Police Chaplains Resign Over Lesbian Appointment

DomnNC · 11-07-2010, 08:56 AM

I agree that perhaps that was the wrong response, however, you have to give kudos to the man for hiring her and sticking by her, not asking her to resign to placate the masses. Rodney Monroe has been in his share of controversy since his appointment but let's not overlook that he did do a progressive and good thing in hiring her in the first place and then standing by his appointment. Prior to his arrival, all LGBT matters within the department were swept under the rug and kept hush hush, at least he's having the balls to come out within the force so to speak.

Lynn · 11-07-2010, 09:29 AM

I think it's progressive that they had such a strong, well-developed spiritual support program. Hiring the new chaplain, sticking by her, and saying a polite goodbye to the six who resigned is also professional. They were all volunteers and couldn't be compelled to stay--just thanked for what they had done. Now it clears out the department to bring on new clergy who are more forward-thinking. It's a great story, and I'm not disappointed with the response.

Nat · 11-07-2010, 09:31 AM

There is a book and also a podcast series called "Coming Out from Behind the Badge" which talks a lot about experiences of gay and lesbian police officers and the cultures within different police departments. I haven't read the book, but I've listened to some of the podcasts, and I recommend it for anybody who's interested.

It's really frustrating to me that people think gay-hating is a "belief" which should be "respected."

Lynn · 11-07-2010, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nat

It's really frustrating to me that people think gay-hating is a "belief" which should be "respected."

I don't disagree with you. Maybe the chief doesn't think that, either. Just knowing the culture of the community, and keeping in mind his goal, he may have felt that this was the best way to handle to situation to keep it non-contentious. He's making what are, sadly, some really remarkable changes. I'm just guessing, though.

Kobi · 11-07-2010, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nat

It's really frustrating to me that people think gay-hating is a "belief" which should be "respected."

Seems to me, this situation and the words used might be a matter of perspective.

"I respect the decisions and convictions of those who have decided to resign, as I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs."

One the one hand, one could see this as a gay hating response.

One the other hand, one could see it as a respectful way of acknowledging people have different beliefs and there is respect for all beliefs whether one agrees with them or not. And there is also respect for making decisions which makes one true to oneself without disrupting the progress of inclusion.

Actions always speak louder than words to me. Clergy resigning due to their beliefs tells me they are not only being true to themselves but are also choosing to remove themselves from the situation rather than fight.

Not fighting tells me there is a fundamental acceptance for differences within the chaplaincy program which could not be overcome.

This, in turn, tells me there is, within the police department and the chaplaincy program, an understanding, tolenarce, acceptance, respect and willingness towards inclusion.

Overall, I see it as a wise and diplomatic choice of words to indicate beliefs are respected but will not stop tolerance from being part of this institution.

waxnrope · 11-07-2010, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kobi

Seems to me, this situation and the words used might be a matter of perspective.

"I respect the decisions and convictions of those who have decided to resign, as I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs."

One the one hand, one could see this as a gay hating response.

One the other hand, one could see it as a respectful way of acknowledging people have different beliefs and there is respect for all beliefs whether one agrees with them or not. And there is also respect for making decisions which makes one true to oneself without disrupting the progress of inclusion.

Actions always speak louder than words to me. Clergy resigning due to their beliefs tells me they are not only being true to themselves but are also choosing to remove themselves from the situation rather than fight.

Not fighting tells me there is a fundamental acceptance for differences within the chaplaincy program which could not be overcome.

This, in turn, tells me there is, within the police department and the chaplaincy program, an understanding, tolenarce, acceptance, respect and willingness towards inclusion.

Overall, I see it as a wise and diplomatic choice of words to indicate beliefs are respected but will not stop tolerance from being part of this institution.

Well analyzed. Well said. Thanks, Kobi

DomnNC · 11-07-2010, 03:14 PM

I don't see that big of an issue with the statement:

"I respect the decisions and convictions of those who have decided to resign, as I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs"

Why? Because I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs. Why? Because I will NOT compromise my beliefs for anyone, not one single person, so it would be hypocritical of me to do the same or tell someone to do that very thing. A persons religious beliefs are just that, theirs, just as yours are yours and mine are mine. No one should challenge a persons religious beliefs lest you want to put your own under the microscope. Religion is a personal issue and a personal choice as I see it.

As far as the first part: "He respects their decisions and convictions". Why shouldn't he respect their difference in opinion. After all we are asking people to respect our decisions for ourselves, our own convictions as individuals and as a group.

I don't know, I'm not reading anything inflammatory into that other than what he meant which was in no way derogatory towards anyone. He was just stating his mind and respecting their decision to resign.

EnderD_503 · 11-07-2010, 04:02 PM

I think what HowSoonIsNow pointed out is the primary issue. What other minority/marginalised group other than the LGBT community would warrant the same tolerant response? For example, if a black woman or muslim man were in the place of this lesbian woman, would the chaplain have been as respectful of their religious beliefs/the reason for their resignation? Far more likely that the issue of racism would have been brought up, rather than the claim that he would not ask them to compromise their beliefs. It was not so long ago (and is still this way for some religious people) that working with muslims, jews, blacks, south americans etc, was asking someone to "compromise" their beliefs. Why should the LGBT community be treated differently? Again, I think there is a hierarchy of minorities/marginalised groups going on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DomnNC

I don't see that big of an issue with the statement:

"I respect the decisions and convictions of those who have decided to resign, as I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs"

Why? Because I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs. Why? Because I will NOT compromise my beliefs for anyone, not one single person, so it would be hypocritical of me to do the same or tell someone to do that very thing. A persons religious beliefs are just that, theirs, just as yours are yours and mine are mine. No one should challenge a persons religious beliefs lest you want to put your own under the microscope. Religion is a personal issue and a personal choice as I see it.

As far as the first part: "He respects their decisions and convictions". Why shouldn't he respect their difference in opinion. After all we are asking people to respect our decisions for ourselves, our own convictions as individuals and as a group.

I don't know, I'm not reading anything inflammatory into that other than what he meant which was in no way derogatory towards anyone. He was just stating his mind and respecting their decision to resign.

Nat · 11-07-2010, 05:07 PM

When "belief" means having a problem with the existence of a person because of their gender ID or sexual orientation, I don't think that should be respected. I might "agree to disagree" but I wouldn't issue a statement that I respected those beliefs. It's bigotry under the guise of religion. It's not a belief that should be respected- in my opinion.

DomnNC · 11-07-2010, 05:09 PM

In a letter to all the chaplains, CMPD Chief Rodney Monroe expressed disappointment that some members decided to leave the program.

"I respect the decisions and convictions of those who have decided to resign, as I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs," he said.

"But I do hope that those of us who remain ... continue to embrace our goal of being an inclusive organization that respects the differences of all of our employees."

He also said he expressed disappointment in their decisions in a letter to all chaplains and also he said right after the statement that some have issue with that he hoped that those remaining continue to embrace their goal of inclusiveness. Kudos to him. I don't understand why one sentence is taken out of a complete article and out of context and made to be the focal point when he also made two very positive statements as well. He has been the FIRST police chief that Charlotte has had that is demanding that the GLBT community be treated with respect, tolerance and has made it a point to be vocal about it.

I guess unless you live in Charlotte or the surrounding community and don't know the man and the regional politics it's easy to take someone who is making an effort and hang him out to dry because it doesn't measure up to some personal standard.

I would be HAPPY to be the first one to shake his hand on a job well done in bridging the GLBT police officers with the rest of the force, be they white, black, purple, orange, a different religion, culture or what have you. The man is making a difference in the GLBT community and I for one will not hang him out to dry over one comment taken completely out of context.

Btw, I lived in Charlotte for 32 years and have seen how the GLBT community has been treated and are being treated. I just recently moved down the road about 22 miles since my wife died but keep up with the local politics in Charlotte still as they still impact our community as a whole.

11-07-2010, 09:29 AM	#2
Lynn Member How Do You Identify?: Unabashed Feminine Lesbian Preferred Pronoun?: Her, She Relationship Status: Married! Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Upstate NY Posts: 689 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 1,499 Thanked 2,414 Times in 505 Posts Rep Power: 9668976	I think it's progressive that they had such a strong, well-developed spiritual support program. Hiring the new chaplain, sticking by her, and saying a polite goodbye to the six who resigned is also professional. They were all volunteers and couldn't be compelled to stay--just thanked for what they had done. Now it clears out the department to bring on new clergy who are more forward-thinking. It's a great story, and I'm not disappointed with the response. __________________ In the flush of love's light we dare be brave And suddenly we see that love costs all we are and will ever be. Yet it is only love which sets us free. Maya Angelou Wedding Photos: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...1&l=22b092b98c

11-07-2010, 09:31 AM	#3
Nat Senior Member How Do You Identify?: bigender (DID System) Preferred Pronoun?: he/him or alter-specific Relationship Status: Unavailable Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Central TX Posts: 3,537 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 11,047 Thanked 13,966 Times in 2,589 Posts Rep Power: 21474855	There is a book and also a podcast series called "Coming Out from Behind the Badge" which talks a lot about experiences of gay and lesbian police officers and the cultures within different police departments. I haven't read the book, but I've listened to some of the podcasts, and I recommend it for anybody who's interested. It's really frustrating to me that people think gay-hating is a "belief" which should be "respected." __________________ I'm a fountain of blood. In the shape of a girl. - Bjork What is to give light must endure burning. -Viktor Frankl

11-07-2010, 05:07 PM	#9
Nat Senior Member How Do You Identify?: bigender (DID System) Preferred Pronoun?: he/him or alter-specific Relationship Status: Unavailable Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Central TX Posts: 3,537 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 11,047 Thanked 13,966 Times in 2,589 Posts Rep Power: 21474855	When "belief" means having a problem with the existence of a person because of their gender ID or sexual orientation, I don't think that should be respected. I might "agree to disagree" but I wouldn't issue a statement that I respected those beliefs. It's bigotry under the guise of religion. It's not a belief that should be respected- in my opinion. __________________ I'm a fountain of blood. In the shape of a girl. - Bjork What is to give light must endure burning. -Viktor Frankl

11-07-2010, 08:56 AM	#1
DomnNC Timed Out How Do You Identify?: Male Preferred Pronoun?: He/Him Relationship Status: Widow Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Permanently Banned 11/15/2011 Posts: 1,223 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,618 Thanked 2,582 Times in 837 Posts Rep Power: 0	I agree that perhaps that was the wrong response, however, you have to give kudos to the man for hiring her and sticking by her, not asking her to resign to placate the masses. Rodney Monroe has been in his share of controversy since his appointment but let's not overlook that he did do a progressive and good thing in hiring her in the first place and then standing by his appointment. Prior to his arrival, all LGBT matters within the department were swept under the rug and kept hush hush, at least he's having the balls to come out within the force so to speak.

11-07-2010, 03:14 PM	#7
DomnNC Timed Out How Do You Identify?: Male Preferred Pronoun?: He/Him Relationship Status: Widow Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Permanently Banned 11/15/2011 Posts: 1,223 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,618 Thanked 2,582 Times in 837 Posts Rep Power: 0	I don't see that big of an issue with the statement: "I respect the decisions and convictions of those who have decided to resign, as I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs" Why? Because I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs. Why? Because I will NOT compromise my beliefs for anyone, not one single person, so it would be hypocritical of me to do the same or tell someone to do that very thing. A persons religious beliefs are just that, theirs, just as yours are yours and mine are mine. No one should challenge a persons religious beliefs lest you want to put your own under the microscope. Religion is a personal issue and a personal choice as I see it. As far as the first part: "He respects their decisions and convictions". Why shouldn't he respect their difference in opinion. After all we are asking people to respect our decisions for ourselves, our own convictions as individuals and as a group. I don't know, I'm not reading anything inflammatory into that other than what he meant which was in no way derogatory towards anyone. He was just stating his mind and respecting their decision to resign.

11-07-2010, 05:09 PM	#10
DomnNC Timed Out How Do You Identify?: Male Preferred Pronoun?: He/Him Relationship Status: Widow Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Permanently Banned 11/15/2011 Posts: 1,223 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,618 Thanked 2,582 Times in 837 Posts Rep Power: 0	In a letter to all the chaplains, CMPD Chief Rodney Monroe expressed disappointment that some members decided to leave the program. "I respect the decisions and convictions of those who have decided to resign, as I would never ask anyone to compromise their beliefs," he said. "But I do hope that those of us who remain ... continue to embrace our goal of being an inclusive organization that respects the differences of all of our employees." He also said he expressed disappointment in their decisions in a letter to all chaplains and also he said right after the statement that some have issue with that he hoped that those remaining continue to embrace their goal of inclusiveness. Kudos to him. I don't understand why one sentence is taken out of a complete article and out of context and made to be the focal point when he also made two very positive statements as well. He has been the FIRST police chief that Charlotte has had that is demanding that the GLBT community be treated with respect, tolerance and has made it a point to be vocal about it. I guess unless you live in Charlotte or the surrounding community and don't know the man and the regional politics it's easy to take someone who is making an effort and hang him out to dry because it doesn't measure up to some personal standard. I would be HAPPY to be the first one to shake his hand on a job well done in bridging the GLBT police officers with the rest of the force, be they white, black, purple, orange, a different religion, culture or what have you. The man is making a difference in the GLBT community and I for one will not hang him out to dry over one comment taken completely out of context. Btw, I lived in Charlotte for 32 years and have seen how the GLBT community has been treated and are being treated. I just recently moved down the road about 22 miles since my wife died but keep up with the local politics in Charlotte still as they still impact our community as a whole.