Tristan Taormino - loves butch girls

[skeeter_01]

Thanks so much Kobi!! I was just about to ask, who the heck is Tristan Taormino?? LoL!! You saved me the embarrassment of being told (and rightly so!) to go Google her!

[Kobi]

Originally Posted by skeeter_01

Thanks so much Kobi!! I was just about to ask, who the heck is Tristan Taormino?? LoL!! You saved me the embarrassment of being told (and rightly so!) to go Google her!

I should have done a little more research myself LOL.

This quote is from an article she wrote for the Village Voice back in 1999 entitled: Of Butches, Kings, and Masculinity.

The exact quote is the first paragraph of the article and was cleaned up a bit.

" I love butch girls. Girls with slick, shiny, barbershop haircuts, trimmed so short your fingertips can barely grip it. Girls with shirts that button the other way. Girls that swagger. Girls who have dicks made of flesh and silicone and latex and magic. Girls who get stared at in the ladies' room, girls who shop in the boys department, girls who live every moment looking like they weren't supposed to. Girls with hands that touch me like they have been exploring my body their entire lives. Girls who have big cocks, love blowjobs, and like to fuck girls hard. It is the girls that get called sir every day who make me catch my breath, the girls with strong jaws who buckle my knees, the girls who are a different gender who make me want to lay down for them."

Reading the paragraph within the context helps a lot. LOL. I can be such a freakin doofus.

The entire article is here: http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-10-...d-masculinity/

[~ocean]

the part that got my attention is u know how to play a womans body like an isntrument >>> hmm << wants to be a drum .. bang me baby ~ lol ?? j/k .. maybe not..

[Tawse]

Might I say... Tristan writes some very hot stuff... very... she's one of the top three on my list (along with Patrick Califia and Laura Antoniou)

[thedivahrrrself]

From a language perspective, I can see why she chose the word "girl". I don't think she would ever call a butch person a "girl", but in her writing, she chose the word that most contrasted with butch. Butch: tough, masculine, hard. Girl: sweet, feminine, soft. I think it was an creative artistic choice. I like the quote, though I can understand why you might object to it. I, however, think it's beautifully written. (And I don't think of butches as "girls". But I doubt the author does either.)

[The_Lady_Snow]

I interpreted it as art via words, it resonates with each word you can literally feel it with her words and it can also conjure up feelings for those of us who have had the same exact feelings.

This: " Girls who have big cocks, love blowjobs, and like to fuck girls hard"

As a young dyke I remember those moments of excitement, fear, pulsing areas, the tightness that came with having an epiphany that that cock slinging girl was going to open up a world of unexhibited sexual escapades, it's like a tall glass of ice cold water on as hot as hell day, it's only satisfies your thirst for a second before the temperature rises again.

That's why it's art in my opinion because it's a different experience for every individual.

[Novelafemme]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

I interpreted it as art via words, it resonates with each word you can literally feel it with her words and it can also conjure up feelings for those of us who have had the same exact feelings.

This: " Girls who have big cocks, love blowjobs, and like to fuck girls hard"

As a young dyke I remember those moments of excitement, fear, pulsing areas, the tightness that came with having an epiphany that that cock slinging girl was going to open up a world of unexhibited sexual escapades, it's like a tall glass of ice cold water on as hot as hell day, it's only satisfies your thirst for a second before the temperature rises again.
That's why it's art in my opinion because it's a different experience for every individual.

is it hot in here or what!!

[JAGG]

I loved it. I thought it was awesome. That some female, femme,lady,woman, whatever you prefer,embraces who I am and isn't embarrassed by my appearance. Isn't trying to soften, my look but saying ,people wouldn't call you sir so often if you would grow your hair out, or maybe if you would wear some womens clothes or even unisex clothes once in awhile. Maybe if you would get your ears pierced. She is saying, she wants that, that's what attracts her, she doesn't just accept it, deal with or tolerate it, she loves it!
Wish I could have known women like that exsisted when I was a teenager.
But then again I'm not one to read into things and pick apart word for word. Something someone wrote, I just take the face value of it, I know what she meant. She may not have used the proper wording, she assumed butch was a cut and dry stereotype . But I know she meant, that is the type she likes.
Since we are on the subject, I will stick my neck on the chopping board here. I was born butch. I have been butch all my life. And even I don't know half the terms or words or titles some people in the community think others should be using. Or terms that others find offensive. I guess it's all relative to the individual.
I'm pretty sure the person who wrote this wasn't trying to offend anyone, just the opposite, she was trying to say this is what I love. And probably if she thought she was offending someone would have worded it to their liking. Butch girl doesn't bother me at all. But that's just me, my opinion.

[CherylNYC]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I should have done a little more research myself LOL.

This quote is from an article she wrote for the Village Voice back in 1999 entitled: Of Butches, Kings, and Masculinity.

The exact quote is the first paragraph of the article and was cleaned up a bit.

" I love butch girls. Girls with slick, shiny, barbershop haircuts, trimmed so short your fingertips can barely grip it. Girls with shirts that button the other way. Girls that swagger. Girls who have dicks made of flesh and silicone and latex and magic. Girls who get stared at in the ladies' room, girls who shop in the boys department, girls who live every moment looking like they weren't supposed to. Girls with hands that touch me like they have been exploring my body their entire lives. Girls who have big cocks, love blowjobs, and like to fuck girls hard. It is the girls that get called sir every day who make me catch my breath, the girls with strong jaws who buckle my knees, the girls who are a different gender who make me want to lay down for them."

Reading the paragraph within the context helps a lot. LOL. I can be such a freakin doofus.

The entire article is here: http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-10-...d-masculinity/

Thank you for finding the complete quote, Kobi. I remember reading that in the Voice when Tristan wrote it. That was nearly 15 years ago, and we were all much younger! This piece was incredibly subversive at the time.

Back then I was more sensitive to any man, gay or straight, who called me or any other woman 'girl'. I corrected them relentlessly because... well I really don't have to bother explaining it. Everyone knows why it was so demeaning coming from a man. It was an especially dangerous word to use on me back in the 1980s when I was struggling so hard to be treated with respect while working as a carpenter/stagehand. Now I really don't care about 'girl' when it's applied to me unless it's thrown down in a way that's designed to infantilise me.

On the other hand, I certainly still get twitchy when anyone who isn't one of us refers to a butch as 'girl'. It seems as if that person isn't seeing the butch for who she is, and that gets me all wound up. It's interesting to re-read this quote now, because at the time I never even noticed the use of 'girl'. I think I must have been too distracted by the erotic content.

[*Anya*]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I should have done a little more research myself LOL.

This quote is from an article she wrote for the Village Voice back in 1999 entitled: Of Butches, Kings, and Masculinity.

The exact quote is the first paragraph of the article and was cleaned up a bit.

" I love butch girls. Girls with slick, shiny, barbershop haircuts, trimmed so short your fingertips can barely grip it. Girls with shirts that button the other way. Girls that swagger. Girls who have dicks made of flesh and silicone and latex and magic. Girls who get stared at in the ladies' room, girls who shop in the boys department, girls who live every moment looking like they weren't supposed to. Girls with hands that touch me like they have been exploring my body their entire lives. Girls who have big cocks, love blowjobs, and like to fuck girls hard. It is the girls that get called sir every day who make me catch my breath, the girls with strong jaws who buckle my knees, the girls who are a different gender who make me want to lay down for them."

Reading the paragraph within the context helps a lot. LOL. I can be such a freakin doofus.

The entire article is here: http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-10-...d-masculinity/

I would like to offer another perspective on this!

Before I read it to my butch, I said: "Just substitute butch for 'girl' when you hear it".

When I first read it, that actually is what I did mentally, instead of focusing on the word "girl" but you could substitute whatever ID or gender or gender-free ID that you prefer.

I absolutely loved it because butches in general and my love in particular; thrill and turn me on and my sweetie’s hair is trimmed so short I can’t even grip it and love it dearly *sigh*. Everything else in this paragraph also describes her to a T:

Butches "with slick, shiny, barbershop haircuts, trimmed so short your fingertips can barely grip it. Butches with shirts that button the other way. Butches that swagger. Butches who have dicks made of flesh and silicone and latex and magic. Butches who get stared at in the ladies' room, butches who shop in the boys department, and butches who live every moment looking like they weren't supposed to. Butches with hands that touch me like they have been exploring my body their entire lives".


(My apologies to Tristan for changing the context of her original article, which was written in 1999. A lot has changed in our knowledge and understanding of gender since that time, too).

[WickedFemme]

Originally Posted by skeeter_01

Thanks so much Kobi!! I was just about to ask, who the heck is Tristan Taormino?? LoL!! You saved me the embarrassment of being told (and rightly so!) to go Google her!

lol... I think she would just 'die' if someone didn't know 'who' she is cause of course she's all that. Anywho... I think she wrote that quote years and years ago before the whole gender identity revolution became so widely accepted within the lesbian or queer community.
She really doesn't know any more than any of us about gender identity, etc.. she just chooses to make it her job and her livelihood. I wouldn't look to her as the source of all knowledge. however, I'm sure the vanilla hetero world finds her quite remarkable, which is good cause she is paving the way towards societal acceptance of 'differences'.

[Dude]

Originally Posted by WickedFemme

I'm sure the vanilla hetero world finds her quite remarkable, which is good cause she is paving the way towards societal acceptance of 'differences'.

ohhh
so she is talking about butches TO straight people?
it's almost as if the word is used for "shock value"
and this explains that it was , I guess

it still has nothing but sting value for me

but
but
but
werent butches the anti-girls from the beginning of time?
I think so

[WickedFemme]

Originally Posted by Dude

ohhh
so she is talking about butches TO straight people?
it's almost as if the word is used for "shock value"
and this explains that it was , I guess

it still has nothing but sting value for me

but
but
but
werent butches the anti-girls from the beginning of time?
I think so

I'm not butch and it had 'sting' value for me too. so, I can only imagine how you must feel. At the time, I guess it was cutting edge for some... meh.

[Random]

So butch only comes in one flavor and if it's not the right flavor it has an ick factor?

That's how the last couple of posts felt to me...

Just because the term doesn't resound with you, doesn't make it less than or geared twards hetros...


This piece resounded with me...

I got what she was saying...

I like butch girls..(Ok, I like butch in just about any flavor, but have a weakness for a big ol butch who is a girl)

I happened to be partnered with one...

Nothing shocking, nothing cutting edge..

Just a big old hard working, hard fucking, gets called sir, taking up space butch who is also a girl...

[Dude]

she doesn't "get me" fine at all = different strokes ( Did I not say that?)
even at my youngest (around four)
that word was very off-putting and insulting (to me)
and I know for certain I am not alone in those thoughts.


diversity
don't we all get to be who we are?
cant we all say what is true (for ourselves) without someone
taking offence?

[BullDog]

Dude if you won't want to be called "girl" then fine, but she wasn't talking TO straight people and was partnered to a butch at the time and words like "ick" and "sting" are pretty loaded terms when there are plenty of butches who are fine with the term girl (some are submissives and some are not).

I think people need to read the entire article before leaping to conclusions about what the author does or doesn't know.

http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-10-...masculinity/2/

[SugarFemme]

I remember at age fifteen being offended at being called, "girl" after finding out the definition was, "A young, immature female". I certainly did not feel that described me at all as I was a very mature, responsible and politically astute young woman. Now that I am fifty, it REALLY annoys me when I go to a restaurant with my nineteen year old daughter and the twenty year old server asks, "What can I get you girls to eat??" Really??? Oh and fuggedaboutit if she calls me, "Honey" LOL.

Originally Posted by Dude

she doesn't "get me" fine at all = different strokes ( Did I not say that?)
even at my youngest (around four)
that word was very off-putting and insulting (to me)
and I know for certain I am not alone in those thoughts.


diversity
don't we all get to be who we are?
cant we all say what is true (for ourselves) without someone
taking offence?

[BullDog]

Originally Posted by June

Like I said before, girl still = less than to many people. It's so fucked up.

There is an entire universe of difference to me in the following:

Some guy says "You, girl. I need some service over here"
My lover says "You're my girl" and has that tone of wonder in her voice
I say to my friend "Girl, you need Jesus"
My friend says "I need to check with the girl first"
Someone says to someone else (consensually) "Girl, you need to drop and stay until I say otherwise"

Girl is not a bad word. Girl is not less than. I never get "Sir'd" ever, but I think I know the difference when people are speaking from their own place of internal hierarchy.

Girl does not default to submissive or weak or helpless. Not all girls are children or childlike any more than a masculine word defaults to strong or Top or capable or adult.

You can get "Sir'd" in a derisive way too. It's all in context.

Ya know when people are using a term like girl it's usually in real life interactions with people they know- like how June describes above.

It isn't about deeply seeded gender identity or whether someone ids as submissive etc. It's just real people having real conversations and the ebb and flow of language.

I don't see how anyone can not read the essay by Tristan Taormino and not see that she is quite familiar with butches and that it was a butch positive piece.

Isn't it all about context and intent?