UN General Assembly: Summary execution of queers okay

[Julie]

Originally Posted by apocalipstic

I have a question. Why is our problem just with Queers being executed?

I am just quoting this part of your post, because it really put my stomach in knots.

I love the term Queer. While I identify as a Femme... I am also Queer.
Something about the way it is stated, makes me sad.

As I just explained on the phone to people I work with -- It is about PEOPLE. We should be concerned with Female Stoning and Female Circumcision, among the other atrocities going on in the world.

BUT THIS... Right now. There are PEOPLE/HUMAN BEINGS who are imprisoned in countries, such as Uganda - who have been on a "stay of execution." They no longer have protection. Tomorrow, they can be executed without the protection or investigation. This is HUGE.

I have contacts in many of these third world countries. I am concerned for them and those that I do not know. We are concerned, because OUR LGBTQ brothers and sisters will be executed.

[Apocalipstic]

Originally Posted by InfiniteFemme

I am just quoting this part of your post, because it really put my stomach in knots.

I love the term Queer. While I identify as a Femme... I am also Queer.
Something about the way it is stated, makes me sad.

As I just explained on the phone to people I work with -- It is about PEOPLE. We should be concerned with Female Stoning and Female Circumcision, among the other atrocities going on in the world.

BUT THIS... Right now. There are PEOPLE/HUMAN BEINGS who are imprisoned in countries, such as Uganda - who have been on a "stay of execution." They no longer have protection. Tomorrow, they can be executed without the protection or investigation. This is HUGE.

I have contacts in many of these third world countries. I am concerned for them and those that I do not know. We are concerned, because OUR LGBTQ brothers and sisters will be executed.

I was also using Queer as an umbrella term for Gay, Lesbian, Intersexed, Butch Femme, Trans, etc.

I am horrified that anyone is EVER executed.

I grew up in a country where people dissapeared all the time never to be heard from again. I think we should be just as angry about all of it, not just people like us. Gay people sat in prison and many were executed. Dead people were in the streets.

I think we are more horrified because its is people like us who are being executed, I think we should be horrified that anyone is executed.

Yes it is horrible to me that this vote went as it did, but even more horrible to me is that there is a list of groups it is ok to execute at all.

I asked that question as a Queer Femme Lesbian, sorry my use of Queer made your stomach feel upset. All of this makes mine pretty upset too.

[Apocalipstic]

In a perfect world I would wish for the US to have the good reputation to be able to stand up and say executing anyone is morally wrong. But we can't becasue we execute people and lie to the UN and start wars for no reason.

I wish we could censure Uganda and they would have to stop this.

That there is a list of who it is OK and not ok to excute makes my head need to explode.

[Julie]

Originally Posted by apocalipstic

I was also using Queer as an umbrella term for Gay, Lesbian, Intersexed, Butch Femme, Trans, etc.

I am horrified that anyone is EVER executed.

I grew up in a country where people dissapeared all the time never to be heard from again. I think we should be just as angry about all of it, not just people like us. Gay people sat in prison and many were executed. Dead people were in the streets.

I think we are more horrified because its is people like us who are being executed, I think we should be horrified that anyone is executed.

Yes it is horrible to me that this vote went as it did, but even more horrible to me is that there is a list of groups it is ok to execute at all.

I asked that question as a Queer Femme Lesbian, sorry my use of Queer made your stomach feel upset. All of this makes mine pretty upset too.

It's probably not you at all. It is the telephone conversations I have had this past few hours about this with colleagues. Nobody knew about this. I did not know about this and I generally get all the news in my inbox.

No, I am equally angry and upset over any type of cleansing/genocide. I think it almost reminded me of the term "troops," which was coined by our government, so we would not think of them as people when we heard. 600 Troops lost today. Which in fact meant... 600 people killed.

I am not sure what I can do - I am just one little person in a big giant world. BUT... I do have a big mouth and I will use it. Just as I have for any humanitarian rights issue that has come my way.

And... I am sorry you had to experience this in your life. Truly.

Julie

[Apocalipstic]

Originally Posted by InfiniteFemme

It's probably not you at all. It is the telephone conversations I have had this past few hours about this with colleagues. Nobody knew about this. I did not know about this and I generally get all the news in my inbox.

No, I am equally angry and upset over any type of cleansing/genocide. I think it almost reminded me of the term "troops," which was coined by our government, so we would not think of them as people when we heard. 600 Troops lost today. Which in fact meant... 600 people killed.

I am not sure what I can do - I am just one little person in a big giant world. BUT... I do have a big mouth and I will use it. Just as I have for any humanitarian rights issue that has come my way.

And... I am sorry you had to experience this in your life. Truly.

Julie

It is horribly sad. I get the relationship to the word troops. We need to bring those kids home! I could go on and on.....

Maybe if there is a way to send messages to the UN delegates from other countries, you could let us know? Or we can find out how to help groups against these executions in those countries financially?

I am against the death penalty and executions of any kind, and was trying to ask why we in general only get this upset when it is people like us being executed?

[Julie]

Originally Posted by apocalipstic

It is horribly sad. I get the relationship to the word troops. We need to bring those kids home! I could go on and on.....

Maybe if there is a way to send messages to the UN delegates from other countries, you could let us know? Or we can find out how to help groups against these executions in those countries financially?

I am against the death penalty and executions of any kind, and was trying to ask why we in general only get this upset when it is people like us being executed?

This is way BIGGER than me or my organization - sadly. I have contacted some other human rights people I know, who are pretty aggressive. I am waiting to hear back from them. This is not a USA issue - this is the UN which just happens to be in the USA. We tend to think the UN is American, because of this.

We can as individuals write to each and every one of the UN General Assembly Country members. Though, I am having difficulty finding the names of each individual who voted. I am working on that now.

http://www.un.org/en/members/

http://www.un.org/en/ga/about/background.shtml

[Apocalipstic]

Originally Posted by InfiniteFemme

This is way BIGGER than me or my organization - sadly. I have contacted some other human rights people I know, who are pretty aggressive. I am waiting to hear back from them. This is not a USA issue - this is the UN which just happens to be in the USA. We tend to think the UN is American, because of this.

We can as individuals write to each and every one of the UN General Assembly Country members. Though, I am having difficulty finding the names of each individual who voted. I am working on that now.

http://www.un.org/en/members/

http://www.un.org/en/ga/about/background.shtml

Thank you!

It is likely an issue that will have to be fought country by country without them feeling like the USA is trying to force our way of life down their throats.

Because the UN is in the USA, I do tend to expect more of the USA in regards to the UN. But as we saw during the last administration in the USA, we fall way short.

I appreciate you putting together the list, and for discussing this!

Maybe many small voices together can make a difference.

[Isadora]

From Rachel Maddow's site:

The vote was 79-70. Here's the list of countries that wanted to reserve the right to kill the gay:

Afghanistan, Algeria, Angola, Azerbaijan, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Belize, Benin, Botswana, Brunei Dar-Sala, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, China, Comoros, Congo, Cote d'Ivoire, Cuba, Democratic People's Republic of Korea, Democratic Republic of Congo, Djibouti, Egypt, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Ghana, Grenada, Guyana, Haiti, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Jamaica, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Kenya, Kuwait, Lebanon, Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Madagascar, Malawi, Malaysia, Maldives, Mali, Morocco, Mozambique, Myanmar, Namibia, Niger, Nigeria, Oman, Pakistan, Qatar, Russian Federation, Rwanda, Saint Kitts and Nevis, Saint Lucia, Saint Vincent and Grenadines, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Sierra Leone, Somalia, South Africa, Sudan, Suriname, Swaziland, Syrian Arab Republic, Tajikistan, Tunisia, Uganda, United Arab Emirates, United Republic of Tanzania, Uzbekistan, Viet Nam, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe

[dreadgeek]

Originally Posted by apocalipstic

It is horribly sad. I get the relationship to the word troops. We need to bring those kids home! I could go on and on.....

Maybe if there is a way to send messages to the UN delegates from other countries, you could let us know? Or we can find out how to help groups against these executions in those countries financially?

I am against the death penalty and executions of any kind, and was trying to ask why we in general only get this upset when it is people like us being executed?

I didn't post this because I’m only concerned about executions when it's people 'like us'. I posted it because it is horrific. If the UN General Assembly had passed a resolution saying that Muslims could be summarily executed I would STILL have posted it and I would still be horrified because summary executions are immoral.

I'm not completely against the death penalty there are crimes that are so completely heinous that I think the person who commits them forfeits their lives. However, the crimes I'm thinking of--specifically the use of nuclear weapons by non-state actor or someone reintroducing smallpox into the ecology as a bioweapon--haven't taken place yet. (And before someone says that the United States used nuclear weapons the key phrase is non-state actor. States can keep other states in check. My concern here is nuclear terrorism.) Now, the day someone uses either a nuke or a bioweapon in a terrorist attack, anyone involved in the planning of that act should be tried and when convicted executed. But that's about it for anything less than that, I think the death penalty is needless.

Some of the nations that voted for this are simply beyond anyone's ability to influence. Nothing is going to make North Korea listen to us. However, other nations can be influenced because of tourism--or the lack thereof. Jamaica lives or dies on tourism and a tourism boycott WOULD be felt by them.

Cheers
Aj

[Nat]

I believe this is the resolution from two years ago, when sexual orientation was first included.

Here's the bit that used to include sexual orientation

To ensure the effective protection of the right to life of all persons under their jurisdiction and to investigate promptly and thoroughly all killings, including those targeted at specific groups of persons, such as racially motivated violence leading to the death of the victim, killings of persons belonging to national or ethnic, religious and linguistic minorities, killings of persons affected by terrorism, hostage-taking or foreign occupation, killings of refugees, internally displaced persons, migrants, street children or members of indigenous communities, killings of persons for reasons related to their activities as human rights defenders, lawyers, journalists or demonstrators, killings committed in the name of passion or in the name of honour, all killings committed for any discriminatory reason, including sexual orientation, as well as all other cases where a person’s right to life has been violated, and to bring those responsible to justice before a competent, independent and impartial judiciary at the national or, where appropriate, international level, and to ensure that such killings, including those committed by security forces, police and law enforcement agents, paramilitary groups or private forces, are neither condoned nor sanctioned by State officials or personnel;