Troy Davis - Guilty or Innocent?

[MissItalianDiva]

It's sickening that they are executing him with the use of nembutal...it is not approved for human use and should not be used for human executions per the maker or this drug. So many injustices have taken place tonight

[Gráinne]

(I know very little of Davis's case, but this is in general about the death penalty).

I think this country has a hell of a lot of nerve complaining about China or North Korea or whathaveyou country, when we're just as bad, maybe worse.

If we're going to have a death penalty, let's have it-not 22 years later after the crime. I mean, fast. If we can't do that and really need 20 years of extremely expensive appeals and trials, etc., let's abolish it.

Mr. Davis was a prime example of why the whole thing should be abolished. Black, poor, from the South, and probably not highly educated (I know little of his background, but what I did hear was bad enough). If we're going to have it, it should be for *this* crime (whatever the *this* is), without reasonable doubt as to guilt, for all those who commit that crime-no matter race, faith, background. If we can't do that much, it's inhumane.

Are we truly a more civilzed people than everyone else we "other", and react with horror at public stonings or hangings? The only difference is that we hide executions, more out of shame, I think, than any real reason. I don't think we're that removed from the Tudors, with burnings right out in the middle of Smithfield, than if we set up a scaffold in the parking lot of Wal-Mart.

This fucking country. There are those who have no problem telling a woman she cannot have an abortion because it's "murder", and yet are almost gleeful at painfully poisoning to death just another almost non-person who didn't count for anything.

[Rockinonahigh]

Im sorry Troy Davis is dead.I know little about him or his case,BUT I do know that takeing another life with the situation as it is, is wrong.I know we need to do something to make anyone think twice before doing the crime of muder,onething I know for shure that if anyone else is sentenced to leathal injection the proof of guilt,in my opinion" should possitive proof the person who is charged did the crime as anyone elses involvement in said crime be judged on its own merrit or lack of .Our court systen is suposed to help everyone equally but I know it dosent because of classisum,raceisum and just plane ignorance of so-caled justic.What gives me the right to sentence anyone to death,a price need to be paid by life in jail at hard labor if there is any doubt what so ever for eny reason at all.I realise there are some people who muder that desreve to have the hard dentence put on them,im not in the least wanting that to be done to another human being but something need be done,what I have no idea.There has to be another way to deal wthe situations like this.

[*Anya*]

Did they really use Nembutal? It is a barbiturate. It is rarely used to today.

Nembutal (Pentobarbital)
Pentobarbital, a barbiturate, is used in the treatment of insomnia. It is also used as a sedative to relieve anxiety and induce sleep.

www.nlm.nih.gov

David Batty
guardian.co.uk, Thu 22 Sep 2011 00.46 BST
The case of death row inmate Troy Davis should spur the European Union into imposing stringent controls on drugs used in lethal injections to prevent EU companies from being complicit in further US executions, according to human rights campaigners.
Pentobarbital, one of the three drugs set to be used to kill Davis, was bought from the Danish pharmaceutical company Lundbeck before it announced strict controls on the sale of the drug earlier this summer.
Lundbeck, which manufactures the drug in the US under the tradename Nembutal, now demands that its US distributors sign an agreement stating that they will not make pentobarbital, which is a sedative with a wide range of uses, available for prisons using it for lethal injections.
Maya Foa, investigator for human rights charity Reprieve, said the dose that could be used to kill Davis if his execution in a Georgia death row prison goes ahead, was among batches obtained prior to Lundbeck's restrictions on the use of the drug.
She added: "States that carry out lethal injections will still have a decent but not excessive supply of pentobarbital. Most will have about 12 doses. But they are unable to get extra doses."
Davis execution was delayed until the Supreme Court makes a decision on whether or not to grant him a stay of execution.
MEP Sarah Ludford, who lobbied for the UK export ban on three drugs used in lethal injections, said she hoped Davis' case would persuade the European Union to impose stringent control to prevent EU companies from being complicit in future executions.
Ludford said: "This is a tragic case, a seriously flawed case. But if there's any commemoration we can make to Troy Davis it's that there's a no EU company complicit in executions in the future."
The Liberal Democrat MEP said she hoped the case would lead to the European Commission adding the relevant drugs to the torture goods regulation, which would prevent them from being used in cruel or inhuman..."

[Okiebug61]

This is the part that scares me the most.

There was no physical evidence tying Davis, then 20-years-old, to the shooting and several witnesses at his trial later recanted their testimony.

The victims have not gained anything from this execution. Their hearts are hardened with anger and until they can let go of the anger nothing has really changed.

[Abigail Crabby]

Originally Posted by Okiebug61

This is the part that scares me the most.

There was no physical evidence tying Davis, then 20-years-old, to the shooting and several witnesses at his trial later recanted their testimony.

The victims have not gained anything from this execution. Their hearts are hardened with anger and until they can let go of the anger nothing has really changed.

I agree - how they could take his life without concrete evidence and with recanted testimony is scary indeed.

It would seem we *the govt* is becoming immune to it's own rules of evidence.

How long before Soylent Green

[MsTinkerbelly]

..........Troy Davis maintains innocence in final words
By The Associated Press | AP – 10 hrs ago


Here are his final words, as witnessed by an Associated Press reporter:

"I'd like to address the MacPhail family. Let you know, despite the situation you are in, I'm not the one who personally killed your son, your father, your brother. I am innocent.

The incident that happened that night is not my fault. I did not have a gun. All I can ask ... is that you look deeper into this case so that you really can finally see the truth.

I ask my family and friends to continue to fight this fight.

For those about to take my life, God have mercy on your souls. And may God bless your souls."

[SoNotHer]

Remember as well he was denied the opportunity to take a polygraph and until the end, he maintained his innocence.

How did we ever get to this place?

[kannon]

Nothing will change until the standard of guilt (beyond a "reasonable" doubt) is modified. It's impossible to prove guilt beyond any doubt. The states murder people based on theories. They've killed over 400 people in Texas since the death penalty was reinstated. Over 200 at the hands of Rick Perry. When he was questioned about it during the republican debate the crowd cheered him on. That's scary. If you look at the stats - you can see how racist our justice system is. Top of the list of executionees are black perpetrators with white victims. It's like we modified our lynching practice to suite the taste of the 21st century. It's truly disturbing.

[Julie]

A tragedy took place last night on the 30th anniversary of The International Day of Peace - How ironic to kill a potentially innocent man, in Georgia on this day.

It has been less than 24 hours and I can only imagine the grief and loss his family is feeling. Not to mention all of us who have been a part of his story and have done our part to write our people in congress and try to get his execution revoked.

Maybe we need to focus a little on sending our positive thoughts to his family and to Troy. I don't usually get all spiritual on the boards - but a human being was put to death last night, in our country.

Perhaps we can internally send our healing to him, so his journey is smooth and to his family. Also, to the family of the victim who was killed. They will have a lot of struggling to go through in the coming months. This will unfold and the facts will come out.

Rest in Peace Troy.

Julie

[suebee]

The live coverage I watched played this at the end of the broadcast. I'd never really listened to the lyrics before. Smooth journey Mr. Davis. Your life had great meaning despite the circumstances of your death.

[nowandthen]

Yes, Two men where killed yesterday by the states they live in GA. Troy Davis and Texas Russel Brewer. One Innocent or One guilty neither should have died at the hands of the state. One did a unspeakable crime against James Byrd, One was sent to death on lies, lack of proof and recanted testimony. I find still today that killing to show folks killing is wrong is morale reprehensible and feel less safe in the world today as a result of state sanctioned violence.

[SoNotHer]

A lot of good comments here, and yes, I don't know how killing to show that killing is wrong actually works.

"Strange Fruit" is on my mind today. This was released as well. I'm so sorry we have arrived at this place in 2011.

[Dominique]

[QUOTE=SoNotHer;422657]Remember as well he was denied the opportunity to take a polygraph and until the end, he maintained his innocence.

Polygraphs are not admissable in any court, this is one point I'm missing.

Many many manygreat points have been brought up (and you can bet I was looking things up, case law included) but the polygraph thing. They are not accurate. Anxiety can give a false read. Medicines can give a false read. Even poorly administered testing, can give a false read, these are some of the reasons they are not admissable.

Not one word of this on my local news for two days.

[MissItalianDiva]

[quote=Yellow band;422753]

Originally Posted by SoNotHer

Remember as well he was denied the opportunity to take a polygraph and until the end, he maintained his innocence.

Polygraphs are not admissable in any court, this is one point I'm missing.

Many many manygreat points have been brought up (and you can bet I was looking things up, case law included) but the polygraph thing. They are not accurate. Anxiety can give a false read. Medicines can give a false read. Even poorly administered testing, can give a false read, these are some of the reasons they are not admissable.

Not one word of this on my local news for two days.

Georgia is actually one of the few states where that type of testing can be used in a court of law. However I personally believe it was declined to be used for the simply fact that a higher court was reviewing the case and I know from case law polygraphs are not a norm or accepted much into federal proceedings.

However I wish if not for any other reason that he would have been granted permission to take one. It's the least this country could have done after locking him up like an animal for 22 year with 16 of that being done on death row. It's almost like our legal system just did not want to see the truth here.

I am not one to racially separate anything but I would be willing to put money on the fact that if Troy Davis was a white man we would not be having this discussion this morning. Ugh my stomach is still turning this morning. I am just flat out sickened and saddened by what has taken place.

[Dominique]

[quote=MissItalianDiva;422760]

Originally Posted by Yellow band

Georgia is actually one of the few states where that type of testing can be used in a court of law. However I personally believe it was declined to be used for the simply fact that a higher court was reviewing the case and I know from case law polygraphs are not a norm or accepted much into federal proceedings.

However I wish if not for any other reason that he would have been granted permission to take one. It's the least this country could have done after locking him up like an animal for 22 year with 16 of that being done on death row. It's almost like our legal system just did not want to see the truth here.

I am not one to racially separate anything but I would be willing to put money on the fact that if Troy Davis was a white man we would not be having this discussion this morning. Ugh my stomach is still turning this morning. I am just flat out sickened and saddened by what has taken place.

That is on the lines of why I was looking up case law. And thank you for the post BTW. So much about this I am not understanding, as is the case with most of us. 16 years he spent in an 8 ft by 8 ft cell, 23 hours a day. That in it's self seems so inhumane (to me) and again, back to the polygraph...do you think he could of passed one...imagine his own mental torment. I'd bet no natural light comes into a death row inmates cell. That one hour a day he is out,does that include shower....(3 times a week) I realize they were grasping for straws, I really do. I appologize I didn't make myself clear-er....but do you think he'd of passed that polygraph, even if it was admissable? Can you imagine how living the way they had him living/ and with the propencity existing he is innocent, HELLO? WILL ANY BODY LISTEN TO ME, (tick tock tick tock tick tock) thats why I wasn't getting the polygraph thing. I was afraid it would have sealed his fate. But today, in retrospect. He had nothing to loose.

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by suebee

The Supreme Court has requested that the execution be delayed so they can consider the motion before them. No indication how long this could last. He could still be executed tonight. I cannot even imagine what Davis and his family are going through. Nor the family of the victim.

I didn't follow all of the media coverage on the SC stay- this is outrageous! The man is now dead. I don't understand why if the Court requested a delay, the execution was just not called off- why a time frame was part of this motion for delay? 24-48 hours- something like that.

Personally, I think that if the US Supreme Court agrees to hear matters in a stay of execution, there should be an automatic time frame in which the court can study the facts. It is bad enough that these situations always seem to be heard by the SC at the very last moment. How the hell can the Court rule on a case like this (with 23 years of material) in a couple of hours??

My gut tells me that we will be learning of some awful facts about the GA Pardons Board in the immediate future. How it is "appointed," etc. In GA, it has sole power over pardons, stays etc., not the govenor. Is this body made up of former cops? What is the history of it's make-up throughout the years of this case? Was there pressure on it from police? The victim was a police officer. What is the racial break-down of the board?

Since I first learned of this case about 5 years ago- I have always wondered about the GA Pardons Board and political ramifications.

This is not about the death penalty for me, it is about fair trials and competent investigations without prejudice. The fact is that any of us or someone we love could be Troy Davis. I feel for the victim's family, but it might very well be that they are hit with the fact that the wrong person was executed in the future. I hope that some renegade reporter and a PI set out to find the real truth. And if Davis was guilty, so be it, but I wouldn't want to live with the doubt of his guilt.

[kannon]

Did anyone witness the applause and adulation that Gov. Perry received from the audience during the Republican debate? How will politicians view and react to this? Will they advocate more strongly for capital punishment?

[Dominique]

Always the extreme people in the parties will say the republicans are in favor.

In Penna. The last female executed was in 1946 and the last male was
1999. The death penalty was re-enacted here in 1978. Three have been
executed since. Lethal injection is the manner this state uses. There are currently 215 inmates on death row.

We've had plenty of Republican Gov. I'm not sure, so I'm going to with hold any judgement. Those 8ft by 8ft cells, 23 hours a day, for life are weighing heavy on my mind right now.

[Toughy]

I hope everyone understands that the appeals process all the way to the SCOTUS does NOT allow new evidence to be considered. It can only consider what was done during the jury trial. Recanted testimony (after the verdict) has no bearing.