Parenting

[Jess]

I just realized that we don't have a thread or area for folks to discuss parenting. We have a lot of parents here, so here goes.

Will start with a link that I posted on another area here for KIPP schools. I think as parents we are charged with the duty and honor of getting involved with our children's education. I think the failure of public schools to educate our kids with even the basics of social history is in great part why we see so many of the "isms" still rampant in this country. Sexism/ racism etc as well as basic math/ grammar should be part of our curriculum.

The drop out rate of kids is still way too high. The rate of kids graduating and then going to college is still too low. The effectiveness of teachers is still not where it should be. I commend teachers who really giving our kids the attention and tools they need to become healthy citizens. I think a well rounded education is work on both the part of the system ( schools/ teachers) and the parent. It should be a parental contract to agree to help every child do the work needed to become "educated".

I just learned about these schools and urge parents to become involved in their school boards to find ways to make EVERY school as successful as these models.

http://www.kipp.org/

So, education is a huge issue for parents. What issues do you face as a parent? Terrible twos? Terrible teens? IVF? Where are we as a community in raising our kids?

I think sometimes it is easy to forget we are "parents" because we are queer and by and large "queers don't have kids". I have met some amazing moms and dads in my time at the b-f communities. My hat is off to you all!

Here's a spot to talk about your highs and lows in the journey of sharing our child's path. Ideas for making the world a better place for them? Field trips? Resources? Healthy snacks? Protecting without being "over protective" ?

Hope to see some of you sharing how you do it!

Thanks!

[Lusciousblondefemme]

Ok so .. I am the mother of two wonderful children Krystal is 15 and Kevin is 13. They truly are amazing children who have wonderful hearts and souls. But it has been a long journey to be able to sit back and say,"Hey, I did a damn good job", i raised my children basically by myself. My ex husband was there but not a hands on parent. He was alittle too concerned with his own life to realize that he should be part of their lives. That has changed some but still I feel like I did it all and he got just the easy parts.

So the discussion at hand .. I definately think that schools need to be brought up to date on the lessons and classes that they teach. I think that they need a class in tolerance, maybe anger management. I think that schools should prepare children for LIFE. I look at my daughter when she comes home from school and is taking a computer class that honestly she knows more about computers than the teacher does. Why not instead of teaching computers to children who have been using them for years teach something that will help them in life.
Another thing is that I believe that teachers should be tested as well as kids. When i was a preschool teacher I always made everything I learned fun. Why can't they make school fun, i find that if you can actually get a child interested in what they are learning, maybe by making your lesson plan fun, that children retain the information alot better.

Ok i have a good question, Why is saying that someone is Gay or Lesbian considered using vulgar language in schools? I will never forget when my daughter was in middle school I got a call at work telling me that my daughter was in the principals office. Well when i talked to Krystal she explained that there was a fight between two of her freinds and Krystal said hey why dont you kiss and make up. I always say that to my kids.. it makes them laugh and they forget the reason they are mad. So Krystal thought it was funny to say it. Well she got pulled down to the principals office for accusing two girls of being gay. I was appalled when she told me this. I asked her to give the phone to the principal and I asked the principal what was going on. She told me " Krystal has accused two girls of being gay and that is just not right and against school policies, for her to even discuss such a subject is not right." I said, " Well if you knew fucking anything you would know that I AM A LESBIAN, and my daughter would never accuse anyone of being a LESBIAN or being GAY because she knows better than to judge people." I went on to say that if they would have asked her what happened she would have told them the story. If they asked her why she said what she said they would have had an explanation instead of accusing her of being rude and cruel. I went on to say that As a LESBIAN, I find it very insulting that they are saying basically that if she talks about me that it's against their school policies. This principal didn't know what to say to me. I heard her tell Krystal to go back to class and that she was sorry. She than stated Have a nice day Ms. M****.
My thing is why is it wrong for children to talk about gay and lesbian issues, why is it ok for another child to call another child a faggot, but god forbid my children discuss the fact that I am a lesbian it violates their code of conduct at their school?

When is society going to start realizing that we are here, we are queer and WE ARE NOT going anywhere. That children they are teaching can come from gay families. They should be teaching tolerance in schools towards all people. Hazing should extend to sexuality.

I am the token lesbian at my daughters school because I am out. All her friends know that I am and she is very proud of me. She tells everyone that she talks to that I am gay and that if they don't like tough shit.

Kevin is still kinda quiet so he hasn't gotten to that stage yet. But i can imagine when he starts talking about me that his friends of course will find it fascinating. LOL.

So now the next hurdle that I shall be getting into with Krystal is she gets her permit in December. GOD help me please.!

I am sure that until December that we will have a few more obstacles to overcome but i look forward to them.

I find that as a parent the best approach is to be open and honest with your children. Krystal and Kevin know that they can come to me with anyone. They know that there is nothing that they will say that will shock me and/or make me upset with them. We talk about sex, sexuality, and drugs on a daily basis. I make sure that they know that no matter what I love them unconditionally, but that I hope that they make wise decisions in life, not for me but for themselves.

On a funny note.: Ok so Krystal, Kevin and I were in the grocery store. We are standing in the frozen food aisle and Krystal turns to me and goes ,"Mom what is Masturbation?" I very calmly said " This is not something we should discuss in the store, I will tell you when we get to the car." just as I finished telling her that I saw some guy looking in astonishment at me and run away. I was laughing my ass off. Kids definately do say the Darndest things

[Rockinonahigh]

One thing I found out about parenting is, dont expect a rule book and that Dr.Spock must have not been a hands on parent when he wrote his book on parenting all those years ago.
I had kids when I was 19 & 23 so as they grew up I didnt get all in a wad about much of what they did cause I really wasnt that much older than they were..but I definatly could see things from both sides of the parent/child world.It would drive my mom nuts cuse I would always take the time to talk to my boys about everything that was age appropreate aaaannnnddd if they ask about something that I felt wasnt really time for them to ask..well I just gave them the anser to the question without going overbore with it cause sometimes it was just something in passing.
My kids are as diffrent as day light and dark..the oldest is hell on wheels adhd hyper overdrive kid into it all..my youngest is calm,quite ,funny,a book worm that approaches the world and life with a purpose and goals of wich he has made nearly everone he set out to do..When ask how I managed to raise kids of such a diffrent personality I say ..easy they are both sides of who I am.

[morningstar55]

Originally Posted by Lusciousblondefemme

On a funny note.: Ok so Krystal, Kevin and I were in the grocery store. We are standing in the frozen food aisle and Krystal turns to me and goes ,"Mom what is Masturbation?" I very calmly said " This is not something we should discuss in the store, I will tell you when we get to the car." just as I finished telling her that I saw some guy looking in astonishment at me and run away. I was laughing my ass off. Kids definately do say the Darndest things

oh my........ lol .. i couldnt help but chuckle about this.. lol
i remember once... when my daughter was .. hmm 11 or 12 i think..... im driving , and she suddenly ask this ?? out of the blue......
"mom, does it hurt to have a baby?"
my eyes im sure poped wide open.. and thought. whaat??
where did that ? come from??
but i just calmly .... said.... " well , hate to say it , but yes it does hurt very much. but its something alot of mom's go thru if they want a baby,Its all part of life..and silly thing is as much as it hurts, some want another one.... heh....
kids do say or ask the darnest things sometimes

[Andrew, Jr.]

Jess thanks for starting this thread.

Right now I can use some advice. I am being bombarded with all of my nieces and nephews coming to me. In 3 weeks one of my nieces is getting married. My niece getting married wants to honor her aunt (who died) by placing a photograph of her on the alter in the Church. My late sister's husband is bringing a date to the wedding, and his 2 sons will be there as well. The issue is that he is dating, and that the kids feel Aunt Jo is being replaced. I constantly tell them all that nobody is ever going to replace Aunt Jo. Nobody. But when dealing with children, it is different. And I am not one to really help them. I can say the words, but it is just sinking in with them. The ages range from newborns all the way up to early 20's.

Help me with this, please.

Much thanks.

Love,
Andrew

[Rockinonahigh]

My oldes son has two kids so one weekend we were out about town just kicking around.Well we all know how kids do say the darndest things at some really crazy times.We were in chucky cheeses and the grand daughter who was 13 at the time out of the blue ask me what it was like to have an orgasm.This caught me fixing to take a bite out a a pizza,the room was packed with people of all ages and her voice is like mine ..u cant miss it.I thing I took on second to take a deep breath( remembr I raised her dad) and said we will take a walk to settle this pizza pie when we are done and talk about it...she said ..ok.Btw the folks siting at any table near enough to hear it was either silence or stares or deep chuckles.I turnes out she has followed her grandbutch into queerdome.

[Rockinonahigh]

Andrew,how ar ya bro?
All I can say its your nices wedding and she should feel free to honor her aunt as she wishes and I think her ideas is a sound one that will be great for her.Now as for the rest of the family,ya know its hard when a parent starts dateing again cause then the kids will be shareing dads time with someone new.Now if he is just dateing and it not overly serious they should be remeinded somehow that its just dateing.If its serious dad needs to sit down with the kids involved alone and have a talk with them about it all to reashure then that no on will ever replace mom ever.Both sides need to really listen to each other cause what ever happends in this will be something that will be remembered by all in the future and should be in a possitive way.I think the older folks /kids could be a little easyer on dad cause he has a right to a life of happyness if he loves this woman...she needs to understand the foundation both of them put down now will set the tone for the future with the other folks involved as well.A possitive relationship is far better than a neggetive one and all need to work to that gaol.

[Lusciousblondefemme]

Andrew,
I would tell your neice that since it is her big day that she should do what is in her heart. If she feels that she wants to honor her aunt than so be it. You should also ask them When exactly they think that its enough time or the right time for her husband to move on. Unfortunately everyone deals with heartache differently and no one can tell another person when its time to move on. Tell them that its not that he is trying to replace their Aunt, it's just that he wants to feel happiness again.
I hope that her wedding is amazing and that the day goes off without a hitch... There truly is something to be said about your neice who wants to honor her aunt. That is something very special she has inside of her heart.

[Andrew, Jr.]

Thanks for the responses. I feel caught in the middle. I can understand the Dad wanting to date again, and wanting to move on with life and living. At the same time, the kids are still grieving. This is the first major event and my niece getting married is the one who was very close to my late sister. That is why I can see having a picture of her on the alter. I just don't want anyone to be crying. I want it to be a happy event. I want to keep spirits up.

[evolveme]

Hey y'all.

I'm writing an article and need to interview some parents. Specifically I'm looking to speak to the parent of a boy, but could also stand to speak to the parent of a girl child as well. This would be a child old enough to have experienced and/or witnessed bullying.

Please PM me if you are available to chat briefly on the subject and are willing to give your full name (not your child's) for an article that would appear online.

Thank you in advance!

Julie

[KayCee]

Here's an interesting article I received today and wanted to share with you:

Kids With Lesbian Parents Do Just Fine
http://www.medicinenet.com/script/ma...iclekey=116921

When compared to teens of the same age, adolescents raised by lesbian parents are doing just fine socially, psychologically and academically, new research finds.

Not only that, they have fewer social problems, and less aggressive and rule-breaking behaviors than other teens.

The nearly 20-year study has followed 78 teens since their lesbian mothers were planning their pregnancies, and concluded that these children "demonstrate healthy psychological adjustment." These findings stand in contrast to what some vocal opponents of gay or lesbian parents might have expected.

"One of the things that opponents of the equalities of gays and lesbians -- in marriage, parenting, adoption and foster care -- often bring up is the so-called gold standard of parenting, which defined by them is the traditional family where children are conceived in traditional ways and not through insemination or surrogates. But, when we compared the adolescents in our study to the so-called gold standard, we found the teens with lesbian mothers were actually doing better," said study author Dr. Nanette Gartrell, the Williams Distinguished Scholar at the University of California Los Angeles School of Law.

As to why these teens are doing better, Gartrell said, "Moms in the lesbian family are very committed, very involved parents."

Gartrell said she expects that these findings would also translate to the children of gay male parents as well. "Gay male parents are another group of very committed parents, and really, [among gay male couples] only economically privileged gay men have access to the opportunity to become parents right now," she said.

Family therapist Andrew Roffman, at the New York University Langone Medical Center, wasn't surprised by the findings and agreed that such results would likely be similar for gay male parents.

"Good parenting makes for healthier children, regardless of your sexual orientation. Whether you're gay, straight or lesbian, good parenting is good parenting," said Roffman.

Results of Gartrell's study will be published in the July issue of Pediatrics.

Between 1986 and 1992, Gartrell and her colleague, Henry Bos, recruited 154 prospective lesbian mothers as they were considering artificial insemination, or once they were already pregnant.

As the children have grown, the researchers have been periodically checking in on them, and the latest follow-up included questionnaires completed by 78 children when they were 10 and again when they were 17. The study also included an interview with one of each child's mothers to assess the child's psychological well-being.

The results were then compared to a group of age-matched children from traditional families.

Compared to the traditionally reared teens, adolescents with lesbian parents rated significantly higher in social, academic and total competence, according to the study. The teens with lesbian parents also rated significantly lower when it came to social problems, rule-breaking and aggressive behavior than teens raised in more traditional families.

Even in homes where the lesbian parents had split up, the researchers found that those teens still fared better than teens from more traditional families.

Just over four in 10 of the teens raised by lesbian parents reported that they had been stigmatized at some point because of their parents' sexual orientation, said Gartrell. But, when the researchers compared those who had been stigmatized to those who hadn't, they found no significant psychological differences.

"These young people seem to have done well; they have some resilience," she said.

Roffman said there's likely a resilience factor at play. And, he said, it may come from the lesbian parents thinking ahead of time about what the child's experiences might be and talking with the children before anything happens.

"Probably the most effective thing to do is to prepare kids ahead of time. Let them know that there is still a cultural stigma and that they may encounter children and adults who are insensitive. Having these kinds of talks is relationship-building for both parents and children," said Roffman

"The outcomes here were very clear. These are families in which the mothers were very committed, involved and loving. The 17-year-old adolescents are healthy, happy and high-functioning," said Gartrell.

[SuperFemme]

Stanford Report, August 30, 2010
BY ADAM GORLICK
Children raised by gay couples show good progress through school

By mining data from the 2000 Census, sociologist Michael Rosenfeld figured out the rates at which kids raised by gay and straight couples repeated a grade during elementary or middle school. He found that children of same-sex parents have essentially the same educational achievement as their peers growing up in heterosexual households.

Jack Hubbard Stanford research finds that children of gay and straight couples do equally well in school. Associate professor Michael Rosenfeld, Sociology, drew his research from census data.

In nearly every discussion, debate or lawsuit about gay marriage, the talk at some point turns to family values.

Do gay couples make for good parents? Will their children – whether adopted, conceived with the help of a surrogate or brought in from a pre-existing relationship – adjust, adapt and succeed in a world dominated by traditional families?

The answers usually depend on who's giving them, and come dressed in anecdotes and colored by bias. But Stanford sociologist Michael Rosenfeld brings something new to the conversation: facts and figures derived from the country's largest data bank – the U.S. Census.

In a study published this month in the journal Demography, Rosenfeld concludes that children being raised by same-sex couples have nearly the same educational achievement as children raised by married heterosexual couples.

By mining data from the 2000 Census, Rosenfeld was able to figure out the rates at which children in all types of families repeated a grade during elementary or middle school. According to his findings, nearly 7 percent of children raised by heterosexual married couples were held back a year, while about 9.5 percent of children living with adults identifying themselves as same-sex partners repeated a grade.

The difference between the groups pretty much vanishes when taking into account that the heterosexual couples were slightly more educated and wealthier than most gay parents, Rosenfeld said.

"The census data show that having parents who are the same gender is not in itself any disadvantage to children," he said. "Parents' income and education are the biggest indicators of a child's success. Family structure is a minor determinant."

Rosenfeld's findings have been cited by lawyers fighting Proposition 8, the gay marriage ban passed by California voters in 2008. A federal court judge recently overturned the ban, but his ruling is under appeal.

Rosenfeld's study shows that children of gay and married couples had lower grade-repetition rates than their peers raised by opposite-sex unmarried couples and single parents. And all children living in some type of family environment did much better than those living in group housing. Those who were awaiting adoption or placement in a foster home were held back about 34 percent of the time.

"One of the fundamental issues in modern family law that differs from state to state is whether same-sex couples can adopt," Rosenfeld said. "My research makes clear that there's a huge advantage to kids to be out of the care of the state and into the care of any family, even if the family is not perfectly optimal."

Educators, policymakers and social scientists have long known that children left back in school are at greater risk than their peers for not finishing high school and getting into trouble.

Because gays and lesbians make up such a tiny sliver of the American population – only 1 percent – it has been difficult for researchers to conduct a representative study of how their children perform in the classroom. And gay marriage opponents have criticized earlier studies for having sample sizes that are too small.

"Sample size is power," Rosenfeld said. "And the census is the biggest sample we have. This study is based on a sample of thousands and thousands of kids."

Most personal decisions about gay marriage are based on gut feelings, religious beliefs and individual experiences. Rosenfeld knows his research isn't going to change the minds of most people opposed to same-sex unions. But he has added new data to the debate that helps debunk assertions – whether based on a lack of knowledge or some unfounded fear – that children raised by gay couples cannot thrive.

"Social scientists have an obligation to shed light where they can on issues that are roiling the public," he said. "Sometimes we have to throw up our hands and admit that something is unknowable. But in this case, we could bring some real hard data to bear on an area that was otherwise really in the dark."

http://news.stanford.edu/news/2010/a...tml?view=print

[Sachita]

my son is an adult and ready to have his own child. this is sweet revenge because shes not even here and he's worried.

you can't rely on any schools or system to teach your child how to get by in this world. You have to be very proactive and damn patient. No matter what never give up on your child. I see this so often and it breaks my heart. Kids will break your heart over and over yet teach you the most unbelievable capacity to love.

my son was raised in a queer home by a very open-minded freespirited goddess leather crazy woman. over all he turned out great and as each year goes by I see him seasoning towards life and beating his own drum. This I am most proud of.

[sylvie]

proud mother of 2 teenagers here.. i have a 17 yr old boy and a 14 yr old girl.. i breezed through with my son, i admit.. we've had a few issues but nothing too stressful - but my daughter took over as far as terrible teens.. hahaha

a little while back, it felt like she was spiralling out of control and i wouldnt be able to survive it, i was sure i was losing my mind.. but i kept on her and she's made so much progress and is back to being my daughter again (i wasnt sure who took over her LOL).. sure we have our little moments still with regular teenage issues, but.. nothing at all like it was.. i refused to give up on her!

i'm so proud of my children.. they've taught me so much through life, different ways of understanding, seeing the world through a much more innocent eye, and how to love from the depths of my soul.

my biggest issue with parenting as a single parent, is relationships.. my children are sooo ready for me to meet someone and be happy.. they're at the point in their lives where they have their own things going on and don't need mom to hold their hand anymore, they feel i'm a lonely 'ol hen (laughs) but.. it's hard because when dating someone, they're taking my children on as well as me, and my passed experiences have taught me that its hard to come into a relationship with me and take on someone else's children. my children have had to take on my ex's anger and jealousy and mean things said, either to me or to them and it hurt them deeply.. (not in one relationship, but a few).. when my children are hurt, i hurt very much because i end up feeling responsible for allowing this to happen...

anyway, love this thread and looking very forward to some parenting chitchat.. if there is one thing i love about myself, it's being a parent!

[Tommi]

Originally Posted by Sachita

my son is an adult and ready to have his own child. this is sweet revenge because shes not even here and he's worried.

you can't rely on any schools or system to teach your child how to get by in this world. You have to be very proactive and damn patient. No matter what never give up on your child. I see this so often and it breaks my heart. Kids will break your heart over and over yet teach you the most unbelievable capacity to love.

my son was raised in a queer home by a very open-minded freespirited goddess leather crazy woman. over all he turned out great and as each year goes by I see him seasoning towards life and beating his own drum. This I am most proud of.

I would echo this loud and clear Sachita.

I'll never forget the day I picked Leia up at day care after first grade, at her private Christian school. I saw the principal meandering over with the first grade teacher, both just kind of staring at me. Out of the mouths of babes as they say. Leia shared with her class that day about her family. She had a dog named Snigglefritz that slept with her in her twin princess bed. That Mommy and Tommi slept in a giant bed together, but didn't need a big bed because were always cuddled together to stay warm, in just part of that big bed. She said she and Snigglefritz should have the big bed because they needed more room than we did. She told them there was another bedroom beside the den, that didn't need a bed because that was our playroom.

I saw the slight smile on their faces, and the principal simply said," I knew you two were not sisters, but kissin cousins is okay. " I told her we were not cousins, and were gay, had been together for many years prior to getting Leia when she was 2, because her Mom abandoned her. (they knew peggie was her Gramma), and if being gay was a problem we would find another school, and Leia didn't belong here then.

Mrs. Samuelson, in a motherly tone looked at me and said" I can't wait to hear more stories, and I suggest you put a lock on your bedroom door, because I can imagine when talk comes to how babies are made Leia will be happy to talk about anything she has seen or knows." Miss Taylor said, my roommate and I will have something fun to talk about at dinner. " I breathed a sigh of relief, and became a Chaperone on trips from first grade to high School , and was accepted and respected by the school staff and parents. I got to go to Catalina scuba diving, on a school bus for 8 hours with 25 screaming 3rd graders to Sacramento,CA and we flew to Disney World escorting 30 teenage girls and boys.

I miss seeing my lil kiddo's who are at Ellsworth Air Foce Base in South Dakota. Plans are for them to come home for Christmas if their Daddy is deployed to Afghanistan again.

My Mom came out when I was 17. I had always known, and she was a great role model. She made sure I understood becoming "Tommi" at 5 was okay and gay from as long as she can remember. and that I was respected and she gave me support and strength in those rough teen years I had. Now, my father was another story. and , that is another thread.





I am a proud Grandparent of Trinity Hope, a beautiful little, who next week will be 4, and Dustin Bradley, the all American boy who is 5.. We raised our daughter with the tools she needed to get out into the big old world. We tried to Keep her safe, in a private school, had her friends, and their parents at our house and showed them that a gay couple who respected each other and them is where Leia learned to do the same.

She shares with her friends about diversity, love, respect and how our employment paid her way through school. We bought her a computer for college. She met and married an Air Force Sergeant she met in a chat room, quit school, got married and is making her own way in the world.

[christie]

I typically don't post a lot about parenting. I don't want others judging my parenting skills/style and I don't want to judge theirs.

However, I find myself on a very uncertain road. I'm not sure I am looking for answers/advice or if I am looking for someone to tell me that its gonna be ok, that they have walked/walking the road or the road scares the bejezus out of them.

Some of you may know that we have a 17 (almost 18) year old son who is lovingly referred to as Bratboy. I am quite open about his being an ASPIE (Asperger's Syndrome) as well as a myriad of other acronyms. I have always prided myself on being able to navigate single-parenthood of a special needs child and really tried not to become a martyr about "Why?". Truth is, I can't imagine wanting my son to be any different than he is - except when I do.

He graduated high-school in May and is one of those kids who is just not ready in terms of maturation to attend college either away from home or close to home without some additional support systems. We are fortunate in that he has been accepted at a school about three hours from us where he will first have a nine week "life skills" course and then go on to begin the culinary arts program. He will live on campus but have more supervision than if he were at a mainstream (lack of better word) college.

The conundrum is that he is a pig and has little to no regard for the impact of his actions on others. It doesn't matter that Jess and I could both have the tidy-fit award on a daily basis. It doesn't seem to matter that we have a freakin' housekeeper and all he has to do is to pick up his crap and she will dust, do the floors and make the bed. It doesn't seem to matter that he has a mountain of dirty laundry and no clean underwear - he wears "basketball" shorts if he has no clean underwear. He deplores showering and personal hygiene as if you are asking him to bathe in acid and only does so when whatever he wants (internet access usually) becomes the currency.

Having his internet access was a great repercussion when he spent hours upon hours talking/skyping with his internet pals. Low and behold, he has made real-time friends. Something he has never had. The last month or so has been these two boys (young men, really) and Bratboy traipsing back and forth between our house and theirs.

They seem to have no concept of how their escapades at all hours impact our lives. Jess can't sleep during the week (I work a couple hundred miles from home) because the dogs are alerting her to every time they hear a noise. We have tried talking to him about how ecstatic we are that he has friends and that we are trying to teach him about the different expectations now that he has close folks to interact with - not that we want to continue to treat him as a child, but that we are teaching him things that he's just coming to need.

At moments, he seems to get it. Just about a month ago, he spent his first night away from home since he was about 6 (other than with my folks or his father on occasion). Following that, Jess was able to leave him alone overnight and he took amazing care of the dogs. It felt like the anchor of him not being self-sufficient/mature was being lifted! We were overjoyed.

Last week, we attempted Jess coming to Richmond for the night so we could attend the Melissa Etheridge concert. He agreed to take care of the dogs. Good, right? Uh-huh - until Jess found the pool filter system full of airsoft pellets (kinda like plastic BB's). Until I couldnt reach him till THREE THIRTY the next day to find that our giant schnuazer who lives outside most days hadn't been watered because, "Mooooommmmmm - I am tired. It just rained." Don't even get me started on my reaction.

I know to some it sounds simply as if we aren't enforcing boundaries. The issue seems to be that there is no repercussion because there is no currency. He is completely apathetic most days and the internet and his cell phone are of no importance to him now. Money isn't an issue because he has EVERYTHING he could possibly want - and short of taking things away (which he doesn't care about anyway), there isn't a possible solution there either.

My rope is short and I am finding myself about to have a "Mommy meltdown." These usually aren't pretty and do result in what I term as band-aids on an artery. Stops the bleeding for a hot minute and then things are right back to where they were.

Jess does an amazing job of caring for him while I am away and I will own that I do feel a certain amount of Mommy guilt at having someone there doing the hard stuff while I am away for work. I don't want to add to what I already consider a huge undertaking for Jess. I don't want him to get a "pass" on unacceptable behaviors because he is wired differently, yet, I constantly find myself searching for the one thing that will finally click and make sense to him.

Sigh. Anyone have a magic wand? My apologies if this seems too long or too detailed. Once I started, it poured out like a river.

[tapu]

Hi, Christie.

A couple of things came to mind as I was reading your post...

First, I thought, eh, that's what a guy that age is like. But I figure you've got a handle on that and know that this goes beyond.

Another thing that I get out of it is that you do think he's capable of great improvement in this area. So it's not that he's completely limited in maturing this way. It just hasn't happened.

I assume you do the list thing because I can't imagine getting this far without such proven tools.

I wonder if setting him up in more of a space of his own would eventually lead to natural motivation to improve in this area. Like, I don't know your house set-up obviously, but if he has a bed/bath of his own, or even just a separated out bedroom, and you stop all housekeeping service in there.... Well, eventually he runs out of basketball shorts, too.

It might take a while, which could be blech-y. Most older teen guys just have basically bad hygiene so who wants to sit next to them? Eventually though, he may be motivated to clean up.

The other thing that can jumpstart a kid is developing an interest in romance. You may have to use only a band-aid right now.

I don't know if any of this would be helpful, but I really got into your post. Please give word of how it goes. tapu

[jelli]

Originally Posted by christie0918

I typically don't post a lot about parenting. I don't want others judging my parenting skills/style and I don't want to judge theirs.

However, I find myself on a very uncertain road. I'm not sure I am looking for answers/advice or if I am looking for someone to tell me that its gonna be ok, that they have walked/walking the road or the road scares the bejezus out of them.

Some of you may know that we have a 17 (almost 18) year old son who is lovingly referred to as Bratboy. I am quite open about his being an ASPIE (Asperger's Syndrome) as well as a myriad of other acronyms. I have always prided myself on being able to navigate single-parenthood of a special needs child and really tried not to become a martyr about "Why?". Truth is, I can't imagine wanting my son to be any different than he is - except when I do.

He graduated high-school in May and is one of those kids who is just not ready in terms of maturation to attend college either away from home or close to home without some additional support systems. We are fortunate in that he has been accepted at a school about three hours from us where he will first have a nine week "life skills" course and then go on to begin the culinary arts program. He will live on campus but have more supervision than if he were at a mainstream (lack of better word) college.

The conundrum is that he is a pig and has little to no regard for the impact of his actions on others. It doesn't matter that Jess and I could both have the tidy-fit award on a daily basis. It doesn't seem to matter that we have a freakin' housekeeper and all he has to do is to pick up his crap and she will dust, do the floors and make the bed. It doesn't seem to matter that he has a mountain of dirty laundry and no clean underwear - he wears "basketball" shorts if he has no clean underwear. He deplores showering and personal hygiene as if you are asking him to bathe in acid and only does so when whatever he wants (internet access usually) becomes the currency.

Having his internet access was a great repercussion when he spent hours upon hours talking/skyping with his internet pals. Low and behold, he has made real-time friends. Something he has never had. The last month or so has been these two boys (young men, really) and Bratboy traipsing back and forth between our house and theirs.

They seem to have no concept of how their escapades at all hours impact our lives. Jess can't sleep during the week (I work a couple hundred miles from home) because the dogs are alerting her to every time they hear a noise. We have tried talking to him about how ecstatic we are that he has friends and that we are trying to teach him about the different expectations now that he has close folks to interact with - not that we want to continue to treat him as a child, but that we are teaching him things that he's just coming to need.

At moments, he seems to get it. Just about a month ago, he spent his first night away from home since he was about 6 (other than with my folks or his father on occasion). Following that, Jess was able to leave him alone overnight and he took amazing care of the dogs. It felt like the anchor of him not being self-sufficient/mature was being lifted! We were overjoyed.

Last week, we attempted Jess coming to Richmond for the night so we could attend the Melissa Etheridge concert. He agreed to take care of the dogs. Good, right? Uh-huh - until Jess found the pool filter system full of airsoft pellets (kinda like plastic BB's). Until I couldnt reach him till THREE THIRTY the next day to find that our giant schnuazer who lives outside most days hadn't been watered because, "Mooooommmmmm - I am tired. It just rained." Don't even get me started on my reaction.

I know to some it sounds simply as if we aren't enforcing boundaries. The issue seems to be that there is no repercussion because there is no currency. He is completely apathetic most days and the internet and his cell phone are of no importance to him now. Money isn't an issue because he has EVERYTHING he could possibly want - and short of taking things away (which he doesn't care about anyway), there isn't a possible solution there either.

My rope is short and I am finding myself about to have a "Mommy meltdown." These usually aren't pretty and do result in what I term as band-aids on an artery. Stops the bleeding for a hot minute and then things are right back to where they were.

Jess does an amazing job of caring for him while I am away and I will own that I do feel a certain amount of Mommy guilt at having someone there doing the hard stuff while I am away for work. I don't want to add to what I already consider a huge undertaking for Jess. I don't want him to get a "pass" on unacceptable behaviors because he is wired differently, yet, I constantly find myself searching for the one thing that will finally click and make sense to him.

Sigh. Anyone have a magic wand? My apologies if this seems too long or too detailed. Once I started, it poured out like a river.

Thank you for posting Christie,

I can't even imagine and major props to you and to Jess for continuously and lovingly striving to help "bratboy" become the most independent and integrated young man as he can possibly be. Go easy on yourselves it reads as if you're doing all you can do at this point.

Have you looked into any local or online support groups?

I took just a moment to look around and found one that has some forums:

http://www.aspergersyndrome.org/

As tapu stated, let us know if you find some resolution. I'm sorry I couldn't be much help.

{{{{{Christie & Jess}}}}}

[christie]

Originally Posted by tapu

Hi, Christie.

A couple of things came to mind as I was reading your post...

First, I thought, eh, that's what a guy that age is like. But I figure you've got a handle on that and know that this goes beyond.

Another thing that I get out of it is that you do think he's capable of great improvement in this area. So it's not that he's completely limited in maturing this way. It just hasn't happened.

I assume you do the list thing because I can't imagine getting this far without such proven tools.

I wonder if setting him up in more of a space of his own would eventually lead to natural motivation to improve in this area. Like, I don't know your house set-up obviously, but if he has a bed/bath of his own, or even just a separated out bedroom, and you stop all housekeeping service in there.... Well, eventually he runs out of basketball shorts, too.

It might take a while, which could be blech-y. Most older teen guys just have basically bad hygiene so who wants to sit next to them? Eventually though, he may be motivated to clean up.

The other thing that can jumpstart a kid is developing an interest in romance. You may have to use only a band-aid right now.

I don't know if any of this would be helpful, but I really got into your post. Please give word of how it goes. tapu

Thanks, Tapu for your response.

Unfortunately, he does have his own bedroom and even his own "boy cave" space where his bicycles, "faux" Flex weight machine, the 10 thousand (it seems) airsoft guns and his sword and knife collection lives. It doesn't seem to matter that they are his spaces and that he is responsible for them - he just doesn't care - and I think more than anything, the apathy he has about life just really wears me out.

He is so blessed in comparison to most of the kids in our lil town. Most families in our town have issues with putting food on the table much less to have the abundance of material things we have. It irks me to no end that even when you point out to him his privlige and he acknowledges it, you can still walk into his room and find both of his laptops on the floor, the iPad tossed on the bed amongst just trash, his nasty fingerprints on the flat screen tv - I could just open the window and toss it all in the front yard (except that tidy yard Jess won't let me unless she can pull the Beast (don't ask - its an old truck) under the window so I don't make a mess.

He has a romance of sorts, but manages to shower is she is coming over.

Last night after I made the post, he called to ask if he could spend the night at his friends'. I have told him (and Jess) time and time again that its NOT a good idea to put me on speaker - there is no accounting for what I might say.

Low and behold, I start in on, "What are you and your friends going to do to pay for the $500 pool filter you ruined after you were told not to airsoft in the yard?", quickly followed with, "Are your friends going to help you do your laundry and clean that pig-sty of a room, and while they are at it, are they gonna get in the shower and wash your nasty ass?" (He's almost 18 - saying ass to him isn't the worst thing in the world and sometimes he seems to "hear" me when its not the same Mom speech).

There is a part of me that abhors embarrasing him. Really. There is another part of me that thinks maybe, just maybe, it might make him take action. *shrugs*

I'll keep you posted. I have told him that he might wanna think about getting it together because when Momma comes home this weekend, reality is about to smack him square between the eyes. I'm not sure yet what that entails, but I am certain that its nor going to be pretty.

Originally Posted by jelli

Thank you for posting Christie,

I can't even imagine and major props to you and to Jess for continuously and lovingly striving to help "bratboy" become the most independent and integrated young man as he can possibly be. Go easy on yourselves it reads as if you're doing all you can do at this point.

Have you looked into any local or online support groups?

I took just a moment to look around and found one that has some forums:

http://www.aspergersyndrome.org/

As tapu stated, let us know if you find some resolution. I'm sorry I couldn't be much help.

{{{{{Christie & Jess}}}}}

Jelli -

Thanks for your response.

The unfortunate part of support groups, for me, has always been I have little patience for those who seem to get wrapped up in their issues, wearing them as a blanket to keep them warm - I tried an autism group when he was first diagnosed at 2.5 years and found that most times, it was just a lot of venting and not a lot of practical solutions. I feel like Jess and I spend enough energy talking about it and I just don't want to sacrifice any more of the precious time we have together to "boy issues."

I'm not dismissing anything that you or Tapu offered - really. You have no idea that just someone else heard me means so very much and I appreciate it. I know Jess does too.

Thanks again to you both -

Christie

[tapu]

Hey, does he have a therapist or a life coach or some kind of social worker? His having one might take some of the stress off you guys. But also, what about a family counselor. Confront him with the problems in front of someone else. A therapist might have good ideas for "enforcement" or "pay-off" or whatever....

If you've already tried that, might be time to try different one. (I like "mixing it up" with therapists every few years. It's all so different.)