(Re)Building the trust...

[Bubala]

Trust is everything... How is it built? How is it broken? Can it be rebuilt once it's broken? What if the trust is not broken but rather just lost... Can it be found, can it be rebuilt again?

[~ocean]

In my own opinion, I think its never lost ~ takes years to rebuild that trust providing it won't be re-tarnished. I live w/ re-tarnished trust. I look at my ex apprehensively in all factors when I deal w/ hym . Best described as "I love you as a person , but theres a wall ~

[Bubala]

Originally Posted by ~ocean

In my own opinion, I think its never lost ~ takes years to rebuild that trust providing it won't be re-tarnished. I live w/ re-tarnished trust. I look at my ex apprehensively in all factors when I deal w/ hym . Best described as "I love you as a person , but theres a wall ~

Thank you for the response. I understand the wall you talk about.

My spouse and I are trying to work trough a major breakdown... The worst part is that no one did anything to break the trust, no cheating, no lies... In our case I do not think the trust we once had was broken...it was simply lost...

As his walls grew higher and colder... I built mine...heavily pressurized well hidden storage of hurt and resentment. Now hy can do everything right, but I won't be able to take it for what it is without my own cold hard skepticism, and mistrust that's eating at everything that we've got and everything we are...

Broken trust can be repaired somehow... lost trust on the other hand comes with the added weight... Is there hope?

Damn butches... Why can't they talk about their feelings!? We know you got some! Why the walls always the walls... I hate walls..... lol

[Blade]

For me I guess it depends on how that trust is broken. I don't give trust instantly, and don't expect to be given it instantly. I believe in building a strong foundation, and working from there. If there is a crack in you're foundation or any level above that, it requires repair to move forward. If it can't be repaired or isn't worth the work, and the trust will never be restored. It's best to move on.

Great topic!

[Bubala]

Originally Posted by Blade

For me I guess it depends on how that trust is broken. I don't give trust instantly, and don't expect to be given it instantly. I believe in building a strong foundation, and working from there. If there is a crack in you're foundation or any level above that, it requires repair to move forward. If it can't be repaired or isn't worth the work, and the trust will never be restored. It's best to move on.

Great topic!

Thank you.

Broken trust can be repaired...but in most cases it can never be the same. In best conditions it is never fully repaired but rather patched. Some wounds patch better than others, some patch worse... some don't patch at all...

But what if the trust built well was never broken... just lost... faded away... Could it ever be found... is it worth searching for...?

[Gemme]

Using Blade's analogy of a cracked foundation, any weak spot is always going to be a weak spot, even if it's repaired well. Trust can, in situations where all parties are genuinely and fully invested, be repaired but it cannot be replaced or ever exactly as it was.

What can take milliseconds to destroy can take years to rebuild. It's possible though, as most things are.

[Cin]

Originally Posted by Lorelai

My spouse and I are trying to work trough a major breakdown... The worst part is that no one did anything to break the trust, no cheating, no lies... In our case I do not think the trust we once had was broken...it was simply lost...

As his walls grew higher and colder... I built mine...heavily pressurized well hidden storage of hurt and resentment. Now hy can do everything right, but I won't be able to take it for what it is without my own cold hard skepticism, and mistrust that's eating at everything that we've got and everything we are...

Broken trust can be repaired somehow... lost trust on the other hand comes with the added weight... Is there hope?

I'm trying to understand the difference between broken trust and lost trust. By lost trust do you mean that no one broke trust by cheating or lying but instead trust just faded because the expectation of how you would love each other, how you would share your lives was not met. You believed that there would be sharing and a connection but instead there were walls and separation. Does lost trust mean not being able to believe in the person any longer because they are not who you thought they were or are not behaving in the relationship in the way that you were led to believe that they would? Is that the idea or is it something else?

[kittygrrl]

it depends on the two people involved and if they want to badly enough..if that's true, then together you will take the careful steps necessary to bringing wellness, peace and love back from the abyss..

[~ocean]

would a marriage councilor help ? reassurance maybe ? built up defensive walls ~ when u both get over this ~ ur gonna hear fireworks ! after Christmas sales are perfect for purchases ~ just saying

[Bubala]

Originally Posted by ~ocean

would a marriage councilor help ? reassurance maybe ? built up defensive walls ~ when u both get over this ~ ur gonna hear fireworks ! after Christmas sales are perfect for purchases ~ just saying

Lol ~ocean

[imperfect_cupcake]

I personally can't imagine trying to work through something like that without a couples councelour. I've gotten a coule Relate books on rebuilding trust in relationships and have found them incredibly useful on my own - Relate books aren't flakey worded or fully of California speak or have inspirational quotes in them, just very practical advice and homework. However, if I was trying to do that with a partner, I'd want to see someone who knows how to guide the process along and give us both work to do - a neutral third party that has expertise in the area.

Every time I have asked a partner to go, they have refused. So I went on my own. They did nothing and expected me to do all the work after that point. So I think if some refused again, that would be the end of it.

I'm pretty bad with expressing how I feel. My Butch partners have usually been better at it than I am. We are all individuals, even butches

[RockOn]

Trust is a major issue with me. Today, I cannot imagine opening my soul up again to a woman. I am happy being single. I have never been one to have to be in a relationship in order to be complete or feel good about me. I was usually in a relationship from the time I came out at 20 years old. After a break-up, I always needed some time (maybe a year or so) before I jumped back in.The last almost 12 years now really hurt me to the core. Maybe I will venture out again and get hooked up when I am 80. LOL! Until then, I have my dogs and I love them more than anything in the universe. Job is good and outside work, I enjoy staying busy with my wood and gadgie projects. There are so any things I want to make. Keeps my mind occupied and excited thinking about them. I am really just a nerd. Heh Heh!

[Shay McGee]

Every time I have had my trust broken an imprint is left, that can never be erased. Only a portion of what was before can ever be brought back. I usually stick my neck out there and have those hard conversations. I really respect people who will reach out, with the intention of repairing trust.

[*Anya*]

Trust has two meanings for me when we are talking monogamy. I fell in love wth my long-term ex and both of us agreed to monogamy. In retrospect, I think it was a more important value of mine, then hers. Then, out of the blue, my ex cheated. The sense of betrayal was so profound (no one had ever cheated on me-or that I had ever known about).

The first time she cheated was what you may be calling broken trust. Instead of breaking up, because I loved her and because I got a lot of tears and promises of "I'll never, ever do it again". I worked really hard on rebuilding that with her. I had a mantra of forgiveness in my brain 100 times a day.

Just as a tiny bit of trust was being rebuilt, she fucking did it again. Trust gone, never to be seen in regards to her again and it never will be again. We are now no more, 19 years of partnership and love down the drain.

Current partner made vow of faithfulness and I have total trust with her. Monogamy is just as an important value to her, as it is to me. If my trust were ever to shatter with her, there would be no rebuilding. The betrayal would be too deep.

[Cin]

Originally Posted by Lorelai

Broken trust can be repaired somehow... lost trust on the other hand comes with the added weight... Is there hope?

I agree with what everyone is saying here about when trust is broken and the struggle to repair it, but the OP is talking about lost trust. She has mentioned nobody cheated or lied but instead the trust was lost. She responded more than once saying that the trust was not broken, but instead it was lost. I am certain she is not talking about leaving it in her other pants or accidently throwing it in the trash. Does she mean misplaced trust, which conjures up a different meaning for me altogether? I understand broken trust but the meaning of lost trust that is not predicated by a betrayal of some kind is not clear at all to me. Perhaps she means a betrayal that is not about lying and cheating? I wish I understood.

[Jane Bond]

Originally Posted by *Anya*

Trust has two meanings for me when we are talking monogamy. I fell in love wth my long-term ex and both of us agreed to monogamy. In retrospect, I think it was a more important value of mine, then hers. Then, out of the blue, my ex cheated. The sense of betrayal was so profound (no one had ever cheated on me-or that I had ever known about).

The first time she cheated was what you may be calling broken trust. Instead of breaking up, because I loved her and because I got a lot of tears and promises of "I'll never, ever do it again". I worked really hard on rebuilding that with her. I had a mantra of forgiveness in my brain 100 times a day.

Just as a tiny bit of trust was being rebuilt, she fucking did it again. Trust gone, never to be seen in regards to her again and it never will be again. We are now no more, 19 years of partnership and love down the drain.

Current partner made vow of faithfulness and I have total trust with her. Monogamy is just as an important value to her, as it is to me. If my trust were ever to shatter with her, there would be no rebuilding. The betrayal would be too deep.

------------------------------------------
Anya, your summation was so easy to relate to my own situation.
I adored my wife, but her first cheating episode battered the trust, but not enough to make me want to leave her, because I loved her and chose to believe her promises that it was an isolated incident that would never occur again.
Still, that one betrayal and the lies she first told to deny it, continued to gnaw at my heart and abrade the trust.
Love may be the bricks of a relationship, but I have come to believe that loyalty and trust are the mortar that hold the bricks together.
Lies and betrayal from the first affair cast aspersions on her every word and deed after the affair was discovered. I hated feeling that way, but she seemed so much sneakier now.
I started suspecting her with each new muffled phone call, taken into the next room, text message she erased upon reading, and other behaviors that I never saw (or noticed) before.
Basically. I had cast myself in the role of Private Investigator, and I had lost my constant state of lust for her.
She resented my suspicion and started saying I was being paranoid. I bickered with her because it was hard not to throw her cheating back in her face as justification for my paranoia.

One day, I was cleaning our shared home office space, and I opened a bottom drawer in her desk to store some random papers of hers. I spied a little packet of baby blue envelopes, rubber banded together and addressed to her workplace address.
Hell yes I opened them, and discovered the whore she was cheating with was still in touch, and still very attached to my wife. When the letters mentioned how lovely recent trysts had been (like nooners at chic local hotels) I folded them up and replaced them in their envelopes.
I carried them upstairs to our bedroom and arranged them neatly under her pilllow. I was reading in bed that night when she came in and got in bed.
She heard the crisp paper envelopes rustling when she laid her head down, and immediately found the collection.
She looked at me with her best sheepish expression and I said, "This isn't baseball where you get three strikes. Get your shit out of the house tomorrow and have your lawyer call mine. And get out of my bed, sleep in the guest room or the couch, or go to your girlfriend's studio apartment and sleep on her futon. I don't care where you sleep as long as it's not with me."
I think once the trust is broken through infidelity, it's only a matter of time before we discover that cheaters lie and liars cheat and this wasn't the first whore and wouldn't be the last.
We vowed before God to be faithful and loyal to each other. She lied to God and me--I chose an insincere egomaniac who was more into the fancy wedding, the dress and the 2 karat rock than she was ever into me.

[JDeere]

Once trust is broken with me, I am done.

I do not trust easily because I ALWAYS end up getting hurt. So once you gain mine, you better keep it, whether friendship or relationship or family member. Yes I don't even trust my own family members at times, that's how far my walls are up.

If I am with someone in a relationship that breaks trust of any kind, BYE FELICIA!

[Bubala]

[imperfect_cupcake]

I'm lucky enough to have had friendships that have lasted 8, 10, 25-35 years and some of those are exes and some are people I used to sleep with on rare occasion while having a friendship. Last New Years people wound up in a big sex pile, I sat that one out and played a phone game and made people sandwiches.
And I've had relationship with my mom that has been really bad at times but was worked on.

During the friendships there have been times when trust has been lost (not broken) and repaired. The friendships are stronger for it because I now trust that no matter what happens, in the very long term my friends and family will stick around. I'm guessing that if I can get that from my friends, there *might* be someone who is willing to put that kind of freedom, patience, work and care into making something romantic last.

Right now it's not important. I'm really happy with where I am and how hard I've worked and the people I've got.

I was willing to work with the betrayal in my marriage because it wasn't just one person "being an asshole". There were extreme and extenuating situations that happened, that were excessively difficult for my partner to cope with, I wasn't able to be the kind of support she needed because of a communication break down that was half my fault, and there I things I could have done differently. I hurt her, unintentionally, when she as quite weak.
I know I have to take some of the blame for e breakdown that led to what happened. So I was willing to accept some of the hurt for her decision. I also felt a lot of empathy for her. I was pissed, and frankly really dispointed at her infantile behaviour, and she did break my trust, but her heart must have been a bit broken itself at that point.

Empathy. Goes a long way in re-establishing trust. Some people don't deserve it, some people do. I made a vow in front of 40 people and a magistrate to stick by her through sickness and health, and to me that ment including mental illness of depression and slipping with booze and making bad choices.

I would still stand by that kind of promise today. I believe in marriage. And I don't think running away at first crisis is what marriage means.

I stuck to it. I made suggestions, bought books, made appointments to therapy. I was willing to forgive. Eventually she made her mind up she didn't want forgiveness, she wanted escapism from the pain in her head. And I feel for her. I'm only just now getting to the point I'm not so angry at her choice. I know she wanted to get away from being poor, not having enough stability, working so fucking hard all the time and never getting a break. Now she has that because she chose someone with money over me in the end. And although it's shit, I also empathize because it was brutal hard, what we we were going through.

And ultimately, I'm ok. I have all that I need. Her choice did not destroy my life though it felt like it for a coule of years. I'm ok. She's ok. We are both doing what we need. I didn't die. And I learned that having the worst thing ever happen to me in a relationship didn't, in fact, kill me.

Look how strong I am. Look at my friends. Look at my new career. It's ok.

I still care for my ex. I still care she's happy. I still love her in a bigger picture kind of way. I don't really want to hang out with her because she actually annoys me now, fall out from what happened, but I definitely want her to be happy and well cared for.

Anyway... I think trusting yourself is a big step to trusting others. I lost a lot of trust in myself. I trust my boundaries and my abilities now. I also trust I won't shrivel up and die every time something doesn't work out or some one hurts me in the process of working something out. That means I can take risks.

Just thinking out loud.

[Jane Bond]

Originally Posted by Shay McGee

Every time I have had my trust broken an imprint is left, that can never be erased. Only a portion of what was before can ever be brought back. I usually stick my neck out there and have those hard conversations. I really respect people who will reach out, with the intention of repairing trust.

It occurred to me that (for me) trust can be broken and repaired among family, friends and romantic partners if it didn't involve betrayal.
For example, if I loan a friend $100 and she promises to pay it back next week, then 6 weeks later I have to ask her about it, then she hems and haws, I might not trust her enough to lend her more money, but I don't see the friendship ending over 100 lousy bucks.

When my heart is involved and a woman with whom I share a commitment, sleeps with or romantically carries on online with someone whose emails and texts she has to delete lest I catch on to her, that's different. That's broken trust, that usually includes lies by omission, denials, jealousy, arguments, promises that may or may not be true, etc. Broken vows IMHO destroy the trust for good.
I have remained friends with most of my exes, but with the ones who cheated it took many years before it stopped mattering to me. I have cheated myself a couple of times (a long time ago) and as I recall, they chose not to remain friends.
I broke up with a very nice woman after a LTR because I had met and fallen for the woman who is now my ex wife. But I broke it off with the ex before I started sleeping with (or even kissed) the one I married, because I respected the ex, and wanted to start the new relationship fully available and single.
The ex was pissed off that I started seeing the new one so soon, but she said at least I never cheated on her. I still felt guilty but I kept that to myself.