Pagan

[Bit]

Here's a link to a new children's book.

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Growing-Up-Pagan-Workbook-Families/dp/0764331434"]Amazon.com: Growing Up Pagan: A Workbook for Wiccan Families (9780764331435): Raine Hill, Gillian M. Pearce: Books[/ame]

There are many children's books linked to that page, btw.

[foxyshaman]

Hi Linus,

I did tell my kids that Santa was not real... and then I got a call from the school, cause it made other kids cry... and then I got a call from my ex mother in law... and then I decided to take a fox approach...

Kids... Santa is an amazing magical being. Christmas is about Magic and the celebration of magic. Etc etc...

They accepted that and until they were 10 or 11 (I think) they continued to believe in Santa...

We still celebrate Christmas cause most of the family does, but we also celebrate Solstice which is to me more important.

Bit thanks for the info on shamanism, it may have been new information. I think personally the red and white of santa's uniform in the Saami traditions is in reference to Amanita Muscaria, or Fly Agaric the magic mushroom. Reindeer love it and it is one theory of flying reindeer... but only one mind you!!!

[Bit]

I read a marvelous book on Santa and Shamanism several years ago, Foxy. The author made a cogent case for the sacred colors, and might have mentioned fly agaric--I don't remember--but also tied Santa into the tompte and other northern beings. He also traced Santa's history as he changed, passing through the Germanic and Celtic cultures.

[Daryn]

Merry meet, my planet friends. Nice to see this thread here.

[hottprof]

okay.. wow... I have literally read every post in this thread thus far and I am amazed and completely intrigued. I hope you do not mind me poping in an reading. I have learned so much and can not wait to learn more. I hope you are open to questions and or even conserns if they would pop up. Thank you.

peace and Smiles

[foxyshaman]

Originally Posted by hottprof

okay.. wow... I have literally read every post in this thread thus far and I am amazed and completely intrigued. I hope you do not mind me poping in an reading. I have learned so much and can not wait to learn more. I hope you are open to questions and or even conserns if they would pop up. Thank you.

peace and Smiles

Hottprof I am glad that you stopped by. You are most welcome to post anything you want and ask questions. I am sure there is always an answer for every question...maybe even more than 1 answer to every question!!

[foxyshaman]

QUOTE=Bit;11145]I read a marvelous book on Santa and Shamanism several years ago, Foxy. The author made a cogent case for the sacred colors, and might have mentioned fly agaric--I don't remember--but also tied Santa into the tompte and other northern beings. He also traced Santa's history as he changed, passing through the Germanic and Celtic cultures.[/QUOTE]

Good Morning Miss Bit!!!

I am always interested in reading other thoughts and ideas on Santa and how the traditions all started. I have found over the years that there is always an excited audience when we begin to discuss our holidays and pagan beginnings.

Right now I am preparing a Winter Solstice ritual called Dreaming the Dark. I did it in 2007 and have had requests to do it again this year. There are three parts to it, drumming, aspecting and joiking. We meet for a practice and then we meet for real on Dec 21. It is a good thing that the 21st is a Monday, cause not many people have office or family plans on a Monday. I am not including those who celebrate Yule and not Christmas. Those individuals are obviously busy <sometimes I catch myself thinking and I am all like.... oh bright one Foxy, briiiggghhhttt...>

Now I won't have amanita muscaria for this, although they do grow where I am. I have seen them but never ingested them, I have heard they make you very sick, very sick indeed. But then ayahuasca made me very sick, and I knew that going in and it did not change my resolve to try it.

Anyway I am getting off track.

[Bit]

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Daryn, HotProf}}}}}}}}}}}}} Welcome, welcome, welcome!

Daryn, I hope you might be willing to share a little about your path and the take your Tradition has on the holidays, because I've never researched that. *pretty please?*

HotProf, darlin, you ask all the questions you like! That's what keeps a thread like this active, people having questions and concerns, yanno? And I am always happy to talk, but what I love even more is when everyone talks cuz then I learn a LOT!

Originally Posted by foxyshaman

Good Morning Miss Bit!!!

Good mornin', darlin! Even if it is another day midafternoon, lol... still, hello hello! And btw, thanks for checking on me. I'm okay, just tired from housecleaning and frustrated cuz the work doesn't show the way I thought it should.... lord love a DUCK this place needs work (twas vacant for eight years before we bought it). And we have company, so I haven't been online so much, but hey, I'm back!

Originally Posted by foxyshaman

I am always interested in reading other thoughts and ideas on Santa and how the traditions all started. I have found over the years that there is always an excited audience when we begin to discuss our holidays and pagan beginnings.

I've been searching for our Pagan beginnings for YEARS, yanno? I didn't find much at first, then I found books like the one I read on Santa being the memory of Shamans, then I found some things online. I think overall the thing which most influenced me was the realization that the Romans celebrated "Christmas" the same way we do here in the US (and presumably the rest of the Western World, lol, but maybe not to the same excess) long before there was anything known as Christianity... Saturnalia was a commercialized Mid-winter Festival held within a week of Solstice with obligatory gift-giving, loving gift-giving, huge traditional feasts, holidays from work, "mandatory" Temple celebrations---and lots of people bitching about the over-commercialization of the holiday.

Originally Posted by foxyshaman

Right now I am preparing a Winter Solstice ritual called Dreaming the Dark. I did it in 2007 and have had requests to do it again this year. There are three parts to it, drumming, aspecting and joiking.

For those who don't know, here are some links to joiking.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoik

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaitEJidUs0"]YouTube- Sami Joik[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzupjHuvACk&feature=related"]YouTube- Yoik'n Roll - Yoik/music[/ame]

Now, my dear Foxy, tell me please... what do you mean by aspecting? *eyebrow waggle* love learning new things!!

Originally Posted by foxyshaman

Now I won't have amanita muscaria for this, although they do grow where I am. I have seen them but never ingested them, I have heard they make you very sick, very sick indeed. But then ayahuasca made me very sick, and I knew that going in and it did not change my resolve to try it.

Whoa! You are braver than I, Gunga Din....

I have sometimes wondered if the utter disruptions of the electrical system one experiences with fibromyalgia might mimic some of the altered states one achieves with drugs....certainly not ayahuasca or amanita(!!) but maybe some of the milder drugs that are used in shamanism.

Originally Posted by foxyshaman

Anyway I am getting off track.

Nope, actually, you are right on track. This is all part of Paganism as far as I'm concerned, anyhow. To me, Pagan is a big umbrella term that encompasses all the nature-based and psychic-based spiritualities including Shamanism, and I love it when you share your experiences with us because it broadens my knowledge, gives me new things to try and new ways to look at the world. And isn't that what it's all about?

[foxyshaman]

ahhhh sometimes I get confused when trying to get all fancy in a message... it takes this old fox time to learn new things. Gone are the days of the simple hen house and the chicken wire fence... now we got lights and electricity and alarms and fancy whatnots....

okay unrelated to anything but I had to get that out there.

Now Miss Bit you asked what is Aspecting. I learnt Aspecting from the Reclaimers in my area. And then I shamanized it I know but true. Anyway, in this particular ritual we use cloths or bandannas or whatever the aspector is drawn to. Aspecting is akin to being a conduit. Aspecting is when the seeker makes a conscious choice to step aside and make space. It is a conscious intention to open yourself to allow this spirit (in this case the Spirit of the Dark) to cohabitate with you for awhile. We are a physical extension of spirit and moving with guidance, spiritual movement, whether that be physical, verbal or experiential – this is an interactive dance between the Spirit of the Dark and the body. We can use Ballroom dancing as an analogy in that the dance is a constant non verbal communication.

The cloth is used to facilitate the entry of the spirit helper it is a physical symbol of transcendence. As the curtain parts, or the cloth comes down, one world gives way to another. We are not using masks because we are not engendering a specific form or entity. The Spirit of the Dark is an ambiguous, formless spirit. The Aspectors sit inside the circle of joikers and drummers, so a very intense place to be. It is just fascinating to watch. You can tell who is in and who is out quite easily. It takes a lot to step aside and dance with another spirit. This is not the same as possession as is practiced say by Yoruba dancers or Voodoo priestesses. This is much more subtle and gentle. Usually the aspectors are left with an amazing sense of joy, upliftment and well they are quite high.

Now joiking is from the Saami people of northern Scandinavia who have a unique unaccompanied vocal style called joik. Thank you Bit for posting those videos. Joiking is chanting visions. It is an improvised style of singing that is less about actual words than melody and vocal textures. Our ancestors could joik about a hunt, a frozen stream or the birth of a baby, however what makes it unique is that there are no fixed rules and the fluid songs are not considered to be about a subject. The joik, and by extension the joiker, are said to actually become the subject. So when our voices are calling out to the Spirit of the Dark our joik returns the very response we seek. Joiking is the place betwixt and between when the singer sings the song and the song returns to sing the singer. The joik is the summoning of the unconscious or a wordless connection with the deepest archetype of song itself.

In this ritual the intention of the Joikers is to sing back the sun; the aspectors are becoming the Dark and returning with messages from the 'outgoing' darkness. The drummers are situated in each corner of the room and they are the energetic backbone of the ceremony. The drums are the energy elixer for the joikers. There is often a lead joiker and drummer, keeping the singers and drummers in sacred space. It is quite easy to lose yourself as a drummer or a joiker. The reason for this is because when you joik, aspect or drum it is your inention to go off on your own. However... that being said there has to be strong singer and drummer to ensure everyone gets back okay. All three roles within the ritual are open to move between the worlds... which is all well and good, but there has to be someone available to ensure they all come back intact and without hangers-on. And there are times when it can take work to bring someone back and work to clear the space after. This is an intense ritual and is only open to people who are very familair with altered states work. We meet for a practice so that people can see what each role is like and they are welcome to change it at the time of ritual.

Anyway... Did that answer your question and then some?? I can get a bit long winded at times.

[Daryn]

Foxyshaman - Amanita mushrooms are pretty much all poisonous, many of them are lethally so. I personally would not mess around with fly agarics. People who want a spiritual experience would probably be better off with liberty caps which a one of the sub-species of psilocybens. None of these fungus are particularly good for a human body.

For a little info:

http://www.shroomery.org/8752/What-i...cybe-mushrooms

I have something of an interest in mycology though that interest is in edibles like chantrelles, morels, chicken of the forest, etc.

[foxyshaman]

Originally Posted by Daryn

Foxyshaman - Amanita mushrooms are pretty much all poisonous, many of them are lethally so. I personally would not mess around with fly agarics. People who want a spiritual experience would probably be better off with liberty caps which a one of the sub-species of psilocybens. None of these fungus are particularly good for a human body.

For a little info:

http://www.shroomery.org/8752/What-i...cybe-mushrooms

I have something of an interest in mycology though that interest is in edibles like chantrelles, morels, chicken of the forest, etc.

Hi Daryn,

Thanks for the information. I have been to that site a few times, I think it is pretty useful. I have no desire to try AM... like ever. I have however used Psilocybin mushrooms for spiritual work. I really respect the Little People and all that they have taught me over the years. In Canada it is legal to purchase the spores and grow them, but I find them tricky to grow. But hey that is what practice is all about.

[JustLovelyJenn]

I have decided I can only read this thread when I have at least an hour to spend just on it... I read something and then I want to look it up and research, and then respond with questions... and I just never seem to have the time.

This is directly related to my choice to consider myself Druid. I choose this signifier for its interpretation, even though my actual practices are such a splendid mix of all that works with me.... Druid, as I have found the interpretation, means... one that learns. I love this part of my religion. Learning what works for me, what works for others, knowing as much as I can on each thing...

It makes it so difficult for me to pay as much attention as I should. BUT... after the new year I hope to see this change some. One of my yearly goals (not resolutions, because I only care that I tried, happen or not) is going to be to devote more time to my studies and my faith.

That being said, even if I don't seem to post often. Please keep in mind I am here and listening. I have a tendency to wait first and speak later, wanting all of my words to be filled with wisdom and meaning.

[foxyshaman]

Originally Posted by JustLovelyJenn

I have decided I can only read this thread when I have at least an hour to spend just on it... I read something and then I want to look it up and research, and then respond with questions... and I just never seem to have the time.

This is directly related to my choice to consider myself Druid. I choose this signifier for its interpretation, even though my actual practices are such a splendid mix of all that works with me.... Druid, as I have found the interpretation, means... one that learns. I love this part of my religion. Learning what works for me, what works for others, knowing as much as I can on each thing...

It makes it so difficult for me to pay as much attention as I should. BUT... after the new year I hope to see this change some. One of my yearly goals (not resolutions, because I only care that I tried, happen or not) is going to be to devote more time to my studies and my faith.

That being said, even if I don't seem to post often. Please keep in mind I am here and listening. I have a tendency to wait first and speak later, wanting all of my words to be filled with wisdom and meaning.

Thanks for that Jenn. I look forward to hearing about your path and what you are learning along the way. I too can be slow in responding. Then I get back to it and the conversation is three pages ago and then don't bother cause the conversation train has pulled out of my stop.