Obama and the tax cut issue

[AtLast]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-0...n-concern.html
Yes, at this time, only S & P actually downgraded the US credit rating, but, both of the other 2 rating firms (Moody's & Fitch) are not optimistic about the US keeping the AAA ratings they are sticking with right now.

They could also downgrade us at any time. Most likely they could do this when the "super-commission" that will be appointed to offer up the budget cuts necessary via the recent debt-ceiling bill. We are not out of the woods at all with this and these downgrades can and will trickle down to both the middle and working classes. In fact, this could very well smack down even further any gains that just "common folk" might be making if they have been fortunate enough to find work after being laid off due to the recession.

I don't like scare tactics (especially when so many are so stressed economically right now), but this is not something we as a country should take lightly or wait for the direct effects it could have on us.

It seems to me that we ought to be sending messages to all 4 of the Congressional leaders (Reid, McConnell, Boehner & Pelosi) that will be appointing members to this panel stating that appointments need to be made up of people that are willing to compromise! Both sides have already been talking about appointing stead-fast reps of their party that hold to the same damn things that caused the debt-limit mess- and brought on the S & P downgrade. We need more of this conflict???

[Toughy]

I want the most hardcore idealogues from both sides on the super commission. When they fail to do anything because they will not compromise, all those triggers will kick in. Then the Republicans are fucked because they will have to either increase revenue or cut their precious defense budget and corporate welfare. If the triggers kick in SSI, Medicare, Medicaid, Veterans and Senior benefits are OFF the table for cuts.

All those big corporations and big pharma are shitting their pants right now as they will be the ones who are going to face the big ass cut spending knife, not the middle/working class and poor people.

I'm telling y'all, Obama royally fucked the Republicans with the debt ceiling legislation.

The real way to stop this forever is two-fold. Pass a federal Constitutional Amendment declaring Corporations are not people and money is not speech (the only way to get around the Robert's SCOTUS). The other thing would be passing legislation that requires only public financing of all political campaigns. Bye bye special interest groups and all those big money lobbyists. K Street will have a whole bunch of empty office buildings.

[Random]

Personally I like the thought of...

The First thing that hits the tables for cuts when they try to hold the goverment hostage is Wages, Bennifits, and Retirement funds for Cong and Sens...

If they are really so worried about our future then how about they unline their pockets a little?

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by Toughy

I want the most hardcore idealogues from both sides on the super commission. When they fail to do anything because they will not compromise, all those triggers will kick in. Then the Republicans are fucked because they will have to either increase revenue or cut their precious defense budget and corporate welfare. If the triggers kick in SSI, Medicare, Medicaid, Veterans and Senior benefits are OFF the table for cuts.

All those big corporations and big pharma are shitting their pants right now as they will be the ones who are going to face the big ass cut spending knife, not the middle/working class and poor people.

I'm telling y'all, Obama royally fucked the Republicans with the debt ceiling legislation.

The real way to stop this forever is two-fold. Pass a federal Constitutional Amendment declaring Corporations are not people and money is not speech (the only way to get around the Robert's SCOTUS). The other thing would be passing legislation that requires only public financing of all political campaigns. Bye bye special interest groups and all those big money lobbyists. K Street will have a whole bunch of empty office buildings.

I am under the impression (but could be wrong) that the trigger mechanisms are not the same for cuts and revenues under the agreement reached- that it is very much in the GOP/Tea Party's favor if the "super" commission does not make cuts (to the degree called for) as outlined in the agreement.

Gotta go do some more research... but here is one analysis that doesn't look so great for what the Dems/Obama care about the most-

http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-coh...enue-tax-obama

(exerpt only)
The debate played out as a microcosm of the debt ceiling debate as a whole: Republicans threatened to torpedo the whole deal if the trigger included new revenue, so Obama retreated. It appears he’s agreed to substitute automatic defense cuts for automatic revenue increases.

The problem is that, these days, plenty of Republicans support cuts in defense spending. Or, at the very least, they don't find them as objectionable as they once did, notwithstanding the best efforts of defense contractor lobbyists. That would increase their leverage in the committee negotiations, making it more likely that the end result is substantial cuts to entitlements. (The media seems to be missing this point completely, at least based on what I'm reading and seeing right now.)

Now, I do like your federal constitutional amendment idea- and hell yes, public financing of all political campaigns is long overdue.

[citybutch]

The downgrade was brought by the fact that Republicans are not willing to raise taxes and the Democrats are not willing to cut spending.... and not the debt limit "mess". In order to make for a healthier financial outlook either one of those two things or both need to happen. Just like when I am working with my clients who are spending more than they are making (which is what is happening in the country right now) we work on increasing revenue and/or decreasing expenses. It's that simple. This is a problem that has been brewing with the rating companies long before the debt limit stalemate came along... THAT "mess" was created, in my very humble opinion, by politics... although frankly it needed to come to the forefront at some point. The debt limit was raised 8 (?) times under GW Bush... and 4 times thus far (well, 5 now... kinda) under Obama... There just comes a time where one has to stop increasing the amount one can borrow... and start to work on the systemic problems of overspending when revenues are reduced... Something had/has to change....

Originally Posted by AtLastHome

hold to the same damn things that caused the debt-limit mess- and brought on the S & P downgrade. We need more of this conflict???

[JustJo]

Originally Posted by citybutch

The downgrade was brought by the fact that Republicans are not willing to raise taxes and the Democrats are not willing to cut spending.... and not the debt limit "mess". In order to make for a healthier financial outlook either one of those two things or both need to happen. Just like when I am working with my clients who are spending more than they are making (which is what is happening in the country right now) we work on increasing revenue and/or decreasing expenses. It's that simple. This is a problem that has been brewing with the rating companies long before the debt limit stalemate came along... THAT "mess" was created, in my very humble opinion, by politics... although frankly it needed to come to the forefront at some point. The debt limit was raised 8 (?) times under GW Bush... and 4 times thus far (well, 5 now... kinda) under Obama... There just comes a time where one has to stop increasing the amount one can borrow... and start to work on the systemic problems of overspending when revenues are reduced... Something had/has to change....

Exactly....what's the old saying?

"When your outgo exceeds your income, then your upkeep becomes your downfall."

Yea, that one.

[Martina]

THe money we're wasting is the effing billions a day in interest. That makes me sick sometimes when cuts to important services are being discussed.

i agree that the issue is the stalemate. i do not think Obama could have done a lot about that. But i do think he could have and should have pursued the financial and corporate criminals who helped land us in this recession.

The first -- ending the stalemate -- is a thousand times more important. But it just burns -- it's so symbolically throw it in your face unfair -- that none of these bastards has gone to jail.

[citybutch]

This is an excellent read on the topic. Although there is one error. The US went on credit watch with S&P in April of this year and not June.

http://nutsandolts.com/2011/08/06/te...s-its-hostage/