The Debates

[Kobi]

I dont know that I agree on the pundits assessment of the debate. I guess it depends on what factors one is using to determine a winner.

Wardrobe - Romney. Red power tie vs purple subdued tie.

Energy - Obama. Frenetic energy is Romneys forte. Frenetic energy tends to be contagious but it is also used to obscure a message. Frenetic energy makes one appear to be dynamic but it is also indicative of desperation and anxiety.

Obama was his usual controlled, low key self. I dont know about anyone else but I would rather the White House be occupied by someone who exudes stability, constancy, and consistency rather than a whirling dervish of contradictions.

Credibility - Obama. The man inhereted a mess. Yet his message has never waivered. It is the hallmark of an incumbent. Romney has always tailors his message to the audience du jour. It is the hallmark of a contender. Obama has always been true to himself. Romney has always been willing to be whatever anyone needs him to be.

Message - Obama. I may not always agree with him but the man has a vision of the bigger picture, the global picture, which is running the world today. He is the pioneer President who has to deal with the never before known hazards of a meltdown of a global economy. He has had to deal with the USA becoming a partner in rather than the leader of the world. Yet, his humanity and his values have never waivered.

Romney, on the other hand, is stuck on a USA only vision. He is stuck spouting policies and ideals which are outdated; economics which have failed miserably in the past and are the antithesis of what is needed for a global economy; and he is panderer.

Personality - Obama. A global economy and global world require thought, cooperation, negotiation, compromise, and a willingness to tackle the hard stuff that challenges ones own values, beliefs and principles.

Romney, no matter how hard he tries, still comes across as a bull in a china shop, a bully, an intimidator, a steamroller, and a control freak. This will not bode well in a global picture. The USA doesnt have the clout or the money to operate this way.

Humor - Obama. Obama is a master of understated irony and he got his digs in. Made me laugh at his cleverness a few times. I dont think Romney even has a humerus.

Ideas - Obama. The man is very reality based. Is a tough world out there. There are no easy answers. There is no Superman or Superwoman who is going to swoop in with a magical elixir and fix all that ails us and the world.

Romney, as a contender, is still relying on selling the fantasy of what he can and will do. It might sound good to some, it might sound like the right thing cuz he is making it seem so simple and easy. If it was that easy, dont you think someone would have done it by now?

He is stuck in Friedman economics which is famous for making 2 classes of people - the obscenely rich and the obscenely poor; and for requiring the exertion of a great deal of control over the masses.

Not exactly the way the pundits called it.

[Gráinne]

I think I disagree with most of the pundits myself, especially after a good night's sleep. I was very upset with Obama, but today I think I'm coming around.

I thought Romney acted as if he'd had several pots of strong coffee and an entire bottle of No-Doz. He jumped in and interrupted the moderator and the President. I thought he was rude and condescending there.

What some are calling listless and tired, I thought was calm and professional. Obama is never going to be Christie, Mr. Fire. He always has been, and always will be, wonky and subdued. He really hadn't changed that much.

I actually thought Obama was smart not to dig with the 47% or Bain. He was sticking to the big picture, not the sideshows (even those that show Romney's character).

Romney also contradicted himself, and I hope the Obama campaign makes use of his statements.

However, I am afraid that voters not familiar with Romney's record watched last night and liked what they saw; more energy, almost a bullyish attitude that some might want to see in foreign policy.

Romney might have "won", but fortunately this was only the first debate, and that news cycle will probably be long gone two weeks from now, or even by next week. I cannot envision how Ryan will make a better impression than Biden.

[~ocean]

I totaty agree w. u Kobi !! also, Romney's constant interuptions. Romeny had to do something to save his campaign , even if it meant to change his stand lol... Obama looked a tad surprised w. Romeny agreeing w. a few things .. like i said b4 ..

**wipes Romneys mouth on both sides**

[princessbelle]

I am a little calmer today as well. But, i still think that Bain and the 47% should have been addressed as well as many other points about Medicare and SS.

Afterall, Medicare is going to change one way or another and many, many of *us* will be the ones that it changes on. Romney was just a yes man last night IMO.

Being a yes man gets many politicians elected. That has been proven over and over. With no real substance, just saying the right things at the right time.

That's what bothers me more than anything. It was a chance to call him out and let the American people know that he has nothing and no plan to back most everything he spewed out.

Again, i believe the debate was not really what it was meant to be. It was more of a "Romney is saying the right things and Obama is standing there looking down and distracted and letting him".

I do believe the next one will be better. I believe that. I have to believe that.

please oh please

[Reader]

Bam is a brilliant strategist. I am hoping he planned this all to give Mitt a false sense of security and also to give him confidence to shoot his mouth off some more.

Maybe he also wanted to make sure everyone who supported him last time, comes out in big numbers for him again like we did last time.

[Martina]

The strategy was for him to look Presidential. And it backfired, especially as Mitt lied and made him look befuddled.

Strategists admitted as much to Politico. It was a big mistake.

In fact, the debate made the President look vulnerable, the opposite of the intention of the strategy.

The President looks beatable. His base is frustrated and demoralized (I am sure temporarily) while Romney's folks are energized.

[Reader]

Originally Posted by Martina

The strategy was for him to look Presidential. And it backfired, especially as Mitt lied and made him look befuddled.

Strategists admitted as much to Politico. It was a big mistake.

In fact, the debate made the President look vulnerable, the opposite of the intention of the strategy.

The President looks beatable. His base is frustrated and demoralized (I am sure temporarily) while Romney's folks are energized.

I appreciate what you are saying. I was ripping angry last night.

But, I meant more of a medium-range strategy. I think, if it WAS an actual strategic move, we won't see its result for a week or so, until the next 2 debates.

[Reader]

Incidentally, Big Bird has now been replaced by Tweety Bird as Tweety is willing to work for chicken scratch.

[Corkey]

Today there has been a backlash like Obama finally gets it. Robme was being bullish and it showed. Unfortunately most voters don't get the nuances of body language or can tell a lie from spin. I do like what Obama has done today with his speeches.
The President can't do what he did, head down, not look at Robme, not look up from his notes in the next debate. He has to take Robme head on look him directly in the eye and tell him he's a lier.

[Blade]

I wasn't very happy with Obama's debate performance. I didn't think he seemed bored I thought he seemed preoccupied. I mean think about it the Pres. is a busy man with much more on his mind than a debate. Who knows what may have happened yesterday to have caused him to be off his game.

I know many others have mentioned the 47%. If I had that ammunition in my bag of arsenal, I wouldn't use it in the first debate. However I would use it in my last debate. Placement is important. Hopefully in the last debate Obama will toss out a reminder about the 47% comment that Shitty Mitty made and that will be fresh on the minds of voters when they go to the polls. I'll bet the 47% can keep Shitty Mitty out of office. If Obama had mentioned the 47% during this debate...it would give the Romney Camp time to make new commercials to take voters minds off of that comment.

I agree that mediator needs to go back to the rest home.

[BullDog]

Obama gave a good stump speech in Denver today. The frustrating part is why didn't he say a lot of those things last night during the debate.

I expected him to take the presidential route, but not being so passive. To me he appears to be disgusted with Romney and the Republicans with all of their lies and distortions. However, he still has to make his case as to why he should be president for the next four years. Also a big part of being presidential is being in command and appearing strong and decisive.

I watch the electoral college because that is what matters. If Obama's lead in Ohio starts to evaporate I will start sweating bullets. If not, I think he will win. It will be very difficult for Romney to win without Ohio. If Obama wins Ohio and one of the other remaining swing states like Iowa, New Hampshire etc. he is almost certain to win unless something really dramatic happens.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Obama kept calm, perhaps to subdued. He's in a no win situation as a President who isn't white. If he's to confrontational he's the rabid black man if he's to soft he's weak. In my opinion Mittens looked, acted, spoke like he was on a 60oz can of Monster drink, he was pushy, inconsiderate, slobbery and imposing. He danced around, waffled, repeated himself and LIED.

Obama could of been more aggressive but I feel it would of made Mittens more foamy at the mouth. The Moderator SUCKED and it made me cringe when he corrected Obama about his time being up. Mittens Interruptous wasn't spoken to in that manner and that felt icky.

I personally won't expect for Obama to be overly aggressive, it would hurt him since the kooka nuts already paint him as the hateful black Muslim guy.

[The_Lady_Snow]

PS...

We need women Moderators not just ancient white guys, that needs to change as well.

[Reader]

Romney: "The rich are just fine". The one line from last night that sums up his whole platform's reason for being: keeping the rich fine and getting finer.

[Kätzchen]

I wish I could distill into simple sets of information what is on my mind concerning serious debates of this nature, but I am not that skilled yet in doing so. I process information in relatively very slow ways and one of the reasons I am not so good at that yet is because I largely think in abstract terms and ways and it takes me a while to narrow items of consideration down to a point where I can make sense of these sorts of things.

I know who I will be casting my vote for in the upcoming election but aside from that, to me the larger part of the story rests upon extended and ongoing national and international unrest. Not only is it terribly important that the US have a leader who is capable of making reliable executive decision, that takes into consideration the health of our own society, but there needs to be a concentrated effort in demonstrating a capacity to take into consideration the health of other societies and social issues of extreme paramount of importance: For example, the recent markers of global unrest in Libya, Egypt, Syria (Middle East participant societies) and items of unrest residing on the global stage of economic unrest (the Euro affair, etc) - all to say that our own Presidential election issues affect not only us, but others who work cooperatively on a global stage. In my mind, leadership is not a singular act - it is cooperative by design.

To me, this is why - as an observer to the debates or other issues recieving wide media attention - we (the general 'we') may not see items publicly addressed, or items that we feel need public redress, in timely ways; as there might be more at stake than can be given a public accounting for.

(eta: Where was Gwen Eiffel? Does anyone know why she was not appointed to facilitate the debate? I like her style as a facilitator, moderator.)

[Toughy]

Obama must win because of 3 words: The Supreme Court The next President could appoint up to 4 Supreme Court Justices.....Scalia and Kennedy are both 76yrs old and could well step down in the next 4 years. Scalia is the most conservative Justice along with Clarence Thomas (age 64). Kennedy is sometimes a swing vote, but really is a staunch conservative. Ginsberg is 79 and Breyer is 74 and are both staunch progressives and could step down in the next 4 years. We could be fucked big time for at least a generation.

Jim Leher is old and needs to be replaced by Gwen Eiffel. However Gwen is not moderating any of the debates. Website for the debates: http://www.debates.org/

I also have to say it sooooooooooooo sucks that absolutely none of the 3rd party candidates were part of the debate. We need them to hold people's feet to the fire. KPFA and Democracy Now actually had the alternative debate with 3rd party candidates Jill Stein of the Green Party and Rocky Anderson of the Justice Party. After Romney and Obama gave their answers Stein and Anderson answered the same questions. You can listen here: http://www.kpfa.org/archive/id/84853

I think Romney should be called on all his lies from last night and he is being called on it by some papers today....such as Business Week and the Wall Street Journal. It's pretty amazing he just ignored what he has been saying for a year and made up a whole bunch of new stuff. And Obama certainly is taking on ALL the lies today and cracking some pretty good jokes in the process..........

I'm also thinking Obama had his head down because he was talking to himself and saying....don't get mad, don't look at him or you will punch him in his lying face, don't get made, don't get mad........I kinda figure that is his self talk last night.........shrug.............

sleeping on it always gives me perspective.........

[Ciaran]

I don't have a horse in this race (I'm not US so won't be voting) but managed to catch much of the debate in an airport.


From my outside perspective, there's no doubt that Romney came across more impressively than Obama. Obama was too impassive and, for much of it, appeared to lack focus. In addition, his approach seemed slightly more academic which isn't what wins this type of debate. Maybe it comes across as Presidential, I don't know. However, I would want a leader, not a President. Obama didn't come across as a leader.


That said, IMO, it actually worked out well for Obama. Why? Because, in practice, the importance of these debates can be blown out of proportion. Those most interested in the specifics and who watch and take-in these debates from start to finish have typically made up their minds beforehand. The debate doesn't sway them.


Therefore, for someone such as Obama who, despite some US media coverage suggesting that this is a tight race (the international media coverage is very different, recognising Obama's significant lead in key swing states and that's what this election will come down to), is in an extremely strong position, the key objective from last night's debate was to avoid any significant gaffs that could get all of the USA excited and talking about today, outside of the normal election coverage. He avoided any such gaffs so, in my opinion, it worked for him in that nothing significant occurred so as to impact on his lead in the swing states.


That said, if I were American and unemployed / underemployed, I would be worried about both his responses and those of his challenger yesterday evening. Neither would have filled me with any confidence or hope.

[Slater]

Originally Posted by Blade

I know many others have mentioned the 47%. If I had that ammunition in my bag of arsenal, I wouldn't use it in the first debate. However I would use it in my last debate. Placement is important. Hopefully in the last debate Obama will toss out a reminder about the 47% comment that Shitty Mitty made and that will be fresh on the minds of voters when they go to the polls. I'll bet the 47% can keep Shitty Mitty out of office. If Obama had mentioned the 47% during this debate...it would give the Romney Camp time to make new commercials to take voters minds off of that comment.

I agree that mediator needs to go back to the rest home.

He can't really use it in the 3rd debate because that one is about foreign policy not domestic policy. And the middle debate isn't so much a debate as it is a joint town hall meeting. Now he might be hoping that things like the 47% and the tax returns will come up in the town hall debate--and likely they will. Then he can run with it without being the one who brought it up.

[DMW]

If it wasn't clear before, it's clear after watching last night's debates:
fact checkers are critical for future presidential and vice presidential debates.

Please add your name to my SignOn.org petition asking for
unbiased fact checkers at the presidential and vice presidential debates,
so that voters can base their decisions on facts rather than rhetoric.

Sign the Petition!

Dear MoveOn member,

Whenever I see a political ad or hear a politician speak,
I'm (1) angry because I know it is a lie,
(2) confused because I am not sure, or
(3) pleased because I assume that my preferred
candidates are speaking the truth.

Voters must be given the truth before
they can make decisions that are in their own best
interests and that of our country. That's why I
created a petition on SignOn.org to
the Commission on Presidential Debates and
the major TV networks, which says:

Have unbiased fact checkers at the presidential and vice presidential debates so that voters can base their decisions on facts rather than rhetoric.

Click here to sign the petition

http://signon.org/sign/have-fact-che...254741-ULa1YLx

Catch romney in the lies...rehatch the flip floppers words...

[Martina]

This race could be very close. Close elections in the U.S. mean that fraud can make the difference, and we have fraud. Rachel Maddow today had a segment today on Idaho's voter guide, which says, "Bring Your ID and Vote" when there is no voter ID requirement in Idaho. A firm employed by the RNC just got caught turning in fraudulant registration forms in Florida. This is a firm which had destroyed Democratic registration cards in swing states in 04.

In 2000, Gore lost a lot of traction after the debates, and in 04 Kerry got within striking distance after a good showing. They can narrow the race significantly.

I think Romney will get a bounce from this, the bounce he didn't get after the Convention. It will make the race a close one, and that is dangerous in this country because the Republicans are willing to break the law to win elections.

One great quote I heard - can't recall who said it -- went something like Obama's campaign has been doing the work for him while Romney has been doing the work for his campaign. Romney is in there fighting with everything he has. Obama spent last Sunday watching football. It's not encouraging.