Stone Butches

[cuddlyfemme]

Originally Posted by DapperButch

For me, this is a very significant point. I do not want to date someone who is "ok" with me being Stone or can "give up" being able to touch someone's chest. I want to be with someone who does not want to touch my chest. I don't want someone to give up their desires for me. I want to BE their desire.

I totally agree with this from a Stone Femme's point of view. I don't want to date someone that is giving up something they enjoy just because I won't do it. Everyone should get what they want/need. If that means not dating me, then, thats what it means. I want someone that respects what my boundaries are

[morningstar55]

Originally Posted by chrisbutch

Ok, all good advice thanks! But surely, now call me old fashioned, people should get to know each other slowly, and let things develope. Sexual preferences are not what early dating conversation should be about??

to me this is a yes and no answer to your ?
sexual conversation should be at the bottom of the list of getting to know you stuff... and i can agree to letting things develope, with some old fashion dating..
but ...... its nice to know up front , that should a heated passionate moment should occur.... I want to know ahead of time , what your boundries are and know how to please you on ways that you feel comfortable with.
If your open to anything.... i want to know that
if you have bounderies I want to know that ...... and not make a mistake or find out down the road at some point that we are NOT compatable in area's we enjoy and how we are to enjoy giving as well as recieving.
I have dated stone and non stones...... and wel im sure missing that stone butch energy, so much. *sigh*
... just my 2 cents..

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by stonebutchinpa

I like to tell woman I am dating right up front, because being with a stone isn't for everyone.

I date butches. I never assume anything when it comes to sex. Honestly sweetie in my 20 years dating butches none of them came and told me how they wanted to be touched. I always ask when I feel we are moving in that direction.

You're a cutie! How did I miss you and just a state away! Should you ever want to interact with an older woman I hope you'll look me up.

[Chazz]

Thank your for this post.

Originally Posted by Mister Bent

I've read this thread a little here and there, and have largely held off posting because:

1) I don't at this point in my life identify as stone butch, though there was a time in which I did.

This has been my experience. I identified as "stone butch" for 14 years, through two relationships, then this happened:

Originally Posted by sassy_girl

Hello Stoners...

I guess I am going against the grain here and saying I don't understand limiting your dating pool by what someone has wanted or wanted in sex. I could never not want to be with someone because of what they want or don't want sexually, I suppose if that would be a dealbreaker for me ( I can't even imagine) it would be different.

I guess I just don't see what is wrong with two people getting together and discovering what energy/magic/vibes they get off each other and rolling with it. The way I have been with one lover does not define how I will be with another lover.

It all just seems so predefined. I'm trying to understand I suppose.

Yep, that's what happened to me alright. My partner and I rolled with it and came out in a new place, together, and individually.

Originally Posted by Mister Bent

One commonly held belief is that "stone butch" came about to refer to butches that were "stone cold butch;" the most butch among butches - those who were most masculine (and I pointedly state "masculine" not male).

This is the definition to which I have always held.

Ah, the hierarchy of butch-ness.... Agreed, that is a very common definition. I subscribed to it myself for many years.

I guess I'm an exception to that definition (assumption?). I look, behave, live, am taken for, butcher than butch, but I no longer ID as stone.

(I suspect there are a great many more butches like me than is commonly thought.)



But, back to this:

Originally Posted by sassy_girl

...I guess I just don't see what is wrong with two people getting together and discovering what energy/magic/vibes they get off each other and rolling with it. The way I have been with one lover does not define how I will be with another lover.

This is precisely what happened to me. Imagine my surprise !

Originally Posted by Mister Bent

This is the definition to which I have always held. It refers to a butch who is unwavering in their identity, and in their presentation of self; one who would never sacrifice their personal sense of comfort, well being and identity in order to bend to the wishes of others, whether seeking a job, dealing with family, or a sexual partner. This definition, for me, includes no particular reference to sex/sexuality, but allows for each stone butch to define for themselves what their comfort level is and how they are going to hold that line - in all aspects of their life. Technically, that means a stone butch could be quite "free" sexually, including open to anal penetration or oral sex, for example.

But not just stone butches - all butches. Oh yeah, and femmes, too.

Hierarchies suck.

[cuddlyfemme]

Good Morning all you wonderful and handsome Stone Butches!!!

[stonebutchinpa]

Originally Posted by cuddlyfemme

Good Morning all you wonderful and handsome Stone Butches!!!

Good afternoon Cuddly!

[cuddlyfemme]

Originally Posted by stonebutchinpa

Good afternoon Cuddly!

Hows it going? I was starting to think my post ran everyone out of here lol

[stonebutchinpa]

Just got back from a bad date where the woman I was with told me that being with someone "like me" aka a stone made her feel like she wasn't a lesbian anymore, I took her lesbian identity and made her feel straight?!?!

I completely understand that everyone has their opinion, but I clearly told her who I was waaaayyy before we started dating.

I just want to thank the femme woman out there who love and appreciate us stone butches.

[morningstar55]

Originally Posted by stonebutchinpa

Just got back from a bad date where the woman I was with told me that being with someone "like me" aka a stone made her feel like she wasn't a lesbian anymore, I took her lesbian identity and made her feel straight?!?!

I completely understand that everyone has their opinion, but I clearly told her who I was waaaayyy before we started dating.

I just want to thank the femme woman out there who love and appreciate us stone butches.

I dont understand .... why someone continues to date someone when they know way way before hand .. what type the person is ... maybe she thought she could change you somewhere down the road..

[DapperButch]

Originally Posted by stonebutchinpa

Just got back from a bad date where the woman I was with told me that being with someone "like me" aka a stone made her feel like she wasn't a lesbian anymore, I took her lesbian identity and made her feel straight?!?!

I completely understand that everyone has their opinion, but I clearly told her who I was waaaayyy before we started dating.

I just want to thank the femme woman out there who love and appreciate us stone butches.

I'm sorry this happened. At some point you will find a woman who WANTS this in her butch.

That is the difference, I think, and I mentioned it earlier. I would only want to be with a woman who DESIRED a butch like myself, not one that is "ok" with me being stone.

I want that part of me to be something she prefers in a partner, not something she "accepts" in a partner.

[cuddlyfemme]

Originally Posted by stonebutchinpa

Just got back from a bad date where the woman I was with told me that being with someone "like me" aka a stone made her feel like she wasn't a lesbian anymore, I took her lesbian identity and made her feel straight?!?!

I completely understand that everyone has their opinion, but I clearly told her who I was waaaayyy before we started dating.

I just want to thank the femme woman out there who love and appreciate us stone butches.

I'm really sorry that this happened to you You were up front with her so its not like she didn't know. I've been in relationships where the butch thought hy could "change" me....not gonna happen in this lifetime!

I am glad you realize that there are femme's that love and appreciate all you wonderful, handsome stone butches. Nothing gets me going like a stone butch does!

[stonebutchinpa]

Originally Posted by morningstar55

I dont understand .... why someone continues to date someone when they know way way before hand .. what type the person is ... maybe she thought she could change you somewhere down the road..

I think she did think I would change....so obviously she didn't truly understand what a stone butch is.

Originally Posted by DapperButch

I'm sorry this happened. At some point you will find a woman who WANTS this in her butch.

That is the difference, I think, and I mentioned it earlier. I would only want to be with a woman who DESIRED a butch like myself, not one that is "ok" with me being stone.

I want that part of me to be something she prefers in a partner, not something she "accepts" in a partner.

I agree Dapper, you are right. I definitely want someone who "accepts" me for being stone not who is "ok" with it. I appreciate the support

Originally Posted by cuddlyfemme

I'm really sorry that this happened to you You were up front with her so its not like she didn't know. I've been in relationships where the butch thought hy could "change" me....not gonna happen in this lifetime!

I am glad you realize that there are femme's that love and appreciate all you wonderful, handsome stone butches. Nothing gets me going like a stone butch does!

Ahhh Cuddly you are such a sweetie, thank you for the support.

[Converse]

Originally Posted by stonebutchinpa

Just got back from a bad date where the woman I was with told me that being with someone "like me" aka a stone made her feel like she wasn't a lesbian anymore, I took her lesbian identity and made her feel straight?!?!

I completely understand that everyone has their opinion, but I clearly told her who I was waaaayyy before we started dating.

I just want to thank the femme woman out there who love and appreciate us stone butches.

It’s who we are, and sexually it’s a part of the whole. I don’t think that some realize that when they ask for a part of us to change- that it cant happen without it altering everything else about us. It’s hard to hear, to hear that something about the way we are is in someway depriving or diminishing some one we care about. I’ve stood in your shoes, and I’ve tried to tolerate, tried to make this “one” concession. I’ve allowed myself to believe that I am somehow less than, that it is some kind of hurdle that I have to jump, that if I wanted a woman in my bed that ‘lesbian – take it in turns” sex was part of the deal.

I’ve been with the women who claim that they are attracted to the energy, to the hardness, to an edginess, a confidence, to something they say seems a little remote, a little self-contained- and then in a short period of time I’ve experienced those same women talk of wanting to expose the underbelly, of seeking some compliance and pliability, of wanting to experience the girl behind the Butch. It’s as though there is a belief that a Stone Butch is simply a façade, a layer of clothing, that gets worn and removed at will, but what many don’t understand is that it is not a veneer - so when it is removed- there is nothing of our true selves left.

I have attempted to accommodate a sex as they have “always done it”- and as a consequence have had to accept the lack of sexual gratification, but more importantly suffered from a sense of “loosing myself” because of it.

And then I discovered a stone Femme, and suddenly knew what it was like to fly high.

Neither of you are wrong or imperfect, but like most things in life we need to find our compliment, because just as a mismatch can cause us to loose ourselves, the right one can help us take air. I wish you well.

[DamselFly]

i want to speak about myself as a stone femme. in a very early post on this thread, i read a definition of a stone femme as either receiving, not giving, or not wanting to be touched sexually in certain ways. neither of these definitions apply to me! when i hear of stone femmes as "receiving, not giving", i really get angry! when with a stone butch, i AM giving just as much as i am receiving, only in a different way. first of all, let me say that in the past i have dated almost exclusively stone/tg/FtM butches. i go for that type of energy exchange. when with a Stone Butch, whether tg or not, i feel an exhilaration just to be with hym. i feel proud to be seen by hys side in public- a "this is who i am, this is who WE are"! this pulls at the inmost part of my femininity, my femme-ness. sexually, i adore being w/a stone butch. when i give myself to hym, it is as a precious gift, and the true ones know this and treat me as such. but this giving is NOT a passive "just lay there"! in my giving myself and getting hys energy, hys passion, hys tenderness, i give back mine in return. perhaps more subtly and in different ways than w/a non-stone butch. for example, i would never touch a stone butch in a feminizing way, and i find out beforehand where hys boundaries are. but i move with hys rhythm, i run my hands down hys back and body where appropriate, i wrap my legs around hym...and GO with hym! hys taking/my receiving go back and forth in a yin-yang flow that is the essence of the stone dance. i WANT hys taking me as hys gift. the energy is equal in quality but not in means. i don't want to touch a butch like hy touches me. (one BIG reason i'm a femme and a stone/transensual femme.) i am not a lipstick lesbian-i am a FEMME.
i hope that this makes some sense and helps put an end to the canard that stone femmes just receive. of course, this is just one queer stone femme's perspective. it is my truth.
namaste,
DamselFly
i apologize for so many caps, but this is a subject that i get very passionate about!

[DapperButch]

Originally Posted by DamselFly

i want to speak about myself as a stone femme. in a very early post on this thread, i read a definition of a stone femme as either receiving, not giving, or not wanting to be touched sexually in certain ways. neither of these definitions apply to me! when i hear of stone femmes as "receiving, not giving", i really get angry! when with a stone butch, i AM giving just as much as i am receiving, only in a different way. first of all, let me say that in the past i have dated almost exclusively stone/tg/FtM butches. i go for that type of energy exchange. when with a Stone Butch, whether tg or not, i feel an exhilaration just to be with hym. i feel proud to be seen by hys side in public- a "this is who i am, this is who WE are"! this pulls at the inmost part of my femininity, my femme-ness. sexually, i adore being w/a stone butch. when i give myself to hym, it is as a precious gift, and the true ones know this and treat me as such. but this giving is NOT a passive "just lay there"! in my giving myself and getting hys energy, hys passion, hys tenderness, i give back mine in return. perhaps more subtly and in different ways than w/a non-stone butch. for example, i would never touch a stone butch in a feminizing way, and i find out beforehand where hys boundaries are. but i move with hys rhythm, i run my hands down hys back and body where appropriate, i wrap my legs around hym...and GO with hym! hys taking/my receiving go back and forth in a yin-yang flow that is the essence of the stone dance. i WANT hys taking me as hys gift. the energy is equal in quality but not in means. i don't want to touch a butch like hy touches me. (one BIG reason i'm a femme and a stone/transensual femme.) i am not a lipstick lesbian-i am a FEMME.
i hope that this makes some sense and helps put an end to the canard that stone femmes just receive. of course, this is just one queer stone femme's perspective. it is my truth.
namaste,
DamselFly
i apologize for so many caps, but this is a subject that i get very passionate about!

[Sachita]

This is what I think and it can apply to almost anyone.

I have a 3 month rule. No matter what I don't have sex until that time passes. Trust me, I'm VERY open minded but I also view sex as sacred and the one final thing that truly connects us. I also want to know that the time I'm investing in pursuing a relationship isn't wasted. Worse case we remain excellent friends. If the can't communicate well or they can't be honest about their feelings its not going to work- end of story. There is no way in hell you'll understand this about anyone coming out of the gate. People talk a lot of shit especially when trying to impress someone. If you can't be with one another, regardless if your B-F, stone, trans whatever, in common space, without the complexity of sex then you've never survive a relationship. I have a real problem with someone who exits at the first sign of conflict so i want to know this FIRST before I ever drop my panties.

If you are remotely interested then spend time with that person. If you're honest, real and basically good people you will begin to forage a friendship. Any chemistry thats there should naturally balance itself because what i have found that the rules changes sometimes depending who you're with. Never say never. I mean I don't want to make love to a butch the way hy does me- nope, not my thing BUT there may be an exception based on the human connection and dynamic WE feel together. If we spend time together, as friends we will naturally learn to respect each other's space. If it evolves into hot wonderful sex PERFECT! If not it just wasn't meant to be.

I don't misrepresent myself I just don't feel the need to tell a friend how I fuck. After many many moons I've also learned that there may be new horizons I may climb. I'd like to keep my options open. I once dated a little trans-boy much younger then I. We started as friends and somehow we established an interesting dynamic that neither one of us had ever even thought about before. It came out of nowhere one day and the most amazing thing is that we remained friends with that special chemistry. I've never had this with anyone before so I never bottom line anything. lol Ultimately I am seeking a life partner and there are so many OTHER factors that come into play other than sex. These all must be present BEFORE anything else and if sex seals the deal off we go into the sunset!

[southernboi63]

I have to agreee with you DomnNC. I define myself as Stone but as I have read I find myself as being confussed. For myself, when I am with that special woman, When we are tgether in the bedroom, I get off by getting her off by me penertrating her. I like being touched but not penertation at all, I feel as if I were born in the wrong body, I wear mens clothing, boxers, eveything....I pack all the time so what would you classify me if not a stoner... the only thing I see if anything would be the touching... I need help//\\

[Miss Scarlett]

Originally Posted by DamselFly

i want to speak about myself as a stone femme. in a very early post on this thread, i read a definition of a stone femme as either receiving, not giving, or not wanting to be touched sexually in certain ways. neither of these definitions apply to me! when i hear of stone femmes as "receiving, not giving", i really get angry! when with a stone butch, i AM giving just as much as i am receiving, only in a different way. first of all, let me say that in the past i have dated almost exclusively stone/tg/FtM butches. i go for that type of energy exchange. when with a Stone Butch, whether tg or not, i feel an exhilaration just to be with hym. i feel proud to be seen by hys side in public- a "this is who i am, this is who WE are"! this pulls at the inmost part of my femininity, my femme-ness. sexually, i adore being w/a stone butch. when i give myself to hym, it is as a precious gift, and the true ones know this and treat me as such. but this giving is NOT a passive "just lay there"! in my giving myself and getting hys energy, hys passion, hys tenderness, i give back mine in return. perhaps more subtly and in different ways than w/a non-stone butch. for example, i would never touch a stone butch in a feminizing way, and i find out beforehand where hys boundaries are. but i move with hys rhythm, i run my hands down hys back and body where appropriate, i wrap my legs around hym...and GO with hym! hys taking/my receiving go back and forth in a yin-yang flow that is the essence of the stone dance. i WANT hys taking me as hys gift. the energy is equal in quality but not in means. i don't want to touch a butch like hy touches me. (one BIG reason i'm a femme and a stone/transensual femme.) i am not a lipstick lesbian-i am a FEMME.
i hope that this makes some sense and helps put an end to the canard that stone femmes just receive. of course, this is just one queer stone femme's perspective. it is my truth.
namaste,
DamselFly
i apologize for so many caps, but this is a subject that i get very passionate about!

Exactly! This is the way I feel too...but many people cannot wrap their brain around it...

For me there is an exchange in every aspect of the relationship and it is my natural response to him...it just flows between us and is a beautiful thing!

I respect boundaries too, when I know what they are.

[DamselFly]

it is good to know that are T/those who understand how i feel!
just dropping by to say hello to all the B/butches and femmes in this thread. i want to say that i like reading E/everyone's post and POV. very interesting. thank Y/you, everyone, for them. i'm so glad to have this thread!
damselfly

[QueenofSmirks]

Good morning all!