-to-be-husband; she behaves exactly as the host).

To be honest, I've found that if people stopped worrying about impressions and images life would be a lot easier. In fact, most people (that I've run into, at least) either are oblivious, don't give a shit or too self-centered to really notice. Offense isn't the issue; the issue usually is "Where's the beer?", "Where's the food?" and "Can I have another beer?".

In a positive spin of life, my aunt got married this summer. I wasn't sure how her friends and how our family would take my obvious physical change (I've met many of her friends -- film and music people -- over the years). I was well received and, had I arrived earlier, I would have been the best man for my aunt and new-uncle's wedding. I was floored at this level of acceptance (granted my name is the nickname she choose and she's only 8 years older than me so it's more of a sibling-like relationship).

It sucks, Jet, that you're going through this but I suspect this will lessen over time (at least it has for me). Now either its because people don't care or because I don't give a shit about other's opinions (issues) about me. I hope that these become farther and farther apart for you.
Linus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 10:14 AM   #42
Greyson
Infamous Member

How Do You Identify?:
Transmasculine/Non-Binary
Preferred Pronoun?:
Hy (Pronounced He)
Relationship Status:
Married
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 6,589
Thanks: 21,132
Thanked 8,160 Times in 2,007 Posts
Rep Power: 21474852
Greyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jet View Post
Why is it that we must continually dance around our sexuality either because of discrimination or by way of labeling? This past summer I had plans to go on an outing 4th of July. The person who invited me came over and said that the host of the party didn't want me there because I'm transgendered. His mother and sister were going to be there and he didn't want me to do "anything embarrassing." As if I would? But is was okay for an transitioned FTM to be there with his wife? Where does it stop? You can bet I'll damn well be me and I don't care who I offend. Because it's not me who's offensive. It's the other person's unwillingness to be respect something I was born with. I would have been gracious at the outing, but I wasn't given that chance. I'm dismayed at the prejudices within the GLBT community.
Jet, I am sorry you were treated poorly by people who are clueless and choose to live in fear of people that may not be the cookie cutter most have come to see as "normal."

All of the labels I use to be a discriptor of who I am, mean something to me. Some of the labels for me are a noun; others more of an adjective. I am not trying to dance around my sexuality nor my gender. I have lived a very much "out" life since the age of 18.

I think there is room for all of us under the umbrella of Queer, Trans, Butch, Gender Outlaw, Bent, whatever. I hope you know I am not trying to dish you. I got your back and the back of the guys in here.
Greyson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 10:27 AM   #43
Jet
Timed Out - TOS Drama

How Do You Identify?:
..
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: ..
Posts: 3,471
Thanks: 292
Thanked 2,646 Times in 1,295 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Jet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Linus View Post
As my namesake says: I love mankind. It's people I can't stand.

There are times when I question whether the T really belongs with the rest of the alphabet (so to speak). I suspect that many people put assumptions about people who transition (not all but some). It's ironic that the same conversation was being had by the LGBTQ community a few decades ago (K and I watched an episode of the Golden Girls where Blanche is introduced to her baby brother's new friend -- and soon-to-be-husband; she behaves exactly as the host).

To be honest, I've found that if people stopped worrying about impressions and images life would be a lot easier. In fact, most people (that I've run into, at least) either are oblivious, don't give a shit or too self-centered to really notice. Offense isn't the issue; the issue usually is "Where's the beer?", "Where's the food?" and "Can I have another beer?".

In a positive spin of life, my aunt got married this summer. I wasn't sure how her friends and how our family would take my obvious physical change (I've met many of her friends -- film and music people -- over the years). I was well received and, had I arrived earlier, I would have been the best man for my aunt and new-uncle's wedding. I was floored at this level of acceptance (granted my name is the nickname she choose and she's only 8 years older than me so it's more of a sibling-like relationship).

It sucks, Jet, that you're going through this but I suspect this will lessen over time (at least it has for me). Now either its because people don't care or because I don't give a shit about other's opinions (issues) about me. I hope that these become farther and farther apart for you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyson View Post
Jet, I am sorry you were treated poorly by people who are clueless and choose to live in fear of people that may not be the cookie cutter most have come to see as "normal."

All of the labels I use to be a discriptor of who I am, mean something to me. Some of the labels for me are a noun; others more of an adjective. I am not trying to dance around my sexuality nor my gender. I have lived a very much "out" life since the age of 18.

I think there is room for all of us under the umbrella of Queer, Trans, Butch, Gender Outlaw, Bent, whatever. I hope you know I am not trying to dish you. I got your back and the back of the guys in here.
Great posts both of you. You know it's funny, the people that have not hurt me are straight. For some reason, they get it better than folks in our community. I came out to my aunt as a transgender a few weeks ago, and she didn't bat an eye. Changes are beginning to happen with me and T will be part of that so I'll see how this will unfold. Thanks for your responses, both of you.
Jet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 02:47 PM   #44
Andrew, Jr.
Timed Out

How Do You Identify?:
Me
Preferred Pronoun?:
He
Relationship Status:
Unavailable
 
Andrew, Jr.'s Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Over the Rainbow in a House
Posts: 5,072
Thanks: 16,004
Thanked 5,244 Times in 2,213 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Andrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST Reputation
Default

I have enjoyed this thread a great deal. I am a quiet guy. I rarely get pissed off, but I cannot stand it when I get ma'amed. Remember Linus in the smoke shop? I introduced myself as Andrew. I live as a man. And still I get ma'amed. It grated on my nerves like fingernails being drug across a chalk board.

Oh well. I say live and let live. However, like Linus, I love mankind, but have issues with people (mainly the ones who are disrespectful and intentionally evil). But that is just me, and how I am. I'm a private person as well. Too many times I have tried to be open, and was hurt deeply. So, I won't be that way ever again. I have learned my lesson.
Andrew, Jr. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 03:10 PM   #45
Linus
The Planet's Technical Bubba

How Do You Identify?:
FTM
Preferred Pronoun?:
He/Him/Geek
Relationship Status:
Married to my forever!
 
Linus's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 5,440
Thanks: 2,929
Thanked 10,724 Times in 3,172 Posts
Rep Power: 21474851
Linus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew, Jr. View Post
I have enjoyed this thread a great deal. I am a quiet guy. I rarely get pissed off, but I cannot stand it when I get ma'amed. Remember Linus in the smoke shop? I introduced myself as Andrew. I live as a man. And still I get ma'amed. It grated on my nerves like fingernails being drug across a chalk board.

Oh well. I say live and let live. However, like Linus, I love mankind, but have issues with people (mainly the ones who are disrespectful and intentionally evil). But that is just me, and how I am. I'm a private person as well. Too many times I have tried to be open, and was hurt deeply. So, I won't be that way ever again. I have learned my lesson.
It's hard to get people to understand a trans individuals mind. I certainly can understand why it's difficult. It's just like me not understanding what it's like to be completely comfortable with one's body from day one. While we should always try to understand what it might be like in someone else's shoes it's hard to comprehend sometimes.

And in the times when I used to get "ma'am'd" (I recently --yesterday and keep in my photo, which is how I look -- got called "Baby" by the manager of a local grocery store -- it was more of a term of friendliness than anything, I think) I smile and remember Llama Surya Das' teaching of compassion for those who mean a lot to us and those we hardly know. Those who do those infractions may have had a hard life, especially those who throw hate at us. I've got to figure that those who are so mired into hate must have lived painful lives to get where they are and I cannot do anything other than feel compassion for the pain they must have endured to get where they are.

So, Andrew, if I can offer: when you get "Ma'am'd", smile and politely correctly them and continue. It will make them re-think a bit and probably blush. In your prayers to God, ask Him/Her to direct them and alleviate their pain. (I hope it's ok that I mention this and if it's not, I'll remove it)


In another tangent: I'm curious as to everyone's thoughts on the term "cis" (I've seen it used in the following examples: cis-gendered, cis-man, cis-woman, etc.) This past summer a huge debate started about cis and how it was offensive to a "cis-gendered individual" (I'll use the term in this sense since I don't have the words on how else to describe it and "non-trans individual" doesn't quite seem right either..).

Opinions? Thoughts?
Linus is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Linus For This Useful Post:
Old 11-10-2009, 03:22 PM   #46
Jet
Timed Out - TOS Drama

How Do You Identify?:
..
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: ..
Posts: 3,471
Thanks: 292
Thanked 2,646 Times in 1,295 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Jet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Addressing us as "Miss"

To which I have replied,
"I ain't no miss, I'm right on target, you got that?


Addressing us as "Ma'am"


To which I have replied,
"Do I look like Miss Daisy to you?
Get the hell out of the car and let me drive."


Remember, I'm in the South, the female pronoun capitol of the universe.



What is cis? Something else to deal with now? Gawd! Does it ever stop?
Jet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 03:31 PM   #47
Linus
The Planet's Technical Bubba

How Do You Identify?:
FTM
Preferred Pronoun?:
He/Him/Geek
Relationship Status:
Married to my forever!
 
Linus's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 5,440
Thanks: 2,929
Thanked 10,724 Times in 3,172 Posts
Rep Power: 21474851
Linus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST Reputation
Default

From this site: http://cydathria.com/ms_donna/tg_def.html

Quote:
Cisgender

The term Cisgender was coined in 1995 by Carl Buijs, a female-to-male transsexual from the Netherlands.
  • Main Entry:cis- Function:prefix Etymology:Latin, from cis Meaning: 1: on this side <cislunar> 2:usually ital : cis <cis-dichloroethylene> -- compare TRANS- 2b
As we are not talking about chemistry, it is definition 1 that we want.
As we defined gender above to mean "the behavioral, cultural, or psychological traits typically associated with one sex", Cisgendered literally means: on this side of the behavioral, cultural, or psychological traits typically associated with one sex.
Stated simply, it means that one's identity and presentation matches their physical morphology.
Linus is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Linus For This Useful Post:
Old 11-10-2009, 03:34 PM   #48
atomiczombie
Member

How Do You Identify?:
Femmesensual Transguy
Preferred Pronoun?:
He, Him, His
Relationship Status:
Dating
 
atomiczombie's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rio Vista, CA
Posts: 1,225
Thanks: 3,949
Thanked 3,220 Times in 757 Posts
Rep Power: 21474847
atomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew, Jr. View Post
I have enjoyed this thread a great deal. I am a quiet guy. I rarely get pissed off, but I cannot stand it when I get ma'amed. Remember Linus in the smoke shop? I introduced myself as Andrew. I live as a man. And still I get ma'amed. It grated on my nerves like fingernails being drug across a chalk board.

Oh well. I say live and let live. However, like Linus, I love mankind, but have issues with people (mainly the ones who are disrespectful and intentionally evil). But that is just me, and how I am. I'm a private person as well. Too many times I have tried to be open, and was hurt deeply. So, I won't be that way ever again. I have learned my lesson.
I am right with you when I comes to being "ma'amed" And when I am with a female, being called "ladies", etc. My ex-wife continues to use female pronouns when referring to me. Grr! This is why I am so looking forward to going on T (which will probably begin after the first of this year). I feel invisible. It's painful.

That being said, I worry about how I will be perceived after transition. Will I be shunned but the queer community as no longer being part of the tribe? Will femmes no longer be interested? Will my queerness be invisible? I don't consider myself straight- no because I am attracted to masculine people. I am not. But because I am attracted to femmes. Femmes aren't straight women. I have little interest in straight women. Does that make me a jerk? I hope not. But will I trade being seen as a female for no longer being seen as queer when I go on T?? What is your experiences guys? Do any of you feel the same?
atomiczombie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 03:37 PM   #49
Bit
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Stonefemme
Relationship Status:
married to Gryph
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 2,177
Thanks: 1,126
Thanked 3,768 Times in 1,265 Posts
Rep Power: 10778864
Bit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST Reputation
Default

I have a question. Lately when Nick and Gryph and I have been out in public, it has seemed to me that people have been going out of their way to call us "ladies."

Now if you've known me for a while, you already know that it makes me uncomfortable to be called "lady" because, after all, that's my dog's name... well, okay, really it's because of the stereotypical crap I was force-fed growing up about a lady is always quiet and demure and never laughs out loud (I cannot stop laughing when something is funny), a lady never shows the least hint of temper (I cuss like a sailor! sheesh), a lady never sweats (omgawd, in PHOENIX? seriously?! Are you insane?!)---but when I am out with a transman who is wearing a dress shirt and tie, someone who does not even LOOK female, and people go out of their way to call us ladies.... well it just makes me cringe!

I suppose one of the big cringe factors is their attitude; they are quite obviously going out of their way to be extra nice and to reassure us all that "they can tell [the transman] is actually really female, no worries, we accept you as a girl, we aren't going to embarrass you by not noticing your femaleness" omg it just makes me CRINGE....

So anyhow, here's my question. Does this happen to you in your area, or is it just the Midwest US; and if it does happen where you are, does it happen to you more when you are with a Femme than if you are alone?

I would ask Nick directly, but yanno he and Gryph are off shooting paper people dead and I don't want to forget the question---so hey, Nick, would you mind answering too? Do you get this treatment more when I'm with you?

Thanks in advance for your answers, everyone. I appreciate your time.
Bit is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Bit For This Useful Post:
Old 11-10-2009, 03:38 PM   #50
Jet
Timed Out - TOS Drama

How Do You Identify?:
..
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: ..
Posts: 3,471
Thanks: 292
Thanked 2,646 Times in 1,295 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Jet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomiczombie View Post
I am right with you when I comes to being "ma'amed" And when I am with a female, being called "ladies", etc. My ex-wife continues to use female pronouns when referring to me. Grr! This is why I am so looking forward to going on T (which will probably begin after the first of this year). I feel invisible. It's painful.

That being said, I worry about how I will be perceived after transition. Will I be shunned but the queer community as no longer being part of the tribe? Will femmes no longer be interested? Will my queerness be invisible? I don't consider myself straight- no because I am attracted to masculine people. I am not. But because I am attracted to femmes. Femmes aren't straight women. I have little interest in straight women. Does that make me a jerk? I hope not. But will I trade being seen as a female for no longer being seen as queer when I go on T?? What is your experiences guys? Do any of you feel the same?
Do you talk to your therapist? How about joing a support group of transmen.
Just as we aren't attracted to women as women, it's also my belief that there are femmes who are attracted to masculine energy but not in biological men. We're in luck in finding potential partners on the same page.

My biggest worry is what bathroom do i use. I worry about not passing enough to make it to the men's room.
Jet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 03:41 PM   #51
Linus
The Planet's Technical Bubba

How Do You Identify?:
FTM
Preferred Pronoun?:
He/Him/Geek
Relationship Status:
Married to my forever!
 
Linus's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 5,440
Thanks: 2,929
Thanked 10,724 Times in 3,172 Posts
Rep Power: 21474851
Linus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomiczombie View Post
I am right with you when I comes to being "ma'amed" And when I am with a female, being called "ladies", etc. My ex-wife continues to use female pronouns when referring to me. Grr! This is why I am so looking forward to going on T (which will probably begin after the first of this year). I feel invisible. It's painful.

That being said, I worry about how I will be perceived after transition. Will I be shunned but the queer community as no longer being part of the tribe? Will femmes no longer be interested? Will my queerness be invisible? I don't consider myself straight- no because I am attracted to masculine people. I am not. But because I am attracted to femmes. Femmes aren't straight women. I have little interest in straight women. Does that make me a jerk? I hope not. But will I trade being seen as a female for no longer being seen as queer when I go on T?? What is your experiences guys? Do any of you feel the same?
From my experience the following:

I never really felt part of the "Tribe", so to speak although the B-F dynamic did certainly feel more at peace than elsewhere.

Some in the community will shun you. That's a reality. You'll be viewed as a "traitor", so to speak. But just as many will accept you as you are. There are many femmes who like transguys so I don't think you'll be without and you'll likely be very interesting to them.

As for your queerness, invisible to whom? If to yourself, then no. You're the one who defines that, not others. I don't consider myself straight although to mainstream society that doesn't know me I probably do. That is their assumption (we all know that to assume makes an "ass" out of "u" and "me" so one shouldn't do those thigns but people do). Regardless of their assumption, I still define my own sexual orientation.

Would you be a jerk for not wanting to date blond-haired women? I don't think so. It shows your own preferences in a partner, that special "thing" that attracts you to someone.

Remember that the whole transition is the most important selfish thing you have determined you need to do. Everything else will come or not but it doesn't change your core self.
Linus is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Linus For This Useful Post:
Old 11-10-2009, 03:43 PM   #52
Linus
The Planet's Technical Bubba

How Do You Identify?:
FTM
Preferred Pronoun?:
He/Him/Geek
Relationship Status:
Married to my forever!
 
Linus's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 5,440
Thanks: 2,929
Thanked 10,724 Times in 3,172 Posts
Rep Power: 21474851
Linus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jet View Post


My biggest worry is what bathroom do i use. I worry about not passing enough to make it to the men's room.
For my first 3 months on T I still used women's washroom (never got chased out). I then gradually began using unisex washrooms (usually family washrooms at airports or Starbucks when out in public). I then used men's washrooms. Besides the cleaniness factor (men's washrooms are a sty at times), most men don't pay attention. If you go in there with purpose and direction, no one stops you. And I sit every time. No one has ever challenged me on that.
Linus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 03:49 PM   #53
Linus
The Planet's Technical Bubba

How Do You Identify?:
FTM
Preferred Pronoun?:
He/Him/Geek
Relationship Status:
Married to my forever!
 
Linus's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 5,440
Thanks: 2,929
Thanked 10,724 Times in 3,172 Posts
Rep Power: 21474851
Linus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST ReputationLinus Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit View Post


So anyhow, here's my question. Does this happen to you in your area, or is it just the Midwest US; and if it does happen where you are, does it happen to you more when you are with a Femme than if you are alone?
Hrmm.. I don't think I've ever noticed but then again, I have the advantage of a beard and facial hair seems to cement things for most people's view of gender (voice drop didn't hurt either).

When I was out in Kansas City last year, I got read both ways (I was there for work so by myself).

Did the person in question know both of you before Nick began transition?
Linus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 03:51 PM   #54
Bit
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Stonefemme
Relationship Status:
married to Gryph
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 2,177
Thanks: 1,126
Thanked 3,768 Times in 1,265 Posts
Rep Power: 10778864
Bit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST ReputationBit Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomiczombie View Post
That being said, I worry about how I will be perceived after transition. Will I be shunned but the queer community as no longer being part of the tribe? Will femmes no longer be interested? Will my queerness be invisible? I don't consider myself straight- no because I am attracted to masculine people. I am not. But because I am attracted to femmes. Femmes aren't straight women. I have little interest in straight women. Does that make me a jerk? I hope not. But will I trade being seen as a female for no longer being seen as queer when I go on T?? What is your experiences guys? Do any of you feel the same?
I can answer some of your questions, Drew, if you don't mind a Femme perspective.

I have seen Transmen be shunned by the Queer community after transition, and I have seen them be welcomed, both--so I think the answer to that one depends on your own community.

I know at least two Transmen who have said they do feel invisible to the queer community now that they are living as men--but other than what those two have said, I cannot answer that particular question.

Not being attracted to straight women does NOT make you a jerk AT ALL--it makes you one very fine special guy, MUCH appreciated by the Transensual and Queer Femmes among us... and yes, not only will you still be attractive to us, you will be MORE attractive to us because you will be settled in your own identity and you will be happy.

I think people in general highly underestimate the attractiveness of a person who is settled in his own skin, who knows who he is and who is damned happy to be himself.
Bit is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Bit For This Useful Post:
Old 11-10-2009, 03:55 PM   #55
atomiczombie
Member

How Do You Identify?:
Femmesensual Transguy
Preferred Pronoun?:
He, Him, His
Relationship Status:
Dating
 
atomiczombie's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rio Vista, CA
Posts: 1,225
Thanks: 3,949
Thanked 3,220 Times in 757 Posts
Rep Power: 21474847
atomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputationatomiczombie Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jet View Post
Do you talk to your therapist? How about joing a support group of transmen.
Just as we aren't attracted to women as women, it's also my belief that there are femmes who are attracted to masculine energy but not in biological men. We're in luck in finding potential partners on the same page.

My biggest worry is what bathroom do i use. I worry about not passing enough to make it to the men's room.
I do see a therapist, and I have been to the san francisco support group, although I now live 2 hours away and that is not easy for me to make it. But I am talking to people and this forum is one of the resources I am utilizing.
atomiczombie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 05:04 PM   #56
Andrew, Jr.
Timed Out

How Do You Identify?:
Me
Preferred Pronoun?:
He
Relationship Status:
Unavailable
 
Andrew, Jr.'s Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Over the Rainbow in a House
Posts: 5,072
Thanks: 16,004
Thanked 5,244 Times in 2,213 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Andrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST ReputationAndrew, Jr. Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Oh Linus, you can ask me to do or say anything. I appreciate you, and your advice. I feel like you are my brother.

Jet, I use a pissing packer. I still am working on the aim situation. For the life of me, I just cannot figure it out, and end up with pee down my leg, all over my boxers, and pants. I feel like such a to sum it up.

Drew & Bit, You are right about being shunned by the glbt community. I get alot of slack because I don't fit in. I am never in the "in" crowd for whatever reason. I have a tbi that causes me to have a host of neurological health issues. I am on meds, but no surgery or anything else can "cure" my health problems. When you have a head injury, that is it. You are injured for life.
Andrew, Jr. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 05:25 PM   #57
Blue
Junior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Trans
Preferred Pronoun?:
he
Relationship Status:
Married
 
Blue's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: England
Posts: 28
Thanks: 4
Thanked 84 Times in 15 Posts
Rep Power: 660738
Blue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST ReputationBlue Has the BEST Reputation
Default

I can remember coming out as lesbian and being shunned by straights.

I can remember coming out as butch and being shunned by lesbians.

I can remember coming out in leather and being shunned by both.

There will always be people out there who will shun, run, fear and try to bully others because it is their nature to bully. The good news is there are plenty of humans out there who will connect with you on a variety of levels from the intimate to the professional and everything in between and they will come from all corners of human experience. Some will need a little time to get their equalibrium. I always give new aquaintenances a bit of slack because I realize that their world might not be as wide as mine. However, life is short and I don't waste my time on anyone who either cannot get over it or are making me uncomfortable with the effort of acting like they are doing me some sort of favor even interacting with me (or playing the 'Look at me! I am so open minded' self delusion). Nasty bigots can just bugger off IMHO. In the end, it is always my choice. It's me who gets to pick and chose who I want to trust and be close to.

I always pass these days. I have an aquaintenance (straight man) who referred to Jenny and I as 'ladies'. It was rather touching because he always treats me with respect and seemed to want to let me know that he 'gets' me even though Jenny always calls me 'he'...LOL. He has shifted now, but it was for a good year. He never meant to offend me...but people looked at him really funny because some of them genuinely didn't know.

Just my 2p (Oh, and Trans works for me. It covers just about everything)

Blue

P.S. What? No spell check??????
Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 05:43 PM   #58
Jet
Timed Out - TOS Drama

How Do You Identify?:
..
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: ..
Posts: 3,471
Thanks: 292
Thanked 2,646 Times in 1,295 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Jet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST ReputationJet Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew, Jr. View Post
Jet, I use a pissing packer. I still am working on the aim situation. For the life of me, I just cannot figure it out, and end up with pee down my leg, all over my boxers, and pants. I feel like such a to sum it up.
*Smiling wide*
Jet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2009, 09:26 PM   #59
Greyson
Infamous Member

How Do You Identify?:
Transmasculine/Non-Binary
Preferred Pronoun?:
Hy (Pronounced He)
Relationship Status:
Married
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 6,589
Thanks: 21,132
Thanked 8,160 Times in 2,007 Posts
Rep Power: 21474852
Greyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST ReputationGreyson Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit View Post
I have a question. Lately when Nick and Gryph and I have been out in public, it has seemed to me that people have been going out of their way to call us "ladies."


I suppose one of the big cringe factors is their attitude; they are quite obviously going out of their way to be extra nice and to reassure us all that "they can tell [the transman] is actually really female, no worries, we accept you as a girl, we aren't going to embarrass you by not noticing your femaleness" omg it just makes me CRINGE....

So anyhow, here's my question. Does this happen to you in your area, or is it just the Midwest US; and if it does happen where you are, does it happen to you more when you are with a Femme than if you are alone?
Thanks in advance for your answers, everyone. I appreciate your time.
Evening Bit. I am going to give your questions a shot. This has happened to me where I live in the San Francisco Bay Area. And, as a matter of fact it did seem to happen more often when I was in the company of femmes and other ladies. I have been taking T for the past 18 months and the ma'am thing rarely happens now. I am not a hairy guy so not much facial hair to speak of on me.

There have been a few times in my past that I have just directly dealt with the ma'am and lady thing. First I tell them, Look no need to apologize. I know you are trying to be polite. I know how I look, present. Then I ask, "Seriously, do I look like a lady?" Usually they are not sure what to say and looking at me with a look of dumb foundedness. Then I again try to reasure them with something like "I know you have probably never been face to face with a person like me. I am Trans. This means for me, I purposely present as masculine. So please try this; If you cannot wrap your head around using a masculine pronoun on me, use prounouns that are genderless or use my name, Grey."

By this point they really are trying to make sense of what I have just said. Usually people are so unprepared to hear in a very matter of fact style such openess. They just say okay and the conversation ends or we move on.

I am very serious, I have done this a few times and so far, so good.
Greyson is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Greyson For This Useful Post:
Old 11-10-2009, 10:42 PM   #60
Thinker
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
transman
Preferred Pronoun?:
male
 
Thinker's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,868
Thanks: 710
Thanked 4,134 Times in 1,079 Posts
Rep Power: 21474847
Thinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Linus View Post
In another tangent: I'm curious as to everyone's thoughts on the term "cis" (I've seen it used in the following examples: cis-gendered, cis-man, cis-woman, etc.) This past summer a huge debate started about cis and how it was offensive to a "cis-gendered individual" (I'll use the term in this sense since I don't have the words on how else to describe it and "non-trans individual" doesn't quite seem right either..).

Opinions? Thoughts?
I've never been fond of "cis-", but using "bio-" always worked just fine for me.

I know there are transmen who do not like to hear the term "bio-male" to refer to someone......oh, someone like my brother.......but it's always been a natural default for me, and it makes clinical sense......*to me*.

I certainly never mean to offend anyone. I also recognize that it's virtually impossible not to offend *someone* when navigating these waters. I think if people are genuine, thoughtful, and honest we should cut 'em a little slack and *respectfully* explain why something may be offensive or hurtful.

Respect is the key. A little compassion, patience, and understanding come in handy too.
__________________
Practice humility and kindness.
Thinker is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Thinker For This Useful Post:
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:01 PM.


ButchFemmePlanet.com
All information copyright of BFP 2018