It's Time to Boycott Arizona

[Toughy]

laughin...............

please don't make me go off about gun laws............my brain will explode...........

and mind all of you...........I come from a gun toting animal hunting family........funny thing is..........my family believes in wait periods, training, licensing, and regulation of ownership of weapons and are firm believers in the 2nd Amendment.....however none of them believe Obama wants to take our guns and ammo away......not even my brother-in-law's mother, who is a Palin supporter.....

I hope everyone watched Rachael Maddow's special on Tim McVeigh........the true enemy of this country is domestic and not foreign..........

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

Looking forward to more of this bullshit happening, LEGALLY...

How no one can see how this is outright racism I don't know..

Crypt Keeper she is not, he was not real, this scary bitch is... and THAT is worse...

Very scary and this type of person is all around us jumping for joy at AZ's new legislation. And take note at congressional members like John McCain that actually authored federal legislation in the not so distant past that opposses the AZ bill! Oh, yes, that's right, he's up for re-election... in AZ!!! But, it isn't just AZ. How many border states (Mexican border) are going to be pushing for bills just like this one?

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by Toughy

laughin...............

please don't make me go off about gun laws............my brain will explode...........

and mind all of you...........I come from a gun toting animal hunting family........funny thing is..........my family believes in wait periods, training, licensing, and regulation of ownership of weapons and are firm believers in the 2nd Amendment.....however none of them believe Obama wants to take our guns and ammo away......not even my brother-in-law's mother, who is a Palin supporter.....

I hope everyone watched Rachael Maddow's special on Tim McVeigh........the true enemy of this country is domestic and not foreign..........

Yes, saw this special and it really brings your point home!

I have the same kind of background with gun ownership and although I don't own one anymore, I can't think of anyone in my family that thinks Obama want to take guns away either. And, sorry to say, some of them probably support Sarah, too. What you are say here - wait periods, training, licensing, and regulation of ownership of weapons and are firm believers in the 2nd Amendment demonstrates the key differences between the wing-nut zealots and people that are responsible gun owners and are not into stock piling AK-47's, and other assualt weapons, etc.

[apretty]

Originally Posted by Toughy

This kind of racist bullshit masks the real problem. There is more violence around our southern border, more in CA and AZ than NM. Violence caused by drug dealers and human dealers.

i wonder if there is more violence at the border... you hear that a lot, but i wonder, 'more violence' in comparison to who/where? i think it's another way to make *some* white people more fearful, more phobic...

*not denying that there's drugs and human trafficking along *both* sides of the USa/Mexico border (as well as within both of these countries).

[friskyfemme]

Originally Posted by apretty

i wonder if there is more violence at the border... you hear that a lot, but i wonder, 'more violence' in comparison to who/where? i think it's another way to make *some* white people more fearful, more phobic...

*not denying that there's drugs and human trafficking along *both* sides of the USa/Mexico border (as well as within both of these countries).

I have a gf who lives in Phoenix but has family in Nogales(Arizona/Mexico) border. The violence is so bad there that her parents will not visit their relatves in Mexico. The murders, kidnappings, muggings in Mexico are blamed on the 'drug Lords'. The Mexican government appears 'helpless' to arrest and prosecute these 'terrorists'. People are fleeing from there (wouldn't you?). Human trafficers exploit people who fear for their lives and their families lives, to get them out of this terror. Each person pays between $5000 - $10,000 to be smuggled across our borders in vans, pickup trucks, 18=wheelers inside crates and bags. Most of these people are taken to 'drop houses' (sometimes as many of 30 people living there). These people immediately try to get work (general labor -cash). They are required to play approx. $1000 per mth a person to their landlord.
The reason these immigrants coming to the United States is to get established here, send money to their families in Mexico and to get their families across the order legally.

These folks are not 'criminals'. They are REFUGEES! They are fleeing for their lives. If the federal government 'Homeland Security' wants to REALLY protect our southern borders than provide military support to Mexico. Does the US government really think that people
want to leave their homeland? If we help the people of Mexico defeat their 'terrorists' they will want to stay in their homes. Mexico can begin to prosper again.

The cost of this SB1070 to the citizens of will be devasting to our already bleak economy.

I propose this:

The citizens of the United States petition their State Representatives and Senators to send troops to Mexico, to organize a refugee program that willl repay the cost to the federal fund to get the people here and settled during the intervention. Once the 'Mexican terrorists' are defeated the familes will return to their homeland.

The US citizens of the border states should not have to absorb the costs of protecting our country. I definitely OPPOSE the SB1070 bill. Movement is already underway in Arizona to repeal the bill. I do understand the fear of the US families on the border. As you should know by now the government controls it's Citizens by instilling fear. This is a NATIONAL SECURITY issue! The threat is not the people flowing across the borders.

IT IS THE PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES OF THE BORDER THAT ARE EXPLOITING THEM.

I purpose a UNITED NATIONS investment in an INTERNATIONAL CRIMINAL database that tracks 'TRUE CRIMINALS' and information sharing of individuals.

BOYCOTTING AZ is noit going to resolve the ISSUE. If FACT it will only create another 'knee jerk' reaction to a NATIONAL problem. GET INVOLVED in a Productive Solution!

[DapperButch]

Originally Posted by apretty

our friendship ended months ago, she unfriended me on facebook. *real sad face* for questioning her on her lack of college degree, on declaring an official 'day of prayer' to fix the economy, and because i dared ask if the citizens pay for her health care (she wants to sue the feds to exempt az from having health care reform because she's crying poor...).

we're no longer bffs, can't imagine why.

http://content.comicskingdom.net/Tin...0425_large.gif

[apretty]

friskyfemme:

have you read the entire thread?

i'm attending 2 rallies today (gay and straight) for the people against SB 1070.

i think boycotting arizona is just one way that people can get involved.

(prior to living here, i lived 29 years in san diego, ca (2nd generation) --i do have some experience with living in border towns. phoenix isn't even NEAR a border and they blame mexicans for every kind of crime conceivable.)

[friskyfemme]

pretty,

My response was not directed at you. I was only addressing your question of increased violence. There is increased violence in Mexico and in the US border cities. Those responsible for that violence are NOT the individuals fleeing here.
The 'racial profiling' is very much a ISSUE here in Phoenix Metro Area. Our Sheriff Arpaio has been doing this for years. After a federal investigation of racial profiling it continues.

I don't believe BOYCOTTING is the going to be helpful. The 'snowbirds' are leaving within the month and by the time they come back in the winter we will have elected another governor and repealed this SB 1070.

The immigrants that do 'sneak' across the border work to maintain a very low profile. They work for cash 'pennies on the dollar'.

Does the migration cause a strain on border states? Yes it does, but not necessarily for the reasons our government sites. The fact that this State-AZ is controlled by the Republican minority is appalling.

I am only pointing out instead of putting money an effort to round up and incarerate our Mexican neighbors, we need to 'help' them within their own country.

I agree with you about REPEAL of SB 1070. I don't think that most Arizonians and maybe the rest of the country understand the 'REAL' issue of white conservatives that are in CONTROL of the Arizona BIG BUSINESS-including insurance, farming, ranching, and tourism pushing for a Dictatorship through our 'puppet' Governor.

[yourexwife]

I feel for the 30% that don't want anything to do with this whole thing, and have a better opinion about it than the rest of the state.

[apretty]

so, i'll see you at the rally?

i have a really big jan brewer -fascist sign that will be impossible to miss.

-Christine

Originally Posted by friskyfemme

pretty,

My response was not directed at you. I was only addressing your question of increased violence. There is increased violence in Mexico and in the US border cities. Those responsible for that violence are NOT the individuals fleeing here.
The 'racial profiling' is very much a ISSUE here in Phoenix Metro Area. Our Sheriff Arpaio has been doing this for years. After a federal investigation of racial profiling it continues.

I don't believe BOYCOTTING is the going to be helpful. The 'snowbirds' are leaving within the month and by the time they come back in the winter we will have elected another governor and repealed this SB 1070.

The immigrants that do 'sneak' across the border work to maintain a very low profile. They work for cash 'pennies on the dollar'.

Does the migration cause a strain on border states? Yes it does, but not necessarily for the reasons our government sites. The fact that this State-AZ is controlled by the Republican minority is appalling.

I am only pointing out instead of putting money an effort to round up and incarerate our Mexican neighbors, we need to 'help' them within their own country.

I agree with you about REPEAL of SB 1070. I don't think that most Arizonians and maybe the rest of the country understand the 'REAL' issue of white conservatives that are in CONTROL of the Arizona BIG BUSINESS-including insurance, farming, ranching, and tourism pushing for a Dictatorship through our 'puppet' Governor.

[Corkey]

Originally Posted by friskyfemme

I have a gf who lives in Phoenix but has family in Nogales(Arizona/Mexico) border. The violence is so bad there that her parents will not visit their relatves in Mexico. The murders, kidnappings, muggings in Mexico are blamed on the 'drug Lords'. The Mexican government appears 'helpless' to arrest and prosecute these 'terrorists'. People are fleeing from there (wouldn't you?). Human trafficers exploit people who fear for their lives and their families lives, to get them out of this terror. Each person pays between $5000 - $10,000 to be smuggled across our borders in vans, pickup trucks, 18=wheelers inside crates and bags. Most of these people are taken to 'drop houses' (sometimes as many of 30 people living there). These people immediately try to get work (general labor -cash). They are required to play approx. $1000 per mth a person to their landlord.
The reason these immigrants coming to the United States is to get established here, send money to their families in Mexico and to get their families across the order legally.

These folks are not 'criminals'. They are REFUGEES! They are fleeing for their lives. If the federal government 'Homeland Security' wants to REALLY protect our southern borders than provide military support to Mexico. Does the US government really think that people
want to leave their homeland? If we help the people of Mexico defeat their 'terrorists' they will want to stay in their homes. Mexico can begin to prosper again.

The cost of this SB1070 to the citizens of will be devasting to our already bleak economy.

I propose this:

The citizens of the United States petition their State Representatives and Senators to send troops to Mexico, to organize a refugee program that willl repay the cost to the federal fund to get the people here and settled during the intervention. Once the 'Mexican terrorists' are defeated the familes will return to their homeland.

The US citizens of the border states should not have to absorb the costs of protecting our country. I definitely OPPOSE the SB1070 bill. Movement is already underway in Arizona to repeal the bill. I do understand the fear of the US families on the border. As you should know by now the government controls it's Citizens by instilling fear. This is a NATIONAL SECURITY issue! The threat is not the people flowing across the borders.

IT IS THE PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES OF THE BORDER THAT ARE EXPLOITING THEM.

I purpose a UNITED NATIONS investment in an INTERNATIONAL CRIMINAL database that tracks 'TRUE CRIMINALS' and information sharing of individuals.

BOYCOTTING AZ is noit going to resolve the ISSUE. If FACT it will only create another 'knee jerk' reaction to a NATIONAL problem. GET INVOLVED in a Productive Solution!

What you are proposing here is the invasion of Mexico by US troops or by UN troops? Do you think Mexico is willing to abdicate to either party? So we go to war with whom? War isn't the answer, never has been. If the people of the US were to stop paying for drugs that so readily flow over the boarder, then there would be no need for drug lords, and the people of Mexico could have economic stability in their own country.

The highlighted part of your post is what I am concerned with.

[Corkey]

I agree that immigration reform needs to happen, this just isn't the way to go about it.

[Rook]

True, if the U.S. would stop smuggling Drugs, quite a few Countries would have a decent Drop in their Crimes..
No Profit from Drugs = No Cartels...
Not just Mexico though, but also Columbia, Afghanistan, Panama, etc etc...
Although, other "rich" countries, like Netherlands, England, Germany etc etc, also "order" drugs...
And, considering just how easy it is to Buy Guns in the U.S. (and smuggle off the Border), we might also wanna consider figuring that out as well.

Then there's the Pharmaceutical issue, from somewhere the Legal purveyors of Opium have to get their Source, or else we wouldn't have Morphine, Vicodin, Oxycodone etc..
Oh, right, and lets not forget another Profitable Crime in Smuggling...
Exotic Animals {Someone once tried to smuggle a few "big cats" across U.S./Mexican Border}
And Human trafficking...
There's always something to smuggle, and profit from

[leatherfaery]

This bullshit "law" is unconstitutional.


I snipped that because it stood out to me:

SNIP:I propose this:

The citizens of the United States petition their State Representatives and Senators to send troops to Mexico, to organize a refugee program that willl repay the cost to the federal fund to get the people here and settled during the intervention. Once the 'Mexican terrorists' are defeated the familes will return to their homeland. End SNIP



Well then who is going to assist mexico or any other country in sending troops here to help us with our violence problem ? We certainly have a huge one.

Believe it or not there are a lot of Mexican Nationals that want nothing to do with the USA. true story.

[friskyfemme]

I am sorry this is the way I wrote this. It is missing some key words (my dyslexia). I will fill in what I neglected to write.
SNIP:I propose this:

The citizens of the United States petition their State Representatives and Senators to send troops to aid Mexico in defeating the drug cartels , to organize a refugee program that will allow persons from the targeted areas to relocate here temporarily and the Mexican government to repay the cost to the federal fund to get the people here and settled during the intervention. Once the 'Mexican terrorists' are defeated the relocated familes will return to their homeland. End SNIP

I am not suggesting this is THE answer. I do believe in the power of the people. I do believe in humanity wanting to help each other. I don't think Boycotting Arizona is the answer. It will only hurt the underemployed, unpaid majority who is struggling to support themselves and their familes here in AZ and south of our border.

Sincerely, I hope that people do get involved. I look forward to positive resolutions.

[Corkey]

Originally Posted by friskyfemme

I am sorry this is the way I wrote this. It is missing some key words (my dyslexia). I will fill in what I neglected to write.
SNIP:I propose this:

The citizens of the United States petition their State Representatives and Senators to send troops to aid Mexico in defeating the drug cartels , to organize a refugee program that will allow persons from the targeted areas to relocate here temporarily and the Mexican government to repay the cost to the federal fund to get the people here and settled during the intervention. Once the 'Mexican terrorists' are defeated the relocated familes will return to their homeland. End SNIP

I am not suggesting this is THE answer. I do believe in the power of the people. I do believe in humanity wanting to help each other. I don't think Boycotting Arizona is the answer. It will only hurt the underemployed, unpaid majority who is struggling to support themselves and their familes here in AZ and south of our border.

Sincerely, I hope that people do get involved. I look forward to positive resolutions.

Still wont fly, here's why. You by asking congress to send troops, ours, to another country, for whatever reason are asking congress to invade a sovereign country. It isn't constitutional at all. How's this instead...Ask congress to make medical pot legal, get FDA approval for better safer drugs sooner, tell congress to pass sane immerigation legislation that doesn't profile americans already living legally in this country, and is humane in dealing with immigrants who for what ever reason are here without documentation.

ETA: Congress has no power to send troops anywhere, that is the purview of The President. Congress can only declare war, or not.

[Dylan]

I guess we've all forgotten the government pulled this same thing (telling us of all the violence in border towns due to drug 'cartels', immigration, joblessness of Americans, 'Mexicans taking all the good jobs', and all that) way back in the 30s when they were first trying to make pot illegal


Same Tactics,
Dylan

[leatherfaery]

friskyfemme,
I applaud your thoughts on how to deal with this issue although I don't agree, for several reasons. I do think in order to move forward these kinds of conversations need to occur and I appreciated your clarification.

I am still in shock about this and everytime some crap assed idiotic legislation gets barreled through I get alarmed about what will happen next and what groups are going to be the target cuz we ( collective) queers are a dice roll away from shit like this.

Again, thanks for taking the time to clarify.

LF

[Rockinonahigh]

Corkey..we have sent troops many place over the years for way less that whats going on in mexico...look where we are now!! The two wars that the Bush legacy left us in,that we are still fighting and prolly will for a long time yet.Why not help Mexico fight the cartells and other crime thats effecting both our nations.NO,I dont want us in a other war, but we should help some how at least better than we are doing now.I know if my family was in harms way I would be getting out to somewhere safe..wouldnt you?

[Corkey]

Originally Posted by Rockinonahigh

Corkey..we have sent troops many place over the years for way less that whats going on in mexico...look where we are now!! The two wars that the Bush legacy left us in,that we are still fighting and prolly will for a long time yet.Why not help Mexico fight the cartells and other crime thats effecting both our nations.NO,I dont want us in a other war, but we should help some how at least better than we are doing now.I know if my family was in harms way I would be getting out to somewhere safe..wouldnt you?

Hell no, I've been to war. If anyone has any illusions here, we are helping the Mexican government with eradication programs. There is corruption and flat out civil war going on down there. I don't want any of our troops in their war. We already assist their government to catch their drug lords. The elected leaders of Mexico are being killed, that isn't something our troops can stop. Let me be clear. Our troops in Mexico without the direct permission of the Mexican government is an invasion on a sovereign nation. We have enough troubles with our own made up wars we don't need another on our southern boarder. DEA, ICE and other US government agencies are helping the Mexican government, our troops belong at home.
I support legal immigration to the US, and I want to see a humane policy in regards to any nations citizens, that law that the governor signed isn't constitutionally legal, it will be repealed.