02-21-2010, 04:54 AM | #61 |
Member
How Do You Identify?:
Butch Preferred Pronoun?:
doesn't matter to me Relationship Status:
single Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 122
Thanks: 149
Thanked 167 Times in 48 Posts
Rep Power: 676963 |
When I saw the title of this thread I assumed it was a question, but that was before I read the first few posts and saw that there was already an answer given. Is everyone with a different opinion on this subject an arrogant, classist, racist? I hope not.
My reason for referring to my country as the United States of America or my nationality as American is because that's what our country is named. When the founding fathers of the USA wrote our Declaration of Independence, that's what they called it. Were the people of South America referring to any of their countries as "America" at the same time, or calling themselves "Americans"? If so, Jefferson and Adams and Franklin and everyone else involved back then owe them an apology. My understanding has been that the USA is the only country with "America" in its title. If I'm wrong I'm sure someone here will point it out. I think we shorten the name of our country because it's easier to say. |
02-21-2010, 08:12 AM | #62 | ||
Infamous Member
How Do You Identify?:
Butch Relationship Status:
A very happy Mr. Grumpy Cat Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Neither here or there
Posts: 7,987
Thanks: 27,733
Thanked 18,936 Times in 4,705 Posts
Rep Power: 21474858 |
Quote:
I think what is lacking is the knowledge that America is a continent. I did some consulting work for a Canadian firm and they always made the distinction and that made me aware that this was a US thing. Whenever they referred to the way they did things in Canada or the US as opposed to here in Colombia, they always said...oh this is how this or that is done in North America. I found that very respectful. Quote:
|
||
02-21-2010, 03:12 PM | #63 | |
Member
How Do You Identify?:
Special Snowflake Preferred Pronoun?:
she/her Relationship Status:
Married Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Wine Country, Oregon
Posts: 470
Thanks: 22
Thanked 792 Times in 238 Posts
Rep Power: 1006287 |
Quote:
And people from Colombia? as "Republican of Colombia" And how about those from Brazil? as "Federative Republicans of Brazil" And those from Germany? "Federal Republican of Germany" And how about those zany occupants of France? "French Republicans" And let's not forget the good people of "The People's Republic of China" (Yeah... what would that be? "A Person of the Republic of China" - rolls right off the tongue) Again, I realize I didn't pay a lot of attention in school (I'm sure it'll come as a shock to you all that I thought I knew it all as a teenager too), but I do believe the US(ofA) was recognized as a country before any other foreign colony on the North or South American continents. And yes, the founding fathers decreed that their newly established nation would be called "The United States of America". While I wasn't there, and do not know if their intent was to crowd out the ability for any other person living on the continents to feel comfy calling themselves an American - I some how doubt it. Why are those of you up in arms about this flap not screaming bloody murder about the audacity of the Australians? Well the poor sorry sods in Papua New Guinea and Indonesia must really hate life. Maybe it's not an issue any longer because the continental naming convention is seen as evolving from the Australian Continent to Oceania in some circles. And lest us not forget the continent Africa and the nation of South Africa or is that not so important nor confusing? This hub bub over what others call us? Lots of hot air. I don't know anyone from Germany, France, Spain, Italy or Portugal who calls themselves a European. They, seemingly more so to me, are far too nationalistic to be grouped with other nations under such an umbrella term as "European". Those from *outside* Europe? Yep, you bet! Although mostly I hear this in terms of descriptors "Oh, he's so European looking" sort of thing. The individuals from those European nation generally refer to themselves as "German", "French", "Spanish", "Italian" or "Portuguese". You'll note that each of these labels are formed off the unique identifier of their proper national name. So the call to arms to use another label for ourselves (USAian - yeah, I want to hear you call yourself that) seems rather silly. Should there not, instead, be a call to change the name of the nation? Or maybe the continent? One *really* could argue that we're much more brash and insensitive to say that we're "from the States" or "from the US" as though it's the only organization of states in the world when clearly the United Mexican States and the Federated States of Micronesia both exist. And I agree. Our bad rap has much more to do with our politics and general poor manners (not that self absorption isn't chief amongst our poor manners) over the last 40 years than it does with what the Founding Fathers so blithely determined we would wind up calling ourselves over the next many millenia. /soapbox of crankiness |
|
02-21-2010, 03:19 PM | #64 | |
Member
How Do You Identify?:
A soul for a compass and a heart for a pair of wings. Preferred Pronoun?:
All I ask of living is to have no chains on me. Relationship Status:
All I own are the strides I spend to the finish line. Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Somewhere in between here and gone.
Posts: 662
Thanks: 110
Thanked 1,448 Times in 369 Posts
Rep Power: 6344714 |
Quote:
I can understand that it was a joke meant in good fun, but to an outside observer it was callous and uncalled for. I'm not telling you, any of you, not to joke but perhaps cautioning you to think twice about where it is posted. Because no, I don't know you, or UofM, but I'm reading this thread, too, and I'm going to respond where I see posts worth calling out.
__________________
Two or three things I know for sure, And one is that I would rather go naked Than wear the coat the world has made for me. |
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Selenay For This Useful Post: |
02-21-2010, 03:36 PM | #65 | |
Senior Member
How Do You Identify?:
A complex confection. Preferred Pronoun?:
Miss Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: The land of milk and honey.
Posts: 2,169
Thanks: 741
Thanked 3,419 Times in 1,200 Posts
Rep Power: 21474852 |
Quote:
I'm quite aware that others read this thread. I must be honest and let you know that your response to what you assumed was a racist statement was offensive to me. When in doubt, investigate and ask questions before attacking. It's a good rule of thumb, not only in the forums but for life in general. As you've stated you don't know me and I do not know you. However, I tend to be respectful when adressing others or topics that I may find offensive. It's the way I believe life should be lived, but everyone has their own way of thought... Again, you still have no idea what the original sentence was about, and I have no intention of clarifying any further. Suffice it to say, it was not even based in the direction you took it. I too will make this my last response in regard to said subject. Enjoy your day, Selenay. Respectfully, Enchantress |
|
02-21-2010, 03:40 PM | #66 |
Member
How Do You Identify?:
A soul for a compass and a heart for a pair of wings. Preferred Pronoun?:
All I ask of living is to have no chains on me. Relationship Status:
All I own are the strides I spend to the finish line. Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Somewhere in between here and gone.
Posts: 662
Thanks: 110
Thanked 1,448 Times in 369 Posts
Rep Power: 6344714 |
I will PM you, Enchantress, so we can continue this dialogue and perhaps clear a few things up *s
__________________
Two or three things I know for sure, And one is that I would rather go naked Than wear the coat the world has made for me. |
02-21-2010, 03:42 PM | #67 |
Senior Member
How Do You Identify?:
A complex confection. Preferred Pronoun?:
Miss Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: The land of milk and honey.
Posts: 2,169
Thanks: 741
Thanked 3,419 Times in 1,200 Posts
Rep Power: 21474852 |
|
02-21-2010, 04:05 PM | #68 |
Infamous Member
How Do You Identify?:
Butch Relationship Status:
A very happy Mr. Grumpy Cat Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Neither here or there
Posts: 7,987
Thanks: 27,733
Thanked 18,936 Times in 4,705 Posts
Rep Power: 21474858 |
Waldo, that is what you are going by these days right? I can understand how names are really not important to you. Having said that, I can see where you would find logic in your post. Fact is, Germany, Mexico, China or even Brazil are not the names of continents, so it is fine for them to call themselves Chinese, Brazilian,etc. since by doing so they are not insulting anyone else.
I don't expect you to see the fact that the more you and others defend your point of view, the more you prove the fact that it is arrogant. I have to hand it to you though, at least you, unlike Bit, do not think that there are two continents named America. |
02-21-2010, 04:20 PM | #69 | |
Member
How Do You Identify?:
Special Snowflake Preferred Pronoun?:
she/her Relationship Status:
Married Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Wine Country, Oregon
Posts: 470
Thanks: 22
Thanked 792 Times in 238 Posts
Rep Power: 1006287 |
Dude. Check your geography. There are only two. Central America is part of the North American continent.
Further. I think my work here is done. Quote:
|
|
02-21-2010, 05:07 PM | #70 | |
Member
How Do You Identify?:
Butch Preferred Pronoun?:
I'm easy Relationship Status:
She's some kind of wonderful. Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: I keep my heart and soul in the boondocks
Posts: 626
Thanks: 240
Thanked 714 Times in 325 Posts
Rep Power: 759421 |
Quote:
Out of curiosity, how do most in Columbia identify themselves? South Americans? Or are they Columbians first? And as I asked before: What exactly is stopping anyone in the Americas from calling themselves American? And for the record, your snark toward Bit does little to cover YOUR arrogance, which is a nice touch when you're trying to point out ours.
__________________
"I believe in the sweet spot, soft-core pornography, opening your presents Christmas morning rather than Christmas Eve and I believe in long, slow, deep, soft, wet kisses that last three days."
-- Crash Davis, Bull Durham |
|
02-22-2010, 10:11 AM | #71 |
Pink Confection
How Do You Identify?:
Femme Preferred Pronoun?:
She, Her, Ma'am Relationship Status:
Dating Myself Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nashville
Posts: 4,266
Thanks: 17,195
Thanked 11,380 Times in 2,839 Posts
Rep Power: 21474855 |
It is awkward, I get it. Our country has a long name which is also the name of a Continent (or 2 or 3 depending on your views...I like to think of us as one).
Actually I learned that the US were not the only Americans and it hurts people's feelings that we think that when I lived in South America....I wish I had come up with it on my own, but as a small child in Argentina I was constantly reminded that the entire continent is America and it is arrogant etc to call ourselves Americans. Now what to call ourselves? It is awkward....we watched a WWII movie this weekend, and it was the British, the Japanese, the Canadians and the American's. The soldiers from the USA does seem awkward when everyone else has nice short names....and I totally get that for many people Yanks is derogatory (not for me, I could care less personally) Maybe we say American because it's easiest? I do try to make a point of saying US and USA when I can and wonder in what other ways I can be respectful to the fact that the US is not the only America.
__________________
|
02-22-2010, 10:15 AM | #72 | |
Pink Confection
How Do You Identify?:
Femme Preferred Pronoun?:
She, Her, Ma'am Relationship Status:
Dating Myself Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nashville
Posts: 4,266
Thanks: 17,195
Thanked 11,380 Times in 2,839 Posts
Rep Power: 21474855 |
Quote:
Does not make it any easier.
__________________
|
|
02-22-2010, 02:33 PM | #73 |
Senior Member
How Do You Identify?:
The original lime-twisted femme Preferred Pronoun?:
I answer to most things, especially lesbian. Relationship Status:
Still loving my Mare ;) Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 4,683
Thanks: 1,343
Thanked 11,426 Times in 2,979 Posts
Rep Power: 21474854 |
If I am going to call myself anything, I'll call myself American. Honestly, if someone finds that offensive, I can't help that. They can say they are American too. Am I being dismissive? *shrug* Would I get offended if they call themselves American? Not at all. Obviously, there are different types of Americans. It is what it is, is it not?
__________________
|
02-22-2010, 02:56 PM | #74 |
Pink Confection
How Do You Identify?:
Femme Preferred Pronoun?:
She, Her, Ma'am Relationship Status:
Dating Myself Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nashville
Posts: 4,266
Thanks: 17,195
Thanked 11,380 Times in 2,839 Posts
Rep Power: 21474855 |
I think as long as mean we are American in an inclusive way, it's all good.
If we go to Uruguay, Norte Americano or Estados Unidense would be a better choice of what to call ourselves... The USA does not contain the "only" Americans.
__________________
|
02-22-2010, 03:03 PM | #75 | |
Member
How Do You Identify?:
Butch Preferred Pronoun?:
I'm easy Relationship Status:
She's some kind of wonderful. Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: I keep my heart and soul in the boondocks
Posts: 626
Thanks: 240
Thanked 714 Times in 325 Posts
Rep Power: 759421 |
Quote:
I think we say American because it's who we have been taught we are. Not because it's easy, per se. Again, i don't think it's arrogant or exclusive unless we're saying the rest of the Americans shouldn't call themselves that. And I was sincere in asking what Central/South Americans call themselves because no, I've never been there. I have been to Canada. I think it's cool they call themselves Americans as well, since it's true. I'm not arguing that at all. I just think it's a bit harsh to call people from the U.S. arrogant for using what they've been taught for at least two centuries. And not meaning to be dismissive, but it's not going to change. Lord knows we are slow to change on anything. I think it's simply about being respectful of everyone else as Americans, too.
__________________
"I believe in the sweet spot, soft-core pornography, opening your presents Christmas morning rather than Christmas Eve and I believe in long, slow, deep, soft, wet kisses that last three days."
-- Crash Davis, Bull Durham |
|
02-22-2010, 03:39 PM | #76 | |
Pink Confection
How Do You Identify?:
Femme Preferred Pronoun?:
She, Her, Ma'am Relationship Status:
Dating Myself Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nashville
Posts: 4,266
Thanks: 17,195
Thanked 11,380 Times in 2,839 Posts
Rep Power: 21474855 |
Quote:
If I can get a few people to at least think about it and how arrogant it sounds for the US to always refer to ourselves as 'The Americans" then that is all I can ask for. I understand that being sensitive to the other countries in the Americas is a new thing for many of us. We were taught in school that those countries are completely insignificant. I hope you do get to travel to South and Central America sometime, I think you would so enjoy it and see more clearly what I am speaking of.
__________________
|
|
02-22-2010, 03:56 PM | #77 | |
Pink Confection
How Do You Identify?:
Femme Preferred Pronoun?:
She, Her, Ma'am Relationship Status:
Dating Myself Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nashville
Posts: 4,266
Thanks: 17,195
Thanked 11,380 Times in 2,839 Posts
Rep Power: 21474855 |
Quote:
Ha, I know. It is something that we have all done forever, but it does upset people in the Americas outside the US, except for the Canadians according to one source . Just something to think about.
__________________
|
|
02-22-2010, 05:37 PM | #78 |
Member
How Do You Identify?:
TOWANDA! Preferred Pronoun?:
Queen Bee Relationship Status:
Good 'n married. Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Eastern Canada. But if I make a wrong turn at the lights I get stopped by a border guard.
Posts: 1,499
Thanks: 2,355
Thanked 2,759 Times in 820 Posts
Rep Power: 16450091 |
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYoTJItSPt0&feature=player_embedded"]YouTube- Tom Brokaw Explains Canada To Americans[/ame]
__________________
"Compassion, in which all ethics must take root, can only attain its full breadth and depth if it embraces all living creatures and does not limit itself to mankind." -Albert Schweitzer |
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to suebee For This Useful Post: |
02-22-2010, 07:03 PM | #79 | |
Senior Member
How Do You Identify?:
pervert butch feminist woman Preferred Pronoun?:
see above Relationship Status:
independent entity Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Oakland
Posts: 1,826
Thanks: 4,068
Thanked 7,657 Times in 1,522 Posts
Rep Power: 21474852 |
Quote:
personally I am waiting with some excitement to hear Tom explain my generation....the Boomers........to me..........laughin..........it's his new tv special..........
__________________
We are everywhere We are different I do not care if resistance is futile I will not assimilate |
|
02-25-2010, 11:01 AM | #80 | |
Pink Confection
How Do You Identify?:
Femme Preferred Pronoun?:
She, Her, Ma'am Relationship Status:
Dating Myself Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nashville
Posts: 4,266
Thanks: 17,195
Thanked 11,380 Times in 2,839 Posts
Rep Power: 21474855 |
Quote:
My dream is that someday we come to have the same type of relationship with the rest of the Americas as we have with Canada. We are not so different, we are all nations of Native Americans and immigrants and their offspring, rich with natural resources and beauty. All of us...American. Meeee tooooooo!
__________________
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Apocalipstic For This Useful Post: |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|