FTM place to vent and talk

[DMW]

Originally Posted by Linus

I modified it a bit more than what you posted. If you want me to remove the "and talk", let me know and I'll pull it. I don't want people to just rant and rave but rather work through whatever needs to be discussed, hashed, beaten around, chewed, chawed, etc.

I think that the modification is good. Thank you. I am outty for awhile.
I have this migraine and i think that along with more nastiness has made me puky now... I hope that the thread doesn't spread nastiness.

Thanks Linus

[Darbonaire]

I do sincerely apologize for mentioning the other thread. That's all I'm going to say about that.

I am interested in WOMEN....I don't care if they are straight or lesbian femme.....I happen to be in a group in R/T where straight women are what surrounds me...therefore my question about the date thing.

I have no problem telling a women...I guess I wasn't clear as to what I was asking.....IF I find the woman & I getting to a point where things may go further then I shall address the situation. I was more interested in the .."What kind of response have you had from...." have you fu*c*ed them & if so, how did that go as far as there being misunderstandings if any.....that sort of question. Having been married for the last 10 years to a femme I was just curious what the differences are & what other's experiences were.

I do hope this isn't going to turn into a "Why are you here on this site if you're only interested in straight women ..." cause that shit gets REALLY old...especially since I am ON this site because I love FEMMES & their energy.....

Nuff said....all the answers to my question I look forward to....

[weatherboi]

Yes I have been actively interested in and dated other women that id other than femme that are not on this site. There are many straight women out there that understand and enjoy dating guys like me/us. My work in the hospitality/entertainment industry offered/s me opportunities to date and share time. Some I have been intimate with and some I haven't but the one thing they all had in common before anything started is they all knew I am a transman/FTM. Some handled it better than others but that never mattered, I just kept moving forward with conviction to be myself.

Originally Posted by Linus

I modified it a bit more than what you posted. If you want me to remove the "and talk", let me know and I'll pull it. I don't want people to just rant and rave but rather work through whatever needs to be discussed, hashed, beaten around, chewed, chawed, etc.

And there is one thing I was curious about because I've seen this from both sides: I know there are many femmes who are interested/intrigued/turned on by FTMs and many FTMs who are reciprocal to this (myself included). What I'm curious about are those FTMs who are here in this community (and others like it) and interested in straight-women as opposed to femmes in this community (and others like it)?

[Julien]

I am a 50 year old transman who is caught "inbetween" in that I am not on T nor have I had any surgery. I have been "transitioning" for about 5 or so years and don't know when I will take the next step (surgery and/or T). It is a money issue for me and I am frustrated with how I am perceived by others. I can pass at times and other times not so much. I was once told by a MTF that I looked gender neutral, which I guess reflects my inbetweenism and I am not comfortable in that status. I am not out to everyone, and don't know how to go about it really. For example at the MCC I attend I am out to the other trans people(MTF) there and I tend to hang out with the Lesbians, but I don't exactly fit in other than my attraction to women. I also have this fear (possibly unfounded) that once I out myself to the Lesbian group that I will be treated differently for I've heard some grumblings about men as a group. I feel I won't be supported. I am not in the gay men's group, because of my inbetweenism and I'm not a gay male. I have found no other transmen in the MCC and feeling a little isolated on that front. I live in a small city and the community as a whole is not so visible. I guess I'm trying to figure out how to fit in. Thanks for any thoughts on the matter.

[Darbonaire]

Originally Posted by Julien

I am a 50 year old transman who is caught "inbetween" in that I am not on T nor have I had any surgery. I have been "transitioning" for about 5 or so years and don't know when I will take the next step (surgery and/or T). It is a money issue for me and I am frustrated with how I am perceived by others. I can pass at times and other times not so much. I was once told by a MTF that I looked gender neutral, which I guess reflects my inbetweenism and I am not comfortable in that status. I am not out to everyone, and don't know how to go about it really. For example at the MCC I attend I am out to the other trans people(MTF) there and I tend to hang out with the Lesbians, but I don't exactly fit in other than my attraction to women. I also have this fear (possibly unfounded) that once I out myself to the Lesbian group that I will be treated differently for I've heard some grumblings about men as a group. I feel I won't be supported. I am not in the gay men's group, because of my inbetweenism and I'm not a gay male. I have found no other transmen in the MCC and feeling a little isolated on that front. I live in a small city and the community as a whole is not so visible. I guess I'm trying to figure out how to fit in. Thanks for any thoughts on the matter.

Nice to meet you Julian...<smile>.....I note you live in AL.....I lived there for 8 years with my ex wife...it can be a bit stifling to be there & be different. I was fortunate, my wife's friends accepted me cause I was with her.....I was never comfortable with "outing" myself there...or anywhere really....mainly because I figure it's no one's business. Do you know of the website "The Transitional Male" ? There are some things on there that might help....binders, suggestions etc. I am lucky cause I am perceived as bio-male & have been on T & had surgery etc.

I know there are some guys on this site in the same situation you are in now. Before I started T I was almost always perceived male...lol...well, after I had a breast reduction that is....lol....before that I think folks thought, "Damn that guy's got big boobs!" Anyway, being true to yourself, exploring possible surgery options, talking with others in the same space....the FTM community in my experience has been very willing to help with questions & help with guidance too. Just keep allowing your true self to shine through man.....

Hope that helped.....

Jonathan

[Corkey]

So... I'm not transitioning because well it isn't going to happen. I can't take T because my insurance, Disability will never pay for it. I found my one and only and she could care less, because she loves who I am not just what I am. If I could say just one thing, it is be yourself always and love who comes your way. Straight, Femme or any other ID. Humans have the capacity for love, and who you love matters only to you and the one who has your heart.

(*you* general)

[Darbonaire]

Originally Posted by Corkey

So... I'm not transitioning because well it isn't going to happen. I can't take T because my insurance, Disability will never pay for it. I found my one and only and she could care less, because she loves who I am not just what I am. If I could say just one thing, it is be yourself always and love who comes your way. Straight, Femme or any other ID. Humans have the capacity for love, and who you love matters only to you and the one who has your heart.

(*you* general)

Thanks for this post ! ^5

Jonathan

[Julien]

Hi Jonathan,
Good to meet you. Thanks for the info about the site, I will look into it. Since you've lived in AL then you know who it can be stifling and I don't mean the weather during the summer. It seems that I've found more MTFs than FTMs here and I am hoping to meet up with FTMs in the future, but for now I will look to people like you and others on this site/thread for input.

Thanks again,
Julien

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Darbonaire

I do sincerely apologize for mentioning the other thread. That's all I'm going to say about that.

I am interested in WOMEN....I don't care if they are straight or lesbian femme.....I happen to be in a group in R/T where straight women are what surrounds me...therefore my question about the date thing.

I have no problem telling a women...I guess I wasn't clear as to what I was asking.....IF I find the woman & I getting to a point where things may go further then I shall address the situation. I was more interested in the .."What kind of response have you had from...." have you fu*c*ed them & if so, how did that go as far as there being misunderstandings if any.....that sort of question. Having been married for the last 10 years to a femme I was just curious what the differences are & what other's experiences were.

I do hope this isn't going to turn into a "Why are you here on this site if you're only interested in straight women ..." cause that shit gets REALLY old...especially since I am ON this site because I love FEMMES & their energy.....

Nuff said....all the answers to my question I look forward to....

Naw.. totally get it. As for the response.. I have to say I dunno. I think the ones that have been into me at the start of my transition were very positive.

I will say that sometimes I'm surprised that straight women come on to me. The most surprising was when I was in Singapore and had three different prostitutes (it was a very well known prostitute area) come up to me, offering to "love me long time" (I shit you not -- that's what they said!).

I think that it's just a matter of finding the right one and sometimes it takes time. A bigger challenge, IMO, is finding one that's nearby. In the few that I've dated (just at the start of my transition), they were either across country or in a different country altogether (I'm Canadian and ended up moving to the US because of the one I found and fell hard for and am still falling hard for to date).

[Darbonaire]

"Love you long time".....lol.....sounds good to me......just kidding......sort of. I got VERY lucky to be "found" by my ex......I traveled a lot with my former job so I met several ladies who I spent time with. Yeah, now the "close by" situation may be a speed bump along the way but, it's how it is.......

I keep thinking I was "found" once so maybe it will happen again....who knows. I even think sometimes, was I an idiot for letting a divorce happen...but, you can't stay someplace that isn't "right" just because you're afriad you may never find another partner....at least I couldn't.

I'm SO not ready to date right now...I do have friends I can call to meet for coffee or lunch but, as far as anything serious...nope, not yet....still WAY too much healing to do.

I have had straight women hit on me & gay guys....lol....so, I will just stay in the present & take baby steps to heal the heart, & when it's right.....she'll walk in.....I truly believe that.

How's Redondo Beach? I'm from CA originally....sometimes I miss it...well, no I miss my friends....I do miss the more open attitude there though...but, VA is very good to me.

Ok, off to watch the weather.....enjoy the night all !!

Jonathan

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Darbonaire

"Love you long time".....lol.....sounds good to me......just kidding......sort of. I got VERY lucky to be "found" by my ex......I traveled a lot with my former job so I met several ladies who I spent time with. Yeah, now the "close by" situation may be a speed bump along the way but, it's how it is.......

I keep thinking I was "found" once so maybe it will happen again....who knows. I even think sometimes, was I an idiot for letting a divorce happen...but, you can't stay someplace that isn't "right" just because you're afriad you may never find another partner....at least I couldn't.

I'm SO not ready to date right now...I do have friends I can call to meet for coffee or lunch but, as far as anything serious...nope, not yet....still WAY too much healing to do.

I have had straight women hit on me & gay guys....lol....so, I will just stay in the present & take baby steps to heal the heart, & when it's right.....she'll walk in.....I truly believe that.

How's Redondo Beach? I'm from CA originally....sometimes I miss it...well, no I miss my friends....I do miss the more open attitude there though...but, VA is very good to me.

Ok, off to watch the weather.....enjoy the night all !!

Jonathan

Ya.. Sometimes it's good to take a break and find yourself before letting someone else find you. That's actually very important.

As for Redondo, it's very nice (weather wise) but damned expensive. A house down the street from us just went up for sale.. for a mere $989K. If I won the lottery...

[Hominid]

I used to think this as well, and for the most part still feel that way - however, I've had TWO different occasions with doctors during an exam, in a very heavily trans-populated area - that had no idea when they saw my scars. They asked, I said "eh ... man-boobs" and both of their responses was "hmmm ... unusual, usually people who need that are overweight" -

Originally Posted by DMW

Linus, you mentioned school and i thought of a situation that came up and presented itself...a story on a lighter note...
I was in school in an anatomy lab class setting...and for some reason that i cannot recall at the moment in which the details are not really necessary for the gist....
The class needed a person to take their shirt off for ...i believe a telemetry unit with leads needing to be applied to my chest, inorder to measure the heart's electrical activity.
and the girls in the class where comfortable with me and so they were like...come on...
at first they just seemed to think that i would go ahead and offer myself for the position... and then they joked with me... and i wanted to do it...and i felt so badly for them because they didn't understand...after i didn't...i had to come up with some lame excuse of being too shy etc... i also, had to finally say...look my girl wouldn't want me to do show myself to you woman anyway...and that is kinda true too...cause they would flirt and boundaries are important..to protect them and my relationship...it was very uncomfortable for me...
The sad thing is...there were only a few biomales in the class and one was heavy set and i wanted to save him from having to take off his shirt. I think the women just assumed i was going to cause i have the kind of body that is just bland or regular i guess. So, why wouldn't they? and they were probably thinking of the overweight guy also. trying to spare him the embarrassment. ...and the other...pissed me off that he didn't. Who knows...maybe he was trans like me. like us. Eventually, the heavy set guy took his shirt off and i thanked him vociferously and publicly for his bravery. I could tell he didn't want to and he was hesitant...god and his eyes...even he looked at me like bro why not? why can't you help me and just do this for me? I felt so badly about that. God i do now.
I guess it isn't such a light note...i can laugh at myself in the situation now. But, it kinda describes our invisibility.

Oh, see....i have scars from chest surgery that would be needed to be explained...i would be outing myself to the class...right there. and the professor...hot black woman...OMG...and the school. I just wanted to focus on learning...you know? I wouldn't be ashamed to out myself...just not necessary there...like that. We had to learn...not about me being FTM...
Hugh...maybe one day...shirt comes off...oh, he is FTM...ok...continue the cardio lesson

[Hominid]

I am interested in women, similarly to Darbonaire. I am less interested in how she identifies, outside of respecting it. If she's into me and vice versa, I could care less. I tend to be attracted in real life to straight women - then again, for the most part, those are the only ones I meet. I do have a faint memory of wanting a straight woman earlier in transition - not as a conquest or anything, but I see that then I wanted to be clear I was not "other" - I was male. Now, I think a queer femme or some iteration from the community would save a lot of time and effort - being understood on some fundamental level and not having to "teach".

I have not had to tell anyone that I am trans. I don't want to. I dread it. So I limit my own self when it comes to moving in the real world. I really don't know if I could handle the aftermath (embarrassment). But I am on some main stream dating sites, and after a long description of myself, I reveal that I am trans. I've had some interest from straight women, less from bi women. As far as an actual "meet", I had breakfast with a wonderfully geeky woman the other day and she seems very interested. I have to force myself to reach out to several women a week who interest me. The percentages of responses are dismal at best, but then again, most women are inundated.

[Darbonaire]

Originally Posted by Linus

Ya.. Sometimes it's good to take a break and find yourself before letting someone else find you. That's actually very important.

As for Redondo, it's very nice (weather wise) but damned expensive. A house down the street from us just went up for sale.. for a mere $989K. If I won the lottery...

Another reason I don't live in CA ...lol...I'd move back to N CA if I won the lottery...actually Tahoe !!! Oh Yeah !!!

[Darbonaire]

Originally Posted by Hominid

I am interested in women, similarly to Darbonaire. I am less interested in how she identifies, outside of respecting it. If she's into me and vice versa, I could care less. I tend to be attracted in real life to straight women - then again, for the most part, those are the only ones I meet. I do have a faint memory of wanting a straight woman earlier in transition - not as a conquest or anything, but I see that then I wanted to be clear I was not "other" - I was male. Now, I think a queer femme or some iteration from the community would save a lot of time and effort - being understood on some fundamental level and not having to "teach".

I have not had to tell anyone that I am trans. I don't want to. I dread it. So I limit my own self when it comes to moving in the real world. I really don't know if I could handle the aftermath (embarrassment). But I am on some main stream dating sites, and after a long description of myself, I reveal that I am trans. I've had some interest from straight women, less from bi women. As far as an actual "meet", I had breakfast with a wonderfully geeky woman the other day and she seems very interested. I have to force myself to reach out to several women a week who interest me. The percentages of responses are dismal at best, but then again, most women are inundated.

dating sites.....I prefer to meet folks r/t......but hey....maybe when the time is right...who knows !

[BrutalDaddy]

Interesting discussion going on in the sense that it's not something I ever really thought about.

Guess you could say the reasoning being that I didn't truly get how "okay" it would be for me to fully come out about being FTM until I met 'sational/Julie. Since then, well she's my wife so it's not even a question in my mind but this question/thought has got me thinking.

I don't think I could ever date a straight woman. Not being judgemental or saying it's anything they would do wrong but it's purely me. Having gone through the journey I've gone through and still going through, I don't know if I could ever have that understanding from a straight female that I would get from a female that lives within the realm of the rainbow

For me, it's hard enough trying to explain my situation to those around me (mainly family and some friends who ask). They are all straight. Yet I know without a shadow of a doubt that I can come in here, verbally vomit anything out (that has to do with me and transitioning) and 9 out of 10 females would GET IT. Whereas with straight women, not so much.

So I feel like I'd rather be with a woman who can somewhat get me, my frustrations, my joy (at being seen as a male out there), my embarrassments, my everything. That's what I have now with Julie. She gets it because she is gay. She understands that society will never completely so get it. I can come home one day and be upset because of how I was perceived and she gets that totally.

Maybe I'm being judgemental because like I said, I've never really dated a straight woman while in transition so I could be way off base. I just know that, if I were single, I honestly think I'd be way more comfortable dating someone from within the rainbow then outside of it. I just want to make sure that I'm understood. That I'm not looked at with pity or that whole, "boy I gots no idea why she'd do that but if it makes her happy, eh who cares". I have enough family members that do that. Lol.

Anyway, good topic. Thanks for the brain food.


Loves Me Some Brain,
Brute.

[Darbonaire]

Originally Posted by BrutalDyke

Interesting discussion going on in the sense that it's not something I ever really thought about.

Guess you could say the reasoning being that I didn't truly get how "okay" it would be for me to fully come out about being FTM until I met 'sational/Julie. Since then, well she's my wife so it's not even a question in my mind but this question/thought has got me thinking.

I don't think I could ever date a straight woman. Not being judgemental or saying it's anything they would do wrong but it's purely me. Having gone through the journey I've gone through and still going through, I don't know if I could ever have that understanding from a straight female that I would get from a female that lives within the realm of the rainbow

For me, it's hard enough trying to explain my situation to those around me (mainly family and some friends who ask). They are all straight. Yet I know without a shadow of a doubt that I can come in here, verbally vomit anything out (that has to do with me and transitioning) and 9 out of 10 females would GET IT. Whereas with straight women, not so much.

So I feel like I'd rather be with a woman who can somewhat get me, my frustrations, my joy (at being seen as a male out there), my embarrassments, my everything. That's what I have now with Julie. She gets it because she is gay. She understands that society will never completely so get it. I can come home one day and be upset because of how I was perceived and she gets that totally.

Maybe I'm being judgemental because like I said, I've never really dated a straight woman while in transition so I could be way off base. I just know that, if I were single, I honestly think I'd be way more comfortable dating someone from within the rainbow then outside of it. I just want to make sure that I'm understood. That I'm not looked at with pity or that whole, "boy I gots no idea why she'd do that but if it makes her happy, eh who cares". I have enough family members that do that. Lol.

Anyway, good topic. Thanks for the brain food.


Loves Me Some Brain,
Brute.

which is why I'm back on this site....cause it WILL be "easier" if the woman understands about us. I just find myself in a group of freinds that I love & enjoy & they happen to be straight so......when in Rome....LOL......anyway, it's just something I'm kicking around. Like I said..i am SO not ready yet......have a ways to go to heal yet. I wouldn't do that to ANY woman straight or lesbian.

[BrutalDaddy]

Originally Posted by Darbonaire

which is why I'm back on this site....cause it WILL be "easier" if the woman understands about us. I just find myself in a group of freinds that I love & enjoy & they happen to be straight so......when in Rome....LOL......anyway, it's just something I'm kicking around. Like I said..i am SO not ready yet......have a ways to go to heal yet. I wouldn't do that to ANY woman straight or lesbian.

I get what you're saying. All of our friends are straight as well. Comes with territory of area we live in but also the gay folks that do live near there really won't have anything to do with us because of the whole FTM/femme status. I guess they think we're "traitors" to our own kind? Lol. Whatever their deal is, we don't worry about it and actually love our straight friends. Only one of them (Julie's best friend) really gets it I think. The rest just kinda get that glazed over look in their eyes then pretend they never heard any of it. Go figure.

When you're ready, you'll know.


Brute.

[Hominid]

I've actually gotten the most flak from vanilla lesbians and butch lesbians - after some conversation, at least with one who was a true enough friend to have it, and with others over time, there was an element of threat/jealousy/something. One friend told me that she wishes she could transition - and I can see it. She's thrilled when someone sees her as male. I can remember, pre-transition, thinking ftms were weak - that it took more strength to be female and masculine, and that I was more masculine as a butch than 99% of the men I knew. Over time (with butches), I tried to recognize their masculinity, and make clear that my male-ness was NOT masculinity in and of itself. Now, they don't "see" me, so it's not an issue in that way. It IS an issue as far as meeting others in the community (another friend and I have compared my position with femme invisibility).

Originally Posted by BrutalDyke

I get what you're saying. All of our friends are straight as well. Comes with territory of area we live in but also the gay folks that do live near there really won't have anything to do with us because of the whole FTM/femme status. I guess they think we're "traitors" to our own kind? Lol. Whatever their deal is, we don't worry about it and actually love our straight friends. Only one of them (Julie's best friend) really gets it I think. The rest just kinda get that glazed over look in their eyes then pretend they never heard any of it. Go figure.

When you're ready, you'll know.


Brute.

[BrutalDaddy]

Originally Posted by Hominid

I've actually gotten the most flak from vanilla lesbians and butch lesbians - after some conversation, at least with one who was a true enough friend to have it, and with others over time, there was an element of threat/jealousy/something. One friend told me that she wishes she could transition - and I can see it. She's thrilled when someone sees her as male. I can remember, pre-transition, thinking ftms were weak - that it took more strength to be female and masculine, and that I was more masculine as a butch than 99% of the men I knew. Over time (with butches), I tried to recognize their masculinity, and make clear that my male-ness was NOT masculinity in and of itself. Now, they don't "see" me, so it's not an issue in that way. It IS an issue as far as meeting others in the community (another friend and I have compared my position with femme invisibility).

Exactly! Julie and I have actually talked about how she goes through femme invisibility and I go through FTM invisibility, both in straight and rainbow world. Maybe that's why I feel I would be way more comfortable with a femme if I were single, versus a straight woman. I've never met a straight woman who suffers from feeling invisible with her own idenity but I've met plenty of femmes who have. It's that tangible common ground/connection that makes the relationship/friendship/whatever it is that much more bonded. That understanding of what the other must go through.

You know I've tried really hard to understand what the issue folks from our own world have against us (her and I) but I can not figure it out. Finally got to a point where I don't care, for the most part. Won't lie, still gets to me sometimes because it really would be nice to be around "family" face to face but that'll happen come September at the Reunion! Not only get to put faces with the names of folks we've talked to for years but also get to soak up the real life experience of being "home", so to speak.