2020 Presidential Election

[Martina]

Sanders voted against the 1994 crime bill as a compromise. He and others liberals traded their votes for the Violence Against Women Act and a ten year ban on assault rifles, which were included in it. He fully understood the implications of the bill and before and after voted against others like it. He's a politician. He has made deals.

And it was around the crime bill that Hillary herself introduced use of the term super-predator, based on discredited research, a term used as a weapon against African American youth. She did that to pander to racist white centrists, something the Clintons specialized in.

Bernie Sanders brought the subject of economic inequality into the public discourse when nobody would even use the word. It's an amazing gift, a huge accomplishment in and of itself. He has real integrity and has been consistently pro- worker. There is no one like him in the Senate. No one with his years of experience who has fought for working people. As far as I am concerned, he is a saint, the nearest thing we have in American politics anyway.

I will add that Gillibrand has received an A rating from the NRA, and Bernie has never gotten above a C-. His last pro-gun vote was 2009. So.

[MsTinkerbelly]

Originally Posted by Martina

Sanders voted against the 1994 crime bill as a compromise. He and others liberals traded their votes for the Violence Against Women Act and a ten year ban on assault rifles, which were included in it. He fully understood the implications of the bill and before and after voted against others like it. He's a politician. He has made deals.

And it was around the crime bill that Hillary herself introduced use of the term super-predator, based on discredited research, a term used as a weapon against African American youth. She did that to pander to the racist white centrists, something the Clintons specialized in.

Bernie Sanders brought the subject of economic inequality into the public discourse when nobody would even use the word. It's an amazing gift, a huge accomplishment in and of itself. He has real integrity and has been consistently pro- worker. There is no one like him in the Senate. No one with his years of experience who has fought for working people. As far as I am concerned, he is a saint, the nearest thing we have in American politics anyway.

You missed my point.

Bernie voted FOR the Crime Bill. Hillary was raked over the coals for the Crime Bill by BERNIE when she wasn’t even in Congress!!

[Martina]

I heard you. But I think you missed my point. She lobbied hard for the bill. She worked to get it passed and in doing so introduced a racist concept into the political discourse. She did worse than vote for it.

Bernie voted for it in order to get the Violence Against Women Act passed. It's in the record. He spoke about opposing the parts of the bill that resulted in mass incarceration.

Originally Posted by MsTinkerbelly

You missed my point.

Bernie voted FOR the Crime Bill. Hillary was raked over the coals for the Crime Bill by BERNIE when she wasn’t even in Congress!!

[MsTinkerbelly]

Originally Posted by Martina

I heard you. But I think you missed my point. She lobbied hard for the bill. She worked to get it passed and in doing so introduced a racist concept into the political discourse. She did worse than vote for it.

Bernie voted for it in order to get the Violence Against Women Act passed. It's in the record. He spoke about opposing the parts of the bill that resulted in mass incarceration.

Anything to throw shade, eh? Bernie voted for the Crime Bill, regardless of why he did so...He is responsible for his vote which allowed the mass incarceration crisis. Try explaining to the people held a lifetime in prison, how they were less valued than violence against women. Bernie is a political hack, just like all political hacks, and will throw one group under the bus to get what he wants.

A saint he ain’t

[Martina]

Obviously, that was not his finest hour. Nor is his history voting for gun laws. But if that's all you got, it's not much. He has been amazingly consistent. No politician in my lifetime has the record he has for voting in the interest of working people. If he's a political hack, there is not a single long-time member of Congress who is not.

[MsTinkerbelly]

Originally Posted by Martina

Obviously, that was not his finest hour. Nor is his history voting for gun laws. But if that's all you got, it's not much. He has been amazingly consistent. No politician in my lifetime has the record he has for voting in the interest of working people. If he's a political hack, there is not a single long-time member of Congress who is not.

I’m sure if I took the time (because what I posted was only SKIMMED off one article), there would be pages of things I could post about Bernie. But again, I think you are missing one of my points, and a point I believe Collette tried to make....we have got to stop tearing apart our candidates and find one that the people of the country will actually vote for this time.

If i’m wrong Collette I apologize.

[Martina]

You skimmed all there is. That's the same old pile of shit that Hillary's folk kept scooping up. The guy is decent. If you know no more about him than what you have posted, then calling him a hack and implying he's corrupt is irresponsible.

There is no comparison between the two. Clinton is truly corrupt on a dozen levels. Bernie has lived a life of service with true integrity. Truly, people other than progressives acknowledge both facts. There's no comparison.

[MsTinkerbelly]

Originally Posted by Martina

What the hell does that mean?

What it means is...when I give an example of something Bernie did, I get “but Hilary!” I didn’t want Hilary Clinton for President...nor did I want Bernie. I voted for Hilary because she was the candidate, and I thought she could win. To be fair to her, she did win the popular vote...but that and $5 will get you coffee at Starbucks.

I didn’t create this thread, but it would be nice if we could all discuss the candidates without painting any of them as Jesus incarnate, and taking a real look at a candidate that has a chance of beating Trump. To ME, Bernie STILL isn’t that person.

[Martina]

Originally Posted by MsTinkerbelly

What it means is...when I give an example of something Bernie did, I get “but Hilary!” .

You introduced the contrast saying she wasn't even in Congress. Well she did way more harm than any single vote.

[Martina]

Re the thread, I brought in that quote about Clinton to point out the fact that none of the current candidates inspires that kind of reaction and based on the numbers presented, it was kind of encouraging. It was all about the current election until Collette called people who disliked Clinton names and took us down this rabbit hole. She asked why Clinton was disliked and here we are.