OCCUPY WALL STREET

[Cin]

Originally Posted by Yellow band

I support a real jobs plan, which will reduce burdensome regulations that are preventing businesses from hiring; ratify three pending free trade agreements that will increase Pennsylvania's exports; simplify and reduce business and individual tax rates to encourage job-creating business expansions; and get our federal deficits under control, among other pro-growth measures. This plan will actually create jobs.

You know it concerns me that our elected officials, elected by the people and supposedly working for the people, can continue to spout this rhetoric. I am sure they have an understanding of how the economy works and how it could be fixed, they know what they are saying are lies, yet they continue to spread these untruths.

How will continued and increased tax breaks for corporations, who if not stopped will continue to bring jobs out of the country where there is cheaper labor, ever, ever create jobs for Americans? How can our elected officials not know this? They do know it. Yet they continue to tell us different because they believe the majority of people are too stupid to figure it out. So there is no harm for them in lying to us.

Free trade agreements aren’t very helpful for creating jobs when we continue to import so much more than we export. No jobs there. It would be helpful if, at least, we could tax imports from. U.S. corporations that are U.S. in ownership only. Meaning they provide no U.S. jobs, no goods are produced in U.S., no raw materials are purchased in the U.S. These corporations should be treated like foreign corporations and should pay to import their products to the U.S. So why don’t our elected officials understand this simple reality. Free trade agreements won’t get us jobs. Are they stupid or do they believe we are stupid?

I shudder to imagine what could define burdensome regulations. We don’t even have enough regulations in place to stop the financial sector from destroying the economy of the world. How much less regulations could we possibly survive with? How can any official, given the jam that a lack of regulation just got us into, say with a straight face that we need less of these burdensome regulations? It’s like the mayor of Oakland saying that Oakland needs a more aggressive police department. She would never say that because it would be political suicide. But politicians feel no such qualms about telling us we need to deregulate. Why? Do they think we are so stupid they can get away with that? They seem to be getting away with it.

The federal deficit would get in control much easier if we hadn’t had to bailout those poor over-regulated financial terrorists. But I doubt curtailing handouts to the wealthy is what the 1% has in mind when they speak of getting the deficits under control. They mean austerity measures (social genocide).

So let me see if I can get this straight. The deficit is so bad because the financial sector engaged in actions that [purposely (hard to believe that they could ignore all the warnings and still plead ignorance) or accidentally because of greed and disinterest in consequences – you choose which you believe] are destroying the world’s economy (which destruction, if they place their bets correctly, could even make them money –so really what is in it for them if we have economic recovery) and we the 99% had to bail them out. And we had to bail them out despite the reality that of all the people hurt by their actions they suffered least, if at all, and that the 1% has plenty of money, the banks have plenty of money, everyone who is anyone in finance is still making money hand over fist, but just they don’t have money they wish to share. Then to add injury to insult we have to be squeezed and nickel and dimed to death. The 1% continues to insist on tax breaks and deregulation and bailouts and bonuses and whatnot that benefit them and that will inevitably erase the middle class, crush the working class and leave the poor hopeless. Rather than raise taxes for the rich they would rather subject the rest of us to untold pain and suffering.

They talk like the things they are saying make perfect sense and deserve to be taken seriously as an answer to our economic woes. It’s as though we should take seriously the idea that perhaps the sun does indeed revolve around the earth after all.

[Sachita]

Does anyone remember this? How profound George was. RIP

[persiphone]

Originally Posted by Miss Tick

You know it concerns me that our elected officials, elected by the people and supposedly working for the people, can continue to spout this rhetoric. I am sure they have an understanding of how the economy works and how it could be fixed, they know what they are saying are lies, yet they continue to spread these untruths.

How will continued and increased tax breaks for corporations, who if not stopped will continue to bring jobs out of the country where there is cheaper labor, ever, ever create jobs for Americans? How can our elected officials not know this? They do know it. Yet they continue to tell us different because they believe the majority of people are too stupid to figure it out. So there is no harm for them in lying to us.

Free trade agreements aren’t very helpful for creating jobs when we continue to import so much more than we export. No jobs there. It would be helpful if, at least, we could tax imports from. U.S. corporations that are U.S. in ownership only. Meaning they provide no U.S. jobs, no goods are produced in U.S., no raw materials are purchased in the U.S. These corporations should be treated like foreign corporations and should pay to import their products to the U.S. So why don’t our elected officials understand this simple reality. Free trade agreements won’t get us jobs. Are they stupid or do they believe we are stupid?

I shudder to imagine what could define burdensome regulations. We don’t even have enough regulations in place to stop the financial sector from destroying the economy of the world. How much less regulations could we possibly survive with? How can any official, given the jam that a lack of regulation just got us into, say with a straight face that we need less of these burdensome regulations? It’s like the mayor of Oakland saying that Oakland needs a more aggressive police department. She would never say that because it would be political suicide. But politicians feel no such qualms about telling us we need to deregulate. Why? Do they think we are so stupid they can get away with that? They seem to be getting away with it.

The federal deficit would get in control much easier if we hadn’t had to bailout those poor over-regulated financial terrorists. But I doubt curtailing handouts to the wealthy is what the 1% has in mind when they speak of getting the deficits under control. They mean austerity measures (social genocide).

So let me see if I can get this straight. The deficit is so bad because the financial sector engaged in actions that [purposely (hard to believe that they could ignore all the warnings and still plead ignorance) or accidentally because of greed and disinterest in consequences – you choose which you believe] are destroying the world’s economy (which destruction, if they place their bets correctly, could even make them money –so really what is in it for them if we have economic recovery) and we the 99% had to bail them out. And we had to bail them out despite the reality that of all the people hurt by their actions they suffered least, if at all, and that the 1% has plenty of money, the banks have plenty of money, everyone who is anyone in finance is still making money hand over fist, but just they don’t have money they wish to share. Then to add injury to insult we have to be squeezed and nickel and dimed to death. The 1% continues to insist on tax breaks and deregulation and bailouts and bonuses and whatnot that benefit them and that will inevitably erase the middle class, crush the working class and leave the poor hopeless. Rather than raise taxes for the rich they would rather subject the rest of us to untold pain and suffering.

They talk like the things they are saying make perfect sense and deserve to be taken seriously as an answer to our economic woes. It’s as though we should take seriously the idea that perhaps the sun does indeed revolve around the earth after all.

they're still clinging to the notion of trickle down economics, which, as we've seen, doesn't work. they keep talking this trash but never mention that the largest corporations in this country are literally sitting on a collective trillions of dollars in cash. TRILLIONS! of CASH! they aren't spending shit and we are the most deregulated we've ever been since after the Depression. the bottom line is they have no other answers. it's all lip service. they really don't have any other ammo in their arsenal. the same old spewing of nonsense is all they've got.

[Cin]

Originally Posted by persiphone

they're still clinging to the notion of trickle down economics, which, as we've seen, doesn't work. they keep talking this trash but never mention that the largest corporations in this country are literally sitting on a collective trillions of dollars in cash. TRILLIONS! of CASH! they aren't spending shit and we are the most deregulated we've ever been since after the Depression. the bottom line is they have no other answers. it's all lip service. they really don't have any other ammo in their arsenal. the same old spewing of nonsense is all they've got.

Well, actually it works just fine for the 1%. And they don't need any other answers. People are still buying this crap by the bushel. Truthfully these financial terrorists scare everyone with there doom economics. If they don't get what they want the economy will collapse, if they fail we will all shrivel up and die. The 99% needs to protect the 1% because they are our ticket to prosperity. Well we've all been riding that train for awhile and I don't know about you but I don't seem to be prospering so much at all. But they threaten us with if you think it's bad now wait and see if any of the shit storm we've created ever gets spattered on us there will be hell to pay. They threaten us saying if anything happens to move us toward a more equitable distribution of the wealth we will take your jobs and eat you alive. Hell I got news for them they've already done that.

Oh, I'm sure they have plenty of ammo in their arsenal. I bet we get a first hand look at it real soon.

[persiphone]

Originally Posted by Miss Tick

Well, actually it works just fine for the 1%. And they don't need any other answers. People are still buying this crap by the bushel. Truthfully these financial terrorists scare everyone with there doom economics. If they don't get what they want the economy will collapse, if they fail we will all shrivel up and die. The 99% needs to protect the 1% because they are our ticket to prosperity. Well we've all been riding that train for awhile and I don't know about you but I don't seem to be prospering so much at all. But they threaten us with if you think it's bad now wait and see if any of the shit storm we've created ever gets spattered on us there will be hell to pay. They threaten us saying if anything happens to move us toward a more equitable distribution of the wealth we will take your jobs and eat you alive. Hell I got news for them they've already done that.

Oh, I'm sure they have plenty of ammo in their arsenal. I bet we get a first hand look at it real soon.

truth be told i'd like to see the whole thing go under. seriously. i can feed myself without money so i'm just not scared of it. they already took my son's college fund and my retirement. my gramma always said.....never get into a fight with someone who has nothing to lose. fear has worked up to this point to spur the masses into voting for crap that screws us in the end. i think the whole doom economics thing has had it's 15 minutes of fame, they just aren't aware that the panic button is broken. we still haven't seen the worst of it. and i say that cuz it just keeps getting worse lol! when we hit the bottom we will all know it and that includes the 1%. you can't eat a 5 million dollar yacht and bullets don't make themselves. yanno who's gonna make it? the granola eating greenies and the survivalist conspiracy theorists! hahahahaa

[Sachita]

I am certainly not counting on SS, money, retirement programs or anything administrated by our government. My retirement plan is owning a big chunk of land free and clear, stock piles of non-gmo organic seeds, lots of hens, more fruit and nut trees and the knowledge to sustain no matter how fucked up it gets.

I do depend on money but could also do without it. Now that, to me, is the ultimate freedom

[persiphone]

Originally Posted by Sachita

I am certainly not counting on SS, money, retirement programs or anything administrated by our government. My retirement plan is owning a big chunk of land free and clear, stock piles of non-gmo organic seeds, lots of hens, more fruit and nut trees and the knowledge to sustain no matter how fucked up it gets.

I do depend on money but could also do without it. Now that, to me, is the ultimate freedom

wouldn't that be lovely? when i say they took my retirement and my son's college fund, i mean i invested hard cash. and now? it's gone. i've never been the recipient of anything from the government until getting a PELL grant to go to college. (thanks Obama! ) i never even take a tax refund. i figure they need it more than me. in fact...thinking back....i have never in my life received a tax refund check. in the times that i have worked for a paycheck and taxes were taken out, i've never technically earned enough to even qualify for filing and i didn't feel like i needed a tax refund so badly that i would annoy myself with such a nightmare institution like the IRS (which i am personally against to begin with) for a few bucks. i'll pass thanks.

i'm rambling. i really really love the idea of being self sufficient. it's a hard life though. but i'm not afraid of hard labor. never have been. it's good to know like minded people.

[SoNotHer]

That's been my belief and plan. ;-)

Originally Posted by Sachita

I am certainly not counting on SS, money, retirement programs or anything administrated by our government. My retirement plan is owning a big chunk of land free and clear, stock piles of non-gmo organic seeds, lots of hens, more fruit and nut trees and the knowledge to sustain no matter how fucked up it gets.

I do depend on money but could also do without it. Now that, to me, is the ultimate freedom

[Cin]

They haven't got enough money they are hoarding. Let's find ways for them to get more. I mean the most we can expect from them is that they will have more business lunches with their 35% tips and maybe some extra landscaping and car washing...


Just Say No to Corporate Greed

Repatriation. It's a word many schoolchildren probably haven't yet learned to define or even seen very often outside of spelling bees. But when it comes to corporate taxes, repatriation is the cornerstone of an idea that has the potential to severely hurt millions of children and parents and widen the already historic and unconscionable gap between the rich and the poor.

In its simplest definition, repatriation is bringing something back to its country of origin—returning it back home. One of the solutions to the jobs crisis being proposed by some of our Congressional leaders and lobbied for aggressively by some of the country's richest corporations is a rehash of an old experiment: enacting a repatriation tax holiday that would temporarily allow U.S.-based multinational companies to bring home profits they currently hold overseas at a 5.25 percent tax rate, instead of the usual 35 percent corporate tax rate. Under current tax law, multinational companies generally pay no U.S. corporate taxes on foreign income until those profits are brought back to the U.S. As the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities (CBPP) explains, “This effectively allows such firms to defer payment of the U.S. corporate income tax on their overseas profits indefinitely, even though they may obtain an immediate tax deduction for many expenses incurred in supporting the same overseas investments. This can produce a negative U.S. corporate income tax—that is, a net government subsidy—for overseas operations. In addition to causing the federal government to lose tax revenue, this structure gives multinationals a significant incentive to shift economic activity—as well as their reported profits—overseas.”

The argument for the repatriation holiday is that giving corporations a huge incentive to bring profits back right now—in the form of an enormous tax break—would bring billions of dollars back to the U.S. economy that would be reinvested and provide a big stimulus to our economy. Corporate proponents and their Congressional bullies argue this will create desperately needed jobs.

But the last time this was tried, under a 2004 Bush Administration plan, it didn't work out that way. Instead, as CBPP points out, “The evidence shows that firms mostly used the repatriated earnings not to invest in U.S. jobs or growth but for purposes that Congress sought to prohibit, such as repurchasing their own stock and paying bigger dividends to their shareholders. Moreover, many firms actually laid off large numbers of U.S. workers even as they reaped multi-billion-dollar benefits from the tax holiday and passed them on to shareholders.” Many economists and scholars believe that if corporations get their way and get another repatriation holiday, history will repeat itself—and once again the corporations and their shareholders, not American workers, families, and children, will be the only winners.

The nonpartisan congressional Joint Committee on Taxation has estimated the holiday would cost the federal government about $80 billion over ten years in lost revenue. The Economic Policy Institute's Andrew Fieldhouse puts it this way: “While there are numerous job creation proposals that would meaningfully lower unemployment, some lawmakers are pushing counterproductive policies disguised as job creation packages. The proposed repeat of the corporate tax repatriation holiday is one such wolf in sheep's clothing.” When the nation is already facing a jobs crisis and many Congressional leaders are threatening to slash nutrition, child care, and other safety net programs children and families rely on as a means of balancing the budget, revisiting a failed idea instead of coming up with real solutions and real jobs is a threat children and families and our country cannot afford. As the Occupy Wall Street protestors are shouting, let's “just say no to corporate greed” and to Congresspeople who continue to raid from the poor and children to curry favor and campaign contributions from the rich.

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by Sachita

I am certainly not counting on SS, money, retirement programs or anything administrated by our government. My retirement plan is owning a big chunk of land free and clear, stock piles of non-gmo organic seeds, lots of hens, more fruit and nut trees and the knowledge to sustain no matter how fucked up it gets.

I do depend on money but could also do without it. Now that, to me, is the ultimate freedom

Oh I should have said I already own my chunk of land free and clear. I refinanced and took 25 acres off my mortgage in the event my mortgage company got freaky. I also put my greenhouse on the free and clear land. I already have the seeds but continue to get things. I have hens but want 100 going all the times.

I need help

[SoNotHer]

Smart. Smart. Smart. I've been doing the same and trying to pick up a few skills in the process. ;-)

I tell anyone, my students included, to invest in land, and preferably land with good soil and water.

Originally Posted by Sachita

Oh I should have said I already own my chunk of land free and clear. I refinanced and took 25 acres off my mortgage in the event my mortgage company got freaky. I also put my greenhouse on the free and clear land. I already have the seeds but continue to get things. I have hens but want 100 going all the times.

I need help

[persiphone]

Originally Posted by Sachita

Oh I should have said I already own my chunk of land free and clear. I refinanced and took 25 acres off my mortgage in the event my mortgage company got freaky. I also put my greenhouse on the free and clear land. I already have the seeds but continue to get things. I have hens but want 100 going all the times.

I need help

more slight derailing/

ever thought of a commune?

/more slight derailing

[Cin]

Originally Posted by persiphone

truth be told i'd like to see the whole thing go under. seriously. i can feed myself without money so i'm just not scared of it. they already took my son's college fund and my retirement. my gramma always said.....never get into a fight with someone who has nothing to lose. fear has worked up to this point to spur the masses into voting for crap that screws us in the end. i think the whole doom economics thing has had it's 15 minutes of fame, they just aren't aware that the panic button is broken. we still haven't seen the worst of it. and i say that cuz it just keeps getting worse lol! when we hit the bottom we will all know it and that includes the 1%. you can't eat a 5 million dollar yacht and bullets don't make themselves. yanno who's gonna make it? the granola eating greenies and the survivalist conspiracy theorists! hahahahaa

Urban dweller here. Never owned any land, never even a house. Came from a long line of no land no home people. Although I will say my grandparents raised chickens in the backyard of 3 story tenement building when i was kid. They also slaughtered pigs and god knows what else down in the basement. I remember roosters crowing up and down the neighborhood so they weren't the only people to do that. Lots of veggies and everybody grew grapes and made wine. However, nobody does that much anymore. I guess there are laws against it. Not the vegetables, the chickens i mean. I guess us land deprived lack of money to buy any urbanites are pretty screwed. Although I think my survival skills are quite honed.

I really do hope the panic button is broke though.

[persiphone]

Originally Posted by Miss Tick

Urban dweller here. Never owned any land, never even a house. Came from a long line of no land no home people. Although I will say my grandparents raised chickens in the backyard of 3 story tenement building when i was kid. They also slaughtered pigs and god knows what else down in the basement. I remember roosters crowing up and down the neighborhood so they weren't the only people to do that. Lots of veggies and everybody grew grapes and made wine. However, nobody does that much anymore. I guess there are laws against it. Not the vegetables, the chickens i mean. I guess us land deprived lack of money to buy any urbanites are pretty screwed. Although I think my survival skills are quite honed.

I really do hope the panic button is broke though.

slight derail/

there are ways around this! on my now defunct previous laptop i had plans downloaded for a complete indoor container garden that used old plastic containers and hung on the wall. ya just gotta think out of the urban box a little bit.

/slight derail