Welcome AZ Butches, Femmes, Trans

[lipstixgal]

Originally Posted by apretty

I wouldn't say that this state is friendly to/for anyone other than white, middle-aged and hopefully male, straight-acting, republican mormons without a lot of university education and zero ecological or political concern.

There are a few less-hateful places in central phoenix (and definitely Tucson!) but nowhere welcoming if you're a POC.

Most of the gays that I've come across are content with a "lifestyle" that isn't officially recognized, or that is 'downlow' and are not out or just out to close friends or other gays in the community. (That I want and think everyone is deserving of human rights, like *yesterday* has/does put more than a few people off--but I am not *from* here. )

The phx GLBTIQ center is a tiny store front in a strip mall. The state just implemented a law that bans ethnic studies and also *requires* the police to stop and question anyone they suspect to be in arizona "illegally" --without any clear guidelines as how to enforce this law without 'racial profiling'. ...And today it's 115 degrees.

Where are you moving *from*?

Well with that said I'm moving from NJ which is not too gay friendly either its all in NYC which is time consuming and costs money to go into all the time!! but the Mormon thing scares a bit. That is just a cult in my minds eye!! I did research on that religion and yeah its a cult. Also I'm Jewish and gay!! I'm really going for the weather because its warm and don't want to winter anymore!!

[friskyfemme]

Originally Posted by lipstixgal

Well with that said I'm moving from NJ which is not too gay friendly either its all in NYC which is time consuming and costs money to go into all the time!! but the Mormon thing scares a bit. That is just a cult in my minds eye!! I did research on that religion and yeah its a cult. Also I'm Jewish and gay!! I'm really going for the weather because its warm and don't want to winter anymore!!

I was concerned with the Mormon influence before I moved to AZ. I really met it 'head on' when I live in White Mountains region and Prescott area. Yes I would agree as apretty stated there is more a 'down low' community in the Phoenix area. As far as women's club there is only one identified as in the Phoenix area such in the Phoenix.

But to AZ's credit, more so here in other states, I've lived there is a large mixed gay crowd in most bars and hetro/gay places. However, I am not much for bars as a place for meeting people.

AZ has elected and appointed officals that are outwardly gay.

[lipstixgal]

Originally Posted by friskyfemme

I was concerned with the Mormon influence before I moved to AZ. I really met it 'head on' when I live in White Mountains region and Prescott area. Yes I would agree as apretty stated there is more a 'down low' community in the Phoenix area. As far as women's club there is only one identified as in the Phoenix area such in the Phoenix.

But to AZ's credit, more so here in other states, I've lived there is a large mixed gay crowd in most bars and hetro/gay places. However, I am not much for bars as a place for meeting people.

AZ has elected and appointed officals that are outwardly gay.

Thanks for the input but I think that there has to be non-Mormon communities around. I know for a fact that there are Jews in the area. North Central Phoenix is very Jewish but yeah I hear you on the Mormon thing, its really scary!! The LDS was behind the Prop 8 in California banning gay marriage in that state. The Mormons are very anti-gay, anti-everything!! But I will take that in mind before the final decision is to be made!!

[lipstixgal]

Any butch-femme happenings going on in PHoenix these days, still thinking about relocating to that state so I don't have tot deal with the traffic and winter. NJ is just too damn crowded for me!! I want some place where you can really drive your car and not get a headache in the process. It took me 45 minutes to get a lamb kebob platter from Whole Foods in Paramus, NJ which is only about 5 miles away!!

[QueenofSmirks]

Originally Posted by lipstixgal

Thanks for the input but I think that there has to be non-Mormon communities around. I know for a fact that there are Jews in the area. North Central Phoenix is very Jewish but yeah I hear you on the Mormon thing, its really scary!! The LDS was behind the Prop 8 in California banning gay marriage in that state. The Mormons are very anti-gay, anti-everything!! But I will take that in mind before the final decision is to be made!!

I'm not trying to start a holy war - and for the record, I'm atheist, so it isn't a personal religious thing, but I have to say, the comment above about Mormons being "very anti-gay, anti-everything", and the "mormon thing" being "really scary"........ really?

I personally know several mormons, a couple of them are even gay. They aren't anti-gay or scary.

Frankly, I'm appalled at blanket statements targeting any group, religious or otherwise, especially on a site like this where a very "targeted" group of people come together for socializing, entertainment and/or support.

I personally don't give a crap what the religious make-up is in a community. I've lived all over, I've conducted business all over, with and amongst a variety of people. Why would I care what a stranger's religious beliefs are? What does that really have to do with me?

I lived in Colorado for most of my life - the first state to put anti-gay legislation to a vote (in 1994?), sponsored by the Christian group Focus On The Family. Do I support right-wing Christian beliefs and politics? No. Did I leave Colorado because of it? No.

I just can't imagine shunning a place to live because it has a predominant religious group.

[friskyfemme]

Originally Posted by QueenofSmirks

I'm not trying to start a holy war - and for the record, I'm atheist, so it isn't a personal religious thing, but I have to say, the comment above about Mormons being "very anti-gay, anti-everything", and the "mormon thing" being "really scary"........ really?

I personally know several mormons, a couple of them are even gay. They aren't anti-gay or scary.

Frankly, I'm appalled at blanket statements targeting any group, religious or otherwise, especially on a site like this where a very "targeted" group of people come together for socializing, entertainment and/or support.

I personally don't give a crap what the religious make-up is in a community. I've lived all over, I've conducted business all over, with and amongst a variety of people. Why would I care what a stranger's religious beliefs are? What does that really have to do with me?

I lived in Colorado for most of my life - the first state to put anti-gay legislation to a vote (in 1994?), sponsored by the Christian group Focus On The Family. Do I support right-wing Christian beliefs and politics? No. Did I leave Colorado because of it? No.

I just can't imagine shunning a place to live because it has a predominant religious group.

QoS

I was not agreeing with 'apretty' about the 'anti' statements she made about the Mormons. My experience with Mormon saturated areas in Central AZ, has more to do with the practices of female suppression and refusing jobs to persons who were not Mormon. I have not met with that attitude in Phoenix or west valley. But then again, if you moved into a Quaker or Amish community you would most likely meet the same thing. (ok I may be chewing my toes now). On the contrary, my neighbor who is also Hispanic and Mormon was the first to greet me to the neighborhood when I moved in my house 2yrs ago. My friends that are RLDS donot hold the same interpretation of the beliefs as do LDS. I donot believe in putting people including gays in boxes. I have come to understand, people acquire wisdom through environment, experience and dimension of their lives.

I apologize if gave any other impression.

[apretty]

to clarify, i didn't make any "anti" statements about mormons.

to be clear, i could detail my disdain for mormons in about 40 different ways (from their political involvement to the high mormon gay teen suicide/homeless stats) it's just that no one was asking my take religion, in this particular thread.

i did summarize my arizona experience.


Queenofsmirks-- You should see Prop 8: The mormon proposition --It played here in a single theatre for all of a week.

Originally Posted by friskyfemme

QoS

I was not agreeing with 'apretty' about the 'anti' statements she made about the Mormons. My experience with Mormon saturated areas in Central AZ, has more to do with the practices of female suppression and refusing jobs to persons who were not Mormon. I have not met with that attitude in Phoenix or west valley. But then again, if you moved into a Quaker or Amish community you would most likely meet the same thing. (ok I may be chewing my toes now). On the contrary, my neighbor who is also Hispanic and Mormon was the first to greet me to the neighborhood when I moved in my house 2yrs ago. My friends that are RLDS donot hold the same interpretation of the beliefs as do LDS. I donot believe in putting people including gays in boxes. I have come to understand, people acquire wisdom through environment, experience and dimension of their lives.

I apologize if gave any other impression.

[QueenofSmirks]

Originally Posted by apretty

to clarify, i didn't make any "anti" statements about mormons.

to be clear, i could detail my disdain for mormons in about 40 different ways (from their political involvement to the high mormon gay teen suicide/homeless stats) it's just that no one was asking my take religion, in this particular thread.

i did summarize my arizona experience.


Queenofsmirks-- You should see Prop 8: The mormon proposition --It played here in a single theatre for all of a week.

Please understand, I'm not here to change anyone's view of the Mormon religion, or any religion for that matter. I'm sure 'Prop 8' outlines the very scum of the Mormon religion but I don't need to see it to know that religious zealots of ALL religions get up to no good in the name of their religious beliefs. As an aside, I'm not stranger to the Mormon religion - I actively boycotted Utah for its political stance on many issues, but none of this is really the point of my previous post.

The point I tried to make earlier is that not *all people* of one religion can be classified as this or that. I personally have an extreme disdain for the Catholic religion, but I think if I posted "All Catholics are pedophiles" it might seem a bit ignorant.

As an aside, a good point was made by FriskyFemme, (which I think I started to make in my own post but then got sidetracked), and that is that quality of life is important no matter where you live. If you live in an area that is unsafe or discriminatory toward you, then you certainly need to re-examine your surroundings.

As far as being discriminated against because of being female and not belonging to the predominant religion - I totally get it because I was treated the same way by some of the Jews in the neighborhood when I lived in Queens. Lucky for me I didn't have to rely upon them for work, or frankly, for anything else. I just took my business elsewhere, but that was easy enough to do given the area I lived in.

Bottom line - there are zealots in every religion, but I personally can't think of a single religion where every member can be completely defined by its values.

[QueenofSmirks]

Originally Posted by friskyfemme

QoS

I was not agreeing with 'apretty' about the 'anti' statements she made about the Mormons. ...

I apologize if gave any other impression.

Nothing in your post made me raise an eyebrow, no worries.

I quoted the post that I found offensive (within my previous post).