2012 US General Election Discussions: Start to Finish

[BrutalDaddy]

I'm just curious Kobi, exactly how is GOProud harming themselves?

Thanks for any clarification you can give.

[Kobi]

Originally Posted by BrutalDyke

I'm just curious Kobi, exactly how is GOProud harming themselves?

Thanks for any clarification you can give.

This group espouses conservative and libertarian principles which they feel will improve the daily lives or gays and lesbians. Lets look at just a few of their tenets:

2 HEALTHCARE REFORM
Repeal of Obamacare; encourage free market healthcare reform. Allow for the purchase of insurance across state lines – expanding access to domestic partner benefits; emphasizing individual ownership of healthcare insurance – such a shift would prevent discriminatory


People forget that it was Mitt Romney who started mandatory health when he was the governor of Massachusetts. All Obama did was impliment the exact same plan on a federal level.

The rational each used was different however. Romney did it because health care providers were complaining about their loss of income in having to treat so many uninsured people. He created a new source of weath for insurance companies and new sources of income for doctors, hospitals etc.

Obama did it to protect those people who didnt have access to or couldnt afford health insurance.

Big difference.



3 SOCIAL SECURITY REFORM
The only way to permanent solvency in the Social Security system is through the creation of inheritable personal savings accounts. Personal savings accounts would give gay and lesbian couples the same opportunity to leave their accounts to their spouses as their straight counterparts.



This is an elitist thing. There are some very wealthy and well to do queer folk but the majority of us are everyday people barely making ends meet. Where will these people get the money to put into a personal savings account?

Inheretance laws are another issue without a federal recongition of gay marriage. How many horror stories have we heard of families of origin stepping in and asserting their rights in inheretances despite wills and trusts and other legal measures queer have used to protect their partners?

Without legal marriages recognized on a federal level, how many queer spouses in states that allow gay marriage are subjected to unfair federal inheretance taxes because their marriage isnt recognized by the federal government - all of them.



6 FIGHTING GLOBAL EXTREMISTS
Standing strong against radical regimes that refuse to recognize the basic human rights of gays and lesbians, women and religious minorities


This is great except the republicans, the moral majority, and Mitt can be considered a radical regime as well for their anti gay stances. How do this improve the lives of queer people? The republicans have been waging a very noticable and very organized war on women - how does this help lesbians?


7 DEFENDING OUR CONSTITUTION
Opposing any anti-gay federal marriage amendment. Marriage should be a question for the states. A federal constitutional amendment on marriage would be an unprecedented federal power grab from the states.



Where would this country be today, if we allowed the states to decide on the abolishment of slavery? Or on the right of women to vote? Not having a federal amendment on gay marriage leaves a great deal of our community vulnerable and at the whim of local politicians and voters.

Our right to marry should not be optional based on local preferences. We should have the same right to marry as any straight person, and as a result, we should have the same benefits and rights afforded to straight folks.

To advocate for less than equality for all is illogical.


Those are just a few examples where GOProud, as a gay organization is advocating for things that are detrimental to gays as a whole.

[*Anya*]

Originally Posted by BrutalDyke

I'm just curious Kobi, exactly how is GOProud harming themselves?

Thanks for any clarification you can give.

If I may also respond, you might look for this outstanding documentary that is chock-full of apparently self-loathing conservative gay Republicans.

"Outrage," a documentary from filmmaker Kirby Dick, takes issue with the secret lives of closeted gay politicians -- especially conservative Republicans who outwardly oppose gay rights.

According to Magnolia Pictures, "Outrage" is an "indictment of the hypocrisy of closeted politicians with appalling gay rights voting records who actively campaign against the LGBTQ community they covertly belong to."

In the documentary, Dick lambastes the mainstream media for not better investigating the politicians' "hypocrisy" and double lives. He told New York magazine that the film explores "the issues surrounding closeted politicians and their hypocrisy in voting anti-gay -- and how these people have harmed millions of Americans for many years."

Marriage equality is only one example of an issue that conservatives vote against. Why would a gay conservative support a party that felt they had no right to legally marry?

[*Anya*]

Bumping this critically important thread.

[Soon]

Cenk Uygur sums it up pretty succinctly for me:

[chefhmboyrd]

I didn't vote last election...

given the choice between two douchebags i chose to abstain...
but this year may be different.

Obama has won me over. I believe he really does care, and is trying to make things better.

...and all hell will break loose if Mitt gets in office. The teabaggers will take as many freedoms and rights as they can, and turn this country over to the 1% once and for all. This isn't just paraniod fears, this is real, and happening before our very eyes.

Also, there are several justices on the Supreme Court who are old an will need to be replaced soon, and I will be damned if we get another scum sucking minion of the robber baron clods appointed to the high court.

lastly, if things don't go well this fall, I may be forced to enter the fray....

message to the Right Wing Immoral Minority:

"Don't make me run for public office mother fuckers..........
you will RUE THE DAY you bunch of greedy wallstreet zombies pissed of this guy!"

[AtLast]

It is critical that Teapublican candidates are not elected and those that are in office, be thrown the hell out. There is much more than the presidential election to get involved with. State and local races matter.

Govenors races are among the most important to take an active role in. Your state and federal Congressional seats matter a whole lot as it is possible (though, pretty damn difficult) for the Dems to take back the House.

And the last thing we need is for the Senate to fall into the hands of a GOP majority.

Here are some links that you can use to get involved. Volunteering a couple of hours per week can and DOES make a difference. Yeah, an old civics teacher calling on the troops to be part of the democratic process- can't help myself.


WOMEN LEAD link- http://www.dccc.org/pages/women_lead
http://democraticgovernors.org/

Here is info about the state (decline) of women Democratic Govenors-http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/20/democratic-women-governors-bev-perdue-christine-gregoire_n_1608808.html


http://www.democrats.org/?nosplash=true


https://my.barackobama.com/page/s/be...ource=Dems_nav

This one has info on all democratic races and ways to volunteer- http://www.dccc.org/

[Miss Scarlett]

The ads!!! OMG make them stop! Especially the ones with sound bites designed to incite and mislead!!! i'm gonna need to replace my remotes because the mute buttons are wearing out!

Oh yeah, thanks to Kate Clinton during the last Presidential election every time i hear something about Romney i giggle because she called him "Mitt, Mitt full of sh#%!" LOL

[Soon]

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by HowSoonIsNow

This is exactly why I wish we would all take a deeper interest in history. This evangelical take-over in the GOP has been going on a very long time. And the "snap" that fueled the fire & brimstone to the core took place during LBJ's presidency and the Dixicrats turning Republican after the passage of the Civil Rights Acts.

Actually... go back to the Civil War. The slogan "The South will rise again" is something to think about when considering the Teavangelicals of today in the GOP.

[AtLast]

http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/2...shore-accounts

[Soon]

[UofMfan]

[Soon]

...based on Romney advisor, Gillespie, who said that Mitt "retroactively retired" from Bain in 1999 despite his involvement (and salary) until 2002.

https://twitter.com/RetroActiveMitt

eg. Retroactive Mitt ‏@RetroActiveMitt
‪#GOP‬ voters want to ‪#retroactively‬ pick a different candidate

Retroactive Mitt ‏@RetroActiveMitt
Just had a cheeseburger for lunch... going to tell my trainer I ‪#retroactively‬ had a salad

[thedivahrrrself]

In other "news"...

[DMW]

[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxfZtNEG1xU"]Which Side Are You On? Natalie Merchant - YouTube[/nomedia]

[*Anya*]

Originally Posted by Soon

Who would have ever thought that Barry Goldwater would sound like a moderate, thoughtful man? (Maybe he always was).

I still remember my parents talking about Barry as so "out there" when I was a kid and they have always been dyed-in-the-wool Republicans!

Of course, now my 88-year-old dad says all the Republicans-including Romney- are "damn fools".

For once, my father and I agree on something.

[mariamma]

Soledad O'Brien schools Sununu on CNN. Wow, this was refreshing, journalist actually working and putting a politician's feet to the fire. Nice job Soledad!

http://www.upworthy.com/cnn-actually...y-ensues?c=la1

[Reader]

Rachel Maddow on msnbc is awesome: Romney proposed that the blind and those with mental retardation should pay a fee (to help balance the budget) when he was in Mass.


http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/06...the-privilege/



Republicans love to play semantics. The 1% are not bloated pigs bleeding the country dry, they’re “job creators.” We’re not empire building when we invade sovereign countries, we’re “spreading democracy.” We’re not raising your taxes, we’re only charging you a “fee.”

While he was governor of Massachusetts, Mitt Romney chose to balance his budget by charging all kinds of “fees” instead of raising taxes. Semantics. But the newsworthy part is who he charged with new “fees” and for what. Business Insider found all sorts of ugly stuff back in January. Why it hasn’t been used is a mystery but there’s still five months to go before election day.


Pay per not view: “It now costs to be blind in Massachusetts. The state’s approximately 35,000 blind and legally blind residents must now pay $10 annually for a certificate of blindness and $15 every four years for a blind identification card. Without the formerly-free documents, blind people cannot take advantage of tax abatements, affordable housing programs, health care services, transportation discounts and other benefits. … The fees originated in February, in Gov. Mitt Romney’s budget proposal for fiscal 2004.” (Shaun Sutner, “Advocates Fight Fees For The Blind,” Telegram & Gazette, 8/5/03)

Sure, it’s only $10 but try charging a rich person $10 extra for a yacht license. “Why are you punishing success?!”

[Soon]

Chronicling Mitt's Mendacity, Vol. XXX