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key
02-13-2010, 03:55 PM
I have my personal opinion about how "great" this healthcare bill is (for the insurance industry, that is), but the truth is, this the best thing we got going in the direction of changing anything. Lets not let our best shot in 100 years pass by without giving an honest effort.

Me, I call my congress critters probably once a week during heated policy processes. they are on my contacts list in my cell phone. But if you need to find out who yours is, just go to this website below, or whitehouse.gov (I believe)

http://www.contactingthecongress.org/

Calling is better than signing a petition. Writing a letter is best, but will take too long right now. A receptionist will answer the phone and/or you can leave a message. Please be polite to the receptionist, they are not your congress critter, they are working a job.

But there is a push for "Pro health Care Reform" people to make 1 Million calls by next Friday. We have heard (and seen - thanks 'liberal media') from the Tea Baggers, we need to seriously get our message through.

Here is the million phone call website

http://salsa.wiredforchange.com/o/5921/t/5859/content.jsp?key=3380

And here is from that website:

A million calls on February 24th and 25th!

We're organizing a call-in effort to Congress on the 24th and the 25th to make a HUGE push to fix the Senate bill via reconciliation and to pass it! We need to finish the job on health care reform, and it's time to give Dems a spine on this one.

When you join our 1,000,000 million call effort, please invite your friends to join as well!

What Are We Aiming For In Fixing The Bill And Passing It?

What are we aiming for in the reconciliation fix package to the Senate bill? We are aiming for these items below:

* Inclusion of the public option
* The Medicare buy-in
* Fixing the excise tax
* Getting rid of the Nebraska Cornhusker Kickback deal
* National exchange
* Drug re-importation
* Drug price negotiation in Medicare Part D
* Increasing subsidies.


http://salsa.wiredforchange.com/o/5921/t/5859/content.jsp?key=3380

violaine
02-25-2010, 02:38 PM
:farmtree:

thank you, key.

a moment of time is all it takes.

:hanging:

http://www.ncsl.org/Default.aspx?TabID=746&tabs=1116,86,507#507


http://www.opencongress.org/

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h956/show
[supporting/opposing health bill]

http://www.ncsl.org/?tabid=18906

Apocalipstic
02-25-2010, 03:28 PM
Thank you!

While I admit to being deeply dissapointed in what the legislation is turning out to be, I do understamd that something is better than nothing and will continue to make calls.

theoddz
02-28-2010, 09:43 AM
I watched this comment from Keith Olberman with tears in my eyes. How many times have I heard from scared Americans "We don't want socialized medicine because Obama wants to create death panels that will kill us"?? How many MORE times have I witnessed and been a part of the exact SAME sad scenario that Keith describes happened to his father. I'll tell you.....too many damned times. Here's the comment. Make up your own mind.

YouTube- Keith Olbermann Special Comment on His Father and Death Panels

Reform health care NOW!!! :|

~Theo~ :bouquet:

Linus
03-05-2010, 10:43 PM
It's an awesome piece by Keith. I like his "life panels" description and it seems more apt.

I'm watching Rachel Maddows right now and she showed a political ad by Anne Louden (sp?) is claiming that the Health Bill is wrong because it's government health care and she believes it will weaken programs like Medicare and "government health care is wrong". :|

Uh.. whut?!

Kenna
03-05-2010, 11:04 PM
I watched this comment from Keith Olberman with tears in my eyes. How many times have I heard from scared Americans "We don't want socialized medicine because Obama wants to create death panels that will kill us"?? How many MORE times have I witnessed and been a part of the exact SAME sad scenario that Keith describes happened to his father. I'll tell you.....too many damned times. Here's the comment. Make up your own mind.

YouTube- Keith Olbermann Special Comment on His Father and Death Panels (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWtwvFc842A&feature=sub)

Reform health care NOW!!! :|

~Theo~ :bouquet:



How incredibly POWERFUL and MOVING!!! Thank you Theo.
I wasn't "allowed" to have a Life Discussion with my mother's doctors... but thankfully, she is better now than a year ago.

AtLast
03-06-2010, 01:12 AM
I watched this comment from Keith Olberman with tears in my eyes. How many times have I heard from scared Americans "We don't want socialized medicine because Obama wants to create death panels that will kill us"?? How many MORE times have I witnessed and been a part of the exact SAME sad scenario that Keith describes happened to his father. I'll tell you.....too many damned times. Here's the comment. Make up your own mind.

YouTube- Keith Olbermann Special Comment on His Father and Death Panels (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWtwvFc842A&feature=sub)

Reform health care NOW!!! :|

~Theo~ :bouquet:

Yes, I had tears in my eyes watching this too.

I am so frustrated with this whole process. I honestly don't believe that our congressional system will be effective until we have publically funded elections! Every move made, and word said in congress hasn't a thing to do with legislating. It is all about re-elections and which party will be in control. I'm sick of all of them. And now we will be dealing with election contributions from corporations as people!

I'm disgusted with the health care fiasco. Yes, pass it, but it isn't really much of what is really needed. But, I guess a start. But, the insurance corporations will be throwing mega-bucks after it to render any beginning null & void in the mid-terms and in 2012.

I don't think I have ever been this disillusioned about our system ever before..... I thought Obama could make some changes. I am not seeing him as being effective as a leader. I still support him, but the on-the-job training and his delutions of non-partisanism is not cutting it.

We need a public health care system and the health-care carriers must be subject to anti-trust rules!!!

Linus
03-07-2010, 09:06 AM
Lots of political fluff going on about "Reconciliation" being used to pass it. What's interesting is depending on who's doing it, the net result was most a plus for government as it meant costs went down (I doubt it will for this one). Interesting chart from the NY Times: http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2010/03/07/opinion/07opedchart_graphic.html

Miss Scarlett
03-07-2010, 09:40 AM
If I get one more email forward from my Dad or stepmother about the evils of healthcare reform and how we're going to end up with a horrible system like Canada or Great Britain I swear I am going to go over there and take a hammer to their computers!

I have reminded my Dad over and over that I was treated under the British healthcare system and everything was just fine. Then he goes off on government health insurance and its evils and I have to remind him about the many times he commented during Mom's illness and after her death about how not having Medicare would have bankrupted them...

I've also reminded him that unlike him, I have been without health insurance including the 10+ years I worked for my own Mother! I had to go without treatment for things because I could not afford to pay for it myself. I've taken jobs with lousy employers just to have insurance.

Argh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

key
03-07-2010, 10:25 AM
If I get one more email forward from my Dad or stepmother about the evils of healthcare reform and how we're going to end up with a horrible system like Canada or Great Britain I swear I am going to go over there and take a hammer to their computers!

I have reminded my Dad over and over that I was treated under the British healthcare system and everything was just fine. Then he goes off on government health insurance and its evils and I have to remind him about the many times he commented during Mom's illness and after her death about how not having Medicare would have bankrupted them...

I've also reminded him that unlike him, I have been without health insurance including the 10+ years I worked for my own Mother! I had to go without treatment for things because I could not afford to pay for it myself. I've taken jobs with lousy employers just to have insurance.

Argh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am from a fundamental Xtian (notice I do not use "Christ") family who are merely pawns in corporate America's death panel, kill granny, gov't hands off my medicare (sic) BS. I have given up trying to convince them with logic and facts and, frankly, have also given up trying to appeal to their sense of morality (Jesusy stuff like heal the sick, help the poor). And I have not seen a doctor (except one emergency room visit after enduring weeks of excruciating pain from kidney stones) in probably 15 years, since I started working for myself. Thankfully I am healthy, well, healthy enough to not be rushed to the hospital against my will, but I swear sometimes I think about getting a tattoo on my forehead saying "Do Not Resuscitate, Do Not Call an Ambulance." I would just rather die than go bankrupt.

But, we have the best Health Care in the world the tv tells us!

So I focus my efforts to educate towards people who may get it but just don't feel empowered to do anything about it. Seriously, if everyone we knew just called their congress critters once a week, we would make a huge impact. They really do take their constituents voices into consideration. And now more than ever we have to be a heavier counterweight to the lobbyists that are surrounding them everyday. Just a 30 second phone call to each rep and senator's office makes an impact.

theoddz
03-07-2010, 11:03 AM
Fear is the biggest, most effective weapon in the GOP's arsenal, and yes, the Republican party is the pawn and legislative arm of Corporate America. Actually, both the Democratic and Republican parties are really all about the same thing, so we really cannot fault one without faulting the other, to be fair. The reality of the situation is that we don't have Democracy in this country, we have CORPORATISM.

Michael Moore brought this out in his latest movie, "Capitalism: A Love Story".....People who are sick, fearful, hopeless and demoralized DON'T VOTE. They do what they're told and "hope for the best". The VOTE is the one thing that "We the people" still have that is the greatest counterweight to this political culture of "I got mine, so screw you." If I've said this before, I'll say it one thousand times......it all depends on whose ox is getting gored.

Make it theirs.

VOTE. ;)

~Theo~ :bouquet:

AtLast
03-07-2010, 12:17 PM
Isn't it ironic that those that espouse that the US has the best healthcare in the world... are members of congress! Hell yes, they have fantastic healthcare and it is publically funded!!!

Gryph
03-07-2010, 05:20 PM
Lots of political fluff going on about "Reconciliation" being used to pass it. What's interesting is depending on who's doing it, the net result was most a plus for government as it meant costs went down (I doubt it will for this one). Interesting chart from the NY Times: http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2010/03/07/opinion/07opedchart_graphic.html

I'm still not a big fan of "Reconciliation", but I know if they don't do something soon, then we, the citizens all loose.

Andrew, Jr.
03-07-2010, 07:22 PM
It is really ashame that a world leading country can't move past this bill. Ugh! I also don't see Obama as being an effective leader. He is just a figure head.

Soon
03-08-2010, 08:51 PM
Palin Crossed Border For Canadian Health Care (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/08/palin-crossed-border-for_n_490080.html)

key
03-12-2010, 08:58 AM
40 Senators have signed a letter saying they will support the public option if it is introduced through reconciliation. But I read yesterday that Sen Durbin is urging Senators to not support ANY amendments to the bill. (Durbin BTW, signed that letter of support)

Believe it or not, Senators and Representatives do feel the pressure from their constituents. If enough of us call and simply tell the receptionist (or leave a message) that you want your Senator to support the public option through the reconciliation process. The call can (and should be) short and sweet, taking just 30 seconds to a minute of your time. Give them your name (or make one up) and your zip code or city/state.

Please take a moment today to call your congress critters. We are down to the wire here and need to keep the pressure up on them.

If you need to know your congress critters number go to http://www.contactingthecongress.org/ or call the Whitehouse switchboard and they will put you through. 202 225-3121.

Kenna
03-13-2010, 07:47 PM
Isn't it ironic that those that espouse that the US has the best healthcare in the world... are members of congress! Hell yes, they have fantastic healthcare and it is publically funded!!!

Thank you AtLast. Sorry I may not be as eloquent in what I have to express... All of a sudden, this issue has really hit home for me.

After getting a call in the middle of the night from Gramma; having to listen to her heart shatter and her sobs as she told me that my dad had just died... I am very bitter and angry at "The System" now.

Very bitter indeed.

And very angry with many Government Officials - those same Gov Officials that have their healthcare, and that of all their dependents, FULLY PAID FOR and who have AMAZING "Access to Care".

Angry and Bitter because these Gov Officials have the POWER to change things for the better benefit of THE PEOPLE and FOR THE PEOPLE... but they choose to...CHOOSE TO, mind you, coddle and cozy up to the "big businesses" (Such as Highmark Blue Shield in Pennsylvania and any other Insurance Company looking to make a buck instead of serve the people), their lobbyists, the pharmaceutical companies and any other "Agency" that seems to have the Government Officials' full attention because of their "pull" in Congress and their "BIG money"...instead of DOING WHAT IS RIGHT and what they have the POWER to do!!

I wonder what these same Government Officials, or their "buddies" in the big businesses which they seem to be in bed with, would do if their father (or other loved ones) died a needless, helpless death because they HAD NO INSURANCE and very very poor Access To Care?? I wonder what they would feel when they had to listen to their 80 year old Gramma sobbing as she said she didn't know how she could afford the hospital bills or a funeral? I wonder how helpless and heartbroken they would feel when the doctor told them that this "death could have been PREVENTED if the illness had been treated earlier." I wonder how hard they would push for changes in "the system" if their partner of 20 years lie dieing of bone cancer in the hospital but they were DENIED to be by her side in her last moments because they were "not related or married" and they were a gay couple?? (like my Aunt's partner of 20 years had to endure.) I wonder HOW FAST THEY WOULD CHANGE "THE SYSTEM" after being faced with the needless loss of a loved one because of LACK OF INSURANCE AND POOR ACCESS TO CARE. My father worked, yet had no health coverage and no death benefits. He should have received Disability for his bad heart and lungs, but had been denied time and time again.

My youngest son passed away 16 years ago... I had NO INSURANCE and EXTREMELY SUBSTANDARD ACCESS TO CARE... I had tried to work, but my kidneys were in bad shape, yet I was denied Medicaid over and over for various reasons (reasons I didn't know, until I became a caseworker, were BOGUS B.S. because someone at the Assistance Office didn't do their job.) I will never know the color of my son's eyes because he died a needless, preventable, helpless death at 9 months term, with no insurance. I gave birth to him at 4 in the morning, held him in my arms and kissed him goodbye, then the hospital discharged me at NOON that day because "ma'am, you don't have any insurance to pay for an extended stay". Right before they discharged me, I had to endure a nurse's question "Are you ready to nurse your baby?" because she didn't know he had passed away. I had to tell her "no thank you, I already said goodbye."

I did not get to say goodbye to my daddy... he died in the Emergency Room of pneumonia which made his heart and lungs fail. Had he had ACCESS TO CARE - the same kind of Access to Care that these Government Officials have - and ACCESS TO HEALTH COVERAGE, I am very certain that he would have sought treatment for his "chest cold" before it cost him is life.

How many more needless, painful, preventable deaths must loved ones face for the Government to make changes for the better benefit of THE PEOPLE and FOR THE PEOPLE??!!


This is a plea, dedicated to my father Jerry and my son Dustin, to FIX AND PASS Health Care Reform that will serve the NEEDS OF THE PEOPLE. (Not those damn big businesses that keep their pockets padded and their private jet planes well fueled while people suffer.)

Please forgive my rant and my anger. I am very bitter and in much grief. Especially for my dear Gramma, who was faced with loosing yet another child, in addition to her Great Grandson 16 years ago. (I have every intention of sending this same letter to every Government Official I can possibly think of. MAYBE my voice will be heard this time, over top of the lobbyists?)

Kenna
03-13-2010, 08:46 PM
I'd like to add, if I may...

Within 7 years in my career in Health Care and Human Services Management, I WORKED for Highmark Blue Shield, Medicare and then the Office of Medical Assistance Programs (Medicaid)...as well as working as a Department of Public Welfare Caseworker.
I tried sooooo hard at my personal level to make positive changes in "The System". Especially in the childrens' preventive health program that I managed for two years. "E.P.S.D.T" = Early and Periodic Screening, Diagnosis and Treatment Program. A Preventive Health Program for ALL CHILDREN who are eligible for Medical Assistance in every State in the Nation. (Each State may call it something different...) I must be honest, I got very burned out... not because of the patients or clients I was there to serve... but because of Congress, our State Government and anyone else involved in Health Care Policy and Laws... I got sick of beating my head against a very solid brick wall, when all I was trying to do was "FIX THE SYSTEM" that was intended to SERVE THE PEOPLE.

I was a "High Level" Manager who wrote the health care policies AFTER the laws where passed. I drafted and submitted Legislative House and Senate Bill Analyses on health care related Bills and draft legislation/regulations... but I know that time and time again, the Government Officials chose the side of the Big Business instead of the People and they didn't give a Rat's A** what my Analysis stated...they were going to do what best served them, not the People. Things have got to change. I wish I had the courage and strength to take them on in person in a Legislative Hearing and testify on how "The Broken System" has affected my family.

I wish I had the strength and voice like Diane McGowan, who regrettably lost her 15 year old son to a PREVENTABLE, TREATABLE disease....Influenza!! She created the M.A.R.T.I.N. Foundation and testified to get the immunization requirements changed for ALL children in the United States...http://www.martinflufoundation.org/martin/about.cfm

AtLast
03-13-2010, 10:16 PM
What is very clear to me is that this bill is critical to me (and so many others, not just a few of which, are members right here!). However, I honestly don't think it amounts to much without a public option and disalowing insurance companies their exemptions from anti-trust provisions.

Toughy
03-13-2010, 11:47 PM
Without campaign finance reform......our choices are as follows (pick all that apply):



do nothing
allow health care financing to continue as a for-profit entity that is subsidized by tax dollars
change health insurance financing to be a not-for-profit entity (it was that way when I was a kid)
medicare for all at 55 yrs (and eventually for all despite age) and if under the current system, pay bunches more of tax dollars to big pharma and big health insurance
overhaul how we finance healthcare and institute a single payer system along the lines of the VA system.



If you think big pharma and big health insurance will loose this battle......I would suggest you look at how we finance elections......money talks....

The first change to be made is how election campaigns are financed. All political campaigns should receive the exact same amount of exposure, head to head.

Unless we change election financing we are pissing in the wind.....

AtLast
03-14-2010, 01:52 AM
Without campaign finance reform......our choices are as follows (pick all that apply):



do nothing
allow health care financing to continue as a for-profit entity that is subsidized by tax dollars
change health insurance financing to be a not-for-profit entity (it was that way when I was a kid)
medicare for all at 55 yrs (and eventually for all despite age) and if under the current system, pay bunches more of tax dollars to big pharma and big health insurance
overhaul how we finance healthcare and institute a single payer system along the lines of the VA system.



If you think big pharma and big health insurance will loose this battle......I would suggest you look at how we finance elections......money talks....

The first change to be made is how election campaigns are financed. All political campaigns should receive the exact same amount of exposure, head to head.Unless we change election financing we are pissing in the wind.....

I agree! And now we have the Supreme Court decision that is going to give corporations MORE power over elections!

I am so damn tired of politicians running for re-election the day after they are sworn in! And elections being over a year long! The money that is spent in this process is crazy and could go a long way in health care and education. and, and....

What is amazing to me historically is that a single-payer system was initially part of the New Deal and was the final portion that FDR wanted to produce along with Social Security. this was not realized, unfortunately. Big business health care companies as we know tyhem today would never have formed if it had been. The SS Acts under Roosevelt were engineered by Francis Perkins, the Secretary of Labor (first woman to serve in a cabinet).

key
03-16-2010, 09:11 AM
Bumping this thread to remind everyone, calling your congress critter really is the only way to let them know how you feel right now. Time is running out and (as usual) the reich wing has their ignorant minions out in force in Washington today to protest against everyone in America having health insurance. And as usual, the "liberal" (Military Industrial Media Complex) media will be covering these reich wingers as if they speak for all of America.

Please please please call your congress critter and Speaker Pelosi and tell them/her that you want all Americans to have decent affordable health care that does not go away if they get sick and actually need it, and does not force them to go bankrupt in order to pay for it. That is what the current bill does. It eliminates pre-existing conditions and rescission (dropping you when you get sick) and it puts a cap on out of pocket expenses so people do not have to sell their homes to get health care.

The bill ain't perfect but it is a heck of a lot better than what we have now.

To find out your congress critter's number go to http://www.contactingthecongress.org/ or just call the whitehouse 202-555-1212 and they will out you through.

PS do not be surprised if you get a busy signal....for a long time...People are calling, lets just make sure that the majority of calls are in favor of the bill.

theoddz
03-17-2010, 09:38 AM
Don't know how many folks know about these free health care clinics, but I heard about them on Keith Olberman's show the other night when Michael Moore was guesting. I think it's a great thing and I contributed $100 to it.

This is what health care in America should be......NON PROFIT!!!

http://www.freeclinics.us/index.php

And this is what Michael has to say about the proposed passage of the current health care bill:

YouTube- Michael Moore on Countdown With Keith Olbermann (Guest Host Lawrence O'Donnell) - Part 2

My thoughts and prayers are with Keith Olberman and his family for the recent loss of Keith's dad. Rest in peace, Mr. Olberman. (f)

~Theo~ :bouquet:

Linus
03-17-2010, 09:51 AM
Those free health care clinics made me think of what it's like in Canada (at least for what I had experienced from growing up and living with for 37 years of my life). While the health care system still has things to fix, I think it'd be nice to have this kind of system here (or something similar -- even just the most basic health care covered to ALL).

Linus
03-18-2010, 09:36 AM
I was tempted to post this in Dreadgeek's Dark Ages thread but will post it here:

Source: CNN (http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/03/18/thursdays-intriguing-people-4/?hpt=T2)

C.L. "Butch" Otter: The Republican governor signed the Idaho Health Freedom Act, making his state the first to pass a law saying no thanks to part of President Obama's health care proposal.

The law says that "every person within the state of Idaho is and shall be free to choose or decline to choose any mode of securing health care services without penalty or threat of penalty."


Virginia Gov. Bob McDonnell is expected to sign a bill passed in his state last week, and according to the American Legislative Exchange Council, similar proposals have made it through one chamber of the legislatures in Missouri, Oklahoma and Tennessee. While such bills have recently failed in six states, 22 additional states have seen proposals introduced.


It's curious to see this. Is this bill really that bad? I really do think a simplier bill of a single payer for basic health care and forcing health care organizations to limit their premiums would be better. Of course, the question becomes "what is basic health care?"

Apocalipstic
03-18-2010, 09:56 AM
Agreed! Health Care should not be an "industry" it should not be for profit.

"Congress Critters" is one of the funniest things I can remember thinking. Thank you Key!

Keith Oberman rocks as does Michael Moore!

Linus, I think the Bill falls way way short of where I think it should be, but even as it is many people are freaked out at the very idea. They are led to believe and vote against their best interests by huge campaigns led and paid for by the insurance companies themselves.

I am very disheartened by the whole thing.

theoddz
03-18-2010, 10:25 AM
You know, I don't see why we can't pattern a national health care system after the VA. I'm going to toot my employer's and my health care provider of choice here and say (again, because I've posted in these threads repeatedly about this)...that the VA has consistently, CONSISTENTLY ranked #1 NATIONWIDE, in patient satisfaction.

Now, that said, what I'm about to say is only my take, my opinion, from my own experiences with VA, both as a Disabled Veteran and a VA employee of nearly 15 years. I have worked in 2 VA health care systems (VA Northern California HCS at Sacramento, CA, VISN 21, and currently in the VA Southern Nevada Health Care system here at Las Vegas, NV, VISN 22) in my career. I also worked (as a civilian) in the DoD system for the US Navy at the Naval Medical Center in San Diego, CA. Most VA medical centers are located in large urban areas and are associated with the big state medical schools. Because of this, Veterans are given access to top of the line, cutting edge treatment. Many of the treatments and medications used to treat serious injury and disease were developed with the partnership that exists between these big educational/research institutions and the VA. On the whole, I have always gotten top notch care. The only reason I'm a little skiddish about having a surgical procedure performed where I work now is because the VA here in Las Vegas has no proximity to a state medical school. The University of Nevada School of Medicine is actually located in Reno, which is quite a ways from here, in northern Nevada. That being as such, VA has to farm many of its patients requiring specialty care to the private sector. For that reason, and that reason alone, I keep my employer based insurance through the FEHB (Federal Employees Health Benefit) plan. I would only use my health insurance plan in a situation where I needed a complex surgery or procedure.

It makes perfect sense to maybe either expand VA to cover every American and perhaps evolve it into a "Federal Health Care System". VA has repeatedly been held up and touted as an example of cost effectiveness successfully blended with cutting edge technology and top notch patient care. Our CPRS (Computerized Patient Records System) links each VA facility with another and enables us to pull up any Veteran's VA medical records from anywhere in this country. That alone saves us a lot of money. VA's buying power consistently drums down drug costs just by sheer volume. Unless a Vet holds a high disability rating (over 50%), is not being treated specifically for a service related injury or illness, or his/her income falls beneath what is called a "means threshold" (in which case, that Veteran is exempt from ALL copays), he/she pays a copayment of $8 for a 30 day supply of medication.

If we expanded the VA into a federal health care system, and covered every American under a similarly funded system, think of the costs that could be saved!! Think of the access there would be for everyone!!! We could drive costs down even further with the additional number of patients served. In such a system, we could even keep the private insurance system, employing it to cover nominal copays for services, treatments and medications. The big insurers wouldn't be making humongous profits, but providing decent care for a reasonable cost would require putting a certain amount of money back into the system. The VA does this by the employment of 3rd party billing. Those Veterans (even those like me, who are exempt from copays because of high disability ratings, yet who have private insurance through employers, etc.) are billed for services/treatment for conditions not related to our service connected disabilities. So, yes, money is put back into the system to help to pay for the treatment of other Veterans who fall beneath the "means threshold" and cannot afford to pay anything. It's all for the common good, really. I don't mind that they bill my insurance company for this. It helps other Vets and that's a good thing.

I still maintain that TRUE reform in health care cannot and will not be achieved unless you take the profit incentive out of the equation. Therein lies the problem. When it comes to money and prying it out of cold, dead, greedy hands, you're almost trying to achieve the impossible. I truly believe that it is do-able.

Respectfully,
~Theo~ :bouquet:

Apocalipstic
03-18-2010, 11:42 AM
You know, I don't see why we can't pattern a national health care system after the VA. I'm going to toot my employer's and my health care provider of choice here and say (again, because I've posted in these threads repeatedly about this)...that the VA has consistently, CONSISTENTLY ranked #1 NATIONWIDE, in patient satisfaction.

Now, that said, what I'm about to say is only my take, my opinion, from my own experiences with VA, both as a Disabled Veteran and a VA employee of nearly 15 years. I have worked in 2 VA health care systems (VA Northern California HCS at Sacramento, CA, VISN 21, and currently in the VA Southern Nevada Health Care system here at Las Vegas, NV, VISN 22) in my career. I also worked (as a civilian) in the DoD system for the US Navy at the Naval Medical Center in San Diego, CA. Most VA medical centers are located in large urban areas and are associated with the big state medical schools. Because of this, Veterans are given access to top of the line, cutting edge treatment. Many of the treatments and medications used to treat serious injury and disease were developed with the partnership that exists between these big educational/research institutions and the VA. On the whole, I have always gotten top notch care. The only reason I'm a little skiddish about having a surgical procedure performed where I work now is because the VA here in Las Vegas has no proximity to a state medical school. The University of Nevada School of Medicine is actually located in Reno, which is quite a ways from here, in northern Nevada. That being as such, VA has to farm many of its patients requiring specialty care to the private sector. For that reason, and that reason alone, I keep my employer based insurance through the FEHB (Federal Employees Health Benefit) plan. I would only use my health insurance plan in a situation where I needed a complex surgery or procedure.

It makes perfect sense to maybe either expand VA to cover every American and perhaps evolve it into a "Federal Health Care System". VA has repeatedly been held up and touted as an example of cost effectiveness successfully blended with cutting edge technology and top notch patient care. Our CPRS (Computerized Patient Records System) links each VA facility with another and enables us to pull up any Veteran's VA medical records from anywhere in this country. That alone saves us a lot of money. VA's buying power consistently drums down drug costs just by sheer volume. Unless a Vet holds a high disability rating (over 50%), is not being treated specifically for a service related injury or illness, or his/her income falls beneath what is called a "means threshold" (in which case, that Veteran is exempt from ALL copays), he/she pays a copayment of $8 for a 30 day supply of medication.

If we expanded the VA into a federal health care system, and covered every American under a similarly funded system, think of the costs that could be saved!! Think of the access there would be for everyone!!! We could drive costs down even further with the additional number of patients served. In such a system, we could even keep the private insurance system, employing it to cover nominal copays for services, treatments and medications. The big insurers wouldn't be making humongous profits, but providing decent care for a reasonable cost would require putting a certain amount of money back into the system. The VA does this by the employment of 3rd party billing. Those Veterans (even those like me, who are exempt from copays because of high disability ratings, yet who have private insurance through employers, etc.) are billed for services/treatment for conditions not related to our service connected disabilities. So, yes, money is put back into the system to help to pay for the treatment of other Veterans who fall beneath the "means threshold" and cannot afford to pay anything. It's all for the common good, really. I don't mind that they bill my insurance company for this. It helps other Vets and that's a good thing.

I still maintain that TRUE reform in health care cannot and will not be achieved unless you take the profit incentive out of the equation. Therein lies the problem. When it comes to money and prying it out of cold, dead, greedy hands, you're almost trying to achieve the impossible. I truly believe that it is do-able.

Respectfully,
~Theo~ :bouquet:

I wish you would run for office!

I agree 100%, health care does not need to be a money making operation.

Toughy
03-18-2010, 06:01 PM
I so agree with Theo...........

I get my care at the SF VA Medical Center and I could not be happier with the cutting edge care I get. Same was true at the Albuquerque VA Medical Center. The Women's Clinic at both places is fabulous. The VA is really pushing to provide quality care for women veterans.

The care I got at a rural VA Clinic was lacking in many areas, particularly women's health and mental health.

VA..........single-payer .............definitely 'socialized medicine' ..........and I would rather have single-payer and have advocated that since the early 90's.

MsDemeanor
03-18-2010, 07:48 PM
Make sure that your Congress Critter (I LOVE that) has signed on to Alan Grayson's Medicare You Can Buy Into Act, HR 4789.

Also, you can sign the petition:
http://salsa.mydccc.org/o/30019/p/dia/action/public/?action_KEY=17

AtLast
03-18-2010, 08:10 PM
Yes, the VA!!! We already have the right kind of public option right under our noses! this is why the GOP makes me so damn mad when it refers to Obama's plan as a socialist plan!! Which is a scare tactic.

Yes, there have been problems with the VA and I remember being very upset with this in terms of our service women and men. But, it could so easily be adopted and adapted for public health-care in the US.

This is such political and corporate welfare bullshit!!

Soon
03-19-2010, 08:25 AM
YouTube- THE TEA PARTY & THE CIRCUS - Final Healthcare Reform Protest

MsDemeanor
03-19-2010, 10:15 AM
I want to find all their cars and put on bumper stickers that say "I'm stupid and I vote".

key
03-19-2010, 02:15 PM
I kinda don't blame these people as much as I blame Fox News. These people want desperately to believe that they are free, that they are valuable. They have the same desires in life that we all do. They just lack the quality of discernment. they honestly do not realize that their "News" could be lying to them, could be using them.

Thomas Jefferson knew it way back when he said the only way a Democracy will survive is with an informed electorate. This is why he started America's first public University. Jefferson was more proud of this accomplishment than of being President, chose it for his tombstone.

These people on this video are sadly a product of what our country passes for education and information. It really takes work to find the truth, and because so few make that effort, the ones who speak these truths are often scorned as outsiders.

Anyway. Great video.

BTW, did you call your congress critter today. This is it, the last chance to speak up about this bill.

AtLast
03-19-2010, 02:26 PM
I want to find all their cars and put on bumper stickers that say "I'm stupid and I vote".


I'll help... let's go!!

When I used to live right by a huge Christian center/church in Sacramento, some friends and me did do this with NO on 6 bumper stickers! Thousands of cars in the parking lot and it was spread out, so we could slap those puppies over the existing yes On 6 stickers without detection!!! You guessed it, security and cameras were then installed and given little electric rent-a-cop cars!!! Prop 6 passed, but, I did feel some joy!

:ohm:

MsDemeanor
03-20-2010, 04:29 PM
Tea party folks get even more disgusting, as if that were possible:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/20/tea-party-protests-nier-f_n_507116.html#s74976

Soon
03-20-2010, 06:17 PM
A Guide for Those Traumatized by Right-Wing, Fear-Mongering Lies on Health Care Reform (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mitchell-bard/a-guide-for-those-traumat_b_507034.html)

Linus
03-20-2010, 06:25 PM
A Guide for Those Traumatized by Right-Wing, Fear-Mongering Lies on Health Care Reform (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mitchell-bard/a-guide-for-those-traumat_b_507034.html)


Uh.. huh? What is this referring to:

"If ObamaCare passes, that free insurance card that's in people's pockets is gonna be as worthless as a Confederate dollar after the War Between The States - the Great War of Yankee Aggression."

What "free insurance" card that exists?

Soon
03-20-2010, 06:32 PM
Uh.. huh? What is this referring to:



What "free insurance" card that exists?

not sure? medicare?

I'm not from the United States--shrugs.

Linus
03-20-2010, 06:36 PM
not sure? medicare?

I'm not from the United States--shrugs.

Neither am I. And Medicare is paid via taxes. Even Canadian Health Care isn't "free" (it's a single payer that is paid for by provincial and federal taxes, income and GST/PST)

Soon
03-20-2010, 06:43 PM
Neither am I. And Medicare is paid via taxes. Even Canadian Health Care isn't "free" (it's a single payer that is paid for by provincial and federal taxes, income and GST/PST)

I know on both counts -- I'm Canadian as well.

key
03-21-2010, 09:18 PM
I hope I am not the only geek watching this historic vote on C-Span tonight.

I must say Nancy Pelosi has earned her place in the history books with this bill. It would not have passed without her leadership.

The bill is not perfect, but it is the first time in US history that Health Insurance Companies will be regulated. Can you believe we have been living under the boot of those thugs all this time?

Tomorrow I plan to call Speaker Pelosi's office to thank her. I hope you will join me. I am sure she is going to get an earful from the other side. So please take a moment to let her know you appreciate her hard work on this.

:party:

Sachita
03-21-2010, 09:27 PM
no doubt it. It was a special report here. No its not perfect but its something.

WolfyOne
03-21-2010, 09:37 PM
This is only the beginning of what may or may not come. I'll be interested in seeing how the overall picture will play out with the insurance companies. Will they still be able to drop those that have a sickness they deem to expensive to pay for? Doesn't matter to much if they regulate the price insurance companies can charge us if everyone can't be covered under this new bill for equal amounts of monies.

Jess
03-22-2010, 04:46 AM
This is only the beginning of what may or may not come. I'll be interested in seeing how the overall picture will play out with the insurance companies. Will they still be able to drop those that have a sickness they deem to expensive to pay for? Doesn't matter to much if they regulate the price insurance companies can charge us if everyone can't be covered under this new bill for equal amounts of monies.


I am also interested in if there is a cap insurance companies can charge for those with pre-existing illness. They can no longer " deny", but I have yet to find any statement regarding how much they can charge.

The brief summary of the 2004 page bill from CBS:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20000846-503544.html

Soon
03-22-2010, 05:35 AM
People are saying this is the greatest speech of Obama's presidency thus far. I haven't watched it yet, but I thought I'd put it up to share (and maybe it will help me to remember to watch it!). Scroll down for video:


Obama Quotes Lincoln To House Dems: 'I Am Bound To Be True' (VIDEO) (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/20/obama-quotes-lincoln-to-h_n_507124.html)

apretty
03-22-2010, 08:03 AM
Uh.. huh? What is this referring to:



What "free insurance" card that exists?


no clue--it's gibberish.

Diva
03-22-2010, 08:22 AM
If You'd like to send Your thanks to Speaker Pelosi, here is her contact information:

http://www.speaker.gov/contact/

Greyson
03-22-2010, 08:58 AM
I kinda don't blame these people as much as I blame Fox News. These people want desperately to believe that they are free, that they are valuable. They have the same desires in life that we all do. They just lack the quality of discernment. they honestly do not realize that their "News" could be lying to them, could be using them.

Thomas Jefferson knew it way back when he said the only way a Democracy will survive is with an informed electorate. This is why he started America's first public University. Jefferson was more proud of this accomplishment than of being President, chose it for his tombstone.

These people on this video are sadly a product of what our country passes for education and information. It really takes work to find the truth, and because so few make that effort, the ones who speak these truths are often scorned as outsiders.

Anyway. Great video.

BTW, did you call your congress critter today. This is it, the last chance to speak up about this bill.


Yes, I spent the entire day and evening watching it until the very end on CNN. I will admit I chose CNN coverage because I like and respect Political Analyst Donna Brazile. Many times when I am about to keel over from the hypocrisy, the spin and all the other B.S. I gather strength and composure from listening and watching Ms. Brazile and Roland Martin. Both, are some of the handful of Political Analyst that happen to be POC.

I would like to just take a moment to point out did any of you notice as the camera scanned the US Congress over and over how few POC faces you saw during the entire proceedings? I know there are many qualified POC in the country that should be active, participating members of the various power structures in government and the private sector. Sometimes it is daunting when I really open my eyes and accept the realities of the society I live in. It still is not a level playing field. I am not sure it will ever be. I am sure that no matter what, I will continue to keep talking about and taking action about the things in our society that are our "dirty little secrets."

Yes, good idea to take the time this morning to contact our Congress women and men who took a stand and made health care more accessible to all Americans.

Diva
03-22-2010, 03:18 PM
I hate to admit this, but the idiot that yelled out "BABY KILLER" during last evening's vote of the Health Care Bill was none other than GOP Rep. Randy Neugebauer of the great state of Texas. He represents the Abilene/Lubbock/Amarillo area ~ several notches in the Bible belt.

It took me a while to find a way to contact Mr. Neugebauer....seems his website is mysteriously down. Gee. Wonder why?

But I found him on Facebook and this is the message I sent to him.....

"Once again, an out of control person in our government has made the great state of Texas a laughing stock.

No matter what your personal beliefs are, if you wanted to call someone a 'baby killer', could you not have done this in private? "Freedom of speech" does not mean "Freedom to be a horse's rear".

Check your Baptist tongue, Sir.

~Janey Hall"



I'm so embarrassed. The entirity of Texas, while mostly conservative, is not ALL like this, folks. Thank God for places like Austin and Houston...that's all I have to say!

Daywalker
03-22-2010, 03:38 PM
I strongly believer that a huge part of Health Care Reform should have
included a cap on the price of procedures, ER visits, Prescriptions...just
everything across the board. Frankly, if some of those things had been
capped long ago, some of the problems we are all experiencing may
have been alleviated. Who in their right mind believes for one
second that a $100,000 Hospital stay should equal bankruptcy,
the loss of ones Home, and all the things that it takes a lifetime
to achieve...because of illness or injury?
:sadangel:

I'll tell ya who...the same folks that seem to think charging $25 to
your Insurance for a fucking band aid during an ER visit...that's who.

:|

:daywalker:

Linus
03-22-2010, 04:17 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/03/22/health.care.lawsuit/index.html?hpt=T1

So 10 States have lined up to sue once Obama signs the HealthCare bill into law. I'm not clear as to why they feel they can sue. It seems the argument is that the gov't is forcing individuals to spend (isn't car insurance similar?) and that States must spend the money for Health Care (aren't similar laws in place for education? No Child Left behind did that, didn't it?)

Corkey
03-22-2010, 04:21 PM
I think its their last ditch effort to mess with the law. I am writing our AG in our state to ask him if he wants to be re-elected. Perhaps if we all wrote these bigots and racists they might get the idea that they are wrong...oh wait, their egos will get in the way of reason.

Hudson
03-24-2010, 06:03 PM
Didn't Rush Limbaugh promise to leave the country if this health care bill passed? And aren't we holding him to it?

Although when he said he'd go to Costa Rica, he was responding to a caller who asked him where he'd go (for health care) if the bill passed (since according to the repubs, the care will be so, so terrible) I was unclear as to whether he meant because he opposes the bill or to actually go get some health care since Costa Rica offers government-financed universal. I bet he's been sneaking anyway, like Palin did in Canada.

Either way, he should go. Sorry, Costa Rica.

Soon
03-24-2010, 06:08 PM
Didn't Rush Limbaugh promise to leave the country if this health care bill passed? And aren't we holding him to it?

Although when he said he'd go to Costa Rica, he was responding to a caller who asked him where he'd go (for health care) if the bill passed (since according to the repubs, the care will be so, so terrible) I was unclear as to whether he meant because he opposes the bill or to actually go get some health care since Costa Rica offers government-financed universal. I bet he's been sneaking anyway, like Palin did in Canada.

Either way, he should go. Sorry, Costa Rica.

A Ticket for Rush (http://www.aticketforrush.com/)

Hudson
03-24-2010, 07:07 PM
A Ticket for Rush (http://www.aticketforrush.com/)

DONATED! --------

MsDemeanor
03-25-2010, 01:59 AM
Fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck

Senate will have to return health bill to House

Senate Republicans learned early Thursday that they will be able to kill language in a measure altering President Barack Obama's newly enacted health care overhaul, meaning the bill will have to return to the House for final congressional approval.

linkyloo (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100325/ap_on_bi_ge/us_health_care_overhaul)

Miss Scarlett
03-25-2010, 04:24 AM
I truly believe that the GOP will stop at nothing...see below (emphasis mine)

March 23, 2010, 7:18 pm

Senate Republicans Offer More Amendments
By DAVID M. HERSZENHORN
The amendments are piling up.

Here are a few of the Republican amendments, as described by the authors, that were submitted on Tuesday in the Senate. The senators referenced below are David Vitter of Louisiana, Charles E. Grassley of Iowa, Judd Gregg of New Hampshire, James M. Inhofe of Oklahoma, Bob Bennett of Utah and John McCain of Arizona.

Vitter amendment: Prohibiting use of funds to the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN). (#3554)

Grassley amendment: To make sure the President, Cabinet Members, all White House Senior staff and Congressional Committee and Leadership Staff are purchasing health insurance through the health insurance exchanges established by the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. (#3564)

Inhofe amendment: To exclude devices for persons with disabilities from the medical device tax. (#3565)

Gregg-Coburn amendment: To prevent Medicare from being raided for new entitlements and to use Medicare savings to save Medicare. (#3567)

Bennett amendment: To protect the Democratic process and the right of the people of the District of Columbia to define marriage. (#3568)

Grassley amendment: To amend title XVIII of the Social Security Act to ensure Medicare beneficiary access to physicians, eliminate sweetheart deals for frontier States, and ensure equitable reimbursement under the Medicare program for all rural states. (#3569)

McCain Amendment: To eliminate the sweetheart deals for Tennessee, Hawaii, Louisiana, Montana, Connecticut, and frontier States. (#3570)

See earlier post on amendments offered by Senator Tom Coburn, Republican of Oklahoma.http://prescriptions.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/03/23/coburns-unusual-amendments/

Link to this NY Times article:
http://prescriptions.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/03/23/senate-republicans-add-health-care-amendments/?scp=2&sq=bennett&st=cse

Greyson
03-26-2010, 11:35 AM
New York Times

The Conscience of A Liberal - Paul Krugman


March 25, 2010, 5:21 pm

David Frum, AEI, Heritage And Health Care
David Frum* has been fired by the American Enterprise Institute; one has to assume that this is a response to his outspokenness about the Republican failure on health reform.

In discussing the Frum firing, Bruce Bartlett asserts that AEI has muzzled its health-care experts, because the truth is that they agree with a lot of what Obama is proposing. I find this quite believable; back in 2003 Stuart Butler of the Heritage Foundation, which is supposedly harder-right than AEI, proposed a health care reform consisting of … drumroll … an individual mandate coupled with subsidies to make insurance affordable. In short, Obamacare.
I was struck, by the way, by Butler’s recommendation that we

Provide support to people to obtain health care based on their need, not where they happen to work, or their eligibility for welfare, or their military record, or their age.

From each according to his ability, to each according to his need?

*I’m informed, by family members, that Frum is a distant cousin of yours truly.

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/03/25/david-frum-aei-heritage-and-health-care/?pagemode=print

AtLast
03-26-2010, 12:36 PM
Goes to show that all this GOP grandstanding is really just about trying to regain power!!! They are acting like a bunch of 2 year olds with very entitled parents! Serving in Congress is about nothing but campaigning and re-election. Until we have public funding/regulation (ONLY) for elections, we will have an ineffective, broken Congress full of trust-fund babies. It isn't about We the People.... its about We the Elite.....

New York Times

The Conscience of A Liberal - Paul Krugman


March 25, 2010, 5:21 pm

David Frum, AEI, Heritage And Health Care
David Frum* has been fired by the American Enterprise Institute; one has to assume that this is a response to his outspokenness about the Republican failure on health reform.

In discussing the Frum firing, Bruce Bartlett asserts that AEI has muzzled its health-care experts, because the truth is that they agree with a lot of what Obama is proposing. I find this quite believable; back in 2003 Stuart Butler of the Heritage Foundation, which is supposedly harder-right than AEI, proposed a health care reform consisting of … drumroll … an individual mandate coupled with subsidies to make insurance affordable. In short, Obamacare.
I was struck, by the way, by Butler’s recommendation that we

Provide support to people to obtain health care based on their need, not where they happen to work, or their eligibility for welfare, or their military record, or their age.

From each according to his ability, to each according to his need?

*I’m informed, by family members, that Frum is a distant cousin of yours truly.

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/03/25/david-frum-aei-heritage-and-health-care/?pagemode=print

AtLast
03-26-2010, 12:38 PM
Fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck

Senate will have to return health bill to House

Senate Republicans learned early Thursday that they will be able to kill language in a measure altering President Barack Obama's newly enacted health care overhaul, meaning the bill will have to return to the House for final congressional approval.

linkyloo (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100325/ap_on_bi_ge/us_health_care_overhaul)

Ocho Fuck!

Linus
03-26-2010, 01:34 PM
That link doesn't have anything that indicates a second return. It may have happened yesterday and was completed last night. AFAIK, Obama signed it into law today. I do believe it's political suicide to repeal it after so many will benefit from it in the next 6 months.

Andrew, Jr.
03-26-2010, 03:15 PM
I am really saddened by the shooting of the office buildings, and the threatening vm's left for Senators and Congressmen & Women - all over this bill. Now Glen Beck is having a revival starting in Orlando, FL.

What is wrong with these people? Oh, that's right...they are republican and have good healthcare benefits. Talk about frustrating. :brainsucker:

Soon
03-28-2010, 02:27 PM
"Of course, a lot of right wingers are very upset about this because they believe this health care bill will cost a lot of money. You know what I think? Just pretend it's another unnecessary war. You'll feel better about it already." -Jay Leno

(caveat: not that I like Leno or believe that this will amount to the billions (trillions?) that the wars have cost)

"If conservatives get to call universal healthcare 'socialized medicine,' I get to call private, for-profit healthcare 'soulless, vampire bastards making money off human pain.'" --Bill Maher

(caveat: not that your HCR is universal HC! at all!)

theoddz
03-28-2010, 03:18 PM
What I find totally baffling is that these nuts are whining about so called "high cost" of the recent legislation which only put limits on some of the abuses of Big Health Insurers. These same foolios didn't make a friggin' PEEP when the Bush Administration passed laws giving the wealthiest top 1% insane tax cuts that cost (and are continuing to cost) waaaaaay more.

I still maintain that "cost" is not the issue.....at least where these right wingnut Repugs are concerned. They just cannot STAND that there is a BLACK man in the WHITE House and they are determined to see or cause him to fail at *everything*, no matter how it would harm this country. They'd rather sabotage this country and throw the populace under the bus.

Idiots. :rant:

~Theo~ :bouquet:

MsDemeanor
03-28-2010, 04:01 PM
What I find totally baffling is that these nuts are whining about so called "high cost" of the recent legislation which only put limits on some of the abuses of Big Health Insurers. These same foolios didn't make a friggin' PEEP when the Bush Administration passed laws giving the wealthiest top 1% insane tax cuts that cost (and are continuing to cost) waaaaaay more.

I still maintain that "cost" is not the issue.....at least where these right wingnut Repugs are concerned. They just cannot STAND that there is a BLACK man in the WHITE House and they are determined to see or cause him to fail at *everything*, no matter how it would harm this country. They'd rather sabotage this country and throw the populace under the bus.

Idiots. :rant:

~Theo~ :bouquet:

That accounts for some of them. For the veterans and the seniors and the unemployed out at the Tea Parties who are living on government checks and/or getting their medical care via taxpayer dollars, there's really no other explanation. I think that the biggest issue is that the wrong party passed this legislation. It gives the republicans and conservatives pretty much everything that they want, and totally sells out the left and near-left, so the lame excuses from the right wing about costs and socialism and such are clearly lies pulled out of their asses.

Linus
03-29-2010, 06:58 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/29/health/policy/29health.html?hp

This is why this country seriously needs single-payer. Really. The insurance companies will try and wiggle their way out of providing support because it hits their bottom line. They truly do not care about the health and welfare of the individuals they insure. They only care about how many shares/stocks they sell in a year.

key
03-29-2010, 08:54 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/29/health/policy/29health.html?hp

This is why this country seriously needs single-payer. Really. The insurance companies will try and wiggle their way out of providing support because it hits their bottom line. They truly do not care about the health and welfare of the individuals they insure. They only care about how many shares/stocks they sell in a year.

and we have known this for generations (since the early 1900's when this debate started in America). In California the people have passed single payer TWICE and TWICE it has been vetoed by the sitting Governor. What you are not acknowledging is the stranglehold that corporations have over our Government. I am saying this, seriously, as a warning and a pre-emptive cry for help from the global community. Corporations own the US Government and are getting more and more "human rights" everyday (through the Supreme Court). It is only a matter of time before the ACTUAL humans of our country either take it out of the jaws of this dragon, or we will need the help of the world community to do so....I am sad to say that Fascism (the marriage of Corporations and Government) is alive and well on the planet, and it is growing here in America....And guess what? The Tea Partiers are now ready to fight to make fascism a full blown reality. They are protesting against their own human rights - and they are armed. Soon we will all have to take sides in this struggle.

:thud: or :ninja:

Linus
03-29-2010, 09:08 AM
and we have known this for generations (since the early 1900's when this debate started in America). In California the people have passed single payer TWICE and TWICE it has been vetoed by the sitting Governor. What you are not acknowledging is the stranglehold that corporations have over our Government. I am saying this, seriously, as a warning and a pre-emptive cry for help from the global community. Corporations own the US Government and are getting more and more "human rights" everyday (through the Supreme Court). It is only a matter of time before the ACTUAL humans of our country either take it out of the jaws of this dragon, or we will need the help of the world community to do so....I am sad to say that Fascism (the marriage of Corporations and Government) is alive and well on the planet, and it is growing here in America....And guess what? The Tea Partiers are now ready to fight to make fascism a full blown reality. They are protesting against their own human rights - and they are armed. Soon we will all have to take sides in this struggle.

:thud: or :ninja:

Hrmm.. perhaps that's because from my POV, a Canadian rosy eyed glass one, there is a separation between State, Church and Corporations. I'm not used to this idea that Corporations, via lobbyists (I suspect that's where they do this, no?), have such a strong hold on the Gov't. And to be honest, with media outlets like Fox News this will never change in this country. As long as this is accepted as norm and ok, then no one will want it changed (in the larger society as a whole -- certainly there seems to be voices in US Society that encourage people to ask and challenge this but..)

theoddz
04-09-2010, 03:44 PM
This (today) in an email newsletter from my union (AFGE - American Federation of Government Employees). This lines out what the recently passed health care legislation will do.

How Americans Benefit from New Health Care Law

Last year as nearly six million people lost their jobs and most economic sectors saw their profits plummet, the nation's five largest health insurance companies – WellPoint, UnitedHealth Group, Cigna, Aetna, and Humana – took in combined profits of $12.2 billion, up 56% from 2008, but at the same time covered 2.7 million fewer Americans. Each of these five CEOs was compensated up to $24 million in 2008. This was happening when Americans saw their premiums skyrocket and went though the worst recession since the Great Depression. One CEO – WellPoint's Angela Braly – recently admitted to Congress that Anthem Blue Cross of California has raised its individual plan premiums by 39% to feed its profits, not to cover health care cost. Besides California, WellPoint has raised or is about to raise premiums in 11 other states. Meanwhile, Braly's 2009 pay went up 51% from $8.7 million in 2008 to $13.1 million.

Insurance companies and their CEOs prosper at the expense of working families. They make money by raising premiums and dropping people when they get sick despite the fact that these people have been paying their premiums for years. A recent study shows that more than 60% of bankruptcies are because of medical bills, and most of those who filed for bankruptcy were middle-class, well-educated homeowners.

For decades, we have seen more and more companies eliminate health insurance coverage as premium costs have risen. We all know relatives and friends who are without coverage. Young people are finding it more difficult to get coverage. Federal Employees Health Benefits Program (FEHBP) premiums are taking a larger share of our paychecks. And if federal employees want to leave government, they fear losing their coverage. As more and more companies drop providing health insurance, it makes our health insurance benefits a target for anti-federal employee politicians. Making sure everyone in America gets covered is not only the right thing but protects our ability to have health insurance coverage as well.

That's why the American Federation of Government Employees strongly supports the new health care law that will end the worst insurance company abuses and make sure they are held accountable. Like Medicare and Social Security, Americans will be able to secure affordable health care. Under the law signed by President Obama March 23, 2010:

* Insurance companies can no longer deny coverage to children who were born with illnesses or have pre-existing conditions.

* Insurance companies are prohibited from dropping people because they get sick.

* They must allow children to stay on their parent's insurance plans until age 26.

* Starting in 2014, insurance companies can no longer deny coverage to people with pre-existing conditions.

* Insurance companies in 2014 will be barred from imposing annual limits on the amount of coverage people can get. There also will be no lifetime coverage limits.

* 32 million Americans who are currently uninsured will be covered.

* The uninsured and self-employed people will be able to buy insurance through state-based exchanges with government subsidies given to those who can't afford it.

* There will be limits on what people have to pay for premiums and out-of-pocket costs based on income.

* Wasteful spending on insurance company executive salaries will be stopped by limiting how much of people's insurance premiums can go toward company administration and profits. A company that goes over the limit has to rebate it back to consumers.

* Insurance companies will be forced to end discrimination against women by charging more for groups with high percentage of women.

* Large employers will pay a penalty if they don't provide health coverage and their employees have to get subsidies in the exchanges to buy their own insurance.

* Small businesses that provide their workers with insurance will get tax credits that cover 35% of premium costs immediately and 50% in 2014.

* Seniors will get additional help for prescription drugs by closing the Medicare "donut hole" or coverage gap, which requires patients to pay the full cost of prescription drugs that cost between $2,830 and $6,440. The donut hole affects about one in four Medicare recipients, forcing them to start splitting their drugs or stop taking medications altogether. Seniors who fall into the donut hole will get a $250 rebate this year, a 50% discount on brand-name drugs starting next year and the donut hole will be completely eliminated by 2020.

* In 2018, there will be an excise tax on employer-provided health plans costing more than $27,500 for family coverage and $10,200 for individual coverage. The tax is imposed only on the amount of the premium that goes over the threshold. It is to be paid by the insurance companies.

How does the new law affect federal employees?

* Dependent coverage: AFGE was successful in persuading the Office of Personnel Management to apply the dependent coverage provision to federal employees so they can keep their children on their FEHBP plans until age 26, up from 22. OPM recently informed the union that the dependent coverage provision will apply to federal employees, effective Jan.1, 2011.
* Premiums: Federal employees who are enrolled in FEHBP are in a separate risk pool from uninsured Americans, so there will be no effect on their FEHBP premiums. In the long run, reform is expected to slowly reduce the growth in premiums.


~Theo~ :bouquet: