Love is within ones self, begin there and stay true to yourself. It seems you already know this situation is not healthy. I wish you happiness and love in your life. Perhaps then you will find what you want . Good luck !

hi folks!!! Happy holidays!!!

i have read thru this thread and am guessing the partner doesn't know you are in the picture. So I am basing my response on this.

i am wondering what the impact on trust issues amoungst peers we create from these kinds of situations in our queer culture. people more than once and I also have been third party witness to enough shady online and real time behavior that i wonder these kinds of things. i mean what if the other guy was potentially a candidate to be a really great friend? What kinda friend bridges are destroyed by feeding into these behaviors?

What do you get from the relationship? What does he get from the relationship? Why can't he open up his primary relationship? Do you want him full time? does he want you full time?

There is absolutly nothing wrong with being a secondary, if that's what you really want... But settling on being second, just because that is the only way you can have the person in your life isn't that good a deal...


Can you find out if him having an open relationship is even on the table?


My thoughts are... Only do what you are willing to pay for... What are the costs?

If you are willing to pay the price.. You have weighed all the sides and found that you still want what you want and are willing to permantly alter someone for your needs to be met (because anyone who has been cheated on knows.. It permanantly alters who you are) then own it... Say, this is who I am... What I want is what matters...

If you are not wanting to be that person, then stop.. Don't be that person... That simple... You know what is going to happen if you continue on this road, someones world is going to be destroyed. Doesn't matter that you didn't mean it to happen, or that you feel bad about it.... You still do it, so own it...

Like Snow said... Don't do anything that doesn't let you look yourself in the eye or makes it hard for you to sleep at night... It's that simple...

Then stop what you are doing. Being a good person is not complicated. It is very straightforward. Just do what deep down you know is the right thing to do. You may not like it, in fact it may really piss you off, having to think of someone else's interests before your own. But when it comes right down to it, you will be miserable doing the wrong thing too. You obviously are now. There are places you can go to get counseling on a sliding scale, so you don't have to pay the full price.

If you want to feel better about yourself, just make the right decisions and do what you need to do to make your life better. It just comes down to making a simple choice - do what is right or continue doing what you are doing. You have the total power and responsibility to make this choice. Not making a choice is making a choice too, by the way. Good luck and Merry Christmas!

Hi Wheelie,

For me, there's nothing wrong with loving someone who isn't available, but there is something wrong with acting on it. If you're talking and texting all the time (and if any of it is about sex...even tho you laughed about "not all about sex"), then you're acting on it. They are already emotionally cheating on their partner...and you're the other player in that triangle.

Again, just for me, that's never okay.

An open or poly arrangment is a very different thing. If everyone knows and everyone is okay with it, then carry on and much joy to you all. It doesn't sound like that's what's happening here though. And cheating...whether it's physical or emotional...erodes trust in a big, big way. For me, that trust never comes back...and without the trust, there's no chance for the relationship.

On the other subject....about always being interested in "not available" people...I have done this. The problem was in myself, and in my core belief that I didn't deserve a "real" relationship. I wouldn't have expressed it that way then, but that's what was going on. Counseling helped, writing helped, talking at length with a trusted friend helped...and I still struggled with it for a long, long time. I know where that came from for me now....but I would guess that it's different for everyone. What I know for sure....those "relationships" were incredibly damaging to me...and they made my problem worse, not better. I had to do the work first...then I had a chance for a real relationship.

Best of luck to you. :rrose:

My advise is simple. Do be careful with your decisions, karma has an uncanny way of kicking one squarely in the ass. Good luck and Happy Holidays.

i am poly, and i see people who have primaries, and these are real relationships that definitely go somewhere. Intimacy is as intense as it is in any relationship. Committment is just as real.

Wheelie, I don't think I can really add anything much to what's already been offered here by so many others. I do want to say one thing to reinforce my idea on this situation.

There used to be a dyke bar in Jacksonville, FL, that was owned and run by a very wise older Butch named "Jo". She had owned that bar for many,many years and she packed a .38 Special in the back waistband of her jeans. Jo always knew as much about what was going on out in the parking lot as she did about what was going on inside the bar.

Over the cash register was a sign that said, "A wise monkey never monkies with another monkey's monkey". I've never forgotten that in all these years. Jo died so many years ago and that bar no longer stands, but that little sign of hers contained some of the best advice that anyone has ever given me. Good luck and think carefully before making a potentially disastrous decision. People have gotten shot over things like this.

Theo :bouquet:

Been there, done that...am currently in same situation with my "gf" but she claims to only still be with her daughters father for their daughter...that im the ine shes in love with. HOWEVER...im her best kept secret short of the few trusted friends we share. Im hidden from her family, HER friends, her coworkers...and even the one that does know about us,she denies that we have been together the past 4months..soon to be 5months. She " is waiting for the appropriate time" to end the 11yr relationship with her daughters father. They are NOT married. In fact hes never even asked her to marry him in 11yrs. The question is...Will there ever be an appropriate time for her to leave? My thought is no cuz theres never a "good" time to break up,unless its an abusive relationship. I no longer consider it a relationship between us cuz of the fact she still sleeps with him on the occassion she cant avoid it any longer and he raises hell cuz she wont. Im her first..yes i flipped her real quick! Be careful with ur heart...like me,it may not end the way we want things to be. I can fully sympathize and empathize with u here. I know exactly what ur going through!!! Do what u feel is best...no matter how hard it may be...i will be making the same step very soon! Much love to ya

Would you like this to be done to you ....
It doesn't matter if he tell his mom or anyone else , it's wrong and it's cheating , very simple :) But your a big girl and you make your own choices , I think you are setting yourself up for a heart break , just sayin

Betrayal is an awful thing. The love of my life, or so I thought betrayed me cheating and it deeply wounded me. Today you gotta jump through major hoops to get and keep my attention. I don't care how hot or horny someone makes me if they are unable to give me complete devotion, only have eyes for me, treat me like I'm the only girl then I won't be interested. I have standards and these standards won't allow what he's doing to you. Someone else might be more open- after all you don't really have a commitment and it seems to some degree you're both encumbered but as with almost any relationship someone invests faster and deeper.

I had a situation not long ago where someone caught my interest. They were recently single after a long relationship. I decided to investigate but take it really slow. There was a part of me that wanted to leap and to be honest my lust motor was full throttle. lol But there was no way in hell I was going to get hung up in drama nor settle for less then what I deserve. Soon into the exchange I learn that although broken up there's still an ex lingering in the background AND I then hear a confession that the EX ended it because HY cheated. Hy completed admitted it and said it was a mistake.

BYE BYE BABY GOODBYE - deal breaker

I don't hang with liars and cheaters even friends. I damn sure wouldn't commit to them or fuck them.

I think that people that are poly are perhaps more committed in a sense. Looking at boundaries and good communication is essential. It is in any relationship but I've noticed that poly people really "get it".

I would be poly for sure if I didn't need to be the center of the universe! lol I couldnt share because its all about ME! Try as I may that always takes over any analytical thinking. lol

I deleted my post because I knew it was rude. I'm sorry Wheelie and folks.