Safety in a Failing Economy

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by Glenn

Sachita and Folks; The Garden of Findhorn has really grown since I read the book "The Garden of Findhorn" back in the seventies. Three people were spiritually guided to turn a garbage dump into a garden where they grew forty pound cabbages, and other huge plants and veggies guided by the Nature Spirits there. They lived in old trailers, and it was amazing and miraculous how they were provided with everything they needed. Wow.. It amazes me to read how they have expanded and have some eco community building information on their site to give ideas to others. www.findhorn.org

Thats very cool! Thanks!

[Sachita]

Morgan has arrived from CA to help on the farm. Big things coming!

[uniquetobeme]

i am extremely concerned about the economy and my families well being. I am a single mom with 3 kids, and my son's boyfriend lives with us also. I went through a break up in 2009 that left me in financial ruin and I am also making much less money than I used to earn.
I am barely scraping by, yet I know that I have it better than a lot of people.
I live in a suburban area and I don't have a yard for a garden, but I plan to use containers this spring to grow food.
I keep saying if I ever win the lottery I want to buy land and build a self sustained farm that is organic and humane to animals. (not that owning livestock can ever be humane, but as humane as possible). But, I don't know the first thing about farming.
I find it so sad that we are being poisoned by the crap that is manufactured andante that animals are treated so harshly.
I would love to come out some weekends and help, when it warms up a bit...that is if I can afford the gas. I've heard it is supposed to go way up...which means the price of food is going to go up even higher.
My mom owns a large plot of land in West Virginia and many times, lately, I have contemplated moving there and seeing if I could talk them into starting an organic farm.
I don't think a lot of people are seeing the writing on the wall. Most of America is asleep at the wheel. There are lots of web sites on emergency preparedness and survival training. My 14 year old is constantly watching the videos. he has a bug out bag that has a few essentials inside. We also have a pantry with extra water and flood, but I don't think we could survive for more than a week. Plus, society in America has become so much more violent. If people are hungry, they will fight and kill for the food. Not all, but there will be some who would. I haven't read all the thread, so I apologize for redundancy. The reality that things are going to get worse economically for the middle and lower class is a real possibility, if not inevetable. I am learning to appreciate the little things in life and be grateful for what I do have, but I can't say that I'm not really scared. Things can get really crazy in the world really fast and those that aren't prepared are going to have a really hard time.
I am grateful for this thread because hopefully some people will see it and take measures before it is too late.
Also, I use freecycle to get things for free (and to give things away) and I also use couponmom.com for saving on groceries when I have time. Which, unfortunately isn't often. ( hopefully there aren't too many typos...I did this from my phone)

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by uniquetobeme

i am extremely concerned about the economy and my families well being. I am a single mom with 3 kids, and my son's boyfriend lives with us also. I went through a break up in 2009 that left me in financial ruin and I am also making much less money than I used to earn.
I am barely scraping by, yet I know that I have it better than a lot of people.
I live in a suburban area and I don't have a yard for a garden, but I plan to use containers this spring to grow food.
I keep saying if I ever win the lottery I want to buy land and build a self sustained farm that is organic and humane to animals. (not that owning livestock can ever be humane, but as humane as possible). But, I don't know the first thing about farming.
I find it so sad that we are being poisoned by the crap that is manufactured andante that animals are treated so harshly.
I would love to come out some weekends and help, when it warms up a bit...that is if I can afford the gas. I've heard it is supposed to go way up...which means the price of food is going to go up even higher.
My mom owns a large plot of land in West Virginia and many times, lately, I have contemplated moving there and seeing if I could talk them into starting an organic farm.
I don't think a lot of people are seeing the writing on the wall. Most of America is asleep at the wheel. There are lots of web sites on emergency preparedness and survival training. My 14 year old is constantly watching the videos. he has a bug out bag that has a few essentials inside. We also have a pantry with extra water and flood, but I don't think we could survive for more than a week. Plus, society in America has become so much more violent. If people are hungry, they will fight and kill for the food. Not all, but there will be some who would. I haven't read all the thread, so I apologize for redundancy. The reality that things are going to get worse economically for the middle and lower class is a real possibility, if not inevetable. I am learning to appreciate the little things in life and be grateful for what I do have, but I can't say that I'm not really scared. Things can get really crazy in the world really fast and those that aren't prepared are going to have a really hard time.
I am grateful for this thread because hopefully some people will see it and take measures before it is too late.
Also, I use freecycle to get things for free (and to give things away) and I also use couponmom.com for saving on groceries when I have time. Which, unfortunately isn't often. ( hopefully there aren't too many typos...I did this from my phone)

Is moving to your mom's land an option? If it is, that sounds like a good plan especially if you have strong kids willing to help you. Will it be easy? Nope, it won't but it will get easier and it will be worth it. If you can earn some kind of income there that seems like your best option. Start a garden, till the soil, grow extra things like tomatoes, greens, almost anything you can sell on the side of the road. There is most likely a horse farm close around there that will give you manure. have your boys till it into the soil good. In fact see if the horse stable will let them work a few hours a week for money and or to trade for the use of a tiller. I had a guy that lived down the street, very close that I use to trade with. He would bring his tractor and tiller and till for me. He sold his tractor. Now I have to rent one. But if there is a farmer close I bet he/she could use an extra hand and will trade with you. Gotta work hard tho.

If you need seeds I'll send you some. If you need laying hens you gotta come get them. But on craigslist you can probably buy chicks pretty cheap in the spring.

I feel safer on land then I would in the city. each year I put in more fruit bushes and trees. My hope is to get a shower and potty built by the barn so people can at least camp out and help develop the land.

[uniquetobeme]

I did buy a little herb garden today :-). I don't know much about farming. I would need to look into it some more. I'd want to find out how to become certified organic. I'd also like to build some cabins and have a little writers retreat or something like that. This particular area could use a decent cultural type center. There is not much to do around there. I would like to open up a used/new bookstore and maybe a coffee shop or bar and have theme nights and live music, maybe a thrift store too. (couldnt do the shop on my mom's land...there is a river and the only way to get to the propery is a long walk over the swinging bridge or to drive a vehicle through the shallow part of the water. The best part of moving is most of my family is there and it would be nice to be near my family. It is also very isolated...I probably wouldn't have many friends and it is highly unlikely that I'd find anyone that I could date. LOL there are probably only 2 lesbians in the entire town! LOL, if that many :-). I'd love to have a writers resort or a couples retreat on the property. I don't think there are any horse farms, but my aunt and uncle own about 3 horses. I just don't know how I would survive until I started to make money and I'm also worried about health insurance. I'll give it more thought and talk with my mom more about it. it would be a big move, but I'd have lots of help, love and support from my family. (again typing from my phone...my cat destroyed my router by knocking over a glass of water onto it!)

[uniquetobeme]

I talked to my mom last night and she is going to talk to her husband and then I'm going to do a bit more research. It sounds like a good idea in theory. Probably, if something doesn't give here within a year, I will move to WVA. In the meantime, I will do as much research as I can :-)
The thought of growing a real watermelon from non-genetically modified seeds is almost enough to motivate me to make such a change right away! Haven't had a good watermelon since I was a kid!

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by uniquetobeme

I talked to my mom last night and she is going to talk to her husband and then I'm going to do a bit more research. It sounds like a good idea in theory. Probably, if something doesn't give here within a year, I will move to WVA. In the meantime, I will do as much research as I can :-)
The thought of growing a real watermelon from non-genetically modified seeds is almost enough to motivate me to make such a change right away! Haven't had a good watermelon since I was a kid!

I am sorry it took me so long to respond. I've been very busy.

What exactly are you waiting to see happen? I feel the best course of action, especially if you have kids, is to move towards safety and sustainability. I do know you need income. Is it possible for you to get some kind of job where your mom is?

Sometimes it takes a leap of faith and learning as you go. You're lucky that you have some little helpers. Pull your family together, make a plan and start moving in that direction. If you'd like to come down some weekends and help I'm sure you'll learn a lot and meet some great people.

[Sachita]

aishah my apologies please.

I meant to say that you seem like someone that could help teach others. If someone is disabled and able to articulate the way that you do and some of the things you are passionate about, it seems you would be a great asset to teach people.

I know a woman right now that is in a wheel chair and has lost use of one whole side of her body. She works for an organization I am networking with as a record keeper and also provides the organization with countless research. She was so passionate about food safety that she taught herself these skills, how she could be valuable and then offered her services free for a chance to prove what she could do. Needless to say, years later she is an employee and very proactive for the cause.

[aishah]

i do teach people, i just don't get paid for it. i also have many other skills and have worked a number of other jobs, they just don't involve lifting more than 5 lbs or standing up for more than 5 minutes. or having decent balance, a great memory, the ability to focus for long periods of time, etc. etc.

i find it frustrating when people assume i'm 'high functioning' because i am so 'articulate' because there is this underlying value judgment that goes with it - i am good and those other disabled people are bad. that's really not okay. people do this a lot with me in real life because i don't 'look disabled.' (i have cerebral palsy, spinal cord injuries, osteoarthritis, and fibromyalgia.) it's not about being 'pc,' it's about - if we are going to talk about futurism, if we are going to talk abut survival in the future, i believe we have to talk about a future that includes everyone. not just able-bodied or 'high functioning' (vomit) disabled people. that's all i'm saying. and having those conversations is also part of the work of building a society that is actually inclusive of everyone in the present, too (which we don't have).

I really want to address this but not sure how. I can talk about our challenges in bringing together a sustainable farm community. Everyone needs to do "something" in order for it to work. Exactly what that "something" is depends on the individual and needs of the community. Even if there are programs for each community to assist people with disabilities or elderly there obviously has to be a balance because you can't have a village of 30 disabled people and 5 able workers. The other thing that would concern me is what would define disability. I see able bodied people that could do "something" and not doing anything.

imho the method of creating 'assistance programs' that we have now is not a sustainable, interdependent way of dealing with disability. i also find it helpful to think of disability as a spectrum rather than a discrete category. the fact is, everyone has access needs - the difference between you and me is society is set up to deal with yours and not mine. in order for everyone - including disabled folks usually labeled 'low functioning' - to be included, their access needs would have to be taken into account. but that really isn't that difficult, to be honest. i do non-profit work in a community of disabled people with a huge variety of disabilities and access needs, and we get shit done. we just have patience and understanding for one another, and we don't expect each other to interact or do everything the exact same way. for example, there's a man who lives downtown in the city where i live and he is considered 'low-functioning' because he has a lot of difficulty with adls (adult daily living skills) due to his developmental disability. he would not be able to hold a job even using voc rehab services because most jobs are not willing to work with his access needs. but he does a billion different odd jobs for the stores downtown and the employees there take care of him and work with his access needs (having short, defined tasks - doing one task before being told to do the next one rather than working down a list - that sort of thing).

in my experience, the work of building supportive community among people with disabilities has a lot to do with not assuming that everyone does everything the same way and with being flexible and supportive in that way.

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by aishah

i do teach people, i just don't get paid for it. i also have many other skills and have worked a number of other jobs, they just don't involve lifting more than 5 lbs or standing up for more than 5 minutes. or having decent balance, a great memory, the ability to focus for long periods of time, etc. etc.

it's not about being 'pc,' it's about - if we are going to talk about futurism, if we are going to talk abut survival in the future, i believe we have to talk about a future that includes everyone. not just able-bodied or 'high functioning' (vomit) disabled people. that's all i'm saying. and having those conversations is also part of the work of building a society that is actually inclusive of everyone in the present, too (which we don't have).

I agree. So let's talk. How do you see it in your minds eye?

[aishah]

sorry, i was just editing while you were writing i hope that answers the question to some extent.

imho the method of creating 'assistance programs' that we have now is not a sustainable, interdependent way of dealing with disability. i also find it helpful to think of disability as a spectrum rather than a discrete category. the fact is, everyone has access needs - the difference between you and me is society is set up to deal with yours and not mine. in order for everyone - including disabled folks usually labeled 'low functioning' - to be included, their access needs would have to be taken into account. but that really isn't that difficult, to be honest. i do non-profit work in a community of disabled people with a huge variety of disabilities and access needs, and we get shit done. we just have patience and understanding for one another, and we don't expect each other to interact or do everything the exact same way. for example, there's a man who lives downtown in the city where i live and he is considered 'low-functioning' because he has a lot of difficulty with adls (adult daily living skills) due to his developmental disability. he would not be able to hold a job even using voc rehab services because most jobs are not willing to work with his access needs. but he does a billion different odd jobs for the stores downtown and the employees there take care of him and work with his access needs (having short, defined tasks - doing one task before being told to do the next one rather than working down a list - that sort of thing).

in my experience, the work of building supportive community among people with disabilities has a lot to do with not assuming that everyone does everything the same way and with being flexible and supportive in that way.

[Sachita]

This is a very interesting article about how a household of 7 people live together on only 21.00 a day.

http://www.verdant.net/sharedhousing.htm

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by Sachita

This is a very interesting article about how a household of 7 people live together on only 21.00 a day.

http://www.verdant.net/sharedhousing.htm

As you read it you'll see that their mortgage is over 2000.00 a month! Can you imagine in other parts of the country where its cheaper?

I know a couple that was laid off from huge companies (IBM-HP) earning over 100K a year. When they were laid off they could no longer afford the huge mortgages and car payments they had. They were forced to foreclose on their homes. They sat down and came up with a great plan and its working. In fact they are in NC, just south of me. Both couples walked away from their homes. They rented a house in the country with a few acres of land. Nothing fancy. They kept ONE car and a truck. Three of them went to work and one stayed home. The jobs they were able to get were nothing close to what they were use to but they easily paid their overhead and two of them work part time. The rest of the time they car pool each other, grow all of their own food and take some to the market. They bought a big oven and one of them bakes bread and other baked goods bringing in a few hundred a week just from those sales.

No one is killing themselves and they will all tell you that they are happier then they have ever been. They are healthier, more at peace and relationships stronger.

[aishah]

yeah, mortgages in oakland are ridiculous. unfortunately that area is still one of the best places to find other radical organizers, sustainability oriented folks, etc. for shared housing - i have lots of friends who live in community living situations out there, especially disabled folks. one of the reasons i love kansas is because of the low cost of living here. when i first moved out here people were trying to talk me to moving out to the bay area because of how much awesome organizing is happening there, but imho the idea that if you are radical or into sustainability or other social justice issues you should move to the bay/portland/toronto/new york is really damaging - that vision is not sustainable for the future. we need to be community building and organizing everywhere, not just four cities in the u.s. even if it is easier to move to where the building is already happening. that's one of the reasons i love the allied media conference (it's a social justice conference that focuses on a lot of different issues - i do disability justice work there - but they have sustainability tracks as well as community tech tracks and other tracks) - allied media projects is doing in detroit what we need to be doing everywhere - actually bringing these principles into our own communities rather than moving where it's already easy to practice them, if that makes any sense.

/ramble

[aishah]

forgot to add - sachita, that is one of the things i love about the model you are building (& sharing with other women). that it is accessible to different communities/built on a model that is actually sustainable. versus a lot of folks i've seen doing sustainability organizing work in a way that is in reality unsustainable in a lot of communities. if that makes any sense.