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Old 11-04-2012, 05:16 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by IslandScout View Post
Sometimes, though, "appropriating" is a way of subverting power dynamics in a cultural or social construct. Members of our community appropriate male pronouns. Gays and lesbians appropriate straight marriage rituals. And so on.

Sometimes appropriation is kind of thrilling.
Sorry been gone all day and this just hit me wrong.
*I* being a male in a female body have *appropriated* nothing. I am who I am, and I am Male. I'm sorry if this doesn't fit with the whole white privilege thing, but it is true none the less. Sometimes I wish folks would put away the microscope and learn that there are whole societies that live just fine, minus the privilege. If the UK isn't as knowledgeable about Studs, Aggressive, and other Pronouns, I would suggest it may be due to culture. Again, Culture is the apt usage of Pronouns that people use to express who they are to a society that hold them at arms length, with privilege.
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Old 11-05-2012, 02:54 AM   #62
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Thanks for this thread, Girl On Fire I've been struggling with B-F terminologies in general, so it's helpful to see threads about these terms being discussed. While I see the sense of simply googling, it's a passive act. I find reading active discussions on the topic more interesting. Language and semantics are ever evolving, to reflect the people who use them. Aren't we the ones who collectively 'own' these terms, and who are most active in deepening and evolving the language that we use?

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I just happened to see 'stud' as meaning one thing. I had a picture of a prize stallion in my head. (*giggles*)
... I thought that's as good a meaning of 'stud' as any
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:10 AM   #63
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However, It is also my long time experience that self empowering labels are anathema to many within the wider 'gay' 'community' but not so much in the pan sexual kink 'community'. It is this that led me on my own path to individual gender expression.
I don't quite understand this part. Why would the gay community want to avoid self empowering labels? Aren't we in the business of self-empowering?
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:27 AM   #64
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Growing up in a multi-cultural area of Brooklyn, I heard the term "papi" used, but it was primarily used in a straight setting. I'd also heard the term "stud"...again primarily in straight discourse. I never heard the terms "stud" "aggressive" or "papi" used in the LGBT context until I joined the LGBT club at my college. From my own experience, I found this to be more an issue of age than of diversity. I live, and work, in a very diverse community, however, it wasn't until I spent time with the 20-something age group that I heard the terms used frequently. Now...I'm not saying that the terms weren't, or haven't, been used in a cultural context for many years..just that I'd never heard them. I will say that, when I joined the club at my college, it made my heart sing to hear young butches, studs, aggressives, and every other self-identifier used with such freedom and pride! It has, and still does, make my heart leap a bit when I see the younger generation...those coming after me...embrace who they are with whatever ID they choose so freely and with such an unabashed sense of self. I admire them, I cheer for them, I support them...and I love them all.
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:07 AM   #65
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I don't quite understand this part. Why would the gay community want to avoid self empowering labels? Aren't we in the business of self-empowering?
Yes 'we' are.
However I find that in the wider 'gay community' I encounter here in UK, including many of my 'gay' friends, folks don't use the labels we embrace here in the b/f world. Mostly I find the attitude to be "I'm just me, I don't need labels". I have observed that those who embrace labels are those who don't 'fit', into the wider gay 'community'.

It is my experience that most folks I come into contact with, homo or hetero, don't understand the need for self empowering, self identifying labels...until a patient person explains the need.

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Old 11-05-2012, 07:16 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by Daktari View Post
Yes 'we' are.
However I find that in the wider 'gay community' I encounter here in UK, including many of my 'gay' friends, folks don't use the labels we embrace here in the b/f world. Mostly I find the attitude to be "I'm just me, I don't need labels". I have observed that those who embrace labels are those who don't 'fit', into the wider gay 'community'.

It is my experience that most folks I come into contact with, homo or hetero, don't understand the need for self empowering, self identifying labels...until a patient person explains the need.

It's been overwhelming to sift through and keep up with the labels, I had given up. After finding this community, it feels that for once, there are labels that I might be able to identify with. Thank you for explaining, I've never thought of labels as self-empowering, yet I'm beginning to feel it even if I can't explain why.
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:09 PM   #67
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I've been thinking about this a lot,
and I'm glad the question came up.


I wanted to say that with every label comes the dreaded stereotype.

Yet, if we do not have a way to differentiate with 'labels' things
get cloudy for some. I like to think of these categories
as 'descriptors' rather than labels.

Well the emerging generations of Studs, Ags, Aggressives, Machas
etc., also deal with being stereotyped within the Community.

Just like Butch folks, Femme folks and all under the rainbow folks have.

I have 2 links to share for thought

One is a U-TooB channel from StudzLife101.

http://www.youtube.com/user/StudzLife101?feature=watch


The other is this video...



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Old 11-05-2012, 06:20 PM   #68
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Default AS for the term "papi"

I've only heard papi referred to for male identified individuals, gay or straight. My girl actually calls me papi = daddy. I also know mostly latin people, male and female, use the term to call younger latin males. . and guys call other guys papi too. At least here in Fl where I am. I'm sure when they use that term "papi" it's not in reference to daddy but instead a male they believe is good looking. Hence the term "papi chulo"
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:28 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by ruffryder View Post
I've only heard papi referred to for male identified individuals, gay or straight. My girl actually calls me papi = daddy. I also know mostly latin people, male and female, use the term to call younger latin males. . and guys call other guys papi too. At least here in Fl where I am. I'm sure when they use that term "papi" it's not in reference to daddy but instead a male they believe is good looking. Hence the term "papi chulo"

On the other hand, I have a friend of 22 years who is Hispanic and
whose Femme calls her Papi and/or Poppi...her preferred pronoun is She.

So does not Identify as a male.

It's all relative...to me.





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Old 11-05-2012, 06:39 PM   #70
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Arrow Cause I am to tired to type about it

>LINKYLOO<



"Excuse Me Sir"


All the shows are actually all very informative, you'll have to look them up on YOU TUBE to watch them.
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:48 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow View Post
>LINKYLOO<



"Excuse Me Sir"


All the shows are actually all very informative, you'll have to look them up on YOU TUBE to watch them.
I know Q-Roc.

I heart Q-Roc.





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Old 11-05-2012, 06:55 PM   #72
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Arrow Uh huh

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daywalker View Post
I know Q-Roc.

I heart Q-Roc.






Me too, when ruffryder mentioned only the cis male version of Papi I remember how lucky I was to have been around a diverse POC queer experience. I really urge folks to read/listen to Q-Roc's stuff it's very informative.

I wish more POC gender variant folks would come to BFP to share experiences and culture.
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Old 11-05-2012, 07:31 PM   #73
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Excellent post Mr. Day. I think of butch, femme, papi and other descriptors as you said as identities. A woman spoke at a conference we went to and she said labels are what others apply to you and identites are what you use to express yourself. I thought this was a great way of putting it. Are labels and identities the same thing? I don't think they are.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Daywalker View Post

I've been thinking about this a lot,
and I'm glad the question came up.


I wanted to say that with every label comes the dreaded stereotype.

Yet, if we do not have a way to differentiate with 'labels' things
get cloudy for some. I like to think of these categories
as 'descriptors' rather than labels.

Well the emerging generations of Studs, Ags, Aggressives, Machas
etc., also deal with being stereotyped within the Community.

Just like Butch folks, Femme folks and all under the rainbow folks have.

I have 2 links to share for thought

One is a U-TooB channel from StudzLife101.

http://www.youtube.com/user/StudzLife101?feature=watch


The other is this video...



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Old 11-05-2012, 08:59 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daywalker View Post

I've been thinking about this a lot,
and I'm glad the question came up.


I wanted to say that with every label comes the dreaded stereotype.

Yet, if we do not have a way to differentiate with 'labels' things
get cloudy for some. I like to think of these categories
as 'descriptors' rather than labels.

Well the emerging generations of Studs, Ags, Aggressives, Machas
etc., also deal with being stereotyped within the Community.

Just like Butch folks, Femme folks and all under the rainbow folks have.

I have 2 links to share for thought

One is a U-TooB channel from StudzLife101.

http://www.youtube.com/user/StudzLife101?feature=watch


The other is this video...



That was helpful, actually. Thank you. I think it's great this has turned into a real, diverse, cultural discussion.
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Old 11-09-2012, 06:17 PM   #75
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Another Perspective...
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Old 11-09-2012, 06:23 PM   #76
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Question WTF

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Originally Posted by txdoc View Post


Another Perspective...


You're kidding me right?

What perspective is this?
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Old 11-09-2012, 06:42 PM   #77
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Because the narrator is so young,

I'm thinking about how I'd respond to one of my students.

With that lens, I want to have patience for her ignorance, but

Her 'Shut the fuck up' stance really bothers me.

It makes it impossible for me to try to disentangle her misconceptions.
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Old 11-09-2012, 06:44 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by txdoc View Post


Another Perspective...

I realize everyone has different perspectives but this whole video bothers me on so many different levels. I don't even know where to start so I think I will just end with WTF
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Old 11-09-2012, 07:19 PM   #79
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but she's like totally been a lesbian for a year now

futch and stem<== strike them from the record
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Old 11-09-2012, 07:25 PM   #80
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she did manage to get ONE thing right, that femme does not = bottom, butch does not = top.

The rest is just sad. i hope her mom sees it.
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