Getting Rid of Flippant Language : Check Yourselves Here

[Andrew, Jr.]

Superfemme,

Like you, I have had seizures in public. And yes, people walked overtop of me during my seizures. It was at my last job. I was left alone. Afterwards, I peed myself, and vomited. It is all apart of epilespy. I had to give a blood test to my employer to verify I wasn't drunk as well. I also had to hire a lawyer. They tried to fire me for being who and what I was for years. Then to have epilespy was just one more thing to throw in the pot. My employer also tried to have my driver's license taken away from me.

You are not understanding what it is I am trying to say. I apologise to you if I hurt you. That is not my intent. Not at all. And I am the same way as you, but I am trying to bring those who are the "norm" to our world. To build a bridge. Not to make you a victim. That is confusing to me. Perception is different to each one of us. I am very happy you found compassion. I have yet to find it within a group. I have found compassion person by person. That is it. Even in my rehab. group, each one of us was handicapped in different ways. There was no way we could have compassion for each other since we had no clue as to what compassion even was.

Anyway, my apologisies to you. I meant no harm, ugliness, or evilness. I won't be back here. I don't want to get timed out, banned, or anything else.

Andrew

[WolfyOne]

Just wanted to chime in and say what a great thread topic this is. I haven't seen one this good anywhere in a long time. Thanks for getting us started Medusa.

[Diva]

My heart goes out to SF and Andrew in light of insensitive treatment by others. Shame on those people.

In other news, I'm a flippant kinda girl (the [sometimes] "lacking seriousness" part, not the "lacking respect" part). When I was in college learning how to teach, one of the things we were "taught" was NEVER to use sarcasm. I discarded that 'rule', as I couldn't teach without it. That being said, there are 2 types of sarcasm....I don't have to tell YOU that.....there's silly sarcasm and there's hateful (hate-filled sarcasm.....which, imho, is oh~so passive-aggressive).

And I also believe there is a certain responsibility which we ALL must share in the giving and receiving of comments made to us. Sometimes, I think there are people who are just waiting to be offended. And they will look for anything and everything over which to be offended. "Chip on their shoulder" is the phrase which comes to mind. Then, of course, there are the whiners and those who are the victims....and there's ALways someone sayin' something 'wrong' to them.

I do my best to be sensitive with my own words, but I know I don't always succeed. It is our human condition, after all. If someone says things to me [repeatedly] that makes me go "hmmm....that was icky", I have no problem just stepping back from that person with no hard feelings......I have found that that works best for me. I know we can't know what that person may be going through at any given moment. And while that's all well and good, I have the responsibility to ME to not be someone else's doormat.

[SuperFemme]

First off, I want to tell Woodie that there is absolutely no need to leave the thread. You are invaluable and not going to get banned or flamed for speaking your mind.

I am not/was not offended. Perhaps my feeler were hurt but not necessarily by you Woodie. It just floored me that you think if we both had a seizure in the same time and place the *I* for some reason would be assisted first. We have such big things in common. I'm not faring any better in the world of different-ability than you. I guess I couldn't understand why you would think so? If you're up to it can you please tell me WHY you have this impression?

I would also like to point out to you gently that lots of people care about you. This community seems to wrap their arms around you in love and compassion. I'd like to hold a mirror up to you so that you could see how much you are cared about.

So please. Don't go away. Let's talk about this, it could be very enlightening and I for one am open to learning.

hugs,

SuperFemme

[MsDemeanor]

Originally Posted by Diva

And I also believe there is a certain responsibility which we ALL must share in the giving and receiving of comments made to us. Sometimes, I think there are people who are just waiting to be offended. And they will look for anything and everything over which to be offended. "Chip on their shoulder" is the phrase which comes to mind. Then, of course, there are the whiners and those who are the victims....and there's ALways someone sayin' something 'wrong' to them.

For me, this is a part of the problem. Sadly, it takes watching the behavior repeat before one can readily identify the victims, whiners, and chipsters; you can't always see it right away, so you end up thinking that you've wronged someone when the reality is that you're dealing with someone who jumps at the opportunity to act/be hurt or offended. It makes me quite happy that no one can hear me snort or see my eyes roll when I'm in front of my computer.

[Diva]

Originally Posted by MsDemeanor

For me, this is a part of the problem. Sadly, it takes watching the behavior repeat before one can readily identify the victims, whiners, and chipsters; you can't always see it right away, so you end up thinking that you've wronged someone when the reality is that you're dealing with someone who jumps at the opportunity to act/be hurt or offended. It makes me quite happy that no one can hear me snort or see my eyes roll when I'm in front of my computer.

Totally get THIS! And it IS sad that it takes a while to figure that out. And just as sad, I think, is that it might not even be evident to THEM until one day, that person's gonna look around them and say to themselves, "Hey! Where'd everybody go?!?!" and what they will hear back is the echo in the room.

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by SuperFemme

I think this is a great lesson in SELF perception. Because I have had many seizures in public Woodie. Hmm. Let me give you a few examples. One time I had a doozie of a seizure in the supermarket. When I came to the store security was pointing a gun at me.

Two other times I went from having a seizure to nobody helping, calling for help and tried to walk myself home. These two times I was arrested for *drunk in public* despite having a letter from my Neurosurgeon and a seizure card and medic alert bracelet. I blew 0.0 on the breathalyzer and then had forced blood tests. I sat in jail for over eight hours until the results came back. Without apology.

I flew to NM with my family who had decided my head injury was me being dramatic. We got off the shuttle at the car rental place and again I had a doozie. My own fucking family stepped right over me and left me laying on the cement in 102 degree weather. The shuttle driver turned me on my side and talked gently to me. He had a son with epilepsy.

In Vegas in 06 I had a seizure during the Ball at the Bash. Do you remember that? Because everybody walked right by me, and when I was taken to the ladies room by a dear friend? Bash attendee's were coming in and rolling their eyes.

The only place I experienced compassion was in my brain injury school. We all looked out for each other and had a plan of action. The teachers knew my quirks and could tell when I was going to seize. They kept a pillow and blanket in the cupboard and always made sure I didn't get hurt and that I came to in a soft, quiet and safe environment. We all did that for each other because it is kind of like a special club we are in, where only we can truly know...

So the assumption that I get some kind of pretty privilege is hurtful. At the end of the day we are the same. We have these seizures and it scares the bystanders because it is in the realm of the unknown for them. It usually traumatizes them, and then us because we hear the nasty/ignorant comments as we are trying to find our way back to our bodies.

Regardless of the bad experiences I am NOT a victim. I am a fucking MIRACLE and if one person learns something and changes their perspective after witnessing my seizure, then perhaps they will pass it on and the torch of empathy, compassion, and love will burn a little brighter. You are a miracle to Woodie. Not a victim.

I have to say that you hurt my feelings, but only for a second. Because I'm not giving them away.

I want names, missy. Names and locations and I'll go open up a ("worms" = whoopass, btw) on those people. The same for Andrew.

That kind of behavior is absolutely reprehensible in my mind. Absolutely. There's no excuse for it.

Having said that, I am most definitely NOT what might be called a "pc" person. I say a LOT of things that I've begun to reevaluate and tweak since this thread started.

There is a stark difference between saying something that may or may be offensive and walking away from someone in a medical emergency situation, though. That is something I could never do.

*shakes head*

[Darth Denkay]

Arwen makes a really important point here. If I am offended by what someone posts, it is my responsibility to let that be known, and again as Arwen said, in a frank and gentle way. I think that the individual should explain what is offensive about the word/phrase as well. While I am certain that at times folks make comments that they know will be offensive but do so anyway, in the majority of the cases (I hope) the person doesn't realize that it might be taken offensively. The intention is not to be offensive, but yeah, we're all going to say stuff not realizing how it is taken by some. I try to give folks the benefit of the doubt - if something is said that bothers me I'll point it out while assuming that no ill will was intended. In this way, my point is made respectfully, no accusations thrown, and we can get on with whatever discussion was going on to begin with.

[quote=Arwen;23636]

The person who is offended needs to have the courage to say something to the person who said the offending term. As has been pointed out by many of us, we do not always know when a word is offensive. So being told in a frank and gentle way is important.[QUOTE]

Slippery slope indeed. You mention various areas where censorship has been used/abused: art, film, books, music. I'm going to offer a thought, wondering if it is a useful distinction to make. The mediums you mention, as artistic expressions, are things that we generally have a choice in whether or not we view them. If we don't like a movie or book, we don't bother with them, and this affects no one except ourselves. When art is displayed, books written, music played, the intended audience is some population full of folks the artist doesn't know. SUre, some people might be offended, but this is a case where that is entirely unavoidable. Specific example - I find Howard Sterns absolutely completely offensive. I choose not to listen to him. But my being offended is nothing directed personally at me. No relationship between us, nothing personal.

To my mind this is a very different scenario than art offered to the public in general. We are a group of folks involved in dialogues between specific people. Some of us know each other in real-time, some don't but know folks well in online terms - there are relationships involved here. Real people, real names. Real feelings. I think it is different here, there should be attempts to not offend because, well, we're a community. Mistakes will be made, of course. Disagreements are going to happen. But if we try to communicate respectfully, seems as though our discussions should generally go reasonably smoothly.

Thoughts? Fair distinction?

Originally Posted by Ms Cyn

I struggle with this issue..

It feels like such a slippery slope to me...


On one hand I think that we as a society can become too *polite* too careful.. We want to make sure that no one is offended...

But someone is going to be offended by something.. Period..

Where does it end?

Art?
Film?
Music?
Books?

People have both fought for and against the right to censor these things..

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