Reclaiming Lesbian Pride

[Kobi]

Originally Posted by June

I don't think it's contradictory at all. When we "out" ourselves as Femmes to co-workers, family and friends, we, or at least I do not say "I'm a Queer Femme" because most people in the heterosexual world don't have a clue what that means. Usually, it's more subtle than that, I make a reference to my partner, which leads them to the conclusion that I am a Lesbian. When you get right down to it, that's what I am. I am in a Lesbian relationship.

I am proud of many things in my life, being a mother is foremost followed by being able to create and maintain long-term relationships of both the friend and lover types. I am not necessarily "Proud" of being a Lesbian, it is simply, or perhaps intricately, part of who I am.

What I am proud of, is to be part of a community that has historically done a lot of the really hard work in building networks of Social Services aimed at making the lives of others better. Increasingly now, we are being joined by men who have been raised with a more evolved social consciousness. I see this as forward movement in the evolution of us as a Human Species, and not as interloping, as some do. It is better to work together, we get more done.

I have worked alongside some amazing, dynamic women over the course of my life. I have also been appalled at the behavior of some women in positions of leadership. Being a Lesbian does not automatically attach a halo to your noggin. We're all still bound by the personal narratives and lived experiences that make us operate in certain ways, both good and bad.

I do believe that women can make better, more compassionate leaders in general, even though it may take longer to achieve the desired goals because of the more thoughtful processes we tend to have. "How are you feeling about that?" - "How does it work for you?" more often than "We're doing it this way", although that also has its place in the process.

I keep reading fear from a few of you that I don't understand. If you are living your life as a Lesbian, however you define that, how can you be erased? How does someone else living their lives in the way they choose negate your own? What exactly is it you're fighting for?

I don't feel the need to carve my space out of anyone elses flesh. I am not threatened by anyone elses identity. (I spoke about one of my personal processes in the Gatekeeping thread).

With that said, I do understand that Butch Women are feeling under-represented and pushed aside by the false masculine hierarchy that is present in our community, but don't we share that struggle as Lesbians? Don't you see me and many, many others standing up to say "Woman/Female is not less than you bastards!" -- Okay, sometimes we're more subtle than that.

It feels sometimes that those of us whose idea of community is more inclusive ARE seen as traitors by some, as though we have abandoned our Lesbian and feminist roots and have actually become "Tools of the Patriarchy". I see this much differently. Just as I want to be accepted for all the facets of who I am, in order for me to be whole, I have to extend that to others. Everyone gets judged on their own merits as a human being first, their sexual orientation and gender are secondary to me.

June,

I have spent the better part of 2 hours trying to figure out why this post bothered me so much. I think I have it now tho I am not sure I can get my point across here.

You came into a discussion where folks are trying to, little by little, speak to the things which are problematic for us. And, it does have to be done little by little cuz we go forward a step and then have to address our right to have feelings and experiences and why we need to speak to them again and again and again.

It bothered me to see a post where you readily admit this isnt a problem for you, the abstract works in your reality, you have had both good and bad experiences with women in different capacities, and only apparently good ones with men "who were raised with a more evolved social consciousness."

I dont know what your intent was here but to me, this said, I am dismissing the concerns others have raised because it isnt my reality.

I have a hard time believing if a POC or a transperson came into a thread talking about difficult experiences they were encountering, that the response would be - well that isnt my experience. My experience is x,y,z and as a matter of fact I have had awesome experiences with white people who "were raised with a more evolved social consciousness".

Can you really picture yourself saying that to a POC? Do you really believe saying this to a POC is going to make them feel heard, understood, validated, and as an accepted member of this diverse community? If you wouldnt do this to a POC, why is it ok to do it to other women and lesbians? What message do you think this sends versus the message you meant to send? Or maybe this was the message you meant to send.

And after you got finished with telling us of your experiences and what works for you, and how you expect is should or could work for everyone else, THEN you ask questions? Felt to me like you were already saying , 'I have told you I am not buying this but I will give you the opportunity to convince me'. That really stung. Again, I doubt this is the approach that would be taken if it was a POC or a transperson. But, it is the approach you chose to take with women and lesbians.

You are asking good questions tho. We have begun to answer exactly what you asked. You hearing it or being open to hear it, is another matter altogether.

In another thread, the question was asked why is it when a woman says something, it will go unnoticed. But if a man comes along and says the exact same thing, there is a totally different response? Something to think about. And I believe the person who asked was Aj.