Forgiveness

Isadora · 09-23-2010, 04:38 PM

See and here is my issue. I fail to see not forgiving as negative. As out of balance. As stopping growth. I think I am a wonderfully amazing positive person. This is hurting me too much, I am going to bow out of this.

julieisafemme · 09-23-2010, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isadora

See and here is my issue. I fail to see not forgiving as negative. As out of balance. As stopping growth. I think I am a wonderfully amazing positive person. This is hurting me too much, I am going to bow out of this.

Isadora please take care of yourself. I do not see not forgiving as bad either. I think we might have a different take on it than others. I do know that forgiveness is a big part of my spiritual practice. I think there is no "right" way. Please don't take others ways of doing it as any comment on yours. I don't. And even if it is, they aren't living my life.

IrishGrrl · 09-23-2010, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isadora

See and here is my issue. I fail to see not forgiving as negative. As out of balance. As stopping growth. I think I am a wonderfully amazing positive person. This is hurting me too much, I am going to bow out of this.

Isa, I"m with you on your feelings. I dont really see non forgivness as a negative either. I think there CAN be times when it will negativly impact you, but for me, my anger, rage, sadness, outrage has also spurred me on to great things. In a way it is the fire that feeds me at times. I dont think I would have survived without it, and it's now my dear close ally and friend, who is always there to give me strength when I dont feel I have any left.
The way I balance it all is, that I forgive what I can, and make no excuses or feel an ounce of guilt for what I cannot. Forgiveness is personal for me, and a private thing. I do not judge others on thier abilities to forgive or not. And I cant stand and wont listen long to someone preaching to me how I "NEED" to forgive.

AtLast · 09-23-2010, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isadora

See and here is my issue. I fail to see not forgiving as negative. As out of balance. As stopping growth. I think I am a wonderfully amazing positive person. This is hurting me too much, I am going to bow out of this.

It doesn't stop YOUR growth. It hinders mine. I sure didn't mean to imply that what gives me balance is what is true for everyone. Actually, I don't see this with anyone's post here.

Although, sometimes it is a good idea to make it clear that we are speaking about our own experiences and goals- and not placing ideas on others. I hope you remain here because you always contribute so much to discussions.

T4Texas · 05-14-2011, 07:28 AM

Forgivness is something we have to come to terms with in our inner self. It is always dependent on your personal circumstances as for some people the reasons are different or more or less painful. I do not think its a negative to not want to embrace something that you haven't made your peace with yet, or may never make your peace with because the hurt is too great. I am a great believer in moving forward in life from the things that cause you harm or pain. But, that said, I struggle with forgiveness because I have a tendency to feel vindictive if I have been hurt badly or feel wronged by someone. That vindictiveness, I know is wrong and a huge part of my struggle in life has been to eliminate that from my personality. As a result, forgiveness comes slowly to me, but that does not mean it won't eventually come. There are some people I have wiped out of my life forever because the hurt was too great and the situation was not repairable. There are many things I have said to people that I wish I could have taken back. I think there are times when we have to go to those extremes in order to be able to move forward. But even though I've done those things, I was still always sad about the loss, the finality of making that decision and the knowledge that even if you forgive, your relationship with that person will never truly be the same because now its tainted in some way. As human beings, we do a lot of things to each other that are abusive, passive agressive, and ultimately unforgivable. I feel as an individual, you must move forward and put yourself in a place where you can heal and if for you that means either forgiving or not forgiving, then you must choose what you think will best serve that end.

Nat · 07-11-2011, 01:56 PM

I ran across this today - thought I'd share:

"There are three aspects to the Buddhist idea of patience: patience-persistence, patience-under-insult and acceptance-of-truth.

The fourth is forgiveness...which in the Buddhist context is based more on Karma - the causal chain that's put into effect by your behavior. With karma, there is no external force or person or being that can intervene with your karma. There's nobody else responsible for your karma but you. So the idea of forgiveness of someone else is not as important as it is for you to do your own work.

What forgiveness is really tied to in this context is releasing our anger we have toward others.

When I forgive you, I am no longer going to hold anger toward you. I can't free you from your karma, you're still going to have to work this out for yourself in some way, but you know now I'm a safe person for you. I'm no longer going to hold my anger against you and make things difficult.

One of the reason's it's so powerful to release our anger toward other people is that a healthy way to change the course of our own karma is to not hold onto anger."

Gil Fronsdal, Audio Dharma podcast

Chancie · 07-11-2011, 02:54 PM

I forgive you.

BullDog · 07-11-2011, 03:30 PM

If someone genuinely asks for my forgiveness then there is a very high chance I will forgive. Things may not be the same between us- for example if someone cheated on me- but I can acknowledge their genuineness and sincerity. People do make mistakes all the time. I know I do. When this happens I do my best to apologize and learn from my mistakes.

In the case of someone treating me in an abusive, very hurtful, manipulative or some other unhealthy manner, those people don't tend to be asking for forgiveness so I am not sure why I would need to expend energy trying to forgive them. For some it is a way of healing and moving forward. For me if I feel I have been wronged or am in an unhealthy situation, I need to figure out how to move forward and not let toxic people influence my life as much as possible. Forgiving someone doesn't really have much to do with it. I can't control how unhealthy people are going to treat me. I need to figure out how to heal and feel good about myself again. I need to learn from my mistakes and use better judgement of who I will let into my life.

princessbelle · 07-11-2011, 03:38 PM

The way i feel about forgiveness is this:

It is actually a gift i give to myself when i forgive others.

When i find that i want to forgive someone, it is not for them necessarily but for myself. It is the ease of the flow. I enjoy the positive of karma that it brings and the light out of the storm.

Sometimes it is done at the deepest levels and sometimes it is just a surface forgiveness, if that makes sense.

Either way it feels good and nurturing for myself, and that is always a healthy thing.

JustJo · 08-10-2012, 08:05 AM

Okay, so this may sound a little weird....but I don't believe in forgiveness. Not out of a "hanging onto anger" place, but just that I don't feel it's up to me. For me, saying "I forgive you" also implies, in a small way, that I have judged you and found you wanting.

When I have been hurt, I do my best to understand....understand what happened, understand my part in it, understand the other's part in it....and hopefully learn some lessons.

Then, I stick it all in a mental/emotional box, tie a ribbon around it, and stick it in a deep, dark closet in my head. It's still there....and I can revisit it if I must, or if I choose to.

Having said that....I grew up around angry, narcissistic, bullying people....and I never....ever....forget.

BullDog · 11-12-2017, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BullDog

If someone genuinely asks for my forgiveness then there is a very high chance I will forgive. Things may not be the same between us- for example if someone cheated on me- but I can acknowledge their genuineness and sincerity. People do make mistakes all the time. I know I do. When this happens I do my best to apologize and learn from my mistakes.

In the case of someone treating me in an abusive, very hurtful, manipulative or some other unhealthy manner, those people don't tend to be asking for forgiveness so I am not sure why I would need to expend energy trying to forgive them. For some it is a way of healing and moving forward. For me if I feel I have been wronged or am in an unhealthy situation, I need to figure out how to move forward and not let toxic people influence my life as much as possible. Forgiving someone doesn't really have much to do with it. I can't control how unhealthy people are going to treat me. I need to figure out how to heal and feel good about myself again. I need to learn from my mistakes and use better judgement of who I will let into my life.

Yes, exactly. I posted this over 6 years ago and is how I feel today as well. Forgiveness is very much a beautiful thing, but if someone is not sorry for what they did or not genuinely seeking it, then for me there is no point. Better for me to just get on with my life and become as neutral about the situation as possible.

cathexis · 11-12-2017, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BullDog

Yes, exactly. I posted this over 6 years ago and is how I feel today as well. Forgiveness is very much a beautiful thing, but if someone is not sorry for what they did or not genuinely seeking it, then for me there is no point. Better for me to just get on with my life and become as neutral about the situation as possible.

What I try to do is limit what is considered a transgression against me. For example, I don't count getting "strange" (a chance, one time, sexual encounter) as a transgression.
A person must lie, truly cheat, or steal someone or something from me.

AtLast · 07-11-2011, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nat

I ran across this today - thought I'd share:

"There are three aspects to the Buddhist idea of patience: patience-persistence, patience-under-insult and acceptance-of-truth.

The fourth is forgiveness...which in the Buddhist context is based more on Karma - the causal chain that's put into effect by your behavior. With karma, there is no external force or person or being that can intervene with your karma. There's nobody else responsible for your karma but you. So the idea of forgiveness of someone else is not as important as it is for you to do your own work. What forgiveness is really tied to in this context is releasing our anger we have toward others.

When I forgive you, I am no longer going to hold anger toward you. I can't free you from your karma, you're still going to have to work this out for yourself in some way, but you know now I'm a safe person for you. I'm no longer going to hold my anger against you and make things difficult.

One of the reason's it's so powerful to release our anger toward other people is that a healthy way to change the course of our own karma is to not hold onto anger."

Gil Fronsdal, Audio Dharma podcast

This way of thinking about my own work and forgiveness has always won out internally. I have to take responsibility for working through anger and hurt. Until then, I can't possibly meaningfully attempt to process with someone else.

Sometimes I wish I could do this more efficiently when I know that want to work through something with someone else that although we have had a rift, I want to make amends.

I have had far too many people I cared about die (family & friends) to not realize that my moving through my faulty reasoning slowly has caused me to miss the opportunity to experience the gift forgiveness can be.

StrongButch · 08-10-2012, 07:47 AM

You must forgive yourself first then you can forgive another. I believe there would be fewer breakups if people could forgive each other.

Tony · 08-10-2012, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StrongButch

You must forgive yourself first then you can forgive another. I believe there would be fewer breakups if people could forgive each other.

Well said. I feel forgiveness is for ourselves, not so much someone else unless they are asking for it. Even then, we have to forgive ourselves the pain & emotion that brought us to that place to begin with.
I absolutely agree with the break up statement. Forgiveness us such a raw emotion; you're baring your soul. If you can do that together, you still have the ability to move forward together.
My .02

spritzerJ · 08-10-2012, 08:04 AM

For me forgiveness is essential, a cornerstone. When I forgive I've opened the space for faith and trust (faith to me is trust mixed with hope).

Faith that I can handle where I am at. And faith comes from trust. Trust in myself and trust that another person can be who they are. I don't need to trust someone to "get" me. I trust and "get" myself.

Forgiveness is wishing the same faith and trust for them as I have found/opened up to for myself.

Miss Scarlett · 08-10-2012, 08:34 AM

Forgiving can be extremely difficult and for me learning to forgive myself was most difficult. But there is a peace and healing that comes from that.

Forgiving others is something else i had to learn...it too brings closure to me. i'm a Libra and as such crave balance. Forgiving myself and others helps bring that about.

i've forgiven those who have hurt me over the years...this takes great strength and isn't always easy but it's far better than letting things fester. It also doesn't always mean that there is a resumption of friendship or relationship...for me that depends on what happened and/or the other party. It's also better for me when to be able to discuss the matter with the other party but that's not always possible for various reasons. If unable to talk with them i will write them a letter that i do not mail. Rather i get everything out on paper and either bury or burn it and scatter the ashes. Bringing it out into the light negates the darkness of the hurt/anger...burning or burying separates me from it and thus sets me free.

i have some favorite quotations of the Dalai Lama i refer to daily:

"If you harbor ill will, it has a negative impact on yourself."

"The way to overcome negative thoughts and destructive emotions is to develop opposing positive emotions that are stronger and more powerful. This takes more than prayer or wishing. It requires deep analysis into the cause of harsh feelings like hatred and a conscious effort to shift perspective."

"Compassion, forgiveness, these are the real, ultimate sources of power for peace and success in life."

09-23-2010, 04:38 PM	#1
Isadora Member How Do You Identify?: Momma, Ma'am Preferred Pronoun?: She/Her Relationship Status: I am in love. Truly Madly Deeply Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: California Posts: 997 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 502 Thanked 2,127 Times in 559 Posts Rep Power: 2369288	See and here is my issue. I fail to see not forgiving as negative. As out of balance. As stopping growth. I think I am a wonderfully amazing positive person. This is hurting me too much, I am going to bow out of this. __________________ "I have a respect for manners as such, they are a way of dealing with people you don't agree with or like." Margaret Mead Read me! www.leatherati.com

05-14-2011, 07:28 AM	#5
T4Texas Member How Do You Identify?: Butch Relationship Status: Ready to play again! Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 233 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 436 Thanked 647 Times in 167 Posts Rep Power: 6739721	Forgivness is something we have to come to terms with in our inner self. It is always dependent on your personal circumstances as for some people the reasons are different or more or less painful. I do not think its a negative to not want to embrace something that you haven't made your peace with yet, or may never make your peace with because the hurt is too great. I am a great believer in moving forward in life from the things that cause you harm or pain. But, that said, I struggle with forgiveness because I have a tendency to feel vindictive if I have been hurt badly or feel wronged by someone. That vindictiveness, I know is wrong and a huge part of my struggle in life has been to eliminate that from my personality. As a result, forgiveness comes slowly to me, but that does not mean it won't eventually come. There are some people I have wiped out of my life forever because the hurt was too great and the situation was not repairable. There are many things I have said to people that I wish I could have taken back. I think there are times when we have to go to those extremes in order to be able to move forward. But even though I've done those things, I was still always sad about the loss, the finality of making that decision and the knowledge that even if you forgive, your relationship with that person will never truly be the same because now its tainted in some way. As human beings, we do a lot of things to each other that are abusive, passive agressive, and ultimately unforgivable. I feel as an individual, you must move forward and put yourself in a place where you can heal and if for you that means either forgiving or not forgiving, then you must choose what you think will best serve that end. __________________ Chivalry is when you meet a woman you would rather die for, than live with.

07-11-2011, 01:56 PM	#6
Nat Senior Member How Do You Identify?: bigender (DID System) Preferred Pronoun?: he/him or alter-specific Relationship Status: Unavailable Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Central TX Posts: 3,537 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 11,047 Thanked 13,971 Times in 2,591 Posts Rep Power: 21474855	I ran across this today - thought I'd share: "There are three aspects to the Buddhist idea of patience: patience-persistence, patience-under-insult and acceptance-of-truth. The fourth is forgiveness...which in the Buddhist context is based more on Karma - the causal chain that's put into effect by your behavior. With karma, there is no external force or person or being that can intervene with your karma. There's nobody else responsible for your karma but you. So the idea of forgiveness of someone else is not as important as it is for you to do your own work. What forgiveness is really tied to in this context is releasing our anger we have toward others. When I forgive you, I am no longer going to hold anger toward you. I can't free you from your karma, you're still going to have to work this out for yourself in some way, but you know now I'm a safe person for you. I'm no longer going to hold my anger against you and make things difficult. One of the reason's it's so powerful to release our anger toward other people is that a healthy way to change the course of our own karma is to not hold onto anger." Gil Fronsdal, Audio Dharma podcast __________________ I'm a fountain of blood. In the shape of a girl. - Bjork What is to give light must endure burning. -Viktor Frankl

07-11-2011, 03:30 PM	#8
BullDog Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: Dominant Stone Butch Daddy Preferred Pronoun?: She Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: In A Healing Place Posts: 5,371 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 18,160 Thanked 22,655 Times in 4,463 Posts Rep Power: 21474856	If someone genuinely asks for my forgiveness then there is a very high chance I will forgive. Things may not be the same between us- for example if someone cheated on me- but I can acknowledge their genuineness and sincerity. People do make mistakes all the time. I know I do. When this happens I do my best to apologize and learn from my mistakes. In the case of someone treating me in an abusive, very hurtful, manipulative or some other unhealthy manner, those people don't tend to be asking for forgiveness so I am not sure why I would need to expend energy trying to forgive them. For some it is a way of healing and moving forward. For me if I feel I have been wronged or am in an unhealthy situation, I need to figure out how to move forward and not let toxic people influence my life as much as possible. Forgiving someone doesn't really have much to do with it. I can't control how unhealthy people are going to treat me. I need to figure out how to heal and feel good about myself again. I need to learn from my mistakes and use better judgement of who I will let into my life. __________________ Love consists in this, that two solitudes protect and touch and greet each other. - Rainer Maria Rilke

07-11-2011, 03:38 PM	#9
princessbelle Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: femme Preferred Pronoun?: femme ones Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,100 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 29,380 Thanked 30,496 Times in 5,198 Posts Rep Power: 21474858	The way i feel about forgiveness is this: It is actually a gift i give to myself when i forgive others. When i find that i want to forgive someone, it is not for them necessarily but for myself. It is the ease of the flow. I enjoy the positive of karma that it brings and the light out of the storm. Sometimes it is done at the deepest levels and sometimes it is just a surface forgiveness, if that makes sense. Either way it feels good and nurturing for myself, and that is always a healthy thing. __________________ ~ I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel. ~ Maya Angelou

07-11-2011, 02:54 PM	#7
Chancie Senior Member How Do You Identify?: queer femme-inist Relationship Status: I'm lucky. Join Date: May 2010 Location: Western Mass Posts: 3,774 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 9,518 Thanked 14,541 Times in 2,744 Posts Rep Power: 21474855	I forgive you.

08-10-2012, 08:05 AM	#10
JustJo Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: pushy broad Preferred Pronoun?: she Relationship Status: Follow your heart; it knows things your mind cannot explain. Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Southeast corner Posts: 5,633 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 24,417 Thanked 25,406 Times in 4,660 Posts Rep Power: 21474857	Okay, so this may sound a little weird....but I don't believe in forgiveness. Not out of a "hanging onto anger" place, but just that I don't feel it's up to me. For me, saying "I forgive you" also implies, in a small way, that I have judged you and found you wanting. When I have been hurt, I do my best to understand....understand what happened, understand my part in it, understand the other's part in it....and hopefully learn some lessons. Then, I stick it all in a mental/emotional box, tie a ribbon around it, and stick it in a deep, dark closet in my head. It's still there....and I can revisit it if I must, or if I choose to. Having said that....I grew up around angry, narcissistic, bullying people....and I never....ever....forget. __________________ I'm not tall enough to ride emotional roller coasters

08-10-2012, 07:47 AM	#14
StrongButch Member How Do You Identify?: I see the world thru a lens Preferred Pronoun?: Yes Boss Relationship Status: Chillin out with awesome women Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: San Francisco Posts: 1,376 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 4,018 Thanked 4,183 Times in 1,180 Posts Rep Power: 21474853	Forgiveness You must forgive yourself first then you can forgive another. I believe there would be fewer breakups if people could forgive each other.

08-10-2012, 08:04 AM	#16
spritzerJ Timed Out - Permanent How Do You Identify?: Queer (gender), female (biological marker) Preferred Pronoun?: she will work as a default. Relationship Status: engaged to jac until 8/10/14 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Maine Posts: 3,154 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 30,307 Thanked 15,802 Times in 2,905 Posts Rep Power: 0	For me forgiveness is essential, a cornerstone. When I forgive I've opened the space for faith and trust (faith to me is trust mixed with hope). Faith that I can handle where I am at. And faith comes from trust. Trust in myself and trust that another person can be who they are. I don't need to trust someone to "get" me. I trust and "get" myself. Forgiveness is wishing the same faith and trust for them as I have found/opened up to for myself.

08-10-2012, 08:34 AM	#17
Miss Scarlett Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: Femme Relationship Status: . Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: . Posts: 5,530 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 4,478 Thanked 12,947 Times in 3,419 Posts Rep Power: 21474857	Forgiving can be extremely difficult and for me learning to forgive myself was most difficult. But there is a peace and healing that comes from that. Forgiving others is something else i had to learn...it too brings closure to me. i'm a Libra and as such crave balance. Forgiving myself and others helps bring that about. i've forgiven those who have hurt me over the years...this takes great strength and isn't always easy but it's far better than letting things fester. It also doesn't always mean that there is a resumption of friendship or relationship...for me that depends on what happened and/or the other party. It's also better for me when to be able to discuss the matter with the other party but that's not always possible for various reasons. If unable to talk with them i will write them a letter that i do not mail. Rather i get everything out on paper and either bury or burn it and scatter the ashes. Bringing it out into the light negates the darkness of the hurt/anger...burning or burying separates me from it and thus sets me free. i have some favorite quotations of the Dalai Lama i refer to daily: "If you harbor ill will, it has a negative impact on yourself." "The way to overcome negative thoughts and destructive emotions is to develop opposing positive emotions that are stronger and more powerful. This takes more than prayer or wishing. It requires deep analysis into the cause of harsh feelings like hatred and a conscious effort to shift perspective." "Compassion, forgiveness, these are the real, ultimate sources of power for peace and success in life."