Casey Anthony - guilty, or not?

[cinderella]

This case has gotton nationwide, if not worldwide attention. I have been following this case sporatically - both on Nancy Grace & Velez, as well as CNN. It is most purplexing, and distrubing to say the least. There are many arguments on both sides - for the defense, and for the prosecution.

I would like to know what you think, and why. Guilty or not?

[Queerasfck]

Guilt is written all over her face!

Judge McJudgerson here!

[Stitch]

Totally guilty!
Have her stoned to death in public. Then quartered!
They can sell tickets to that too!!!!

The amount of frenzy behind it and people wanting to be in the court room is crazy. This is not a celebrity anything. A very adorable innocent little girl died.

:(

[scootebaby]

This has been discussed between Jo and I a few times,but ends quickly because i tend to look at it from the unpopular view.

I have been following this pretty closely since day 1 of court. I agree she is guilty,but i dont think it was premeditated. I also will be surprised if they find her guilty of 1st degree.

I also think her counsel did better when the prosecution was putting on their case than they did when it was their turn. Baez sounded like a rookie lawyer stumbling,sputtering all over himself during closing arguments.

My final vote--she will be a middle aged woman by time she gets out,but i dont see life or the death penalty.

p.s i see the appeals process being exhausted as well.

[Bella~Vita]

This has been discussed between Jo and I a few times,but ends quickly because i tend to look at it from the unpopular view.

I have been following this pretty closely since day 1 of court. I agree she is guilty,but i dont think it was premeditated. I also will be surprised if they find her guilty of 1st degree.

I also think her counsel did better when the prosecution was putting on their case than they did when it was their turn. Baez sounded like a rookie lawyer stumbling,sputtering all over himself during closing arguments.

My final vote--she will be a middle aged woman by time she gets out,but i dont see life or the death penalty.

p.s i see the appeals process being exhausted as well.

Hey Scoote

I too fall in the same place you're in. I believe you're right. We have not seen the last of this case, I don't believe it was premeditated. There goes more taxpayers money .

[NJFemmie]

Yeah, Baez was too busy "cutting the cheese".
Mason made me feel as if I should stick pencils through my ears.

I don't know whether it was murder or an accident, but I do believe she's guilty.

[UofMfan]

In modern times and developed countries, "stoning" is not an accepted means of punishment, capital or otherwise.

I for one am happy about this. I am also glad I don't live in a country were this or any other form of capital punishment is inflicted.

As whether she is guilty or not, it is not for me to decide. The child is dead, nothing will change that now. Many a child have died, this feeding frenzy is, in my opinion, an indication of people showing poor social skills.

[Andrea]

She feels guilty to me.

I honestly don't know if I were on the jury if I would feel she was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt but there is definitely something wrong with her and her grip on reality.

[Blade]

I agree with Scoote. I do believe she is guilty, but I think it was an accident. She got caught up in the emotions of OMG what did I do and being the efficient liar she is, she just thought she could lie her way out of it.

Did the state actually prove she was guilty of murder 1. No not in my opinion. They did prove some of her other counts.

[JustJo]

I think she's guilty. She may not have intended to kill the child, but it certainly wasn't an "accident" in the sense of drowning in the pool, etc. I believe that 911 would have been called in the case of a true "accident."

Since she could never explain where her daughter was during all of her partying, then I tend to think she was knocking her out and leaving her in the car. Chances are, the poor child died there...and Casey, being who she is, thought it was better to try to lie her way out rather than admit what she had been doing.

It's sickening. Casey cries for herself, but not her child. The whole thing is a media circus. A family is destroyed. And how much money will be spent on this trial and the appeal that will no doubt follow....not to mention keeping her in prison for a good chunk of her life?

Meanwhile...an innocent, beautiful little girl is dead. I have known too many women who wanted a child, and couldn't have one, who would have gladly given everything they had to treasure and raise such an adorable little one. While Casey parties it up...knowing her daughter is at least missing and (I believe she knew) dead.

It's heartbreaking.

[cinderella]

I am reading all the posts with great interest. People have become very passionate about this. When the death of an innocent little child is involved, we tend to want to draw blood - at least I feel that way, so the 'frenzy' is well understood by me. I have always been passionate about injustice, and seeking revenge - an eye for an eye, has always been my motto. But as I get older - and hopefully wiser - I realize that an eye for an eye makes the world blind, and, as someone posted above, the child is dead. Further executions will not bring her back, but it rips me that Casey may walk - at the very least, she should spend the rest of her life in jail. What more punishment for someone who puts so much store by her freedom to party!!

When I first started to watch this case, I felt - without a shadow of a doubt - that she was guilty as sin. I looked at that expressionless face, and saw a parade of a multitude of criminals that have come & gone that have done horrific things without a grain of remorse. However, as time has gone by, and so many things have surfaced, ie, alleged sexual molestation of Casey by her father - I can now understand that stone face. Somehow, she had desensitized herself from all emotion. But how a woman can be so unemotional about her little girl, is way beyond my comprehension on all levels.

My personal opinion of her guilt? At this juncture, I think she is responsible for her daughter's death. But now I'm doubting that it was intentional, altho those searches online for making chlorophorm, is enough to create doubt...

[scootebaby]

before i make my post,i want to put a disclaimer out there...i in no way condone anything Casey may or may not have done. i am trying to think outside the box,and look at ALL angles. Do i think she was responsible for Caylees death--YES!! were there factors that came into play long before this beatiful childs death..Absolutely! with that said on to my post....

As for the cholorform--Somehow Casey found/heard that it was good for knocking people out...i think her purpose for searching was to see how much would be needed and where to find it. I think,as my sweetie said,that she used it to knock Caylee out when she didnt have a babysitter so she could go out and party.

1).IMHO, a liar as skilled as Casey (or any person for that matter) is NOT born that way. I strongly believe lying is a learned/taught behavior.

2). I do believe there is a lot that went on in that whole family dynamic that we will never know,but served as a catalyst that led her down the path she eventually ended up on.

3). Casey did not-for whatever reason-understand the extent of damage her actions leading up to Caylees death or the months leading up to the discovery. Again i think this is a direct result of something that happened to her--or something she was taught somehow.
i liken her behavior to that of a child who just broke his moms expensive,rare vase,and knows he will get in trouble if she finds out....im still not saying it is right,but it does explain somewhat her actions.

Personally,i can somewhat relate to what years of sexual,emotional,physical abuse can do to ones pysche..their outlook...without someone to talk to,and depending on severity of abuse i can only imagine how screwed up a person can become.

I could never imagine doing anything that could harm my child--especially cause his death but 1) as i look back over my life with him i now see that i probably have--driving too fast,being in wrong place with wrong people etc and 2) i cant go into since this isnt in the Red Zone and is open to the whole wide world to read,but suffice to say i can relate somewhat to rationalizing things that most ppl couldnt understand.

hopefully i made sense and didnt ramble too much :rrose:

[Andrew, Jr.]

I think Casey is guilty of being negligent of Caylee and the other 5 counts against her dealing with lying to the police, FBI, and so on. As for murder, I am on the fence. I think Casey was using the Cloriform long before Caylee died. I think she od-ed Caylee on the Cloriform in order to go out with her b/f. Something happened this time, and she killed her child. She should have just gone right to the police, hospital, aunt, uncle, brother - Lee, just someone.

Casey threw her family under the tires of the industrial trucks. Her parents had no involvement with this.

I also think Casey needs some sort of mental health help. It will be interesting to listen to the 3 therapists tell the court how they found her sane.

I think the jury picked a foreperson, and made decisions on the first counts already. I am sure they are tired of the case already. I just cannot imagine being sequestered this long.

[Scorp]

GUILTY AS SIN AND A MANIPULATIVE LITTLE FUCKER. Cold fish and NO emotion trying to work the system. She needs to go to Hollywood because she's quite the performer.

For someone so distraught over this, she sure the fuck knew how to go out and party with her friends and celebrate. That alone is fucked up and has "guilt" written all over it.

Oh, and lets not forget about her reference to "Zanny" (aka Xanax) The Nanny. When asked by her mother where Cali was prior to her disappearance. God knows how many times she's drugged that kid because she was a nuisance (in her eyes).

So much shit is being covered up and everyone needs to pay the fuckin' price as far as I'm concerned. Moreso her...

I HOPE SHE ROTS AND BURNS IN HELL FOR AN ETERNITY....

[scootebaby]

Heres a question/thought....if there was no Zanny why did Caylee actually tell her grandma she went to Zannys? Does noone remember that little snippet? she was 2..unable to lie to that degree so there HAD to be someone she identified as Zanny.

i mean if u watch Cindy Anthonys testimony and earlier tv appearances she discusses the fact she talked to Caylee about this.

[little_ms_sunshyne]

I think that Casey Anthony's actions make it hard to not believe she is guilty. However, the state has to prove that she is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Much like many others, I do not believe the state has done a great job of doing so. Everthing is circumstantial.

In regards to this turning into a circus....One of my very best friends lost her grandparents a few years back. They were murdered. The media made a circus of that case as well. I remember how hard it was for her to even turn on the television. Channel after channel..that is all she saw. Images of her grandparents being taken away in body bags and detailed descriptions of how they were murdered. She felt as if though she could not escape from the nightmare, not even in her own home.

I am guilty of following the case and being interested legality and forensics aspect of it. But I do hope that these families are able to find closure and that they may be able to finally mourn the loss of this little girl.

Anyhow, that is my two cents worth of nothing.

[NJFemmie]

Heres a question/thought....if there was no Zanny why did Caylee actually tell her grandma she went to Zannys? Does noone remember that little snippet? she was 2..unable to lie to that degree so there HAD to be someone she identified as Zanny.

i mean if u watch Cindy Anthonys testimony and earlier tv appearances she discusses the fact she talked to Caylee about this.

2 year olds can lie. 2 year olds can also be coached.
What was interesting in this case was that EVERYONE was found to be some sort of liar. Cindy may be up for perjury charges. I mean, it's hard to believe ANYONE in this case, including the guy who found the body.

[JustJo]

I think that Casey Anthony's actions make it hard to not believe she is guilty. However, the state has to prove that she is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Much like many others, I do not believe the state has done a great job of doing so. Everthing is circumstantial.



You're right...it is all circumstantial, but people are convicted on circumstantial evidence all the time.

I doubt that they'll recommend the death penalty. I think they would have wanted more hard evidence in order to do that.

My guess is that she'll get convicted, and a very long sentence. And I'd further guess that her life is not going to be easy in prison either.

I feel for your friend whose grandparents were murdered. I know that the media has the right (and even the responsibility) to report what's going on, but I often wonder if they even give a thought to the family of the victim in those situations. How horrible for your friend to be bombarded with those images of people she loved.

[AtLast]

I don't think her defense attorney represented her well overall. From the start, I have felt he was in it to make a name. A very arrogant person- which I think hurts in a jury believing she is not guilty. He did not pull together many of his opening argument "theories" well at all. And due to Casey's continued lying and bizarre stories and behavior, I don't think the jury will buy any of his assertions, mainly based on not liking him.

The feuding between her attorney and the lead prosecutor was shameful in terms of how it could influence a jury. Almost felt like mal-practice at time- for both of them. If she is convicted, it wouldn’t surprise me at all if she won a new trial on appeal because of some of the actions between attorneys during this trial. The judge seemed pretty disgusted with the lack of professionalism that went on at times. I don’t blame him- this is a capital murder case. And I do believe that all defendants deserve fair representation.

It is a circumstantial case but she is a very disturbed young woman and the whole Anthony family seems very dysfunctional. However, I do think she is responsible for her daughter's death. If it was accidental, my bet would be through Casey's negligence. If anyone was not ready to have a child, she wasn't- nor did she have good parenting herself. This family just strikes me as a mess in general.

It could have been an accidental death, but not as her lawyer proposed with her father as part of a cover-up. I think that if this were true, it would have come out in the investigation. I do not believe she was sexually abused by him or her brother and that is saying a lot because I spent a great many years working in child sexual abuse. Actually, I was angered by the defense's use of "planting" this as a way to demonstrate reasonable doubt.- this isn’t something to use as he did- far too many people are sexually abused. But, I can see that this child's death could have been accidental (unrelated to the pool drowning story and abuse allegations. and that Casey's dysfunctional and personality disorders prevented her from doing the rational thing- calling the authorities and explaining exactly what happened.

My guess is that she is convicted, but maybe not on first degree murder. The whole damn thing is just tragic.

[JustJo]

It could have been an accidental death, but not as her lawyer proposed with her father as part of a cover-up. I think that if this were true, it would have come out in the investigation.

I agree. I can't see a retired police officer doing anything to cover up a truly accidental death. That doesn't make any kind of sense.

Even if Casey was negligent and it resulted in a truly accidental death, her father (as a retired cop) would know that people aren't generally held responsible for that...and I believe he would have reported it.

Yes, I think the whole family is an amazingly sad dysfunctional unit...with Casey a pathological liar, and her family enabling it for years...and, apparently, doing some lying of their own as well.

The critical piece for me, if I was sitting on that jury, is her actions in the 31 days when her child was "missing." For me, that spells guilt. Maybe I'm close-minded or whatever....but I once lost track of my son when he was 2-1/2, in the Borders bookstore at the mall (he liked to play hide and seek and I didn't realize he was "playing" with me at that moment)...and I was a screaming banshee of a wreck within about 2 minutes flat.

More importantly, when my son finally popped up and said "boo mommy" and laughed....and I started breathing normally again...I apologized to everyone I had alarmed in the immediate area of the store. And every single one of them reacted with something along the lines of "oh no, I would be freaked out too, you're fine."

Everyone understands a mom whose child is missing and who is freaked out, screaming for help, calling the cops, losing her mind.

How does a parent not report a missing 2 or 3 year old for over a month?

And how does that parent go party, dance, drink and get a tattoo that reads "Bella Vita" while they believe their toddler is missing?

I know that the defense tried to paint that as her dysfunctional form of grief....but I just don't buy it.

[NJFemmie]

1).IMHO, a liar as skilled as Casey (or any person for that matter) is NOT born that way. I strongly believe lying is a learned/taught behavior.



This might be getting a little off track, but I don't believe lying is learned if associated with a personality disorder - such as a narcissistic personality disorder. Pathological liars don't even know they are lying because they believe everything they come up with. One major exhibition of this is whenever she was questioned about Caylee, she became extremely agitated and shifted the attention back to her "victimization".

Look at Diane Downs, who shot her three children. Even after her surviving daughter called her out on the stand, she still to this day proclaims her innocence. IMHO, Casey exhibits a close psychological resemblance.

ETA: Downs also alleged that her father sexually abused and molested her. Hmm, go figure.

[cinderella]

Woody, I agree with what you've said here. You're prob right about having used choriform for a while, and this one time it backfired.

The analogy Scoote made above - about breaking a precious object, and being scrared to death over it, is a good one. What, (as children) would most of us do in that situation? I know I would try to hide the fragments of the broken object, then act as if nothing had happened - and that's exactly what I think Casey did - she broke it (the child), then tried to hide her crime. In doing so, however, I think she had to have had help - I can't see her taking the body into the woods, digging a hole, and burying it all by herself - someone else had to be involved...the boyfriend, a family member.


I think Casey is guilty of being negligent of Caylee and the other 5 counts against her dealing with lying to the police, FBI, and so on. As for murder, I am on the fence. I think Casey was using the Cloriform long before Caylee died. I think she od-ed Caylee on the Cloriform in order to go out with her b/f. Something happened this time, and she killed her child. She should have just gone right to the police, hospital, aunt, uncle, brother - Lee, just someone.

Casey threw her family under the tires of the industrial trucks. Her parents had no involvement with this.

I also think Casey needs some sort of mental health help. It will be interesting to listen to the 3 therapists tell the court how they found her sane.

I think the jury picked a foreperson, and made decisions on the first counts already. I am sure they are tired of the case already. I just cannot imagine being sequestered this long.

[cinderella]

Keep in mind that Casey's mother, Cindy, lied about doing an online search for chloroform, to protect her daughter. Why wouldn't she lie about Caylee's 'Zanny' story?

This woman is torn - she lost her grandchild, and now she may lose her daughter as well. She wants justice for her grandchild, but if she knows that Casey is responsible for Caylee's death, she fears compromising her daughter, and at the same time knows she must be punished. It is a hellish situation to be in - no wonder she broke down on the witness stand!

Heres a question/thought....if there was no Zanny why did Caylee actually tell her grandma she went to Zannys? Does noone remember that little snippet? she was 2..unable to lie to that degree so there HAD to be someone she identified as Zanny.

i mean if u watch Cindy Anthonys testimony and earlier tv appearances she discusses the fact she talked to Caylee about this.

[JustJo]

Woody, I agree with what you've said here. You're prob right about having used choriform for a while, and this one time it backfired. The analogy Scoote made above - about breaking a precious object, and being scrared to death over it, is a good one. What, in my opionion, would most of us do in that situation? I know I would try to hide the fragments of the broken object, then act as if nothing had happened - and that's exactly what I think Casey did - she broked it (the child), then tried to hind her crime. In doing so, however, I think she had to have had help - I can't see her taking the body into the woods, digging a hold, and burying it, all by herself - someone else had to be involved...the boyfriend, a family member?


I think she could.

Honestly, this trial has been pretty mind-blowing for me to watch...because, having grown up with a narcissist, an awful lot of it felt familiar.

I've heard a lot of people say Casey is a sociopath. I'm not sure if she is (not being a mental health professional and never having met the woman), but she sure feels like a narcissist to me.

The videos and phone calls from jail....when everything is about her...what she wants, how she's being victimized, no one understands her....her, her, her. It's as if her child is an afterthought...not the important part of all this. For Casey, the tragedy is not that Caylee is dead...the tragedy is what's happened to her...how she's been victimized.

Her tears in court....seemingly feigned, or at least very minor, when talking about Caylee....real and visceral when they're talking about her.

Narcissists can love their children (and other people), but it's a weird, twisted kind of love that exists only so long as the other reflects well on them or meets their needs...and can be shut down in an instant when the other becomes a liability or an inconvenience.

I kept flashing back to sitting across a table from my mother, as a young adult in college, having a cup of tea and listen to her calmly discussing how she had frequently thought and fantasized about killing my sister and I, and then herself....but then saying that she didn't really want to kill herself...she wanted to live and be single and not a mother...and she didn't know how she could kill us and get away with it....so she just did "what she had to do"...and kind of started thinking of us as roommates that she couldn't kick out instead.

And then she laughed...in genuine amusement at her own cleverness.

Don't underestimate what narcissists can rationalize, and do, when it suits their own needs.

Having said that....I believe that narcissists can be made. I also believe that the children of narcissists can either become enablers/targets of narcissists...or narcissists themselves. I do the one; my sister does the other. I struggle not to attach to and enable narcissists. My sister rationalized dumping her daughter at age 5, her son at age 13, admittedly on their father (thank goodness) and rarely seeing or thinking about them again...and will tell you with a straight face that she's a good mother who "delighted in raising her kids" (her words). She can say it with a straight face because she believes it herself.

I believe that Casey may very well have been abused, molested, victimized in her own family of origin. She may have had a hellish life that we don't know about. I'll give her that benefit of the doubt.

I just don't think that's an excuse for what she did.

[cinderella]

Ms Sunshyne, whether we agree or not, EVERYONE'S opinion counts as far as I'm concerned. Thank you for your posts, please continue telling us what's on your mind - I for one, am interested in knowing.

I think that Casey Anthony's actions make it hard to not believe she is guilty. However, the state has to prove that she is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Much like many others, I do not believe the state has done a great job of doing so. Everthing is circumstantial.

In regards to this turning into a circus....One of my very best friends lost her grandparents a few years back. They were murdered. The media made a circus of that case as well. I remember how hard it was for her to even turn on the television. Channel after channel..that is all she saw. Images of her grandparents being taken away in body bags and detailed descriptions of how they were murdered. She felt as if though she could not escape from the nightmare, not even in her own home.

I am guilty of following the case and being interested legality and forensics aspect of it. But I do hope that these families are able to find closure and that they may be able to finally mourn the loss of this little girl.

Anyhow, that is my two cents worth of nothing.

[cinderella]

I am in total agreement with what you've said here. Very well thought out and sensible. You should've been a lawyer!

The part you posted about what Casey was doing while her child was supposedly missing, is key. I've never had children, but judging from the way my mom was with us 3 kids, and how she protected us with the ferocity of a lioness with her cubs...I can well understand how a mother feels if her child is missing - even for a second! So yeah, Casey's behavior during those 31 days is just not right - how could any mother do that??!! It is very telling of her guilt!

I agree. I can't see a retired police officer doing anything to cover up a truly accidental death. That doesn't make any kind of sense.

Even if Casey was negligent and it resulted in a truly accidental death, her father (as a retired cop) would know that people aren't generally held responsible for that...and I believe he would have reported it.

Yes, I think the whole family is an amazingly sad dysfunctional unit...with Casey a pathological liar, and her family enabling it for years...and, apparently, doing some lying of their own as well.

The critical piece for me, if I was sitting on that jury, is her actions in the 31 days when her child was "missing." For me, that spells guilt. Maybe I'm close-minded or whatever....but I once lost track of my son when he was 2-1/2, in the Borders bookstore at the mall (he liked to play hide and seek and I didn't realize he was "playing" with me at that moment)...and I was a screaming banshee of a wreck within about 2 minutes flat.

More importantly, when my son finally popped up and said "boo mommy" and laughed....and I started breathing normally again...I apologized to everyone I had alarmed in the immediate area of the store. And every single one of them reacted with something along the lines of "oh no, I would be freaked out too, you're fine."

Everyone understands a mom whose child is missing and who is freaked out, screaming for help, calling the cops, losing her mind.

How does a parent not report a missing 2 or 3 year old for over a month?

And how does that parent go party, dance, drink and get a tattoo that reads "Bella Vita" while they believe their toddler is missing?

I know that the defense tried to paint that as her dysfunctional form of grief....but I just don't buy it.

[Medusa]

I havne't been watching the case but I have caught a few random clips here and there.

Can someone tell me what the discussion or line of questioning was about how Caylee's body got to the woods? Did the prosecution claim that Casey put it there? What did the defense claim?

Did I read somewhere that the defense claimed that the Dad put it in the woods?

I didnt watch closing arguments but I would have heavily stressed that Casey partied for 31 solid days as her child's body lay decaying in the woods. I probably would have juxtaposed photos of Casey in the "Hot Body" contest with photos of Caylee's corpse.

[NJFemmie]

That is the mystery. It's claimed that the body was stashed in the trunk of Casey's car before it was placed in the woods.

The prosecution has maintained Casey put her daughter Caylee's body in the trunk of her Pontiac Sunfire before hiding it in the woods.


Anthony's attorneys have said Casey's father George Anthony helped her dispose of the girl's body. Then later, a meter reader moved the body into the woods.

[Medusa]

That is the mystery. It's claimed that the body was stashed in the trunk of Casey's car before it was placed in the woods.

The prosecution has maintained Casey put her daughter Caylee's body in the trunk of her Pontiac Sunfire before hiding it in the woods.


Anthony's attorneys have said Casey's father George Anthony helped her dispose of the girl's body. Then later, a meter reader moved the body into the woods.


Oh interesting! They are claiming that a meter reader moved the body? Did the prosecution ever shred that or offer motive as to why somoene would move a body?

To me, it's important to know how her body got to the woods and who put it there. And wasn't that wooded area pretty close to the Anthony home?

[NJFemmie]

Oh interesting! They are claiming that a meter reader moved the body? Did the prosecution ever shred that or offer motive as to why somoene would move a body?

To me, it's important to know how her body got to the woods and who put it there. And wasn't that wooded area pretty close to the Anthony home?

Prosecution did try and debunk any theories that defense tried to impose. But what I don't get is, why did Kronk's (?) wait four (?) months to FINALLY get someone to uncover the body ... especially when he knew it was a body four months beforehand....?? And yes, the body was found about 1/4 mile away from the Anthony home - very near the roadside in fact. It wasn't like it was buried deep in the woods.

Ashton acknowledged that the state chose not to call Roy Kronk, the man who found the remains, as a witness, and he suggested that was because Kronk’s story cannot be trusted. “Roy likes to spin a good yarn,” he said. What Kronk claimed happened on December 11, 2008, including the skull rolling out of the bag when he picked it up, was impossible, he claimed.
He also said that he did not believe Kronk just happened upon the location for a second time four months after he called police about it in August. Instead, he suggested that Kronk revealed the location when he did to impress his son, who he had recently reconnected with and who testified that Kronk told him he knew where the remains were in November 2008.
Even if parts of Kronk’s story cannot be believed, Ashton said, that does not make him the morally bankrupt individual the defense portrayed him as. It did not make him someone “who would take a little girl’s skull home and play with it.”

[iamkeri1]

When her Dad died when she was 15, my daughter rarely showed her grief. I was with her whenever she was not in school, and she was very stoic about it. "People do not need to know how I feel, There is nothing they can do about it. I cry when I am alone in my room at night. People will use it against me. You can't trust people. If they know I am weak they will use it against me." were things she said to me.

Casey Anthony is not a very likeable person. We don't like the way she focuses on herself rather than her daughter. This means 1) she is disfunctional OR 2) she is grieving away from the cameras. All evidence against her is circumstantial. I don't have an opinion as to whether or not she is guilty. I do not believe that the state has made their case. I believe that if she is convicted, it will be more because she is disliked than because of proof of guilt.

Smooches,
Keri

[NJFemmie]

Murderers have been convicted on circumstantial evidence before. Scott Peterson was one of them.

What makes Casey so "unlikeable" (IMO) is her excessive lying. The story keeps changing. Come to find out Zanny isn't even a real person. Now, instead of the supposed kidnapping, Caylee drowned. George did it, because George allegedly molested her. But George was the only person Casey wanted to see face to face while in prison (it's on tape).

She parties for the month after her daughter goes missing. She gets that tattoo.

Does this make a likeable person? Not so much. But, it is at her own doing. She CAN step up and tell the truth.

[Medusa]

NJ - You touched on something that has been orbiting for me in this case.

I don't have kids and don't even really like them so I often don't have warm fuzzies around things involving children than other people might. I do, however, get really pissed off/sad when I think about a small child being dead and her body laying out in the woods decaying and alone. If I were on that jury, I would ask myself if, as a Mother, I could go on about my life knowing that my child's body was decaying somewhere and that animals were possibly destroying her remains.
I personally couldn't do that and would feel incredible judgment about a Mother who could.

I think there is a level of mental illness going on with Casey and, in a way, I feel like she operates like a small child would on a lot of levels. The lying, attention-seeking, etc. all speak to someone who just wants to be loved, just wants to avoid responsibility. I wouldn't say I feel sorry for her at all but I do feel compassion for her.

[NJFemmie]

I don't have children either - as I get older, I find myself tolerating them less myself (but at the same time, I do like children, just not always "other" people's children) ... BUT, as you, if I were a mother, and my child was missing - I would have FITS about it. There is no way I could even step out in public let alone party, get a tat, yadda yadda. She was emotionless from the start - even when she was arrested for murder. If I KNEW I didn't do this, and I was arrested for murder, I would be screaming hell on earth so that even satan himself would cover his ears.

Obviously yes, she does has mental issues. I mentioned before that she's more than likely suffering from a narcissistic personality disorder - she has exhibited (if not) all of the signs. What do you do with people like this? I mean, really?

Live feed: (for anyone interested) (http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/caylee-anthony/os-tivid-casey-anthony-jury-livestream-2,0,6003068.htmlstory)

[Gráinne]

Just last night, I lost my son (age 11) in the huge crowd leaving the riverfront for not more than three minutes, but it seemed like a thousand years. The whole world stopped until he was safely within reach. There was no way I was taking one step until I saw him. That's what I don't get about Casey, and what is so chilling.

I take it that there's no insanity defense, which is notoriously hard to show. She seems as disturbed as Andrea Yates, but not just crazy but cunning. She won't go off to a hospital somewhere.

I personally think she's going to get manslaughter, with a long, long sentence a la Diane Downs, with appeals and dragged out legal things up the wahoo.

[Peach]

that whole family is f*cked up. they all lie, and wouldnt know the truth if it bit them on the ass. I know they tested her brother to see if he was the father of the child, did they test the dad. it has never come out, who the father is. If they knew the guy, you would think the defense would have tried to pin it on him, they tried everyone else.
I do not think she will be convicted of 1st degree, mainly due the fact, they cannot prove how Caylee died, only that she did, and most likely at the hand of her mother. But they simply cannnot prove it wasnt an accident (which IMO it was not) and they cant prove the cause of death. I think she will be convicted of 2nd, or manslaughter of those are on the table.

[JustJo]

I mentioned before that she's more than likely suffering from a narcissistic personality disorder - she has exhibited (if not) all of the signs. What do you do with people like this? I mean, really?


It's a good question.

On a personal level, because of my history, I keep as much distance as possible from people who exhibit those behaviors (including family members).

On a societal level, I think we hold them responsible for their actions. Narcissism isn't an excuse for criminal or irresponsible or negligent or *fill in the blank* behavior.

It also isn't a crime in and of itself. Casey may be highly unlikable, but being unlikable isn't criminal. We can't judge her based on disliking her, but we can judge her actions.

[Peach]

My son wandered off one day, I didnt notice him gone for about 10 minutes, and life stopped the second I realized he wasnt in the yard anymore. We found him, a lady had him by the hand and was knocking on doors asking if this was their kid! I almost threw up from fear. That was ovver 30 years ago, and it still makes me ill to think what may have been. No way would I have been out at a party, getting a tattoo, and lying about it. I would have had the National guard out looking for him!

[JustJo]

Just last night, I lost my son (age 11) in the huge crowd leaving the riverfront for not more than three minutes, but it seemed like a thousand years. The whole world stopped until he was safely within reach. There was no way I was taking one step until I saw him. That's what I don't get about Casey, and what is so chilling.


My son wandered off one day, I didnt notice him gone for about 10 minutes, and life stopped the second I realized he wasnt in the yard anymore. We found him, a lady had him by the hand and was knocking on doors asking if this was their kid! I almost threw up from fear. That was ovver 30 years ago, and it still makes me ill to think what may have been. No way would I have been out at a party, getting a tattoo, and lying about it. I would have had the National guard out looking for him!

Yes, this exactly. I don't know of a single mother who could do what she did for a month.

I understand being private, quiet, stoic...all of that. I am not a "public griever"....I don't go to funerals. If I'm hurting, I prefer to do that in private or with a single close friend.

For me, that's fundamentally different than being in a "hot body" contest, drinking, partying and celebrating the "beautiful life" with a tattoo.

My life would not be beautiful if my son were missing or dead. I'd be a wreck.

[NJFemmie]

that whole family is f*cked up. they all lie, and wouldnt know the truth if it bit them on the ass. I know they tested her brother to see if he was the father of the child, did they test the dad. it has never come out, who the father is. If they knew the guy, you would think the defense would have tried to pin it on him, they tried everyone else.
I do not think she will be convicted of 1st degree, mainly due the fact, they cannot prove how Caylee died, only that she did, and most likely at the hand of her mother. But they simply cannnot prove it wasnt an accident (which IMO it was not) and they cant prove the cause of death. I think she will be convicted of 2nd, or manslaughter of those are on the table.

Caylee's father was (kinda) revealed. He was killed in a motorcycle accident years ago. Last I heard, there was talk about exhuming the body for DNA testing, but I don't know what happened after that.

[NJFemmie]

I personally think she's going to get manslaughter, with a long, long sentence a la Diane Downs, with appeals and dragged out legal things up the wahoo.

Honestly? Sitting in jail like Diane Downs is better than letting her out. At least we know Diane Downs won't be making any more babies to kill. (Her words back in 1984 were: " it is so easy to make children"). :|

[cinderella]

No shit!! I'd be insane if my child was missing for a nano-second - so how can Casey callously party for 31 days while her child is 'missing'? That's because Casey knew Caylee was NOT missing, but dead!! Good God! It boggles the mind how unbelievably macabre that is!!

My son wandered off one day, I didnt notice him gone for about 10 minutes, and life stopped the second I realized he wasnt in the yard anymore. We found him, a lady had him by the hand and was knocking on doors asking if this was their kid! I almost threw up from fear. That was ovver 30 years ago, and it still makes me ill to think what may have been. No way would I have been out at a party, getting a tattoo, and lying about it. I would have had the National guard out looking for him!

[Medusa]

I'd go for a good long prison sentence. Something in the 75 year - Life range.

[NJFemmie]

It's a good question.

On a personal level, because of my history, I keep as much distance as possible from people who exhibit those behaviors (including family members).

On a societal level, I think we hold them responsible for their actions. Narcissism isn't an excuse for criminal or irresponsible or negligent or *fill in the blank* behavior.

It also isn't a crime in and of itself. Casey may be highly unlikable, but being unlikable isn't criminal. We can't judge her based on disliking her, but we can judge her actions.


True. But my point is that her behavior is what makes her so unlikeable by the public. It's one thing to just fess up and own what you did, but it's another to make up stories, blame other people and create nanny's that aren't there (and knows it). It's easy to say "oh, people just don't like her, so that's why they'll find her guilty", but um .... :| .. there IS a reason WHY people aren't liking her.

[Gráinne]

Honestly? Sitting in jail like Diane Downs is better than letting her out. At least we know Diane Downs won't be making any more babies to kill. (Her words back in 1984 were: " it is so easy to make children"). :|

That's what I meant. I hope she's locked up, nice and long. If she's acquitted or goes free on some technicality, I think I'll be sick to my stomach.

[The_Lady_Snow]

I have not followed the trial, I can't I recently just regained custody of my kid so reading here and learning the details makes my head swimmy and I want to literally puke. I would be devastated and would be a mad woman driving the police force nuts cause I would be there everyday asking them if they had found my child. Life would go on but I know I would have a gaping hole I'll be honest thinking about it makes me want to cry in desperation cause I can't imagine living it up and not knowing where one of my kids is/are, hell they are adults and I like for them to keep me informed of their plans. Living this far from them is hard so I just can't imagine how this woman could not have lost her mind when her baby was missing.

It's mind dusturbing... I also feel that her looks play into how she's viewed, she's a cute petite white "girl next door" so she plays to that, if this woman was different say looks, race, size, class we'd gave a whole different story but that's another thread.

[scootebaby]

The only thing i recall about the body getting to the woods is the fact that Casey borrowed the neighbor's shovel...did i miss testimony regarding the fact she took her to the wooded area? and the burying of the body--was it buried or did it end up covered and buried in mud bc of the fact the area was flooded for a period of time due to the heavy rains? Yes i know the implication is there,but was there anything to the actual act?

As a mother *I* cant imagine hurting a child in any way...but i consider myself somewhat empathetic,sympathetic,and normal whereas Casey is lacking in these and many other emotions/feelings that "normal" people have. Again i dont condone her actions,but we all seem to be looking at it as what *we* would do or not do, when in the broader spectrum this world is full of people that do/handle things differently,for a variety of reasons beyond our understanding--am i making sense?

I dont know about others,but i know for myself--and based on things i went thru as a child i have the ability to hide things well, to hide my emotions, to *forget* things that cause me pain,hurt,sorrow,disgust etc--not to an extreme extent,but i can to some extent all the same. My point is this--people are talking about Caseys actions during the 31 days--although the death of a child is extreme is it not possible that Casey was able to block that fact out...i mean she did spend at least 75% of the time drinking,partying--and we all know alcohol dulls the senses and allows us (or some of us) the ability to *forget*

[NJFemmie]

The shovel she borrowed from a neighbor was used to break into George Anthony's shed - where the gas cans and duct tape were being housed. Dirt on the shovel did not match the dirt where Caylee was found.

No one is sure how Caylee got to where she was found.

[NJFemmie]

I dont know about others,but i know for myself--and based on things i went thru as a child i have the ability to hide things well, to hide my emotions, to *forget* things that cause me pain,hurt,sorrow,disgust etc--not to an extreme extent,but i can to some extent all the same. My point is this--people are talking about Caseys actions during the 31 days--although the death of a child is extreme is it not possible that Casey was able to block that fact out...i mean she did spend at least 75% of the time drinking,partying--and we all know alcohol dulls the senses and allows us (or some of us) the ability to *forget*

I suppose the question of the day is -- would any normal human being be able to block out the fact that their child has been missing and/or dead to THAT degree? No one in their right mind would party when their child is missing. Not even for a second. Most people would become alcoholic recluses, not party animals. At least that's my take on it.

My point here is that those actions alone imply that she is happy enough to party about it. How crazy is that?

[Scorp]

Bullshit, with all those facts so far, she's crazy like a fox. I don't buy any of it. She wants people to feel bad for her with the hopes of pleading insanity. Good thing I'm not on that jury, I'd already have her convicted.

I put her in the same boat as Pamela Smart, OJ Simpson, Scott Peterson, Joran Van Der Sloot, Andrea Yates, and many others that I can't think of right now.

[Scorp]

I forgot to add that I'm tired of people making excuses for her!!! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH..GUILTY AS SIN!!!


Bullshit, with all those facts so far, she's crazy like a fox. I don't buy any of it. She wants people to feel bad for her with the hopes of pleading insanity. Good thing I'm not on that jury, I'd already have her convicted.

I put her in the same boat as Pamela Smart, OJ Simpson, Scott Peterson, Joran Van Der Sloot, Andrea Yates, and many others that I can't think of right now.

[scootebaby]

Cinderella--i see your point,and i agree with you....again i am just looking at it from an aesthetic point of view.

and let me make this point very clear since its obviously not been made clear or overlooked in my prior posts. i do NOT condone her actions NOR am i making excuses for her...im taking the less traveled road AND im looking at it from the standpoint that the jurors are SUPPOSED to be looking at it. Are there circumstances that explain her actions? was it premeditated? was someone else involved? etc etc ETC!!!!!!


AGAIN..i DO think she is GUILTY OF THE DEATH OF HER DAUGHTER. i DO NOT condone her actions,from the very beginning. I am NOT making excuses for her in ANY WAY!!!


as a sidenote...insanity was never an option as far as i know!

[Semantics]

Bullshit, with all those facts so far, she's crazy like a fox. I don't buy any of it. She wants people to feel bad for her with the hopes of pleading insanity. Good thing I'm not on that jury, I'd already have her convicted.

I put her in the same boat as Pamela Smart, OJ Simpson, Scott Peterson, Joran Van Der Sloot, Andrea Yates, and many others that I can't think of right now.

I just wanted to address the difference between Andrea Yates and the others you listed. Andrea Yates was suffering from postpartum psychosis well before she harmed her children. She had previously tried to kill herself because she knew that she might harm them. Despite repeated attempts by Andrea to convince her husband and her psychiatrist and her pastor that she was a danger to her children because she was suffering from a (diagnosed) psychotic condition, she was pressured by them all to go back to her life.

There's a huge difference between postpartum depression and postpartum psychosis. I don't think that her victimization comes anywhere near that of what happened to her poor children, but I also think that she was insane at the time, the people in her life knew she was insane and didn't help, and that she falls into a different category than the others.


I think Casey Anthony has tried to set up the stage for sympathy based on alleged past abuse and mental illness, but it was a failure.

[purepisces]

The verdict is in!

[Dante]

They have a verdict !!!!

[purepisces]

We will have at least a 30 minute wait before they go live.

[Medusa]

Holy crap - Ok, now I have to watch! I'm not usually one for televised court events but that was a quick verdict and Im curious as to how they found on each count

[scootebaby]

WOW!!!! less than 11 hrs.


thanks for the heads up you all...i had flipped the channel a few minutes ago!

[Scorp]

Side Bar: Semantics, you are correct regarding Andrea Yates, I will strike that and take her out of the mix with the others. Consider it removed. Thank you for clarifying the differences.

And, as far as a verdict, good, this should be interesting..

[purepisces]

In situations like this I've heard that a short deliberation often means a guilty verdict. However, to me, it seems like they would have given more consideration if they were going to recommend the death penalty.

I had wondered if there would be a hung jury, because in jury selection, juror 4 said that she did not feel that she could judge someone. But, she must have found a way, because it would take quite some time to admit that they couldn't come to a decision.

I feel strange right now. I've followed this case on HLN since right after Caylee was reported missing three years ago. I've dvr'd the trial and watched it every night (I know, I need to get a life). It is hard for me to separate all the things I've heard from the media over that time and the evidence that was actually presented in court.

[girl_dee]

Verdict is in.. . Finally.

[The_Lady_Snow]

I can't stomach her & we don't have cable so we're watching Californication and we'll wait for the verdict and find out through you guys.

[NJFemmie]

That live feed link I provided seems to not be working now for some odd reason so here are alternates:

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2011/06/testimony-continues-wednesday-casey-anthony-trial-radar-live-stream

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/03/casey-anthony-trial-live-video_n_889522.html (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/03/casey-anthony-trial-live-video_n_889522.html)

Verdict to be read at 2:15

[JustJo]

I've always heard that a fast verdict is a guilty verdict...although I'm not sure how the actual statistics stack up.

I doubt they'd return with a recommendation for death that fast in any case, though....so I'm guessing guilty, but no death penalty recommendation.

We'll see...

[Gráinne]

I shouldn't be watching this either, but CNN is live from Orlando.

[purepisces]

Not guilty except for lying to police.

[scootebaby]

OMG!!!! they pulled it off....im even surprised that child abuse wasnt at least guilty..UNREAL!!!!!!

[Heavenleahangel]

They found her INNOCENT!!!! UNREAL!!!!!

[Medusa]

:|:|:|:|

WOW.

[Scorp]

Verdict: Not guilty of first degree murder

Only guilty of providing false info to law enforcement which she will be sentenced this thursday at 9 AM EST.

Nice, real nice...got away scott fuckin' free. I hope she's haunted by her little girl the rest of her life.

It will be a matter of time when she poses in Playboy and gets some celebrity status out of this.

This is a fuckin' shame. Karma is a bitch Casey.....Now don't forget to go and party it up and rejoice while your baby girl was just tossed out like garbage..I hope you get paid back....

[dixie]

I can NOT believe she walked on the serious charges. You have got to be kidding me...

[Peach]

I'm as shocked as I was when OJ Simpson was found not guilty. What kid of sentence can she get for the false info verdict?

[Gráinne]

Sadly, I'm not even surprised. I thought she'd be prosecuted at least on child abuse. Unbelievable.

[Medusa]

I think the maximum in Florida on the false statement charges is 1 year each - Going to research further...

[NJFemmie]

She's figuring .... do some jail time and then I can get back to partying!

I am so beside myself right now.

[Scorp]

Exactly!...............



She's figuring .... do some jail time and then I can get back to partying!

I am so beside myself right now.

[atomiczombie]

This is really disturbing, given the facts of the case. I wonder what the jury was thinking and considering.

[The_Lady_Snow]

It's a sad sad day. Rest in peace little child who will never be forgotten.

[purepisces]

I think the maximum in Florida on the false statement charges is 1 year each - Going to research further...

She has already been in jail for about three years, so there is a chance she will be released by the end of the year.

[scootebaby]

Sadly, I'm not even surprised. I thought she'd be prosecuted at least on child abuse. Unbelievable.



i didnt think she would be convicted on murder charges,but like you i assumed child abuse for sure............i am just shocked that Baez pulled it off...or perhaps part of it was his shoddy defense that helped get the verdict received....and i know this is gonna stir up a big pot of shit,but now that woman has to go out into the world--with noone at her side im assuming--and face the world...plus live with ther knowledge of what she did...her life is gonna be far from free even tho she was found not guilty!

ETA::: i still do not think she should be set free nor am i taking her side...i am merely talking out loud!

[NJFemmie]

Verdict: Not guilty of first degree murder

Only guilty of providing false info to law enforcement which she will be sentenced this thursday at 9 AM EST.

Nice, real nice...got away scott fuckin' free. I hope she's haunted by her little girl the rest of her life.

It will be a matter of time when she poses in Playboy and gets some celebrity status out of this.

This is a fuckin' shame. Karma is a bitch Casey.....Now don't forget to go and party it up and rejoice while your baby girl was just tossed out like garbage..I hope you get paid back....


Sadly, she won't feel any remorse - she hasn't so far.

[Gráinne]

I think the maximum in Florida on the false statement charges is 1 year each - Going to research further...

One year each max; maybe with time already served (since Oct. 2008)=no jail time, maybe even just probation.

Same feeling here as when I watched the O.J. verdict, and I thought he would be acquitted way before her.

They are saying that it wasn't so much her attorney, but the gestures and smirks of the prosecutor that may have stuck with jurors. Unfortunately, once an attorney turns someone off, it can taint the evidence from then on.

[morningstar55]

omg....... this is upseting ......
the jury must of been on drugs

[JustJo]

This is so disturbing that I can't even believe it.

Anyone else notice George and Cindy walking out before the judge was done speaking?

The whole thing is sickening.

She's going to walk out and go back to her "beautiful life"....just watch and see. And, yes, I'll bet she's in Playboy or on some reality TV crap before the year is out.

[Scorp]

So like they're saying now the jurors WERE NOT in the room when major discussions were taking place in the courtroom with in-depth details. What kind of shit is that???? That's why she fuckin' got off free for first degree murder and everything else. I'm disgusted with this.

[The_Lady_Snow]

The value (lack there of ) children always amazes me, if this would of been a dog ( ex: Vick) she would convicted, when will our children be worth more? When? My heart weeps for all children right now.

[NJFemmie]

I feel the worst for Caylee, who's justice was not served.
I didn't expect 1st degree murder, but I expected SOMETHING more than this.

[Medusa]

They would have had her ass guilty SO fast if she would have been fat or a woman of color or anything but "poor widdle white woman".

[atomiczombie]

They would have had her ass guilty SO fast if she would have been fat or a woman of color or anything but "poor widdle white woman".

This. I couldn't agree more.

[The_Lady_Snow]

They would have had her ass guilty SO fast if she would have been fat or a woman of color or anything but "poor widdle white woman".



AMEN!!!!!!

[purepisces]

They would have had her ass guilty SO fast if she would have been fat or a woman of color or anything but "poor widdle white woman".

That's exactly what my sister and I were just discussing. I'd like to say that's not the case, but it seems like it had to play a part in the decision.

[morningstar55]

i dont think playboy will want her really.......
but
with so many soo upset over this verdict.... someone will get her.
I believe in karma
im watching a talk show called .... The Talk .... and when they made a special annoucment .. the panel of people . its kinda like the view .. they about started weeping and couldnt read the annoucment to well ...

[AtLast]

They would have had her ass guilty SO fast if she would have been fat or a woman of color or anything but "poor widdle white woman".

And the entire media coverage on this case since the start has been based upon this being a white child and family. There are thousands of horrid cases of children of color, poor, yes, fat, etc. every year that are hardly covered.

This is awful, but I agree with you and look at all the other cases that gained national attention- Lacy Petersen and Natalee Holloway come to mind. When the Petersen investigation was going on (the bodies were found at the dog park I go to everyday), there was a woman of color's body found (there might have been two- can't recall), and other than a few cursory media spots, nothing was made of that case at all! Not a damn thing! The remains were of a young African American woman. What about her family?

I am shocked by the verdict, however, but wonder if "planting" possible incest and having a jury with 7 women has something to do with it.

This young woman is very disturbed- the whole family is- I hope the hell she doesn't have any more kids.

[NJFemmie]

That's what ultimately scares me. Based on how she conducts herself, she could have another child and this could happen again.

[Medusa]

Did the jury hear the part about how someone searched for the words "chloroform" and that Cindy Anthony, who claimed to be the one who did it, was PROVEN to be at work when it happened?

[JustJo]

I believe in karma

I wish I could.....but reality is she'll get a million dollar book deal and walk away.

[Gráinne]

From what I just heard, I'm glad I wasn't in the back room after the verdicts when she started laughing and grinning. I would be the one on trial, with zip chance for acquittal.

It makes me sick as I feared, that tomorrow she could confess and there's nothing to be done about it.

[Blade]

I am still in shock. I agree with Snow, if this were a dog the verdict would be different. I bet she walks free Thursday. In my state when you are sentenced, especially for a non violent offense, they give you 2 for 1 on time served in the local jail. Say if you get a 2 yr sentence it is suspended for time served and you might get some probation or community service.

She could be a millionaire Monday. Books, movies, talk shows. WOW! I'm stunned stunned stunned! I can't believe they didn't even get a lesser charge concerning the murder 1 charge.

[Medusa]

From what I just heard, I'm glad I wasn't in the back room after the verdicts when she started laughing and grinning. I would be the one on trial, with zip chance for acquittal.

It makes me sick as I feared, that tomorrow she could confess and there's nothing to be done about it.


That reminded me of the anger I felt around OJ Simpsons "if I DID IT" book where he basically confessed to the murder but did a "nanny nanny boo boo" to the legal system.

[purepisces]

Did the jury hear the part about how someone searched for the words "chloroform" and that Cindy Anthony, who claimed to be the one who did it, was PROVEN to be at work when it happened?

Yes, they impeached her (Cindy) about the searches on the rebuttal case. However, it was shown that the month that someone looked up chloroform Casey’s boyfriend had posted a cartoon on MySpace saying “Win her over with chloroform” and the defense argued that she didn’t know what chloroform was so she looked it up.

[scootebaby]

i know this is gonna go against the grain,but i disagree with the thought she got off bc she is a white woman....OJ Simpson got away with murder as well and he was a black man...Eileen Wournos a white woman convicted and put to death a white woman....Susan Smith white woman drove her 2 sons into the lake convicted of murder....im sure i could research more and find more examples,but i have to get ready for work.

as sad as it is i think it boils down to the prosecution not being able to show who,how,what, and when....as far as murder charge goes...the abuse charge being not guilty however leaves me speechlesstho

[NJFemmie]

The jury has to live with themselves after this - especially when Casey parades herself around like her shit doesn't stink all over the media.

Whatever. I'm disgusted and my heart hurts over this. I didn't want this to be like the OJ feeling I had, but justice is not always as blind as they say.

[purepisces]

I am still in shock. I agree with Snow, if this were a dog the verdict would be different. I bet she walks free Thursday. In my state when you are sentenced, especially for a non violent offense, they give you 2 for 1 on time served in the local jail. Say if you get a 2 yr sentence it is suspended for time served and you might get some probation or community service.

She could be a millionaire Monday. Books, movies, talk shows. WOW! I'm stunned stunned stunned! I can't believe they didn't even get a lesser charge concerning the murder 1 charge.

I don't want to get too off track of the topic of this thread, but from what I know about this case and the Vick case, they had quite a bit more "hard" evidence to convict in the Vick case

In my opinion, the jury has to suspect that Casey is guilty of something, but all of the prosecution evidence was circumstantial. No one saw her dispose of the body, no physical (DNA) was found linking her to the crime.

If they could have found her guilty of being an unfeeling, horrible mother, I'm sure they would have, but, sadly, that is not against the law.

[princessbelle]

I'm in shock as so many are.

The jurors are now not going to speak?

To me, THAT says a lot.


It's really sad this little girl died and her murderer walks.

[AtLast]

I am still in shock. I agree with Snow, if this were a dog the verdict would be different. I bet she walks free Thursday. In my state when you are sentenced, especially for a non violent offense, they give you 2 for 1 on time served in the local jail. Say if you get a 2 yr sentence it is suspended for time served and you might get some probation or community service.

She could be a millionaire Monday. Books, movies, talk shows. WOW! I'm stunned stunned stunned! I can't believe they didn't even get a lesser charge concerning the murder 1 charge.

Yeah- on everything you say. I thought it very possible for a second degree verdict to come in or even manslaughter.

I am very interested in the instructions the judge gave the jury. I think "reasonable doubt" is the reason for the verdict in the main, but I do see race entering in.

I have to find info on the racial break-down of the jury. Am i correct in assuming that the trial is set in a upper-middle class, white jurisdiction? Florida has pockets of quite wealthy populations and pockets of very, very poor populations.

A book will be out soon, no doubt and she is going to become a rich person. What I am having so much trouble with is what Snow brings up- this was the murder of a 2 year old!! All the buzz has become about Casey and her dysfunctional family.

Yes, looking at this and comparing it to Vick's case and sentence makes me nuts (I agreed with his having jail time, however).

Having served on a jury in a criminal case (long time ago)- I have to say that there is so much the jury is not exposed to during a trial and it is charged to determine a verdict based upon the law as instructed by the judge. Reasonable doubt is a potent interpretation. I bet we hear a lot about each of these factors as coverage unfolds.

I keep thinking about how the hell do we do something to change the media racial (insert class, plus) bias with these cases as well as investigations being done with the same bias. Happens all the time.

[NJFemmie]

One year each max; maybe with time already served (since Oct. 2008)=no jail time, maybe even just probation.

Same feeling here as when I watched the O.J. verdict, and I thought he would be acquitted way before her.

They are saying that it wasn't so much her attorney, but the gestures and smirks of the prosecutor that may have stuck with jurors. Unfortunately, once an attorney turns someone off, it can taint the evidence from then on.

Sentencing on the guilty counts will be held on 9 a.m. Thursday. The maximum sentence applicable in this case is four years, but having already served two and a half years behind bars, Casey Anthony stands to serve one and a half years.

[scootebaby]

actually the jury pool was put together from across the state in pinellas county...somehow they managed to get a wide array of people instead of the older,retired,military type that tend to live in that part---this is according to the news stuff i heard


so let me ask so i can be clear...are people saying she got off bc of upper,middle classs white ppl on the jury(since the jury didnt come from Orange County)..or that the whites outweighed the black and hispanic on the jury or what.....im truly interested in how race is being brought into it.

[Novelafemme]

My partner, who has her J.D, said that the standard of proof is extremely high in cases such as this...meaning, if the defense could convince the jury that there is plausible reason (any reason) that she could be innocent, they must vote not guilty. I totally agree with whomever stated that she should at the very least be sterilized.

[AtLast]

My partner, who has her J.D, said that the standard of proof is extremely high in cases such as this...meaning, if the defense could convince the jury that there is plausible reason (any reason) that she could be innocent, they must vote not guilty. I totally agree with whomever stated that she should at the very least be sterilized.

Yes, the burden of proof by the prosecution in capital cases is very narrow in terms of reasonable doubt. And the judge must make this very clear to the jury. Also, as someone brought up, the antics by both the prosecuting and defense lawyers was not played out in front of the jury.

Also, these days with the hyper-focusing of juries on forensic evidence based upon scientific investigation techniques has put a much higher bar on the prosecution in such cases. connecting the dots circumstantially isn't good enough in today's courtrooms.

If the cause of death had been determined as suffocation, the duct tape theory would have most likely changed the verdict- IF there was also forensic evidence on the duct tape like hairs, blood, fibers that connected Casey to it. From the start, no cause of death actually being found and supported by technological investigative tools has been a problem This allowed the defense to build on other possible scenerios of how this little girl died.

At first I was shocked with the verdict but in thinking more about it, I can see how reasonable doubt played into the verdict strongly.

My heart still hurts for this child and I personally believe Casey killed her, but, when I look at the burden of proof elements for the prosecution- I can see why she was not found guilty of 1st degree murder. I am wondering about why lesser offenses were not part of what the jury could make a verdict on, like second degree murder or manslaughter. I don't know how Florida courts works in terms of the degrees of guilt a jury is given to choose from in cases like this.

[Medusa]

I wonder why the prosecution did not add "Abuse of a Corpse" to her charges? That would at least carry a felony charge that she might have been convicted for.

[The_Lady_Snow]

actually the jury pool was put together from across the state in pinellas county...somehow they managed to get a wide array of people instead of the older,retired,military type that tend to live in that part---this is according to the news stuff i heard


so let me ask so i can be clear...are people saying she got off bc of upper,middle classs white ppl on the jury(since the jury didnt come from Orange County)..or that the whites outweighed the black and hispanic on the jury or what.....im truly interested in how race is being brought into it.

Race ALWAYS plays into it, as does money, privilege. I honestly feel had this been a WOC we would not see this much coverage and she would of been found guilty guilty guilty.

How often do you see kids of color this highly publicized, look at the little Latina girl killed by the minute men in Arizona.

No one wept for her, all children should have value.

[BullDog]

In my opinion the reasons O.J. Simpson got away with murder are (1) he was a very popular football player and celebrity and (2) he was wealthy and was able to afford very, very good lawyers. The police also fucked up quite a bit in the beginning which I believe was influenced by the fact that they were giddy about O.J. Simpson being involved.

I don't believe the average African American male could get away with murder, especially of a beautiful white blonde woman, the way O.J. did. In fact I think there is a lot of evidence to prove that. They don't have his celebrity or money to overcome the fact that they are black males. O.J. won despite the fact he is black and it took a whole lot of celebrity, money and people fucking up for that to happen.

I also did serve on a jury in a murder trial (in California not Florida) and the Reasonable Doubt standard is quite high. The makeup of the jury and the effectiveness of the defense attorneys can also play a big role.

I have not followed this particular trial but the Reasonable Doubt standard could have been what saved her, but I don't rule out race and other factors for sure. The Reasonable Doubt standard is important to protect the innocent, but it can also lead to people getting away with murder if the evidence isn't strong enough or not presented effectively enough. That's tough. It really is.

[Novelafemme]

Race ALWAYS plays into it, as does money, privilege. I honestly feel had this been a WOC we would not see this much coverage and she would of been found guilty guilty guilty.

How often do you see kids of color this highly publicized, look at the little Latina girl killed by the minute men in Arizona.

No one wept for her, all children should have value.

The Lady Snow, are you referring to the little girl and her father who were recently killed?

[AtLast]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/caylee-anthony/os-casey-anthony-trial-week-two-frida20110520,0,469964.story

[scootebaby]

Race ALWAYS plays into it, as does money, privilege. I honestly feel had this been a WOC we would not see this much coverage and she would of been found guilty guilty guilty.

How often do you see kids of color this highly publicized, look at the little Latina girl killed by the minute men in Arizona.

No one wept for her, all children should have value.

Snow..i hope you dont mind that i address this post and you personally. i just think i could understand your explanation better than a lot of others.

Perhaps its my white privilege coming into play bc i dont see it...i mean if race is ALWAYS a part of it would you (general) say that race played a part in OJ getting off? Scott Peterson was white and was convicted by a predominantly white jury...

i truly wanna see what others see as far as the race thing goes,but im having a hard time bc ive seen it goes both ways...again that might just be my white privilege and upbringing

Sadly i did not hear about the latina girl....

i will admit it is sad that more attention is not given to all kids whom have been harmed or killed--regardless of race....

as for the % i would/will do some research and see how it varies


thanks in advance!

[scootebaby]

new post to add i forgot Snow had said money and privilege as well so i understand the OJ thing..

[The_Lady_Snow]

The Lady Snow, are you referring to the little girl and her father who were recently killed?



Yes Ma'am... They thought it was a house full of undocumented people. Her name is BRISENIA FLORES, they were found guilty but the case was not highly publicized, her Papi was also killed his name is Raul Junior Flores.

[little_ms_sunshyne]

I definitely believe she is GUILTY, but unfortunately looking at it from a different point of view, prosecution did not prove their case. Defense didn't do a great job either, but then again they didnt have anything to prove, the prosecution did.

I dislike that uneasy feeling you get after you know that a true injustice was committed. Casey Anthony deserves to be in jail and the fact that she is smiling...blah! Her daughter can never be brought back and that is nothing to smile about!!! I hope she has a hard time living with her decisions. I can only hope they haunt her forever! I know the media will.

[Novelafemme]

Yes Ma'am... They thought it was a house full of undocumented people. Her name is BRISENIA FLORES, they were found guilty but the case was not highly publicized, her Papi was also killed his name is Raul Junior Flores.

There wasn't a lot of national attention focused on this incident, but there sure was here in Tucson. I participated in a local candle light vigil and I know there were many demonstrations that took place over the weeks following their murders. The woman in charge of the killings had clear mental health issues. The whole thing upsets me to no end.

[nowandthen]

Snow..i hope you dont mind that i address this post and you personally. i just think i could understand your explanation better than a lot of others.

Perhaps its my white privilege coming into play bc i dont see it...i mean if race is ALWAYS a part of it would you (general) say that race played a part in OJ getting off? Scott Peterson was white and was convicted by a predominantly white jury...

i truly wanna see what others see as far as the race thing goes,but im having a hard time bc ive seen it goes both ways...again that might just be my white privilege and upbringing

Sadly i did not hear about the latina girl....

i will admit it is sad that more attention is not given to all kids whom have been harmed or killed--regardless of race....

as for the % i would/will do some research and see how it varies


thanks in advance!

The question of race is Always a issue. Oscar Grant! The question you might asks yourself is the same question you asked Snow. Find the answer by doing research, read books, go to events the talk about the race. A good book to start with is, "THE NEW JIM CROW" by Michelle Alexandar. She breaks it down in a way that folks get it. This case would not have been in the media if the players were folks of color.How do I know this? history.

[Toughy]

I stand by what the jury said. They were sitting in the room every day, listened to the judge, witnesses, lawyers, saw her every day and reached a verdict. All 12 of them agreed she lied to the po po. All 12 of them agreed (edited to add: there was reasonable doubt) she did not kill/murder her child.

Trying and convicting people in the press without all the facts hurts our judicial system. Especially when the verdict is not guilty or in this case guilty of lying, but not manslaughter/murder. Common law (and US law) all the way back to the late 1700's states suspects are innocent until proven guilty, with the prosecution having the burden of proof. All of us should remember this.

[Peach]

I was saying to Huskyb last night, there was NO proof how the child died, and without that, there was no proof she was killed by her mother, and she was going to walk. I hoped I was wrong, but I wasnt.

[Kobi]

This verdict, to me, seems justified given the lack of direct evidence. Circumstantial evidence that requires mental gymnastics is likely to be problematic to a convinction.

The prosecution just didnt prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt.

She is to be sentenced Thursday and I fully expect, after 3 years in custody, she will walk out a free woman that day.

Someday, perhaps, the truth of what happened to that child will surface.

[Corkey]

When the prosecution provides only circumstantial evidence in a Capitol case and does not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the accused is guilty, then the person is not adjudicated guilty. She was found guilty of lying to a law enforcement officer on counts 4-7. She may still do jail time for that, sentencing on Thursday.

It is my fervent hope that when called to be on a jury people would use their brains and leave their hearts out of critical decisions of life and death.

The emotional should never enter into deciding the guilt of an individual, only the facts of the case. If there are no facts, or circumstantial evidence, there is no case.

Do I feel she did it, I have no clue as I was not on her jury. Remember the jury was sequestered for the entire trial, they did not see the TV or read the papers of have access to social media. So they had the facts of the case, while we all got conjecture and emotion.

[nowandthen]

Alina Browne
'So if you're a Black mother and you send your child to a better school district you're a criminal, but if you're a white mother and you kill your child, acquittal. Yeah, please don't even try to tell me our judicial system isn't a sham.'

[morningstar55]

in Wisconsin .. 11 yrs ago... 4 kids starved ,beaten , abused... 3 boys 1 girl. the girl was kept in a small dog cage in a cold dark basment most her life until she was 7 ...
the parents......... arrested and gvin 1 yr in jail ...

http://www.imperfectparent.com/topics/2011/02/22/oprah-tortured-7-year-old-girl-who-lived-in-dog-cage-finally-speaks/

[Corkey]

And this is what I mean about the emotional part. Emotion is not fact. Do I feel for the mother who is in jail because she broke the law and tried to get her child a better education, you fucking bet I do, it doesn't change the fact she broke the law. It is the laws that need changing people.

[The_Lady_Snow]

This country's judicial system will put Men and Women of color in prison for an ounce if weed in SOME states, this woman kills her child and she gets off without nothing?

I'm not seeing how the judicial system is balanced and no I'm not leaving my emotions out a child is gone, a child who would of been a woman her value should NEVER EVER be made into nothing, ever.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Alina Browne
'So if you're a Black mother and you send your child to a better school district you're a criminal, but if you're a white mother and you kill your child, acquittal. Yeah, please don't even try to tell me our judicial system isn't a sham.'



THIS SPEAKS VOLUMES!!!

[Corkey]

There is no Proof she did it! I can emote all fucking day about the child, it wont bring her back, but the woman was found not guilty.
The system is flawed, it isn't perfect, but damnit when 12 people say not guilty and they have All the evidence than not guilty it is.

[The_Lady_Snow]

12 people have also placed innocent POC in prison based on their race. Great system yippee!

[Dante]

That's what ultimately scares me. Based on how she conducts herself, she could have another child and this could happen again.


This is so very possible. I have known peeps that are sociopaths. They have no conscience, not capable of feelings for others, unable to control their actions. They use people for their own benefit and then discard them when not needing them anymore. I am also scared and very worried about Casey's future victims! Many people commented on facebook, and reminds us of all of the searches done on the computer. Is it possible that she was planning do kill the entire family??? Someone mentioned karma. Casey, you WILL pay. OJ is now in prison!

[Corkey]

12 people have also placed innocent POC in prison based on their race. Great system yippee!

Yes they have and instead of emoting about it work to change it! There is the SPLC that works to overturn innocent peoples convictions, there is the Innocents Project. There are things that can change the system if reasonable people work to make it happen.
I will in no instance say the system is perfect, it isn't but I will not try a person in the court of public opinion.

[weatherboi]

Our system convicts innocent people all the time and guilty people go free. I accept a guilty woman went free today. Hoorah!!! i remember Susan smith, I think she said a black man carjacked her car with her kids in it. This girl tried to blame it on a latina woman. I see a pattern and this is Our judicial system .it is set up to let pretty white women go free and rich men get away with murder.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Please don't tell me how I should react to a hard situation Corkey and please don't assume I do nothing against the injustices of this country, that was pretty shitty. I'm allowed to say how I feel or what I'm thinking it's not against the TOS just the same way you can express your thoughts without question we all should be able to without having someone wag the do something about it finger at us.

Yes they have and instead of emoting about it work to change it! There is the SPLC that works to overturn innocent peoples convictions, there is the Innocents Project. There are things that can change the system if reasonable people work to make it happen.
I will in no instance say the system is perfect, it isn't but I will not try a person in the court of public opinion.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Our system convicts innocent people all the time and guilty people go free. I accept a guilty woman went free today. Hoorah!!! i remember Susan smith, I think she said a black man carjacked her car with her kids in it. This girl tried to blame it on a latina woman. I see a pattern and this is Our judicial system .it is set up to let pretty white women go free and rich men get away with murder.



And rape!!!!! :(

[nowandthen]

And this is what I mean about the emotional part. Emotion is not fact. Do I feel for the mother who is in jail because she broke the law and tried to get her child a better education, you fucking bet I do, it doesn't change the fact she broke the law. It is the laws that need changing people.

But if that same child can play sports, those parent do not go to jail, please.... look up Jim Crow.

I was not in the jury , I respect what they did, what the eveidence and the law allowed. But this has racism all over it, the fact that we know the name of all the players, that the media coverage is sicking, yet young brown men are dying at alarming rates or are in jail, or pregnat women are handcuffed to the bed when giving birth in jail.

I did not watch any of it and yet I could not get away from it, why not do that with all the children killed reguardless of circumstance, just a thought.
These our post i made on FB
Again are the right questions being asked? How does any child end up dead at the hands of the folks who are supposed to love them. Why is it so hard for white folks to admit we as a collective are valued and benifit in all areas from a system aimed to do just that? I did not watch any of it, I am grateful I read non-normative media...
I am more sad at how this case was elevated over the hundreds of children killed everyday around the world. Yes i know this question is rhetorical I know why. Humans running to get in line made me sick, yes throughout history but I find this offensive, the spectacale seems hypocritical to find happiness or joy in any of it.

[Corkey]

Because I think something doesn't make it so. 12 people found her Not guilty. None of us were in the jury, we don't know what the evidence was, they were sequestered and only had the evidence. WE had the emotion from the reporters the court attendees and the court of public opinion. None of which are facts.

I'd hate like hell to be someone accused and have most of you on my jury.
You're right Snow I am pointing fingers. I want people to use their brains and not their emotions while on a jury. I want the guilty to be jailed and the innocent to go free. No where do I think that because I feel, should any of that happen.

And no where do I think it is fair for POC to go to jail when they are innocent.

[weatherboi]

I don't think people are emoting I think it is more like mourning. Mourning for a child forgotten. Mourning a child that will never receive justice. Reasonable doubt does not make her innocent. She just got lucky.

[Corkey]

But if that same child can play sports, those parent do not go to jail, please.... look up Jim Crow.

I was not in the jury , I respect what they did, what the eveidence and the law allowed. But this has racism all over it, the fact that we know the name of all the players, that the media coverage is sicking, yet young brown men are dying at alarming rates or are in jail, or pregnat women are handcuffed to the bed when giving birth in jail.

I did not watch any of it and yet I could not get away from it, why not do that with all the children killed reguardless of circumstance, just a thought.
These our post i made on FB
Again are the right questions being asked? How does any child end up dead at the hands of the folks who are supposed to love them. Why is it so hard for white folks to admit we as a collective are valued and benifit in all areas from a system aimed to do just that? I did not watch any of it, I am grateful I read non-normative media...
I am more sad at how this case was elevated over the hundreds of children killed everyday around the world. Yes i know this question is rhetorical I know why. Humans running to get in line made me sick, yes throughout history but I find this offensive, the spectacale seems hypocritical to find happiness or joy in any of it.

Don't you admonish ME about Jim Crow you don't know my background! You are bringing emotion to a fact based system.

[weatherboi]

it is pretty clear EVERYBODY posting in here is emotional. :) there are hundreds of poc and non poc that are found guilty with less circumstantial evidence than this woman. She got lucky with the 12 people. Corkey if you don't have anything nice to say to me in a rep then just keep it to yourself. I think you know better at this point. Please and thank you!!!

[nowandthen]

Don't you admonish ME about Jim Crow you don't know my background! You are bringing emotion to a fact based system.


Jim Crow is Law not emotion! I am not invested in this case, I am invested in folks being informed, no I do not know you, nor you me, so we can call it even

[princessbelle]

I don't think people are emoting I think it is more like mourning. Mourning for a child forgotten. Mourning a child that will never receive justice. Reasonable doubt does not make her innocent. She just got lucky.


Totally agree. When it comes to the murder of a child it very hard to accept what the jury finds as a verdict.

It is an injustice IMO and yes it is sad that this child will never be vindicated and no wrath will come upon the woman whose hand caused it.

Just sad.

[FlowerFem]

It's hard to imagine a MOTHER could either kill their own baby, or have a hand in it. I don't know how you could live with yourself afterwards . How could you justify that to yourself ? How could your heart be so cold ? I suppose blaming someone else, or something else, seems to be what she attempted to do. What a dark, lost soul, she must be. Very sad.

[kannon]

Jim Crow is Law not emotion! I am not invested in this case, I am invested in folks being informed, no I do not know you, nor you me, so we can call it even

What does Jim Crow laws have to do with this verdict? Jim Crow laws ended in the 50's or 60's. They were unjust and racist laws that tried to segregate POC. Definitely UNJUST and WRONG. But what does it have to do with this case?

The thread OP asked: Casey Anthony - guilty, or not?

[Apocalipstic]

It is hearbreaking when a child is killed, no matter how it happened.

I agree that people spend more time in jail for small amounts of weed, than apparentlyr tampering with a dead body, staging a crime scene and lying to police...and the people likely to spend that time are seldom white.

Our justice system is incredibly flawed.

I also agree that the missing children the media grasps on to seem to always be white from at least Middle Class, female and really cute. How sad for all the other thousands of children missing right now.

Did she do it? If I were forced to guess I would go with yes, but there was not enough direct evidence to convict. But just a guess.

[Corkey]

it is pretty clear EVERYBODY posting in here is emotional. :) there are hundreds of poc and non poc that are found guilty with less circumstantial evidence than this woman. She got lucky with the 12 people. Corkey if you don't have anything nice to say to me in a rep then just keep it to yourself. I think you know better at this point. Please and thank you!!!


I said in your opinion and I'll say it here, there was no un nice about it, A statement. Period. You are welcome.

[Peach]

this is something difficult to keep emotion OUT of. Yes, 12 people had access to evidence, but that whole trial was on tv almost 24/7, so outside of photgraphs that werent shown on tv, I think the public got most of the same info, but I could be wrong.
MY emotions now are saved for that child who never stood a chance, and for any child she may have in the future, who could be in the same danger. I hesitate to say I hope Casey learns from this, and turns her life around, but *I* feel she is a narcisist and incapable of concern for anyone except her own self, and will not learn a thing.


If she walks free Tursday, which is a huge possiblility, where will she go I wonder? Would her parents allow her bak in their home? Would any of you, if this were your daughter? I dont know if I could or not, after all the lies, and her trying to lay the blame on me, accusations of molestation etc......

[nowandthen]

What does Jim Crow laws have to do with this verdict? Jim Crow laws ended in the 50's or 60's. They were unjust and racist laws that tried to segregate POC. Definitely UNJUST and WRONG. But what does it have to do with this case?

The thread OP asked: Casey Anthony - guilty, or not?

If you think Jim Crow is over then I suggest reading the book, The New Jim Crow, by Michelle Alexandar. It has everything to do with this case. Race and Class impact every legal case in America. We have a prision for profit society that is fed by the imbalance in the justics system. When you can get life for crack and time served for powder cocaine as an example or the statistacs that show the how many POC are some how under police survelance, jail, probation, youth authority, house arrest, etc. there is no question that we have a new perment class of people who can not particapate, can not get student loans, food stamps, welfare or work because you must check the box that states " have you ever been convicted of a felony" you are marginalized.
The relation to this case is the media coverage, and the perception of the accussed. I have no doubt in my mind that is the accused was a women of color the case would not have been a national news story and guilty would have been the outcome. RACE MATTERS as Dr. West states.

[cinderella]

I just found out that the verdict is: NOT GUILTY!!!

Jesus Christ almighty!!! I am so in shock & disbelief, I'm thinking I must be dreaming!!! What the hell is wrong with people??? I am just speechless at this point, and still recovering from the outcome of the deliberations...so unbelivable...

[kannon]

If you think Jim Crow is over then I suggest reading the book, The New Jim Crow, by Michelle Alexandar. It has everything to do with this case. Race and Class impact every legal case in America. We have a prision for profit society that is fed by the imbalance in the justics system. When you can get life for crack and time served for powder cocaine as an example or the statistacs that show the how many POC are some how under police survelance, jail, probation, youth authority, house arrest, etc. there is no question that we have a new perment class of people who can not particapate, can not get student loans, food stamps, welfare or work because you must check the box that states " have you ever been convicted of a felony" you are marginalized.
The relation to this case is the media coverage, and the perception of the accussed. I have no doubt in my mind that is the accused was a women of color the case would not have been a national news story and guilty would have been the outcome. RACE MATTERS as Dr. West states.

I agree with you 100% but I think the real victim in this case is the child.

[cinderella]

...what he said!!

I forgot to add that I'm tired of people making excuses for her!!! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH..GUILTY AS SIN!!!

[cinderella]

From your lips, to God's ears!!!

If there is a God...please, please, please, don't let this woman get away with this - strike her down with lightning or something. That poor baby doesn't deserve this last insult.

Verdict: Not guilty of first degree murder

..I hope you get paid back....

[always2late]

I am shocked and saddened by this...and my heart breaks for that poor little girl. I think that at the very least it should have been a hung jury. If the evidence didn't support a conviction of first degree murder...then at the very least the jury should have asked themselves what kind of mother has a child die in an ACCIDENT and then allows the body to rot in the woods for months where its been dumped like trash while lying to the police? Ok...so its unclear whether she murdered her child or not (according to the evidence), but she KNEW the child was dead! She knew where the body was! And said NOTHING!! How can you reasonably let this woman walk??

My heart weeps...rest in peace little one.

[cinderella]

Or bought, if that were possible - hmmmm, I wonder...

omg....... this is upseting ......
the jury must of been on drugs

[Dante]

this is something difficult to keep emotion OUT of. Yes, 12 people had access to evidence, but that whole trial was on tv almost 24/7, so outside of photgraphs that werent shown on tv, I think the public got most of the same info, but I could be wrong.
MY emotions now are saved for that child who never stood a chance, and for any child she may have in the future, who could be in the same danger. I hesitate to say I hope Casey learns from this, and turns her life around, but *I* feel she is a narcisist and incapable of concern for anyone except her own self, and will not learn a thing.


If she walks free Tursday, which is a huge possiblility, where will she go I wonder? Would her parents allow her bak in their home? Would any of you, if this were your daughter? I dont know if I could or not, after all the lies, and her trying to lay the blame on me, accusations of molestation etc......


Peach, I believe this to be true. I believe that she WILL offend again. People like this, cannot control things like anger, they act on impulse and then usually act with violence, and then it is too late.
Regarding emotion. 1990, I was on a jury for 2 men being tried together, first degree murder, with possibly of the death penalty. I watched this entire case. I never want to be on a jury again. It is emotionally draining when you have to decide the fate for another human being. I believe this jury DID use their emotions and thereby, not follow the law! Several of my fellow jurors were affected by the so called Stockholm Syndrone, and because of the length of the trial and feeling or emotions for the defendant can develop. However, we were very conscious of our duties and felt we HAD to follow the law in that you are not to use your emotions or feelings for any and all parties involved. In my opinion, this jury took the easy way out. And they felt for poor little Casey. This makes me sick! Even the defense attorney in his closing put the dead body of little Caylee in HER trunk!!! WTF...It sucks that the jury wasn't allowed to see more evidence about Casey's priors and her behavior. I sincerely believe that we have not heard the last of Casey! She will become desperate again. Who is going to hire her? Doubt she will go live with the parents again.

[Medusa]

Gotta say that the defense was pretty genius with staging her as a tiny little thing. The pink shirts and ruffles? The ponytails? Lowering her chair almost all the way to the floor?

Psychological genius.

[cinderella]

In my OP, I stated that I'd only been 'sporadically' watching this case - so I don't know every little detail. My question to you, Medusa, is, what do you mean by 'abuse of a corpse'? How was the corpse abused? Can you elaborate? Perhaps this came out during a time I was not watching...thanks.

I wonder why the prosecution did not add "Abuse of a Corpse" to her charges? That would at least carry a felony charge that she might have been convicted for.

[Andrew, Jr.]

31 days this 2 yo little girl is missing...and her mother is out partying. I agree with George Anthony stating today that it was a "baseless defense". I am sure Judge Belvin Perry is also shocked. For me, it is the same as the OJ Simpson trial. God help us all.

[Medusa]

In my OP, I stated that I'd only been 'sporadically' watching this case - so I don't know every little detail. My question to you, Medusa, is, what do you mean by 'abuse of a corpse'? How was the corpse abused? Can you elaborate? Perhaps this came out during a time I was not watching...thanks.

What I meant was that in most states there are very strict laws dealing with the proper disposal of dead bodies and that, in this case, it is clear that even if the jury believed that Casey Anthony did not cause her child's death, she at the very least did not dispose of the body properly if we believe the (bullshit) story about her drowning in a pool.

Had I been the prosecuting attorney, I would have added the "corpse abuse" charge in order to at least guarantee a minimum sentence (1 year I think? with a maximum of 5?) even if the jury didnt find her guilty.

Because clearly, someone threw this child's body in the swamp and duct taped her and wrapped her in a bag. I dont recall hearing if there was ever an explanation as to how or who disposed of the body but I wish that charge would have been added.

[moxie]

I am glad I was not on that jury. I don't know what I would have decided, as from what I have read and seen, which is minimal, it would have been VERY difficult for me to make a decision based on law and not on emotion. And I say that because I was exposed to the media's interpretation of the case, not the facts that were presented in court. I've been a registered voter for 20 years and have never been called for jury duty, and when I think about it, I am somewhat glad I haven't been in fear I would get put on a case such as this.

I am not familiar with Florida law; however, I am surprised there wasn't an endangering the welfare of a minor charge in there.

I fully expect her to walk on Thursday with time served.

[Blade]

JVM just announced that George and Cindy are getting death threats. I can't imagine the kind of life Casey will have when she is freed, if her parents are getting death threats.

[Corkey]

I don't care what kind of life she's going to have, not guilty does not mean innocent, and she is not innocent, just not guilty. My anger is fully on the prosecution and their lousy case.

[AtLast]

Discussing the racial or class implications of this case does not mean that one believes that this woman is not guilty of murder. It is simply a side discussion about how very different POC are investigated, processed, represented, arrested and sentenced in our court systems. It is not equal justice for all.

On the other side of this, I firmly believed OJ Simpson murdered his ex-wife and the young man that was with her. No doubt what-so-ever. Yet, race played a part in that verdict as well (also a circumstantial case). Anyone from the LA area that is a POC can explain how very alive "Jim Crowe" is in the LAPD. And for may POC, that verdict was justified based upon years of biased treatment in the LAPD racially. I don’t agree with this thinking, but I see where it comes from and why.

I certainly had a problem with that verdict in terms of it allowing a psychopath free and I feel the same way about this case. But, I do see race and the media coverage as related- in both cases. POC with this kind of tragedy in their lives are not equally represented. Their missing children, are not subject to the same utilization of resources or support in attempting to find them in most cases.

I wouldn't mind the same thing happening to Casey Anthony that happened to OJ- eventually being convicted of a crime in which time is spent. Getting both of these people off the streets is a very good idea. So is Anthony not having any more children... but that brings me to...

.... the fact that POC have been the populations in the USA that have been subjected to forced/mandated sterilization types of proposed legislation. There is a lot of historical evidence supporting forced sterilization as a means to conduct genocide against POC. I do, however, support certain situations in which women could lose rights to a child/baby such as giving birth to one while being a chronic drug abuser and using while pregnant. But, I also think that under certain rehab situations, this should not be done. That is a whole other subject for another thread.

Talking forced sterilization makes me nervous. I wish Anthony would voluntarily get her tubes tied, but I doubt she will/would. I fear that since her having Kaylee, she was able to play her parents in many ways- it is so obvious to me that that little girl was thought of their "second chance" to raise a child more effectively. She was a very powerful means for Casey to manipulate her parents. This family is desperately dysfunctional. I can see Casey trying to get back in her parents graces by getting pregnant again in the future. That makes me want to scream- but I just can't go with forced sterilization given the history it has in the US in terms of racism.

There is no “excuse” for what this woman did, yet, in the eyes of the law, she was found not guilty. Consequently, the courts can’t do a thing in terms of her having children in the future. Scary.

I wonder now if her parents will attempt a wrongful death suit against her. They might have standing in terms of the care and housing they provided for her. Might be nice for them to get some of the money we all know Casey will be coming into with her “story” publication and donate it to missing children or victims of violent crimes organizations. If Kay lee’s biological father was ever around and cared, he could of brought such a suit. Yes, I am having trouble with this child’s death not having any kind of justice. But this case has a myriad of psychological, social and political implications. I fully expect to see her parents at a later date with Gloria Allred in tow at media events related to this case.

[TickledPink]

I wanted to be pissed off at the jury for being lazy and clueless.

I wanted to be pissed off at the prosecution for not presenting a better case.

I wanted to be pissed off at our judicial system.

I wanted to hurt this mother that could do that to a child, her child, any child!

But.......it doesn't bring this little girl back, does it? None of it.

So what do we do? :readfineprint: This is the biggest bunch of bullshit I've smelled in quite sometime!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

*shaking my head and going to cook dinner*

[cinderella]

Thank you for the explanation, Medusa. I also believe this was something that should have come into play - why wasn't the question asked? Here again, is a missed opportunity on the prosecutor's side...why, I wonder.

What I meant was that in most states there are very strict laws dealing with the proper disposal of dead bodies and that, in this case, it is clear that even if the jury believed that Casey Anthony did not cause her child's death, she at the very least did not dispose of the body properly if we believe the (bullshit) story about her drowning in a pool.

Had I been the prosecuting attorney, I would have added the "corpse abuse" charge in order to at least guarantee a minimum sentence (1 year I think? with a maximum of 5?) even if the jury didnt find her guilty.

Because clearly, someone threw this child's body in the swamp and duct taped her and wrapped her in a bag. I dont recall hearing if there was ever an explanation as to how or who disposed of the body but I wish that charge would have been added.

[Medusa]

Yeah, it was frustrating watching the defense throw out weird theories about how the meter man must have moved the body or how there was molestation or how she drowned in the swimming pool and not have to provide any evidence that what they were saying was the least bit true. I know this is the very cornerstone of our judicial system but I felt like the authorities finding this baby's body in a swamp less than a mile from the house and all the lies Casey told would have amounted to "Casey Anthoney, the child's mother, at the very LEAST commited manslaughter or child abuse"

I still can't get over the fact that the words "neck breaking" and "chloroform" were searched on the home computer, Casey's mother LIED about being the one doing it AND was busted out by computer forensics, and still? The jury didn't think that was at least some form of pre-meditation.

I dunno. Maybe she really did drown and Casey Anthony panicked and threw her body in the swamp. It still doesn't explain why she made up stories about "Zanny the Nanny" or her brother and father abusing her.

[Rockinonahigh]

CAsey Anthony got lucky,very lucky.At the very least I thought she would get time for child indangerment or child abuse.In my opinion she should be sent to a mental intsatution so she can get help,without it she will do something like this a again.One thing for sure she should never have another child in this lifetime.The only thing she had guilty in was lieing to the police,insted of doing any time for it she could be let go with time served.

[NJFemmie]

this is something difficult to keep emotion OUT of. Yes, 12 people had access to evidence, but that whole trial was on tv almost 24/7, so outside of photgraphs that werent shown on tv, I think the public got most of the same info, but I could be wrong.


Fact is, there was a lot of court room activity that the jury did not see and we were privy to it because of live feeds - discussions and arguments (what-have-you) that could have been crucial in the jury's decision making. How that happens is beyond me.

[Dude]

I dont get it.
I expected the death penalty. Now hearing this I am completely
floored.

[NJFemmie]

This is so very possible. I have known peeps that are sociopaths. They have no conscience, not capable of feelings for others, unable to control their actions. They use people for their own benefit and then discard them when not needing them anymore. I am also scared and very worried about Casey's future victims! Many people commented on facebook, and reminds us of all of the searches done on the computer. Is it possible that she was planning do kill the entire family??? Someone mentioned karma. Casey, you WILL pay. OJ is now in prison!


I know a few myself, and yes, it is a scary thought. If anyone thinks that she will feel guilt over this - she won't - at least not for a very long time (if ever). The psychology associated with this type of behavior prevents them from having a conscience. They may SAY they have one, but they don't. They are geared to tell you whatever it is they need to get by for their own benefit.

Youtube the Casey Anthony tapes where she was recorded while interviewed by police, etc. Not one ounce of remorse or regret or guilt was found in her voice. Listen to all the lies and how unbelievable they are. Listen to how agitated she gets when Caylee is mentioned. Me Me Me is all you hear.

I doubt she wanted to kill her entire family. Cindy? Hmmm, maybe. She had some issues with her mother and that was obvious in those tapes. But she was close to George. I have no clue about her relationship with Lee.

*sigh* This verdict really bothers me.

[JustJo]

I wonder now if her parents will attempt a wrongful death suit against her. They might have standing in terms of the care and housing they provided for her. Might be nice for them to get some of the money we all know Casey will be coming into with her “story” publication and donate it to missing children or victims of violent crimes organizations. If Kay lee’s biological father was ever around and cared, he could of brought such a suit.

And I also hope that the real Zenaida (sp?) Gonzalez...who was interviewed, put on TV and put through some hell......and also the black man (whose name I am drawing a blank on because my brain is mush) who is an ex-convict and currently has the phone number George Anthony was accused of calling both bring lawsuits against her as well.

They both had their personal lives dragged through the media and were connected with this case in a very highly publicized way based solely on Casey's lies.

I'd rather they get whatever money she ends up earning by "telling her story."

I don't dispute the fact that POC are treated differently in our justice system (or "just us" system as I prefer to call it)....but I don't think this case is about race, other than the deeply disturbing accusations and lies....that a Hispanic woman stole the baby and a black ex-con must have been involved.

For me it just feels like a victory for narcissism.

I respect the way our system is set up. It's better that a guilty person go free than an innocent person be convicted. I just don't agree with what's happened here. I know that juries are human and therefore not perfect....I just find this all heartbreaking and disturbing.

[NJFemmie]

The real Zenaida already stated that she will sue Casey for defamation. She was denied employment because she was believed to be a baby kidnapper.

I hope they appeal and file a civil suit. It will keep Casey in the judicial system for a while if nothing else.

[JustJo]

The real Zenaida already stated that she will sue Casey for defamation. She was denied employment because she was believed to be a baby kidnapper.

I hope they appeal and file a civil suit. It will keep Casey in the judicial system for a while if nothing else.

Good! I hope Zenaida wins a great big pile of Casey's future money.

[Corkey]

Civil case yes, but she can't be retried for the same crime in a criminal case, there is no appeal for that.

[Kobi]

Now that the jury is free to speak if they choose too, it will be interesting to hear them explain why they saw this the way they did.

It is disconcerting to see so many people judging them, accusing them, second guessing them without waiting to hear their side of the story. They were there, we werent.

They werent bombarded with the conjecture of every lawyer the media could find, the thoughts of all these legal pundits, the thoughts of anyone who wished to venture an opinion. They just had the facts presented in the court.

But somehow us armchair jurors know better? We somehow know the truth? We somehow are endowed with special powers to know what happened and who was responsible? And we know this beyond a shadow of a doubt?

I understand the anger at a perceived injustice. I understand wanting justice for this innocent child. I understand the many ways in which disappointment can be expressed. I'm also kind of familiar with :overreaction: that can occur after a case like this.

Justice isnt perfect. People arent perfect. Prosecutors make mistakes. Defense attorneys get lucky. It's life. It sucks. But its reality.

Emotions, running amok, in the name of justice leads to things like death threats, assaults, lynchings, war, and other vigilante actions.

Sometimes, taking a step back, and a deep breath leads to a cooler head, calmer emotions, and more rational thought.

Less drama, more thought....what a novel idea.

[The_Lady_Snow]

I'm perfectly ok shedding a tear and mourning the death of an innocent child, and glad we can all come in here together and do so if we wish without fingerwagging.

[Corkey]

And while I have respect for the law, I do mourn the loss of a truly innocent child.

[princessbelle]

Kobi,


With all due respect....

I don't believe people posting here that we feel that a murderer was set free by a "not guilty" verdict is equating in any way to death threats or lynching.

The jury made their decision based on what the law instructed. We all know this. Doesn't explain the why, just the how.

Some of us are upset due to the idea that a woman who killed her child is going to walk. Justifiably so.

Talking about this issues is healthy IMO. Communication with others, and not a singular thought of sadness held within, is how some of us deal with the dissatisfaction of our justice system which failed miserably IMO today.

Nothing unhealthy about discussion.

[Kobi]

Kobi,


With all due respect....

I don't believe people posting here that we feel that a murderer was set free by a "not guilty" verdict is equating in any way to death threats or lynching.

The jury made their decision based on what the law instructed. We all know this. Doesn't explain the why, just the how.

Some of us are upset due to the idea that a woman who killed her child is going to walk. Justifiably so.

Talking about this issues is healthy IMO. Communication with others, and not a singular thought of sadness held within, is how some of us deal with the dissatisfaction of our justice system which failed miserably IMO today.

Nothing unhealthy about discussion.


princessbelle,

With all due respect, the woman was tried and found not guilty.

Even saying in your opinion that a "murderer was set free" is not healthy discourse. She was not proven to be a murderer. Saying she is one is deliberately inflammatory and drama provoking.

I have seen this dynamic run amok before under the guise of healthy discourse. I saw it when Michael Vick returned to the NFL and was praised by the President. Suddenly a man who was tried, convicted, and served his time needed to be raked over the coals in a very unnice way cuz people were disappointed with Obama's words on Vick.

I saw it with the "victims of the Superbowl". I saw it with bullying, saw it in "a site unexamined".

Ya'll have a thing for drama and anger. That isnt healthy discourse. Thats just drama and rage.

But we can agree to disagree. :)

[Queerasfck]

princessbelle,

With all due respect, the woman was tried and found not guilty.

Even saying in your opinion that a "murderer was set free" is not healthy discourse. She was not proven to be a murderer. Saying she is one is deliberately inflammatory and drama provoking.

I have seen this dynamic run amok before under the guise of healthy discourse. I saw it when Michael Vick returned to the NFL and was praised by the President. Suddenly a man who was tried, convicted, and served his time needed to be raked over the coals in a very unnice way cuz people were disappointed with Obama's words on Vick.

I saw it with the "victims of the Superbowl". I saw it with bullying, saw it in "a site unexamined".

Ya'll have a thing for drama and anger. That isnt healthy discourse. Thats just drama and rage.

But we can agree to disagree. :)



Well this seems like shit stirring to me. And very unhealthy behavior.

[Dude]

then there's this pesky thing called justified anger
which to me is not about drama at all but real life

[Mister Bent]

Ya'll have a thing for drama and anger. That isnt healthy discourse. Thats just drama and rage.




To whom, exactly, does this refer?

[Semantics]

princessbelle,

With all due respect, the woman was tried and found not guilty.

Even saying in your opinion that a "murderer was set free" is not healthy discourse. She was not proven to be a murderer. Saying she is one is deliberately inflammatory and drama provoking.

I have seen this dynamic run amok before under the guise of healthy discourse. I saw it when Michael Vick returned to the NFL and was praised by the President. Suddenly a man who was tried, convicted, and served his time needed to be raked over the coals in a very unnice way cuz people were disappointed with Obama's words on Vick.

I saw it with the "victims of the Superbowl". I saw it with bullying, saw it in "a site unexamined".

Ya'll have a thing for drama and anger. That isnt healthy discourse. Thats just drama and rage.

But we can agree to disagree. :)




Why is it that people have to come in and try and parent other adults?

That's not really offering healthy discourse. It's silencing.


With all due respect,



Ya'll have a thing for drama and anger. That isnt healthy discourse. Thats just drama and rage.




I saw very little drama and rage and plenty of thoughtful discussion.

The drama I saw was someone (you) coming in and starting off a lecturing post with "with all due respect" and then accusing the rest of us (I assume that's what you meant by ya'll) of being dramatic and full of rage.

What's also strange is that you directed it at a member who is neither dramatic or full of rage, so it looks like you're just annoyed in general and may have been looking for an opportunity to get it off your mind.

I'm sure you can consider your opinion noted. :)

[Novelafemme]

Casey's actions after the fact can't be ignored. Someone dumped her body like trash. Someone drove around with her dead body in Casey's car. Someone put duct tape on her mouth. If it was truly an accident, she wouldn't have been out partying like nothing was wrong.

If your kid goes missing for 30 minutes and you don't report it you're a bad parent. 30 days and you go partying and never report it, you most likely killed her - sometimes written law sucks and common sense must take over.

[princessbelle]

princessbelle,

With all due respect, the woman was tried and found not guilty.

Even saying in your opinion that a "murderer was set free" is not healthy discourse. She was not proven to be a murderer. Saying she is one is deliberately inflammatory and drama provoking.

I have seen this dynamic run amok before under the guise of healthy discourse. I saw it when Michael Vick returned to the NFL and was praised by the President. Suddenly a man who was tried, convicted, and served his time needed to be raked over the coals in a very unnice way cuz people were disappointed with Obama's words on Vick.

I saw it with the "victims of the Superbowl". I saw it with bullying, saw it in "a site unexamined".

Ya'll have a thing for drama and anger. That isnt healthy discourse. Thats just drama and rage.

But we can agree to disagree. :)




Kobi,

I was truly trying to be considerate when i responded to you and stick to the thread's OP.

However, you are wrong. We don't have to agree on anything.

Our United States Judicial System must adhere to strict guidelines especially in capital murdur cases. Being found "not guilty" is not the same as being found innocent. Many times due to information being withheld from jurors over mistakes on obtaining evidence and so forth, jurors have caused many people to be sent to jail who were innocent as well as some that are free that are guilty. That, is a fact.

I believe this woman killed her child. I have that right to believe that. It is not drama provoking at all. It is MY opinion. There are lots of opinions here.

What is unhealthy is belittling MY opinion, accusing ME of unhealthy discourse and saying "ya'll" have a thing for anger and drama.

Pretty sure we were doing fine before you told "us" to take a deep breath and have calmer emotions. Pretty sure i don't need someone else to tell me how i feel. Pretty sure my emotions were and are in check.

I'm just upset at what happened today. If you don't agree with what i say, so be it. At this point, I truly don't give a flying fuck.

As far as what you just said trying to rip me a new one?

I did not deserve that.

VERY UNCOOL.

I'm done with this little blah blah...

On with the topic....

[Dude]

a bumper sticker thought

If you're not outraged you're not paying attention.

[BullDog]

I do agree that our legal system- like all of our social institutions and culture- is racist. I have no doubt in mind that the way this case was discussed in the media would have been far different if the mother was a woman of color. The outcome of the case could have very well been different as well.

I do feel the jury was in a tough spot. The standard of Reasonable Doubt does need to be high to protect the innocent. People of color are also the most likely to be falsely accused of crimes.

I remember watching the O.J. Simpson case. I followed it quite closely. I was absolutely convinced he killed his former wife. To this day I don't understand how anyone could kill the mother of his children. However I also remember thinking to myself if I had been on that jury I don't know if I could have voted to convict him even though I was absolutely convinced he did kill her. There were too many holes in the case, too much evidence not handled properly, etc. It sounds like in this case there may have been too much reasonable doubt to convict her of first degree murder, but I also agree there should have been other charges other than first degree murder that she could have been charged with. I don't know what caused this. Several factors no doubt. I don't understand why she wasn't convicted of child abuse or manslaughter.

The Standard of Reasonable Doubt does get abused. On the murder trial I was on the man accused of murder had a rich father and he had two very talented attorneys. Weeks were spent going over this man's whole life story and how bad it had been for him. I think there should be limits to how much of a person's life story gets brought into play. We all have to be responsible adults, especially if we are the parent or guardian of a child.

Much of what goes on in a courtroom is actually quite theatrical. The cases don't come to trial for many months or many years. It's not hard for a talented attorney to cast doubt on what someone says on the witness stand. There's lots of back and forth between the attorneys which the jury is instructed to ignore. You can be in the courtroom for ten minutes and then told to leave and have that same thing happen several times in one day. It's all very choppy. Things are thrown out that you are supposed to pretend you didn't hear. Members of the jury are "courted" through eye contact, friendly smiles, etc. As a juror who is trying to do your job you just want to get down to the relevant facts. It can be quite frustrating.

I do think our legal system is quite flawed, but I have served on a jury and would do so again if called. I also vote. I do what I can. There are people in this world who do not have the legal and political rights that we have in the United States. As a white person I certainly do have rights and privileges that people of color do not have. I am not sure what can be done about our legal system. I do agree it is quite flawed, but part me still does believe in a jury system of some kind.

I do mourn for the loss of this child and for all children who are killed, harmed or neglected in any way. I support those who are expressing your outrage and grief. I do understand.

[NJFemmie]

Casey's actions after the fact can't be ignored. Someone dumped her body like trash. Someone drove around with her dead body in Casey's car. Someone put duct tape on her mouth. If it was truly an accident, she wouldn't have been out partying like nothing was wrong.

If your kid goes missing for 30 minutes and you don't report it you're a bad parent. 30 days and you go partying and never report it, you most likely killed her - sometimes written law sucks and common sense must take over.

....even if it was an accident, and this body was dumped somewhere to maybe hide the fact that you are a negligent parent ....

Remember - Casey lied about having a job - she took it further to claim that this imaginary job gave her a promotion that would require her to work nights - just so she could go out and party. Cindy (her mother) expressed that she was getting a little tired of being used as a constant babysitter ... Casey didn't want to own up to her responsibility as a parent .... Casey had some decisions to make.


With all due respect, the woman was tried and found not guilty.

Even saying in your opinion that a "murderer was set free" is not healthy discourse. She was not proven to be a murderer. Saying she is one is deliberately inflammatory and drama provoking.

Ya'll have a thing for drama and anger. That isnt healthy discourse. Thats just drama and rage.


It doesn't take rocket science to do simple math. She may have been found not guilty, and for all intents and purposes, the jury says she is not a murderer. Why is it that most people in this country (and around the world) feel otherwise?

Yes, there are judgments, heated emotions, anger and disappointment in the way this case played out. Normally, I myself try not to let certain things get to me - and I don't consider myself a drama mama - but when it comes to baby and animal abuse - I go insane with anger - and admittingly, sometimes rage. But you know what? Expressing it is normal. Venting is normal. Sharing it is normal. What is unhealthy is not letting it out if it affects you in such a way. If you aren't affected by anything in the same manner as someone else, that's totally fine but I don't believe it necessary to tell someone to tone it down unless they are totally out of control and intentionally hurting someone else because of misdirected emotion. And I certainly don't think it's ok to tell someone how and what they should think, or how they should feel about it.

[girl_dee]

Hell I'm outraged and angry! It's very hard not to wish the same fate to the murderer, tenfold. I am not there yet. I may never get there. I want this woman to suffer.

Fuck the reverent manner in which we speak about this. We are respectful to each other and without being told to do so.

This bitch killed her beautiful innocent baby. NO one should get away with that no matter what !

[girl_dee]

The jury did not say she is not a murderer, they said it wasn't proven.

[always2late]

The fact is that "we" (the public) saw more evidence than the jury did. Things that may be judged inadmissible in court are still allowed in the public forum. It is based on those facts that I have formed the OPINION that Caylee's mother is guilty of her murder. And, as such, I am outraged that she is free.

I am sickened that a beautiful little girl is dead. I am saddened that a child never had the chance to live or reach her full potential, whatever that may have been. And it breaks my heart that in ten years when Caylee would have been 15, most people will have forgotten that she even existed at all. I believe her mother is the one responsible for removing her from existence. I think that the only logical response to what I perceive to be true IS outrage. But, of course, that is MY opinion.

[NJFemmie]

It's part of human nature to try and make sense of irrational actions. The bottom line truly is that a beautiful little girl is dead and her death is shrouded in mystery and foul play. As a mother, whether it was an accident or not, there is responsibility as a parent. I'm not saying that George may or may not have had anything to do with this .... that in itself is it's own ugly web of lies. But lying to the police, IMO, was not enough for Casey. Covering up an accidental death is also a crime.

Unfortunately, everything is and always has been speculation, and all I can say is Casey dodged a bullet - she showed more emotion when she was found not guilty than she did when she was accused of killing her daughter or during the whole time her daughter was "missing". Her attorney - just got lucky.

[NJFemmie]

The jury did not say she is not a murderer, they said it wasn't proven.

You are correct. I should have been more precise and said the jury acquitted her of murder.

[girl_dee]

You are correct. I should have been more precise and said the jury acquitted her of murder.

I'm sorry, I was not correcting you, I just want to point out that even if every jury member felt she was guilty, they also felt they could not convict without more evidence.

[NJFemmie]

I'm sorry, I was not correcting you, I just want to point out that even if every jury member felt she was guilty, they also felt they could not convict without more evidence.

Ain't no thing ;) I should have been more precise - I am sure there are jurors who do think she was guilty, but had to make their decision based on evidence (or rather, lack thereof).

[girl_dee]

Ain't no thing ;) I should have been more precise - I am sure there are jurors who do think she was guilty, but had to make their decision based on evidence (or rather, lack thereof).

Yup and that must be one hard thing to do, grrrrr.

[NJFemmie]

Yup and that must be one hard thing to do, grrrrr.

.... agreed.

[Melissa]

I wonder why the prosecution did not add "Abuse of a Corpse" to her charges? That would at least carry a felony charge that she might have been convicted for.

I thought it was strange too. I think it is because there is no proof as to who actually transported and buried her out there.


Melissa

[Melissa]

I'm sorry, I was not correcting you, I just want to point out that even if every jury member felt she was guilty, they also felt they could not convict without more evidence.

I think so too. Something or someone led to her death. But the who and the how were never proven. It could have been a premeditated murder or an accident and then a panicked response from the mother or grandparents, even. Someone did something and there are one or more guilty people, but no evidence to say who.

It seems the whole family had an issue with the truth, not just Casey. It was all very muddy. I watched some of the CNN coverage and most of the defense closing and all I could think was, God, I would not want to be on that jury because I could not see any other verdict but not guilty. And its not because she is not guilty, its because no evidence was found. She's a liar, she's messed up, and she seems to be disconnected from reality. she's probably responsible for the death of her child, but its all about the probably. And there are plenty of lying, messed up, disconnected from reality mothers who don't kill their children or even physically abuse them.

Melissa

[suebee]

I haven't been following this case. After my years in child protection I deliberately don't follow cases like this. But - from what is being posted here my thoughts are as follows: 1) The jury only had what was presented to them to work with, and that, within the confines of the law. I can only assume they did the best they could with what they had. 2) I have got to say that as imperfect as the system is I'd rather see a guilty person go free than an innocent one spend their life in jail or worse. I try to keep in mind that there are OTHER ways that the unconvicted guilty ones pay for their crimes. 3) I can only hope that the prosecution went to trial having presented the best case possible rather than rushing to trial with a weak case because of public pressure. Sometimes the evidence needed to convict just isn't there. Let's hope that's the case here. 4) This leaves me wondering if there was/is any other way to make the mother accountable for her actions or to prevent further tragedies involving this woman. While the criminal justice system has a "beyond reasonable doubt" burden of proof, child protection laws usually have a lesser standard - usually more like if there IS reasonable doubt that the safety of the child is at risk.

I can only hope that if Kaylee ever has another earthly life to live, that she will be loved and doted on beyond her wildest imagination. I'm sorry for what happened to you little princess. (w)

Sue

[RavynTuqiri]

...I know this is going to go against popular belief but I think the jury actually made the right decision. Remember that what we see through news media isn't always presented in court (or allowed to be presented). I have watched the trial proceedings off and on and if I were on the jury, I would be significantly torn between "feeling" she was guilty by her actions (before, during and after Caylee's disappearance and body being found), and having enough evidence to "think" beyond a reasonable doubt that she was guilty.

The coroner's report listed cause of death as homicide solely on the premise that duct tape was found over the mouth but could not determine forensically how that homicide had been carried out. There was no physical evidence to tie anyone within the family to any homicide.

As much of an injustice this is for little Caylee...I do believe that the jury made the right decision give the facts they had to deal with. The only thing proven beyond any reasonable doubt was that Casey lies. Being a liar doesn't inherently make one a murderer.

And I don't see how race plays into this or the OJ case. Wealth played into the OJ case. He bought the best damn defense team money could buy. He got what he paid for.

Casey didn't have the best defense team...she was lucky the state could only garner the evidence it did. For as horrific this case was, they (the prosecution) should have deferred charges until they had a more solid case.

Now with all that said...do I feel like Casey is guilty? Yes. Of pre-meditated murder? Not so sure on that one....but feel she did cause her daughter's death, accidental or not.

What I do find perplexing is that this case has grabbed headline news worldwide and others, like Christian Choate from Gary, Ind...has had very little:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/26/christian-choate-boy-who-_n_884731.html

I think her and the Anthony family grabbed headlines because of their social status...not because her crime was unique (unfortunately) or overly atrocious as some child abuse / parent-child homicide cases are.

[RavynTuqiri]

And for the record...if I was ever to be accused of a crime that i wasn't guilty of...I would be taking the stand in my own defense. I am a mom, I have a child...if she were ever to have been murdered and I stood accused...no one could keep me off of the stand to have my say. No one could keep me out of the media to combat the circus around my daughter's death.

But then again....look what the media did to John and Patsy Ramsey. It took over 10 years for technology to develop along far enough to exonerate them both (but not quick enough before Patsy passed away).....

Makes you think what the impact the media, and all its avenues to paint distorted pictures of cases like this, plays on our judicial system.

[BullDog]

What astounds me is how someone could admit to covering up an "accidental" death and only get a max of 4 years in prison for it. Whether the little girl was killed or died accidentally the fact that her body wasn't recovered for so long made it extremely difficult to have any real investigation as to the cause of her death. So how could she get a max of 4 years for this? This isn't just about lying, she was obstructing the investigation. Not that I really believe the drowning story.

The theory that the child drowned and evil father decides this needs to be covered up doesn't make a lick of sense to me. If a child accidentally drowns of course there will be an investigation and it's going to be questioned why the adults in the house weren't looking after her better. However if you try to cover up a death by going out to bury a body there are way too many things that could go wrong and if discovered you are going to be in lots more hot water than reporting an accidental death. I would think a former police officer like the father would know this better than anyone. It makes no sense.

Also was there any solid proof offered that the mother had been abused or how this connected to the crime? The defense bringing this in seems quite reckless to me. All they have to do is offer a hint of suggestion and have little Casey slump down in her chair to look more child-like herself but offer no real proof? How many women who were abused as children would try to cover up their child's "accidental" death and then move in with their boyfriend and go out partying?

[Toughy]

jurors were affected by the so called Stockholm Syndrone, and because of the length of the trial and feeling or emotions for the defendant can develop.

This is not a true statement. Stockholm Syndrome is not about jurors who may or may not be sequestered in a long trial. Suggesting that it could apply to a jury ignores and downplays the true nature of this phenomena. It is about hostages....folks taken against their will and kept captive. It is about empathy with the captors. Patty Hearst is probably the best known case in the US.

Having feelings or emotions about a defendant as a juror in a trial is an entirely different thing.

------------------------------
We (citizens of the US) have known for decades that race and class have everything to do with prosecution and prison time. If you don't believe it, just look at Oscar Grant (by the way....BART cops shot and killed a guy with a knife a couple of days ago on a BART platform) and at the arrest of a POC for the beating of a white guy in LA at a baseball game. That POC still has not been charged in that case, but they got him on a parole violation and he is in jail right now (there were weapons in the house he was arrested in....not his weapons). He didn't have anything to do with beating the paramedic white guy....oh the poor kids and wife of the white guy, so get the first convenient brown tattoed gang guy.

Anyway as to Casey Anthony. I have no idea what she did or didn't do. I don't listen to emtional bullshit spit out by TV entertainment news anchors. Justice is never accomplished when everyone does that. I am sure Walter Cronkite is spinning in his grave over Julie Chen crying on TV about this verdict. I am also very glad Nancy Grace is no longer a prosecutor.

[RavynTuqiri]

...
What I do find perplexing is that this case has grabbed headline news worldwide and others, like Christian Choate from Gary, Ind...has had very little:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/26/christian-choate-boy-who-_n_884731.html

I think her and the Anthony family grabbed headlines because of their social status...not because her crime was unique (unfortunately) or overly atrocious as some child abuse / parent-child homicide cases are.

And thanks to Scota for posting the lesser known case of Christian in another forum and bringing a greater awareness to child abuse as a whole.

[Novelafemme]

And thanks to Scota for posting the lesser known case of Christian in another forum and bringing a greater awareness to child abuse as a whole.

I read that yesterday online and a piece of my heart broke. That sweet, sweet boy. Children should never-ever have to experience even a second of such pain and sorrow.

[JustJo]

...What I do find perplexing is that this case has grabbed headline news worldwide and others, like Christian Choate from Gary, Ind...has had very little:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/26/christian-choate-boy-who-_n_884731.html

I think her and the Anthony family grabbed headlines because of their social status...not because her crime was unique (unfortunately) or overly atrocious as some child abuse / parent-child homicide cases are.

I think this case got such intense and lasting media coverage, not because of the family's social status, but because they were setting up tents, getting involved with Child Find (I think that's the name) and pulling in 4,000 volunteers to search for their "missing" child by going on the news and begging people to help them find her.

They set themselves up for the media coverage that followed.

[girl_dee]

2008
June 16, 2008 — 2-year-old Caylee Anthony is last seen alive leaving the home of her grandparents, George and Cindy Anthony, along with her mother Casey.
June 18, 2008 — Casey Anthony borrows a shovel from Brian Burner, a neighbor of George and Cindy Anthony. Burner says that Anthony returned it an hour later.
June 20, 2008 — Casey Anthony is captured in various photos partying at Fusion nightclub and participating in a “hard body contest.”
June 23, 2008 — Casey Anthony and her boyfriend, Lazzaro, break into a shed at the Anthony family home to borrow her father’s gas cans to fill her car, which had run empty.
June 24, 2008 — Casey Anthony gets into a fight with George Anthony about the gas can and she storms out of the home. She tells her father that Caylee is with the babysitter, Zanny.
June 25, 2008 — Cell phone records show she was in the area of her parents’ home.
July 15, 2008 — George and Cindy Anthony pick up Casey’s car from a tow yard. George Anthony observes a strong odor emanating from the vehicle. Later, back at the Anthony family home, Casey tells her mother and brother, Lee Anthony, that she hasn't seen Caylee in a month and that a babysitter named Zanaida Fernandez Gonzalez (Zanny) kidnapped her.
July 15-16, 2008 — Casey Anthony takes police to the last place she says she saw Caylee. It turns out to be a vacant apartment. Authorities also take her to Universal Studios where she said she worked. She kept walking with them and then suddenly halted when she was almost at the door of what she claimed was her office. The police testified that she then suddenly stopped and stated that she really did not work there. In fact, supervisors told the police that she hadn’t worked there in more than two years.
October 14, 2008 — Casey Anthony indicted on charges of first-degree murder, along with aggravated manslaughter, aggravated child abuse and four counts of lying to police.
December 11, 2008 — The skeletal remains of Caylee Anthony are discovered in a wooded area not far from the Anthony family home.
2009
January 22, 2009 — The Florida State Attorney's Office releases 311 pages of new documents in the Caylee Anthony case. According to the documents, Caylee's skeletal remains had been placed in a cloth laundry hamper bag, prior to being placed inside a black plastic garbage bag. The documents further reveal that a backpack with the word 'adorable' on it, a Winnie the Pooh blanket, a size 3T shirt, a pair of child's striped white shorts and small, cloth-type, iron on letters were found inside the bag. A search-warrant affidavit which detailed the discovery of the remains also described a "heart shaped" sticker that had been placed on duct tape that was found wrapped around the child's skull.[82]
January 23, 2009 — Casey Anthony's father, George Anthony, is escorted to a hospital by police after he allegedly sends suicidal text messages to family members.
April 14, 2009 — The State of Florida seeks the imposition of the Death Penalty.
June 19, 2009 — The Orange-Osceola State Attorney's Office released the 36-page Medical Examiner's report on Caylee Marie Anthony's autopsy, along with dozens of other pages of forensic reports.
August 25, 2009 — The state releases more than 2,000 pages of documents in the case, including photos from a picture-sharing Web site and aerial photos of where Caylee's remains were found.
September 8, 2009 — A judge in Orlando postpones making a decision on whether to dismiss a defamation lawsuit filed against Casey Anthony by Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez.
September 17, 2009 — Casey Anthony's defense team files a motion to dismiss the murder charges against her because the state allegedly failed to preserve evidence in the case.
September 29, 2009 — The state releases additional discovery documents in the case, including forensic reports from the FBI lab in Quantico, Va., that confirmed Caylee's identity. Among the documents is a report that states the duct tape found on Caylee's mouth had been contaminated by an FBI evidence examiner.
October 6, 2009 — Assistant State Attorney Linda Drane Burdick responds to the defenses motion to dismiss the charges against Casey Anthony, claiming the motion is "legally flawed". Burdick contends it will be decided at the "close of all evidence" whether the state has proven its case.
October 9, 2009 — The state releases 1,400 pages of documents in the case, including photos and evidence from the FBI crime lab. Among the photos are pictures of Casey Anthony's infamous "La Bella Vida" (beautiful life) tattoo.
October 20, 2009 — Judge Jose R. Rodriguez denies the motion to dismiss the defamation lawsuit against Casey Anthony.
November 6, 2009 — The state releases more discovery documents in the case, including reports that a bullet shell casing was found in the vicinity where Caylee Anthony's remains were found.
December 11, 2009 — Casey Anthony breaks down in court when Jeff Ashton gives the State's account of how Caylee was murdered.
December 18, 2009 — Judge Stan Strickland denies a request to take the death penalty off the table in the prosecution of Casey Anthony.
2010
February 16, 2010 — The state releases three CD's of photos and documents in the case, including photographs of a syringe, Gatorade bottle and a child's car seat.
April 6, 2010 — Prosecutors release copies of letters that were allegedly exchanged between Casey Anthony and a jailhouse companion. Within the letter, Anthony allegedly claims Zenaida Gonzalez does not exist. Prosecutors further allege the letter reveals details about Caylee's remains that only her killer would be privy to.
April 19, 2010 — Judge Stan Strickland steps down after Casey Anthony's defense team files a motion accusing him of having a personal relationship with a pro-prosecution blogger. Strickland granted the motion not on the basis that the relationship was inappropriate, but because the accusation would "generate renewed allegations of bias". Judge Belvin Perry Jr. is appointed to take over the case.
April 23, 2010 — The state releases 300 pages of documents in the case, including FBI lab notes, which show investigators tore apart four vacuum cleaners that had been taken from the Anthony family home. The vacuum cleaners were examined for human hair with characteristics of human decomposition. None were found.
July 15, 2010 — Judge Belvin Perry rules the jury will be permitted to hear a 911 call made by Casey Anthony's mother, Cindy, in which she says the odor coming from her daughters car smells like a dead body.
July 26, 2010 — Casey Anthony's attorney, Jose Baez, lashes out at an unidentified blogger for allegedly using photos from his Facebook profile. In addition to removing the photos, Baez claims he has contacted a civil lawyer to prepare a court case against the blogger.
July 30, 2010 — Casey Anthony's defense attorneys spend three hours deposing Roy Kronk, the former Orange County employee who found Caylee Anthony's remains in December 2008.
August 9, 2010 — Casey Anthony's defense team files a motion accusing George and Cindy Anthony's former attorney, Mark NeJame, of obstruction and promoting his own interests by approaching crime writer David Lohr about writing a book on the case and discussing a plea deal Anthony had allegedly been offered. NeJame acknowledged he did discuss a book with Lohr, but says there was a misunderstanding about the plea deal.
August 16, 2010 — George and Cindy Anthony's attorney, Brad Conway, steps down because of a motion filed by Casey Anthony's attorney, Jose Baez. The defense attorney claimed Conway was given unrestricted access to documents belonging to Texas EquuSearch, the missing person search and recovery group that searched for two-year-old Caylee Anthony. Baez claimed he was not given the same access to the documents.
August 30, 2010 — Casey Anthony's lawyers submit an amended witness list to the court that includes Anthony's family members, expert witnesses, law enforcement officials and David Lohr, a crime writer who covered the search effort for Investigation Discovery.
September 28, 2010 — Judge Belvin Perry denies a request made by Casey Anthony's defense attorneys to allow Dutch experts to do additional DNA testing on evidence that is to be submitted at trial. According to the Orlando Sentinel, Perry said he did not feel comfortable allowing evidence to leave the court's jurisdiction.
November 2, 2010 — The State of Florida releases 1,000 pages of evidence in the Casey Anthony case. The documents include letters that were sent to Casey Anthony in jail, as well as e-mail conversations among Anthony family members from 2008.
November 29, 2010 — Judge Belvin Perry denies a request made by prosecutors to order Casey Anthony's defense team to turn over information about their expert witnesses, including contracts, communications and billing records. In making his decision, Perry said prosecutors could obtain the information via the witnesses themselves or a subpoena.
2011
February 11, 2011 — Judge Belvin Perry rules that Casey Anthony's alleged history of lying and stealing is admissible in court.
February 15, 2011 — Judge Belvin Perry rules that postings by Casey Anthony allegedly made to social networking websites prior to her indictment can be presented to a jury by prosecutors. Perry also ruled that only portions of Anthony's sex life will be admissible at trial.
April 27, 2011 — Judge Allows Chloroform Test evidence to be presented at trial, rejecting a motion by Casey Anthony. The prosecution claims tests revealed significant amounts of chloroform in the trunk of Casey's car.
May 9, 2011 — Jury selection begins in Clearwater for Casey Anthony’s murder trial.
May 24, 2011 — Trial begins in Orlando, Florida. The prosecution shows jurors a photo during opening statements of Caylee Anthony alive and smiling, along with a picture of the girl’s skull as it was found in 2008. They say Anthony used duct tape to suffocate her. The defense contends the child actually drowned in her grandparents’ swimming pool.
June 17, 2011 — Casey Anthony defense expert contradicts state entomologist.[83]
July 5, 2011 — Casey Anthony acquitted of all felony charges (i.e., of first-degree murder, aggravated manslaughter, and aggravated child abuse), but is convicted of misdemeanor charges of giving false information to police.[84]

Every time I read something I find more lies and deceit. How sad.

[Toughy]

Every time I read something I find more lies and deceit. How sad.

She was convicted of lies and deceit. The prosecution proved beyond a reasonable doubt she lied. They, however, could not do that for manslaughter or murder.

-------------------------------

Just reading the timeline this thought came to my head and was based on the amount of information the prosecution released prior to and during the trial:

The prosecution is trying this case in the media because it has only circumstantial evidence against Casey for the death of her child..

I will say this about her partying and her tatoo. Grief is a funny thing and folks deal with it in a myriad of ways from isolation to partying to having affairs (think John Edwards) to crying for days to __________. I never fault anyone for the way they grieve or express their loss. It's not my place to say there is a right way and a wrong way to grieve.

[NJFemmie]

The jury made a decision based on what the law required of them.
Doesn't mean it was the right one.

[Corkey]

In the eyes of the law it was the only one to make. I for one want the prosecution to Prove their case in a Capitol crime case. And so does the law.
Like I said before she is not innocent, but under the law she is not guilty.

[NJFemmie]

In the eyes of the law it was the only one to make. I for one want the prosecution to Prove their case in a Capitol crime case. And so does the law.
Like I said before she is not innocent, but under the law she is not guilty.

Isn't that what I just said? ;)

[Corkey]

Isn't that what I just said? ;)

No you said it wasn't the right one. The only one under the law is the right one.

[NJFemmie]

No you said it wasn't the right one. The only one under the law is the right one.

The one under the law is the required one.
As far as I am concerned, it wasn't the right one.
And I don't stand alone on that feeling.

[Corkey]

You have that right, as I have mine. Either the law is right, or it isn't, and if it isn't then it has to be changed.

[The_Lady_Snow]

That woman is a cold, lying, heartless killer, she'll do it again she can't help herself!

[Corkey]

She very well may be, it wasn't proven in a court of law. Her being a liar was. Like I said not innocent.

[AtLast]

Juror: Casey Anthony verdict was the right one
Prosecution failed to prove murder beyond reasonable doubt, alternate juror says, but admits questions remain unanswered


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43651613/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/

------

One thing that strikes me with this man's thoughts is about "no motive" being presented by the prosecution. Motive is NOT required to be supplied by the prosecution to prove guilt. Yet, so many jury verdicts hang on motive. Big mistake not to address motive in cases, I think even when it isn't necessary. Most people want to know the "Why?".

[The_Lady_Snow]

I'll be boycotting ANY magazine ( Life, Time, People, Etc) that. Buys the right to that pariah's story!

[Corkey]

The woman will never have any kind of productive life, and I'm good with that.

[JustJo]

The woman will never have any kind of productive life, and I'm good with that.

Well....I don't think she cares about having a productive life.

As she showed us pretty clearly in those 31 days...she wants to party, she wants to dance, she wants to get lots of attention.

Productive or meaningful..... *meh*....I doubt she cares.

And, unfortunately, there will be plenty of folks waiting to give her money, hear her story, buy her a drink, put her on TV, etc.

It's sickening, but I don't think that most narcissists look at life the way you or I do.

If she wanted meaningful and productive....she had it as a mother...and look how she handled that.

I'm with Snow....any publisher, magazine or TV station that gives her a minute of air time will be hearing (negatively) from me....and not getting my money.

[Corkey]

Well....I don't think she cares about having a productive life.

As she showed us pretty clearly in those 31 days...she wants to party, she wants to dance, she wants to get lots of attention.

Productive or meaningful..... *meh*....I doubt she cares.

And, unfortunately, there will be plenty of folks waiting to give her money, hear her story, buy her a drink, put her on TV, etc.

It's sickening, but I don't think that most narcissists look at life the way you or I do.

If she wanted meaningful and productive....she had it as a mother...and look how she handled that.

I'm with Snow....any publisher, magazine or TV station that gives her a minute of air time will be hearing (negatively) from me....and not getting my money.

I absolutely agree with this, my fervent wish is for her to die a slow death one from starvation or from the elements. Without comfort, food, or human intervention. I do think she is a sociopath, and therefore has no redeeming worth. My opinion.

[Novelafemme]

I'll be boycotting ANY magazine ( Life, Time, People, Etc) that. Buys the right to that pariah's story!

Excellent idea, The Lady Snow! I will be doing exactly the same thing!

[nowandthen]

I absolutely agree with this, my fervent wish is for her to die a slow death one from starvation or from the elements. Without comfort, food, or human intervention. I do think she is a sociopath, and therefore has no redeeming worth. My opinion.

What if it was a accident and she paniced? I wish her a life that has consequence of course, but wishing her dead seems hypocritical. I also agree that sterilization is a slippery slope as it is based in Eugenics and is one tool of racism and ableism as a policing mechanism.

I also find it troubling that folks are so invested in making her the most evil mother, even if she did do it, which I surely do not know either way I want to live in a world where forgiveness transcends hate, which is not the same as saying a person should not suffer consequences, but for me wishing death on anyone is morally wrong for me, others maybe not, but for me there are those that wish me death for how I love and live...

[Corkey]

What if it was a accident and she paniced? I wish her a life that has consequence of course, but wishing her dead seems hypocritical. I also agree that sterilization is a slippery slope as it is based in Eugenics and is one tool of racism and ableism as a policing mechanism.

I also find it troubling that folks are so invested in making her the most evil mother, even if she did do it, which I surely do not know either way I want to live in a world where forgiveness transcends hate, which is not the same as saying a person should not suffer consequences, but for me wishing death on anyone is morally wrong for me, others maybe not, but for me there are those that wish me death for how I love and live...

If you wanted her dead by the state then you want her dead period. I am allowing for the possibility of redemption socially, but not taking a hand in her death. So wether she is redeemable is up to her, not me. Like I continue to say she is not innocent, just not guilty.

[Mr. Moon]

I still can't get over the fact that the words "neck breaking" and "chloroform" were searched on the home computer, Casey's mother LIED about being the one doing it AND was busted out by computer forensics, and still? The jury didn't think that was at least some form of pre-meditation.



I tried really hard not to pay attention to this whole circus. But at the last moment got drug into the tv coverage of the lawyers final statements (two freakin days worth!). This quote above....I saw a lawyer say that there were two different software models run over their computer. One caught 1 search for cloriform, 54 for myspace, the other caught 54 searches for cloriform, none for myspace. I have no idea if this was shown during the trial or only the final statements. However, that would be why a juror would think ..hmmmmm what's this about?

I held no prior expectation when I watched the final days. And to be honest, what I saw IN THE COURTROOM seemed to lean towards reasonable doubt.

People...remember....the media hype was HUGE and you've heard false information and the jurors did not hear this crap.

Did she do something? Yes. And I don't believe ANYONE thinks different. But no one know for damn sure what happened. And you just can't put a person behind bars forever not knowing this. If you could, we could all end up in jail. It's a twisted system that works sometimes ..at best.

I don't get all this knee jerk reactionary stuff I see everywhere. Get a grip people! This happens ALL the time everywhere! We just don't get mass media franzies about it. Sometimes someone innocent is jacked up in jail. (what's the girl in a foreign country that I believe is probably innocent? oy!).

Injustices all over.

Welcome to America or the world for that matter.

I am amazed at all the emotional stuff...people want to hurt her parents? Kill her? Now how does that work? You murder someone and it makes it right??? my god ..what is wrong here??

frustrated, and disappointed in alot of things,
-Moon

[The_Lady_Snow]

Accidents with children happen a lot, sometimes sadly a child is lost by accident, I've yet to hear of an accidental death of a child where the body is placed in bags, child duct taped, body hidden. As a mother I would be crushed, and part of me dead yet even in that turmoil I would hold my child tight until help arrived NOT hide the death. Perhaps that's what only a sane person would do, the horrific disposal of that tiny child was thought out, no sane person does that. I don't wish her harm but I would not shed a tear if she disappeared. She's rotten, non productive and a killer.

[nowandthen]

If you wanted her dead by the state then you want her dead period. I am allowing for the possibility of redemption socially, but not taking a hand in her death. So wether she is redeemable is up to her, not me. Like I continue to say she is not innocent, just not guilty.

I am not for the death penalty for anyone, I find killing people to deter other from killing people has a bad track record. I did not watch the trail and again state I could not avoid much of the coverage. I believe the jury came back with the right choice with what they had. But I would have been just as clear and unhappy if she was given the death penalty.

[Corkey]

I'm for the death penalty for only the worst of the worst. I think it gets used far too often however, when life would be the much preferred punishment. It also gets used racially and I am not a proponent of that.
But if one is a serial killer and has no possibility of redemption, yep bye bye.
I would that the courts not be a revolving door for murderers but that has yet to happen.

[AtLast]

I'll be boycotting ANY magazine ( Life, Time, People, Etc) that. Buys the right to that pariah's story!

I'm with you. I didn't even buy the damn book that Scott Petersen's (is it sen or son?) half sister wrote- and she is local. The jerk stayed at her house in Berkeley before booking to So Cal and his arrest.

People can be such opportunists- watch, someone that dated her will try to do a book.

The fact of the matter is that a 2 year old child is dead and there seeems to be no justice for her in any shape or form. I hurt about this even though I do see as a matter of law, how the prosecution blew this case. I think the DA's office was far too cocky about this case and did not build a solid circumstantial prosecution due to inflated egos.

[Novelafemme]

I am not for the death penalty for anyone, I find killing people to deter other from killing people has a bad track record. I did not watch the trail and again state I could not avoid much of the coverage. I believe the jury came back with the right choice with what they had. But I would have been just as clear and unhappy if she was given the death penalty.

I am not for the death penalty (for the most part) either. I hear what is being said about forced sterilization being a form of eugenics, but I disagree. In my brain, even though she is not put behind bars for the rest of her life, she would not be able to birth any more children. She (and others who commit crimes against children) lost that right the moment she made whatever choice she did that resulted in her baby girl ending up a pile of decomposing flesh and bones in a shallow grave in the woods.

[RavynTuqiri]

I am not for the death penalty for anyone, I find killing people to deter other from killing people has a bad track record. I did not watch the trail and again state I could not avoid much of the coverage. I believe the jury came back with the right choice with what they had. But I would have been just as clear and unhappy if she was given the death penalty.

I don't view the death penalty as any form of deterrent but as a form of punishment. The problem for me is that too many cases have been over turned or turned upside down because of DNA. I don't think I could ever vote on a death penalty case unless there was DNA evidence directly tying that person to that crime.

It may be archaic but I think the victim's family should have a say in what the punishment should be in murder cases...if they can forgive a murderer and accept life in prison that is their call and should have some bearing. Kill my kid and I don't know if I would ever be so forgiving.

As for Casey...I don't think she deserved the death penalty and I don't think it's my place to say what life she deserves...simply because how that child died, only she knows. We know how she was buried and we know how the family tried to cover it up but again....we don't know the how she died. I have to believe that while for now she may appear to have gotten away with...murder...that the universe will eventually right the wrong.

[girl_dee]

I think people are more outraged at her behavior during that month after her child was supposedly kidnapped. We know she did know her child was not even alive.

It's like she was celebrating IT.

[Corkey]

Like Toughy, I can't say how people express grief, we are all different. Do I think it appropriate, no.

[Heart]

Detroit Free Press: Did Nancy Grace assure Casey's acquittal?


http://www.freep.com/article/20110706/NEWS07/110706033/Brian-Dickerson-Did-Nancy-Grace-assure-Tot-Mom-s-acquittal-?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

[scootebaby]

As the death penalty goes i would have to mirror someone elses statement about ONLY if there was undisputable DNA,and then im not sure if i would be for it. I guess it would depend on a range of things.

As for grieving--again as others said everyone grieves in their own way. We can all ay how we would act/grieve etc in a situation but UNTIL we are actually in the situation it would only be speculation. Hell when my son was born i swore Barney would NEVER be allowed in my house---guess what we had EVERY dvd out there........yes i KNOW that is nowhere near as serious as the situation at hand,but i think it makes my point.

As for being guilty...all we know is a beautiful baby girl is dead..last seen with the mother...with personal belongings...people are acting on raw emotion..inflammatory media hype---i mean things like this sells--keeps us glued to our tvs...enrages us...ratings ratings ratings,but i digress...the jury wasnt privy to all the insanity that we were...all the speculation,theatrics,etc

Everyone is talking about how her life will go on,and all this money she will make,but really what kind of life will she have....everybody and their brother will be suing her,she wont be able to go anywhere without being recognized, AND she has to live with the memory of her dead daughter. No matter how fucked up someone is mentally or emotionally,you cant ignore something like that forever--unless of course she truly is a sociopath!

Everyone is gonna be picking this case apart.looking for any little reason to say the jury messed up(as is evident with something one of the jurors was quoted as saying and no doubt is being blown out of proportion) when the cold hard truth is nothing was proven beyond Casey is a pathological liar with serious emotional issues---which btw if u watched the whole trial and watched her you would have seen her vast array of emotions(sometimes uncontrollable).

However i would have to agree with those that said she will commit another crime...if she doesnt receive some intense therapy she is destined to do something criminal---i dunno if i would go so far as to say murder but something.

[The_Lady_Snow]

When I lost a child, drinking and dancing was the furthest thing from my mind, I'm trying really hard to wrap my mind around the partying, the "the kids out of town", the blaming 2 POC, the breaking in her own parents shed for gas cans, duct tape, I mean I could go on and on. Sociopaths can go on with life without skipping a beat, she's got a taste for it she won't stop, they never do.

[Corkey]

I don't think sane people will ever understand the mind of someone like this.

[Andrew, Jr.]

I have been listening to the news and I just learned the following:

1. the State of FL is going after Casey for the money spent on searches for Caylee, and the court costs;

2. the jurors want to be paid for any and all interviews that they do;

3. Casey wrote in a letter to another cellmate that she wants to adopt another child or two;

4. one of the juror's (no. 3) is back peddling after realizing most of the world is against the verdict;

5. Casey has been offered a porn job, but the offer was taken back after the promoter saw the reaction to the verdict;

6. Casey will earn a ton of money to tell her story via book, tv movie, film, and so on.

[Okiebug61]

One of the most disturbing things for me about the entire situation is the vigilante way people act. I am not the higher power, I am not a person who can say she did or did not commit this horrific crime. It saddens me that so many are followers instead of leaders. If you think she is guilty then do something to help prevent this from happening to another child.

I am human and I have made mistakes, some have been not so good. I am thankful that I was not faced with a mob of vigilante finger pointing people who think they should have the final say in my destiny.

Peace!

[Andrew, Jr.]

I am wondering what is going to happen to Casey Anthony after the judge free's her. Where is she going to go? She is really not going to have any sort of life. It is pretty much like what happened to OJ Simpson. And like OJ, I do believe that Casey will be back in jail at some point. I think she is suffering from some sort of mental illness. She maybe sane, but she has something going on.

As for George and Cindy Anthony, I am sure they will be moving. They need a new start. I don't think that Casey will be welcome in their home after she threw them under the bus. That relationship is just destroyed. Casey killed it.

Oakiebug61,

I loved your post. I agree with it. There is a petition you can sign that if anyone (mother, father, grandparent, etc.) doesn't report a missing child, infant, etc. you can be jailed, fined, and charged with a misdameaner crime.

I always have had fingers pointed at me for anything I did right or wrong. It is how I was raised. And even to this day, my bio-parents still do it. Even strangers point at me because of being a ftm. The gang up situation is not pleasant. Not by a long shot. It kills one's self esteem.

[Mister Bent]

I always have had fingers pointed at me for anything I did right or wrong. It is how I was raised. And even to this day, my bio-parents still do it. Even strangers point at me because of being a ftm. The gang up situation is not pleasant. Not by a long shot. It kills one's self esteem.




Just to be clear, am I to understand you're concerned for Casey Anthony's self esteem? (Given that this thread is about her and the recent trial).

[JustJo]

I have been listening to the news and I just learned the following:

1. the State of FL is going after Casey for the money spent on searches for Caylee, and the court costs;

2. the jurors want to be paid for any and all interviews that they do;

3. Casey wrote in a letter to another cellmate that she wants to adopt another child or two;

4. one of the juror's (no. 3) is back peddling after realizing most of the world is against the verdict;

5. Casey has been offered a porn job, but the offer was taken back after the promoter saw the reaction to the verdict;

6. Casey will earn a ton of money to tell her story via book, tv movie, film, and so on.


Lots of this is speculation and rumor at this point...

[NJFemmie]

When I lost a child, drinking and dancing was the furthest thing from my mind, I'm trying really hard to wrap my mind around the partying, the "the kids out of town", the blaming 2 POC, the breaking in her own parents shed for gas cans, duct tape, I mean I could go on and on. Sociopaths can go on with life without skipping a beat, she's got a taste for it she won't stop, they never do.

You're right - they never do. In their minds, whatever they do is justifiable. Maybe not to you or me or anyone else, but in their minds, everything, including lives - are expendable. I'm not necessarily stating that every narcissist/sociopath in the world is a killer, but the ones that are, are very dangerous and cunning people indeed. They push on with no conscience whatsoever.

On another note: There is a juror who is speaking about it now, and she says that the only reason why she was acquitted was because of the evidence -- no one knows how Caylee died - it wasn't because of what they felt in their hearts. I don't think she is back peddling - one of the first things she said was what has been said in here - she's not guilty, but she's not innocent. I think the majority of people feel that way with very few feeling that she was actually innocent.

Makes me wonder if the defense team had their own doubts about her, which I am sure they did. They called her out as a liar right off the bat ... so how can they not? Which makes me think about this supposed book deal that is in the works ... not that I would ever consider buying it - but with four counts of lying to the police and authorities - the book should be considered fiction. Her side of the story means absolutely nothing - it would be all lies anyway I imagine.

[Andrew, Jr.]

JustJo: ABC News paid up to 5 figures according to Barbara Walters for juror #3's interview on tv yesterday. The jail house letters were made public for all to read (about having children, changing her hair color, changing her name, and so on). The State of FL has already filed for Casey to repay the state for the searches done for Casey, and court costs. I am not sure about fines. This will be answered at her hearing at 9am today. You have to remember that in the State of FL there are no laws about Casey's income potential following this case.

Andrew

[NJFemmie]

Unfortunately, her income potential will be based on all the creepy men who find her "hot". Ugh. Despicable.

[Andrew, Jr.]

The one thing juror #3 said was that "they were sick over the verdict" in this case...well, it was obviously the wrong decision.

I wonder about Equi-Search from Texas - if they will also file a suit against Casey Anthony today for costs of searching for her for Caylee.

Cindy Anthony could face perjury charges...I really doubt that this will be followed up on. I do think that this will never be addressed in court. It was a mother trying to save her daughter's life.

[JustJo]

You have to remember that in the State of FL there are no laws about Casey's income potential following this case.

Andrew


Actually, there would be no legal limitation to her profiting anywhere...not just in Florida.

The laws that disallow profiting from a crime apply to people who are found guilty. She was found not guilty...so she can profit from anything she can convince people to pay her for.

Frankly, I'll be thrilled if Florida recoups their money from the cost of searches from any profit she makes. I live in Florida, so I'd rather not help pay those costs....let her do it.

[Mr. Moon]

Just to be clear, am I to understand you're concerned for Casey Anthony's self esteem? (Given that this thread is about her and the recent trial).



Nice..... this is a very nice way to bait someone. wtf?
If he was saying that he would have said that. Yer reading in.

Now I see how people get in arguments on this site. I'm not here enough to witness it first hand, but this time I am.

Hope this made you feel good, whoever you are.

I'm irritated by it. Blocking now. So say whatever. I'd report it if I knew how.