Prenuptial Agreements. Anyone have one? Anyone who would consider one if they married?

[jools66]

even though its not romantic, i think in this day and age its a wise thing to have a pre-nup.
We never like to think that when we get married it will end in divorce, but some things are just out of our control.
i got married years ago, wasnt true to who i was (as in gay) and i left the relationship with nothin bc i wanted it that way.
i was the one who hurt him, and for me personally, i went into it with nothing much money wise.
i just wanted a clean break, with no tangles.
but if i was ever to get married again, i think i would lean more towards getting a prenup.
simply bc my own money circumstances have changed.

[Nattih]

Short answer: Nope.

Long answer: Hell nope.

I realize this will largely kill my ability to marry and I 100% accept that. The idea that I am already a liability to my future wife? Can't deal with.

[Jesse]

I have to agree with imperfect_cupcake, people do change. Sometimes it's for the better, sometimes, through no fault of the person it's for the worse.

Were I to ever marry I would want a prenup. I prefer to see it as a means of the two of us taking care of one another and being responsible financially for the sake of both of our futures. It may have to have a lottery clause too.

I also will not share a banking account. There was a time years ago (30) when a girlfriend and I shared a bank account and I paid for that the hard way. It took me 6 months to pay all of the bounced check fees and bills that got behind because she walked the day after we put the checks in the mail for the monthly bills, and she cleaned out the bank on her way out and everything bounced. Lesson learned.

Also I think most of us go into a committed relationship with the thought in mind that it will be forever, and well, sadly it doesn't always work out that way.

[DapperButch]

Originally Posted by Jesse

Were I to ever marry I would want a prenup. I prefer to see it as a means of the two of us taking care of one another and being responsible financially for the sake of both of our futures. It may have to have a lottery clause too.

Exactly. That is how I was seeing it when I wrote the first post. I saw/see it as a way to protect my wife and also as a way to make things easy and less stressful if we ended. I would actually see it as me being a good husband and doing something "for us", by initiating the process for the two of us.

I think that it is also easy for people who dont have any family assets to say that they would never consider it, as there is not a reason for them to consider it in the first place. It has nothing to do with the money you make as a couple, it has to do with money that you had before the person ever existed in your world. Or, at least for me, that is what I would want in a pre-nup. Not the money we make as a couple.

[Katniss]

Not to sound too jaded about it but frankly there is love and there is the business of life. I have auto and home insurance in case the unthinkable happens and Mother Nature decides those trees in the back yard are coming down on my stuff. I may hope and trust it won't happen but if it does I like to know what to expect while I go about picking up the pieces. I feel the same way about organ donation and end of life decisions. I want to have the hard conversations now while happy and smiling, not standing in the E.R. feeling scared and pressured. To me a pre-nup fits right in there with the first two life items. I am 100% for a pre-nup because I love clarity and a pre-nup provides that for me. I have been married before and we did not have a pre-nup however we were young, dewy-eyed in love and with no kids. Now I am older and the kiddo is 13. Priorities have shifted and while I find it almost laughable that I would get married again (never say never I suppose) I would want to make sure she is taken care of going forward. Especially if something were to happen before she was 18.

I won't reiterate what some of the other posters have said about aging, care issues, etc. as I do agree with all of those. What I do want to emphasize is I truly believe a pre-nup protects both parties regardless of whether their assets are equally matched going in or not. All it takes is one terrible accident and one partner is deceased, one incapacitated and now a guardian of the incapacitated is contesting the will of the deceased and leaving kids from a previous marriage cut out. I've seen that happen and it was ugly. A pre-nup (the deceased owned a business that the other spouse was not involved with at all) would have prevented that from happening. I also know the incapacitated spouse loved those kids and would never have wanted that to happen. But as she was incapacitated mentally she had no say. Not only was it ugly to resolve it was also expensive.

As an aside I do think it will be interesting in ten or so years to compare the divorce statistics of gay couples with those of straight couples. I'd like to think after years and years of fighting for the right to marry that our divorce stats will be lower, but sadly I am not banking on it.

Katniss~~ (As granny used to say, "Trust the preacher but have the ushers count the collection.")

[kittygrrl]

Originally Posted by Jesse

I have to agree with imperfect_cupcake, people do change. Sometimes it's for the better, sometimes, through no fault of the person it's for the worse.

Were I to ever marry I would want a prenup. I prefer to see it as a means of the two of us taking care of one another and being responsible financially for the sake of both of our futures. It may have to have a lottery clause too.

I also will not share a banking account. There was a time years ago (30) when a girlfriend and I shared a bank account and I paid for that the hard way. It took me 6 months to pay all of the bounced check fees and bills that got behind because she walked the day after we put the checks in the mail for the monthly bills, and she cleaned out the bank on her way out and everything bounced. Lesson learned.

Also I think most of us go into a committed relationship with the thought in mind that it will be forever, and well, sadly it doesn't always work out that way.

Agreed, people sometimes do change, but usually not their basic ethics, if they seem to maybe you didn't know them quite that well or in the lush of new love you look the other way. It happens, we want to think of the person we are in love in the very best of terms..for those who can't deal with the risk, I can see a prenup is a good solution but I still understand the need for a marriage license. But I am stubborn that way :P

[imperfect_cupcake]

Maybe you haven't dealt with what I have. And it *certainly* wasn't the flush of new love.
I've changed quite a bit in the last two years.
I've had friends that last over 25, and 30 years. I've watched them change deeply. That we are still friends are only because I grew up with them.

People change their ethics. A lot. What my ethics were 10 years ago are not the same as they are now after living in a different continent and going through severve poverty, a break down and a divorce.
My life has taught me people change in big fat huge ways, right through their core if life hits them hard enough.
So, I have to disagree.

[Katniss]

I suppose I look at pre-nups a bit differently than some of the other posters here. To me a pre-nup would be honoring a commitment I made before I met my future spouse. My daughter is 13 and as soon as I became pregnant with her I made a commitment. (Goodbye Diet Coke and and crappy eating for 9 months). Part of that commitment is to see to her financial well-being at least until she is an adult. I have every intention of paying for her college. I worked my way through college by waiting tables, working at the student cafeteria and holding a work-study position. All at the same time. Because of this I had to decline some research opportunities that had no or little pay. To this day I have very few regrets however having to bypass the opportunity to study wild dolphins off the coast is at the top of the list. I want her to be able to take the opportunities that arise and make the most of them. Like it or not money helps in this regard. When I was married I put my spouse through school. He didn't have to work at all and was a full-time student. I have also helped finance cars, pay off debts, etc. I have no regrets about this nor am I bitter. But I was younger. I'm 49 now and the "Katniss Scholarship Program for Wayward Adults" is closed. If I were to marry again (insert maniacal laughter here) I would not leave the new spouse out in the cold, but my financial past (401K, real estate holdings, etc.) is spoken for.

I also have 2 friends who were together (before the legalization of gay marriage) for 12 years. Long story short there was cheating and an eventual end to the relationship. After the dust had settled and they were on speaking terms again they had the dilemma of what to do with a beach house they co-owned. Neither could afford to buy the other out (prices had skyrocketed), and neither wanted to sell. They came up with a truce where they both still co-own the property and alternate weekends and holidays on who gets use. In their wills they have each left the other with their share of the house. They also agreed in a notarized document that should either marry then that person would have a pre-nup regarding the beach house not being communal property. This makes sense to me because the pre-nup has nothing to do with trust or lack thereof in a new spouse, and everything to do with honoring a previous commitment to someone they had at one time cared for a great deal. While a will can accomplish distribution of property a pre-nup is added insurance.

It's interesting to read the different responses. I suppose my greatest hope is that those contemplating marriage at some point sit down and have discussions about finances, debt, financial planning, etc. If a pre-nup makes the couple feel safe and cared for then I don't think anyone else should believe that marriage is less trusting or loving or "all in" than a couple that eschews a pre-nup.

Katniss~~

[TL1]

It's sad that this is in fact a necessity. At the beginning everything is all lalala great and that person would never do anything to hurt you in such a way. WRong.... By the end That person you thought you knew no longer exists and they just want to take from you. Besides what's the harm in it? If you're not wanting to ef someone over then there's no reason not to.

[imperfect_cupcake]

If a pre-nup makes the couple feel safe and cared for then I don't think anyone else should believe that marriage is less trusting or loving or "all in" than a couple that eschews a pre-nup.

Thank you.

I don't think that people who don't do prenup are foolish. Tinkerbelly's reasons are fantastic for her.

And anyone saying that me asking for a pre-nup is because I don't trust partners or its all business or I am self destructing a relationship can sit and spin.

[DapperButch]

Originally Posted by DapperButch

Exactly. That is how I was seeing it when I wrote the first post. I saw/see it as a way to protect my wife and also as a way to make things easy and less stressful if we ended. I would actually see it as me being a good husband and doing something "for us", by initiating the process for the two of us.

Originally Posted by Katniss

If a pre-nup makes the couple feel safe and cared for then I don't think anyone else should believe that marriage is less trusting or loving or "all in" than a couple that eschews a pre-nup.

Katniss~~

Exactly. That is where I was going with my post.

[clay]

My sentments exactly!

It is interesting to read all the differing views, and no one view is "right" or "wrong"...it is all part of our diversity/adversity!!!

Thanks, K!!!

Originally Posted by Katniss

I suppose I look at pre-nups a bit differently than some of the other posters here. To me a pre-nup would be honoring a commitment I made before I met my future spouse. My daughter is 13 and as soon as I became pregnant with her I made a commitment. (Goodbye Diet Coke and and crappy eating for 9 months). Part of that commitment is to see to her financial well-being at least until she is an adult. I have every intention of paying for her college. I worked my way through college by waiting tables, working at the student cafeteria and holding a work-study position. All at the same time. Because of this I had to decline some research opportunities that had no or little pay. To this day I have very few regrets however having to bypass the opportunity to study wild dolphins off the coast is at the top of the list. I want her to be able to take the opportunities that arise and make the most of them. Like it or not money helps in this regard. When I was married I put my spouse through school. He didn't have to work at all and was a full-time student. I have also helped finance cars, pay off debts, etc. I have no regrets about this nor am I bitter. But I was younger. I'm 49 now and the "Katniss Scholarship Program for Wayward Adults" is closed. If I were to marry again (insert maniacal laughter here) I would not leave the new spouse out in the cold, but my financial past (401K, real estate holdings, etc.) is spoken for.

I also have 2 friends who were together (before the legalization of gay marriage) for 12 years. Long story short there was cheating and an eventual end to the relationship. After the dust had settled and they were on speaking terms again they had the dilemma of what to do with a beach house they co-owned. Neither could afford to buy the other out (prices had skyrocketed), and neither wanted to sell. They came up with a truce where they both still co-own the property and alternate weekends and holidays on who gets use. In their wills they have each left the other with their share of the house. They also agreed in a notarized document that should either marry then that person would have a pre-nup regarding the beach house not being communal property. This makes sense to me because the pre-nup has nothing to do with trust or lack thereof in a new spouse, and everything to do with honoring a previous commitment to someone they had at one time cared for a great deal. While a will can accomplish distribution of property a pre-nup is added insurance.

It's interesting to read the different responses. I suppose my greatest hope is that those contemplating marriage at some point sit down and have discussions about finances, debt, financial planning, etc. If a pre-nup makes the couple feel safe and cared for then I don't think anyone else should believe that marriage is less trusting or loving or "all in" than a couple that eschews a pre-nup.

Katniss~~

[flapdoodle]

we are legally married
no prenup here.
I never understood the purpose.
... I protect myself via my will and my deed, I made sure j gets everything and likewise.

i knew the score going in, sure, she might change...and so might I...

i trust her, bottom line

[kittygrrl]

Originally Posted by flapdoodle

we are legally married
no prenup here.
I never understood the purpose.
... I protect myself via my will and my deed, I made sure j gets everything and likewise.

i knew the score going in, sure, she might change...and so might I...

i trust her, bottom line

Love this...and it's true..if you believe the person you are loving has good bones..then trust you're going to be ok go all in or go home (so to speak)

[Orema]

I think it's a good idea. It's not a statement on someone's feelings or intentions (which is what I thought when I was once a young bride), it's a safeguard for the rough times. I wouldn't get married without one.

[Tuff Stuff]

No, we didn't sign one.If something happens she knows it is all hers,i want nothing from her end.There's something about me that really doesn't give a damn about material stuff.She can have the house,the vehicles ect.I would move out and start new some place else.

[butchgeek]

Knowing what I know now, I will. I went into marriage thinking that it was forever. I did not expect that it would end with the infidelity of my ex after 15 years. I also did not expect the level of dishonesty, manipulation, frankly money-grubbing that ensued. I have a learned a great deal, and would rather have this conversation, as awkward as it may be, when a future relationship starts to get serious, to protect both of us from the unexpected.

[*Anya*]

It really is shocking when it happens and made me doubt myself so much (19-years) that I could be so blind and trusting.

I just have to accept I was in my 20's and just not burned often enough to become less trusting.

Totally vulnerable is not smart but wearing emotional armor isn't either.

A pre-nup is business and when you unite legally, there is love (better be) but one has to protect their assets (no matter how small) and whatever you want left for your children (if any).

The legal fight, if there is one, is costly and emotionally damaging.

My recent ex spent a fortune fighting her ex domestic partner just so she could "win" because she was so pissed her partner of 20-years (no infidelity) wanted out. The partner took less to just to end it.

That should have been a clue for me but it took me a couple of years to figure out the other side of the equation.

Originally Posted by butchgeek

Knowing what I know now, I will. I went into marriage thinking that it was forever. I did not expect that it would end with the infidelity of my ex after 15 years. I also did not expect the level of dishonesty, manipulation, frankly money-grubbing that ensued. I have a learned a great deal, and would rather have this conversation, as awkward as it may be, when a future relationship starts to get serious, to protect both of us from the unexpected.