Americanizing Other Nation's Shows: BBC Being Human vs. SyFy Being Human?

[Linus]

I've become a huge fan of the BBC Being Human series and when I heard that SyFy was going to carry it, I thought "YAY! I won't have to have BBC America or buy it on iTunes" until I saw that they were creating their own version of it (Americanized). Literally, word-for-word the same except slang.

And I'm not sure why. I've refused to watch the redone version as I tend to find a lot of "uniqueness" of the show is the actors and original language that it's in. It's along the same avenue of how I feel about Steig Larsson's Girl With the Dragon Tattoo et al. original Swedish versions vs. the soon-to-be released American version (which apparently will have a different ending )

So how do you feel about it? Good? bad? Ugly?

[Waldo]

The US is probably at the forefront of this practice, but we're hardly the only people to adapt things.

Generally speaking when it comes to film I will lean toward the original, but if the story is compelling enough for me I'll see the US version as well. With any creative endeavor you never know who will be able to bring out different nuances.

La Femme Nikita is one of my absolute favorite films. I love it to bits. And I've seen the US movie version starring Bridget Fonda. It's abysmal. And I've had no desire to see any of the TV versions. Zero.

For the Larsson books... I'll see the US versions. I saw all three of the Swedish films and I had mixed feelings about them because I really enjoyed the books. When you consider that entire chunks of the story were left out or altered slightly I can't see a reason why NOT to see the US version. Will it be better? Doubt it. But so what? It's not the Americanization that bothers me. It's the poorly executed remakes that bother me.

[Linus]

Originally Posted by June

I think Americans should watch nothing but American shows made by Americans lest we further destroy our economy and firm moral fiber.

Or.

I don't understand why we need to bastardize and claim things. Although, I did enjoy both the British and US versions of The Office. Some shows translate just fine though, but are not shown widely. Like that Dawn French show The Vicar. I was just mad for that, and to my knowledge, they never remade it here.

Do we do it to anything but the British shows? Did any other country ever steal Green Acres? I can see that going over well in France.

I think a couple of Canadian shows were "borrowed".

And ya, Dawn French's The Vicar of Dibley would be hard to remake here.

There was also the IT Crowd which was redone for the US but never took off (it still does well, I believe, in the UK and I happen to love the British version).

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Waldo

The US is probably at the forefront of this practice, but we're hardly the only people to adapt things.

Generally speaking when it comes to film I will lean toward the original, but if the story is compelling enough for me I'll see the US version as well. With any creative endeavor you never know who will be able to bring out different nuances.

La Femme Nikita is one of my absolute favorite films. I love it to bits. And I've seen the US movie version starring Bridget Fonda. It's abysmal. And I've had no desire to see any of the TV versions. Zero.

For the Larsson books... I'll see the US versions. I saw all three of the Swedish films and I had mixed feelings about them because I really enjoyed the books. When you consider that entire chunks of the story were left out or altered slightly I can't see a reason why NOT to see the US version. Will it be better? Doubt it. But so what? It's not the Americanization that bothers me. It's the poorly executed remakes that bother me.

The Swedish films were done for TV, technically (IIRC). And any time you do a movie-from-book lots is often left out. What I've heard about the American version is that they are going to be "happier", which struck me as odd since it takes away from the book.

That said, I don't see why the original series, particularly TV series, cannot be done in their original format/language rather than redoing it. Unless there truly is something that is unique to the locale that would be misunderstood, I don't see the need or understanding as to why.

I would think that it would be cheaper than doing a remake of the series. Wouldn't it?

[Waldo]

Originally Posted by Linus

The Swedish films were done for TV, technically (IIRC). And any time you do a movie-from-book lots is often left out. What I've heard about the American version is that they are going to be "happier", which struck me as odd since it takes away from the book.

That said, I don't see why the original series, particularly TV series, cannot be done in their original format/language rather than redoing it. Unless there truly is something that is unique to the locale that would be misunderstood, I don't see the need or understanding as to why.

I would think that it would be cheaper than doing a remake of the series. Wouldn't it?

The thing with any filmed (whether for TV or cinema) entertainment is that in order to connect with an audience the audience has to be able to connect themselves to it. That is what, at the end of the day, limits the appeal of foreign language film.

You may notice that on HGTV a fair number of the series are filmed in Canada. The cultural dynamics are similar enough that it's not an issue. Our accents, save a few words, are similar - as are our neighborhoods, etc. That's not the case with the UK or Australia. The accents create a sense of "other" that most folks can't overcome. And that's, of course, made worse when you introduce actual foreign languages.

So, while you might think that it would save money (and it would), it also wouldn't make money because the audience would be so much smaller.

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Waldo

The thing with any filmed (whether for TV or cinema) entertainment is that in order to connect with an audience the audience has to be able to connect themselves to it. That is what, at the end of the day, limits the appeal of foreign language film.

You may notice that on HGTV a fair number of the series are filmed in Canada. The cultural dynamics are similar enough that it's not an issue. Our accents, save a few words, are similar - as are our neighborhoods, etc. That's not the case with the UK or Australia. The accents create a sense of "other" that most folks can't overcome. And that's, of course, made worse when you introduce actual foreign languages.

So, while you might think that it would save money (and it would), it also wouldn't make money because the audience would be so much smaller.

If that (accents and other cultural dynamics) were true then Coronation Street wouldn't be so popular in Canada.

I think there is far more of an incidence of xenophobia in the US than in Canada. To me, it stems from both the desire to not expose Americans to different cultures *AND* Americans not wanting to be exposed to those cultures. It's interesting that the US is ok with bringing Canadian shows to the US because Canada is often viewed as the "51st State of the US".

UK and Australian cultures are different but it's not 100%. For example, Doctor Who has remained entirely UK and the US has never attempted to remake it even with the large following it has (although Torchwood, a spin-off of Doctor Who, will be a co-production with Channel 4 [??] and Starz, keeping many of the main original actors).

I suppose for me it's still a cultural adjustment and I admit to missing the multicultural view I get from daily, regular TV in Canada (not specialty channels but regular from the air channels).

[Corkey]

Wait...there's a difference? I don't watch either.

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Corkey

Wait...there's a difference? I don't watch either.

I haven't watched the SyFy version but based on the commercial, they seem word-for-word the same.

[Waldo]

Originally Posted by Linus

If that (accents and other cultural dynamics) were true then Coronation Street wouldn't be so popular in Canada.

I think there is far more of an incidence of xenophobia in the US than in Canada. To me, it stems from both the desire to not expose Americans to different cultures *AND* Americans not wanting to be exposed to those cultures. It's interesting that the US is ok with bringing Canadian shows to the US because Canada is often viewed as the "51st State of the US".

UK and Australian cultures are different but it's not 100%. For example, Doctor Who has remained entirely UK and the US has never attempted to remake it even with the large following it has (although Torchwood, a spin-off of Doctor Who, will be a co-production with Channel 4 [??] and Starz, keeping many of the main original actors).

I suppose for me it's still a cultural adjustment and I admit to missing the multicultural view I get from daily, regular TV in Canada (not specialty channels but regular from the air channels).

I know next to nothing about what is broadcast on television in Canada. But you asked about the dynamics of this in the US. And I stand by my answer. Even your xenophobic comments reinforce exactly what I'm saying. I worked in the film distribution industry for years and while I've seen it get better in the decade+ since then, it holds true today.

Dr. Who certainly has a following, but to say that it's *popular* in the US would be vastly overstating it.

Here's a little something for you to chew on - each of these shows has been remade for the UK:

Married With Children
The Golden Girls
That 70s Show
Law & Order
Mad About You
Who's The Boss
Maude
Good Times

And I can't even count the number of "reality" series and game shows.


AND... here's a little gem that just floors me. The Nanny, with everyone's favorite nasal-affected actress, Fran Drescher, was shown in over 90 different countries, but TEN countries felt it worthwhile to make localized versions: Argentina, Chile, Ecuador, Greece, Indonesia, Italy, Mexico, Poland, Russia, and Turkey.

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Waldo

I know next to nothing about what is broadcast on television in Canada. But you asked about the dynamics of this in the US. And I stand by my answer. Even your xenophobic comments reinforce exactly what I'm saying. I worked in the film distribution industry for years and while I've seen it get better in the decade+ since then, it holds true today.

Dr. Who certainly has a following, but to say that it's *popular* in the US would be vastly overstating it.

Here's a little something for you to chew on - each of these shows has been remade for the UK:

Married With Children
The Golden Girls
That 70s Show
Law & Order
Mad About You
Who's The Boss
Maude
Good Times

And I can't even count the number of "reality" series and game shows.


AND... here's a little gem that just floors me. The Nanny, with everyone's favorite nasal-affected actress, Fran Drescher, was shown in over 90 different countries, but TEN countries felt it worthwhile to make localized versions: Argentina, Chile, Ecuador, Greece, Indonesia, Italy, Mexico, Poland, Russia, and Turkey.

Cool! I didn't know that about those shows (except for L&O) and it would be cool to see how other nations took those shows. I believe the L&O was a spin-off and only the first series (season) is expected to follow the traditional L&O model.

The SyFy remake of seems to be a word-for-word remake. So, while I appreciate and understand remaking it to address cultural differences, wouldn't a different script make sense?

As for Doctor Who, a viewership of 1-1.5 million in the US seems rather large given that it's on a specialty channel, no? (although it was originally on SciFi -- before it's rename -- and did well there; compared to the 3 mill or so that watch Eureka regularly, a unique SyFy show, it seems to do well).

[Melissa]

Originally Posted by Linus

I've become a huge fan of the BBC Being Human series and when I heard that SyFy was going to carry it, I thought "YAY! I won't have to have BBC America or buy it on iTunes" until I saw that they were creating their own version of it (Americanized). Literally, word-for-word the same except slang.

And I'm not sure why. I've refused to watch the redone version as I tend to find a lot of "uniqueness" of the show is the actors and original language that it's in. It's along the same avenue of how I feel about Steig Larsson's Girl With the Dragon Tattoo et al. original Swedish versions vs. the soon-to-be released American version (which apparently will have a different ending )

So how do you feel about it? Good? bad? Ugly?

I loved the three Larsson films and want to read the books. In all honesty I have no desire to see American versions. My first thought was that the American versions will probably first take out all the lesbian sex, they will remove the scene where she rapes the man but I bet they will leave in the scene where she is raped, and I bet they make her feminine. What I loved about these films was that she was never a victim. She fought back just as hard if not harder, never felt sorry for herself, made mistakes, learned from her mistakes and never backed down. The best scene was in the third film when she sat through the trial in full punk gear. I don't expect the American film to keep that scene either.

Melissa

[Jess]

I assumed it was sort of a trade off for Law and Order- UK...

[UofMfan]

Originally Posted by Linus

If that (accents and other cultural dynamics) were true then Coronation Street wouldn't be so popular in Canada.

I think there is far more of an incidence of xenophobia in the US than in Canada. To me, it stems from both the desire to not expose Americans to different cultures *AND* Americans not wanting to be exposed to those cultures. It's interesting that the US is ok with bringing Canadian shows to the US because Canada is often viewed as the "51st State of the US".

UK and Australian cultures are different but it's not 100%. For example, Doctor Who has remained entirely UK and the US has never attempted to remake it even with the large following it has (although Torchwood, a spin-off of Doctor Who, will be a co-production with Channel 4 [??] and Starz, keeping many of the main original actors).

I suppose for me it's still a cultural adjustment and I admit to missing the multicultural view I get from daily, regular TV in Canada (not specialty channels but regular from the air channels).

I agree with you Linus. I tend to notice that most Americans, and by that I mean those who live in the US, do not like to be exposed to anything other than their own culture. I said most, not all. And like you, I believe this is a major factor taken into account when remakes are made.

Having lived both in the US and abroad for an extensive number of years I know what my personal experience is on both ends.

For the most part, the majority of US series are subtitled for Latin American audiences (I have worked on a few myself) but to remake something completely it is the exception and not the rule. The only TV content that gets remade constantly are the reality TV shows that mostly originate in the UK and that I can totally understand.

I love watching both US movies and foreign films and I really enjoy the variety of television that I get to see from all different countries here through my local cable provider.

And as to the adaptation of books into movies, few ever get it right. I am looking forward to reading the books then watching the original Steig Larsson's series.

Great topic Linus.

[Sparkle]

I hate it.
I hate it when foreign films (or television shows) are americanized.
I am completely biased and anti-american in regards to this issue. It annoys me hugely. I think it is almost always an exercise in dumbing-down and disney-ising. It makes me roll my eyes and make *tsk* noises.

Even 'Queer As Folk' for fucksake.
The UK version (the original) was brilliant - it was cutting edge, it had socio-political content, it was stylish and fun.
The US version was a bad soap opera full of whiny muscle-marys listening to bad house music.

I dread the americanized versions of the 'Millennium Trilogy'; I really liked the Swedish adaptations and I loved the books.
I feel fairly certain that they will be a debacle of 'La Femme Nikita'/'Point of No Return' proportion.

I think, with a few exceptions, most films or television series should not be adapted. They should be enjoyed for what they are, within their original cultural context.

[Waldo]

Originally Posted by Linus

Cool! I didn't know that about those shows (except for L&O) and it would be cool to see how other nations took those shows. I believe the L&O was a spin-off and only the first series (season) is expected to follow the traditional L&O model.

The SyFy remake of seems to be a word-for-word remake. So, while I appreciate and understand remaking it to address cultural differences, wouldn't a different script make sense?

As for Doctor Who, a viewership of 1-1.5 million in the US seems rather large given that it's on a specialty channel, no? (although it was originally on SciFi -- before it's rename -- and did well there; compared to the 3 mill or so that watch Eureka regularly, a unique SyFy show, it seems to do well).

I think it depends on your chosen metrics. It obviously did well enough to keep it on the channel. And that's the metric that matters.

When you look at the premier of Weeds on Showtime, a premium cable channel, at 1 million households and a viewership that steadily climbed over the next four seasons and compare that to the ongoing performance of Doctor Who at 1-1.5 million on a network that comes in a variety of basic to advanced television packages it's harder to say. I think it's a cult show and the people who love it will watch it. And that makes it successful. When you look at the performance of either of those shows against a broadcast show then they both look pathetic.

[Waldo]

Originally Posted by Sparkle

I dread the americanized versions of the 'Millennium Trilogy'; I really liked the Swedish adaptations and I loved the books.
I feel fairly certain that they will be a debacle of 'La Femme Nikita'/'Point of No Return' proportion.

You're probably quite right there. I'll still see them. At least the first one. And don't even try to pretend you won't, even if you wait for the DVD.

[Sparkle]

Originally Posted by Waldo

You're probably quite right there. I'll still see them. At least the first one. And don't even try to pretend you won't, even if you wait for the DVD.

I'll let other people go see them first and if it is as bad as I anticipate I will try to avoid them. But I'm sure, at some point, morbid curiosity will get the better of me.

[Hack]

Being Human isn't the first BBC show we've ruined. Won't be the last. We've also ruined Life on Mars. I'm just thankful my favorite BBC shows will never likely be replicated on American TV -- M.I.-5 and Luther. I also love Waking the Dead, which is the BBC version of a "cold case" show. I find that the characters on BBC (or ITV) shows are usually more richly and deeply written. Some of the most complex characters on TV are BBC shows -- Mike Walker on "Trial & Retribution" (ITV), Peter Boyd on "Waking the Dead," Tony Hill on "Wire in the Blood" (RIP...I can't believe ITV cancelled this great cop show!), and John Luther on "Luther" (which, btw, is one of the best shows on TV on either side of the pond, imo).

Jake
British cop show junkie

[Ebon]

Originally Posted by Linus

I think a couple of Canadian shows were "borrowed".

And ya, Dawn French's The Vicar of Dibley would be hard to remake here.

There was also the IT Crowd which was redone for the US but never took off (it still does well, I believe, in the UK and I happen to love the British version).

Love both of those shows and I agree I don't think Americans can do anything good with The Vicar of Dibley. It grinds on my nerves when the US tries to redo stuff like they can do it better. They tried to do it with Death At A Funeral too but I preferred the original version.

[Sparkle]

Originally Posted by Hack

Being Human isn't the first BBC show we've ruined. Won't be the last. We've also ruined Life on Mars. I'm just thankful my favorite BBC shows will never likely be replicated on American TV -- M.I.-5 and Luther. I also love Waking the Dead, which is the BBC version of a "cold case" show. I find that the characters on BBC (or ITV) shows are usually more richly and deeply written.

Spooks/MI-5 is one of my most favorite shows EVER.
I'm currently waiting extremely impatiently for Vol: 8 to be sent from Netflix.

BUT, I'm very sorry to tell you this but ABC bought the rights to adapt it.
I'm hoping it comes to nothing, but I fear it will.