Ask a trans person!

[Greyson]

Hi Guys. I know most of you know this stuff about me already. But for those who do not, bare with me. In my profile I use the I.D. Transmasculine Butch. In other instances I also refer to myself as a Transman, Transguy. I agree with Thinker, "It is like trying to nail jello to the wall." I know each of us have different ideas as to what certain descriptor may or man not mean. I know I am most likely going to offend someone. It is not my intention. If I do offend you, please let me know and I will stand corrected.

Other then my above disclaimer, I also came in to say hello and good night to so many old and familiar faces.

[Thinker]

Originally Posted by Greyson

Other then my above disclaimer, I also came in to say hello and good night to so many old and familiar faces.

Hello and good night to you, Greyson.

[Jet]

Originally Posted by Greyson

Hi Guys. I know most of you know this stuff about me already. But for those who do not, bare with me. In my profile I use the I.D. Transmasculine Butch. In other instances I also refer to myself as a Transman, Transguy. I agree with Thinker, "It is like trying to nail jello to the wall." I know each of us have different ideas as to what certain descriptor may or man not mean. I know I am most likely going to offend someone. It is not my intention. If I do offend you, please let me know and I will stand corrected.

Other then my above disclaimer, I also came in to say hello and good night to so many old and familiar faces.

Why is it that we must continually dance around our sexuality either because of discrimination or by way of labeling? This past summer I had plans to go on an outing 4th of July. The person who invited me came over and said that the host of the party didn't want me there because I'm transgendered. His mother and sister were going to be there and he didn't want me to do "anything embarrassing." As if I would? But is was okay for an transitioned FTM to be there with his wife? Where does it stop? You can bet I'll damn well be me and I don't care who I offend. Because it's not me who's offensive. It's the other person's unwillingness to be respect something I was born with. I would have been gracious at the outing, but I wasn't given that chance. I'm dismayed at the prejudices within the GLBT community.

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Ol' Jet

Why is it that we must continually dance around our sexuality either because of discrimination or by way of labeling? This past summer I had plans to go on an outing 4th of July. The person who invited me came over and said that the host of the party didn't want me there because I'm transgendered. His mother and sister were going to be there and he didn't want me to do "anything embarrassing." As if I would? But is was okay for an transitioned FTM to be there with his wife? Where does it stop? You can bet I'll damn well be me and I don't care who I offend. Because it's not me who's offensive. It's the other person's unwillingness to be respect something I was born with. I would have been gracious at the outing, but I wasn't given that chance. I'm dismayed at the prejudices within the GLBT community.

As my namesake says: I love mankind. It's people I can't stand.

There are times when I question whether the T really belongs with the rest of the alphabet (so to speak). I suspect that many people put assumptions about people who transition (not all but some). It's ironic that the same conversation was being had by the LGBTQ community a few decades ago (K and I watched an episode of the Golden Girls where Blanche is introduced to her baby brother's new friend -- and soon-to-be-husband; she behaves exactly as the host).

To be honest, I've found that if people stopped worrying about impressions and images life would be a lot easier. In fact, most people (that I've run into, at least) either are oblivious, don't give a shit or too self-centered to really notice. Offense isn't the issue; the issue usually is "Where's the beer?", "Where's the food?" and "Can I have another beer?".

In a positive spin of life, my aunt got married this summer. I wasn't sure how her friends and how our family would take my obvious physical change (I've met many of her friends -- film and music people -- over the years). I was well received and, had I arrived earlier, I would have been the best man for my aunt and new-uncle's wedding. I was floored at this level of acceptance (granted my name is the nickname she choose and she's only 8 years older than me so it's more of a sibling-like relationship).

It sucks, Jet, that you're going through this but I suspect this will lessen over time (at least it has for me). Now either its because people don't care or because I don't give a shit about other's opinions (issues) about me. I hope that these become farther and farther apart for you.

[Greyson]

Originally Posted by Ol' Jet

Why is it that we must continually dance around our sexuality either because of discrimination or by way of labeling? This past summer I had plans to go on an outing 4th of July. The person who invited me came over and said that the host of the party didn't want me there because I'm transgendered. His mother and sister were going to be there and he didn't want me to do "anything embarrassing." As if I would? But is was okay for an transitioned FTM to be there with his wife? Where does it stop? You can bet I'll damn well be me and I don't care who I offend. Because it's not me who's offensive. It's the other person's unwillingness to be respect something I was born with. I would have been gracious at the outing, but I wasn't given that chance. I'm dismayed at the prejudices within the GLBT community.

Jet, I am sorry you were treated poorly by people who are clueless and choose to live in fear of people that may not be the cookie cutter most have come to see as "normal."

All of the labels I use to be a discriptor of who I am, mean something to me. Some of the labels for me are a noun; others more of an adjective. I am not trying to dance around my sexuality nor my gender. I have lived a very much "out" life since the age of 18.

I think there is room for all of us under the umbrella of Queer, Trans, Butch, Gender Outlaw, Bent, whatever. I hope you know I am not trying to dish you. I got your back and the back of the guys in here.

[Jet]

Originally Posted by Linus

As my namesake says: I love mankind. It's people I can't stand.

There are times when I question whether the T really belongs with the rest of the alphabet (so to speak). I suspect that many people put assumptions about people who transition (not all but some). It's ironic that the same conversation was being had by the LGBTQ community a few decades ago (K and I watched an episode of the Golden Girls where Blanche is introduced to her baby brother's new friend -- and soon-to-be-husband; she behaves exactly as the host).

To be honest, I've found that if people stopped worrying about impressions and images life would be a lot easier. In fact, most people (that I've run into, at least) either are oblivious, don't give a shit or too self-centered to really notice. Offense isn't the issue; the issue usually is "Where's the beer?", "Where's the food?" and "Can I have another beer?".

In a positive spin of life, my aunt got married this summer. I wasn't sure how her friends and how our family would take my obvious physical change (I've met many of her friends -- film and music people -- over the years). I was well received and, had I arrived earlier, I would have been the best man for my aunt and new-uncle's wedding. I was floored at this level of acceptance (granted my name is the nickname she choose and she's only 8 years older than me so it's more of a sibling-like relationship).

It sucks, Jet, that you're going through this but I suspect this will lessen over time (at least it has for me). Now either its because people don't care or because I don't give a shit about other's opinions (issues) about me. I hope that these become farther and farther apart for you.

Originally Posted by Greyson

Jet, I am sorry you were treated poorly by people who are clueless and choose to live in fear of people that may not be the cookie cutter most have come to see as "normal."

All of the labels I use to be a discriptor of who I am, mean something to me. Some of the labels for me are a noun; others more of an adjective. I am not trying to dance around my sexuality nor my gender. I have lived a very much "out" life since the age of 18.

I think there is room for all of us under the umbrella of Queer, Trans, Butch, Gender Outlaw, Bent, whatever. I hope you know I am not trying to dish you. I got your back and the back of the guys in here.

Great posts both of you. You know it's funny, the people that have not hurt me are straight. For some reason, they get it better than folks in our community. I came out to my aunt as a transgender a few weeks ago, and she didn't bat an eye. Changes are beginning to happen with me and T will be part of that so I'll see how this will unfold. Thanks for your responses, both of you.

[Andrew, Jr.]

I have enjoyed this thread a great deal. I am a quiet guy. I rarely get pissed off, but I cannot stand it when I get ma'amed. Remember Linus in the smoke shop? I introduced myself as Andrew. I live as a man. And still I get ma'amed. It grated on my nerves like fingernails being drug across a chalk board.

Oh well. I say live and let live. However, like Linus, I love mankind, but have issues with people (mainly the ones who are disrespectful and intentionally evil). But that is just me, and how I am. I'm a private person as well. Too many times I have tried to be open, and was hurt deeply. So, I won't be that way ever again. I have learned my lesson.

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Andrew, Jr.

I have enjoyed this thread a great deal. I am a quiet guy. I rarely get pissed off, but I cannot stand it when I get ma'amed. Remember Linus in the smoke shop? I introduced myself as Andrew. I live as a man. And still I get ma'amed. It grated on my nerves like fingernails being drug across a chalk board.

Oh well. I say live and let live. However, like Linus, I love mankind, but have issues with people (mainly the ones who are disrespectful and intentionally evil). But that is just me, and how I am. I'm a private person as well. Too many times I have tried to be open, and was hurt deeply. So, I won't be that way ever again. I have learned my lesson.

It's hard to get people to understand a trans individuals mind. I certainly can understand why it's difficult. It's just like me not understanding what it's like to be completely comfortable with one's body from day one. While we should always try to understand what it might be like in someone else's shoes it's hard to comprehend sometimes.

And in the times when I used to get "ma'am'd" (I recently --yesterday and keep in my photo, which is how I look -- got called "Baby" by the manager of a local grocery store -- it was more of a term of friendliness than anything, I think) I smile and remember Llama Surya Das' teaching of compassion for those who mean a lot to us and those we hardly know. Those who do those infractions may have had a hard life, especially those who throw hate at us. I've got to figure that those who are so mired into hate must have lived painful lives to get where they are and I cannot do anything other than feel compassion for the pain they must have endured to get where they are.

So, Andrew, if I can offer: when you get "Ma'am'd", smile and politely correctly them and continue. It will make them re-think a bit and probably blush. In your prayers to God, ask Him/Her to direct them and alleviate their pain. (I hope it's ok that I mention this and if it's not, I'll remove it)


In another tangent: I'm curious as to everyone's thoughts on the term "cis" (I've seen it used in the following examples: cis-gendered, cis-man, cis-woman, etc.) This past summer a huge debate started about cis and how it was offensive to a "cis-gendered individual" (I'll use the term in this sense since I don't have the words on how else to describe it and "non-trans individual" doesn't quite seem right either..).

Opinions? Thoughts?

[Jet]

Addressing us as "Miss"

To which I have replied,
"I ain't no miss, I'm right on target, you got that?


Addressing us as "Ma'am"

To which I have replied,
"Do I look like Miss Daisy to you?
Get the hell out of the car and let me drive."


Remember, I'm in the South, the female pronoun capitol of the universe.



What is cis? Something else to deal with now? Gawd! Does it ever stop?

[Bit]

I have a question. Lately when Nick and Gryph and I have been out in public, it has seemed to me that people have been going out of their way to call us "ladies."

Now if you've known me for a while, you already know that it makes me uncomfortable to be called "lady" because, after all, that's my dog's name... well, okay, really it's because of the stereotypical crap I was force-fed growing up about a lady is always quiet and demure and never laughs out loud (I cannot stop laughing when something is funny), a lady never shows the least hint of temper (I cuss like a sailor! sheesh), a lady never sweats (omgawd, in PHOENIX? seriously?! Are you insane?!)---but when I am out with a transman who is wearing a dress shirt and tie, someone who does not even LOOK female, and people go out of their way to call us ladies.... well it just makes me cringe!

I suppose one of the big cringe factors is their attitude; they are quite obviously going out of their way to be extra nice and to reassure us all that "they can tell [the transman] is actually really female, no worries, we accept you as a girl, we aren't going to embarrass you by not noticing your femaleness" omg it just makes me CRINGE....

So anyhow, here's my question. Does this happen to you in your area, or is it just the Midwest US; and if it does happen where you are, does it happen to you more when you are with a Femme than if you are alone?

I would ask Nick directly, but yanno he and Gryph are off shooting paper people dead and I don't want to forget the question---so hey, Nick, would you mind answering too? Do you get this treatment more when I'm with you?

Thanks in advance for your answers, everyone. I appreciate your time.

[Thinker]

Originally Posted by Linus

In another tangent: I'm curious as to everyone's thoughts on the term "cis" (I've seen it used in the following examples: cis-gendered, cis-man, cis-woman, etc.) This past summer a huge debate started about cis and how it was offensive to a "cis-gendered individual" (I'll use the term in this sense since I don't have the words on how else to describe it and "non-trans individual" doesn't quite seem right either..).

Opinions? Thoughts?

I've never been fond of "cis-", but using "bio-" always worked just fine for me.

I know there are transmen who do not like to hear the term "bio-male" to refer to someone......oh, someone like my brother.......but it's always been a natural default for me, and it makes clinical sense......*to me*.

I certainly never mean to offend anyone. I also recognize that it's virtually impossible not to offend *someone* when navigating these waters. I think if people are genuine, thoughtful, and honest we should cut 'em a little slack and *respectfully* explain why something may be offensive or hurtful.

Respect is the key. A little compassion, patience, and understanding come in handy too.

[atomiczombie]

Originally Posted by Andrew, Jr.

I have enjoyed this thread a great deal. I am a quiet guy. I rarely get pissed off, but I cannot stand it when I get ma'amed. Remember Linus in the smoke shop? I introduced myself as Andrew. I live as a man. And still I get ma'amed. It grated on my nerves like fingernails being drug across a chalk board.

Oh well. I say live and let live. However, like Linus, I love mankind, but have issues with people (mainly the ones who are disrespectful and intentionally evil). But that is just me, and how I am. I'm a private person as well. Too many times I have tried to be open, and was hurt deeply. So, I won't be that way ever again. I have learned my lesson.

I am right with you when I comes to being "ma'amed" And when I am with a female, being called "ladies", etc. My ex-wife continues to use female pronouns when referring to me. Grr! This is why I am so looking forward to going on T (which will probably begin after the first of this year). I feel invisible. It's painful.

That being said, I worry about how I will be perceived after transition. Will I be shunned but the queer community as no longer being part of the tribe? Will femmes no longer be interested? Will my queerness be invisible? I don't consider myself straight- no because I am attracted to masculine people. I am not. But because I am attracted to femmes. Femmes aren't straight women. I have little interest in straight women. Does that make me a jerk? I hope not. But will I trade being seen as a female for no longer being seen as queer when I go on T?? What is your experiences guys? Do any of you feel the same?

[Jet]

Originally Posted by atomiczombie

I am right with you when I comes to being "ma'amed" And when I am with a female, being called "ladies", etc. My ex-wife continues to use female pronouns when referring to me. Grr! This is why I am so looking forward to going on T (which will probably begin after the first of this year). I feel invisible. It's painful.

That being said, I worry about how I will be perceived after transition. Will I be shunned but the queer community as no longer being part of the tribe? Will femmes no longer be interested? Will my queerness be invisible? I don't consider myself straight- no because I am attracted to masculine people. I am not. But because I am attracted to femmes. Femmes aren't straight women. I have little interest in straight women. Does that make me a jerk? I hope not. But will I trade being seen as a female for no longer being seen as queer when I go on T?? What is your experiences guys? Do any of you feel the same?

Do you talk to your therapist? How about joing a support group of transmen.
Just as we aren't attracted to women as women, it's also my belief that there are femmes who are attracted to masculine energy but not in biological men. We're in luck in finding potential partners on the same page.

My biggest worry is what bathroom do i use. I worry about not passing enough to make it to the men's room.

[Linus]

Originally Posted by atomiczombie

I am right with you when I comes to being "ma'amed" And when I am with a female, being called "ladies", etc. My ex-wife continues to use female pronouns when referring to me. Grr! This is why I am so looking forward to going on T (which will probably begin after the first of this year). I feel invisible. It's painful.

That being said, I worry about how I will be perceived after transition. Will I be shunned but the queer community as no longer being part of the tribe? Will femmes no longer be interested? Will my queerness be invisible? I don't consider myself straight- no because I am attracted to masculine people. I am not. But because I am attracted to femmes. Femmes aren't straight women. I have little interest in straight women. Does that make me a jerk? I hope not. But will I trade being seen as a female for no longer being seen as queer when I go on T?? What is your experiences guys? Do any of you feel the same?

From my experience the following:

I never really felt part of the "Tribe", so to speak although the B-F dynamic did certainly feel more at peace than elsewhere.

Some in the community will shun you. That's a reality. You'll be viewed as a "traitor", so to speak. But just as many will accept you as you are. There are many femmes who like transguys so I don't think you'll be without and you'll likely be very interesting to them.

As for your queerness, invisible to whom? If to yourself, then no. You're the one who defines that, not others. I don't consider myself straight although to mainstream society that doesn't know me I probably do. That is their assumption (we all know that to assume makes an "ass" out of "u" and "me" so one shouldn't do those thigns but people do). Regardless of their assumption, I still define my own sexual orientation.

Would you be a jerk for not wanting to date blond-haired women? I don't think so. It shows your own preferences in a partner, that special "thing" that attracts you to someone.

Remember that the whole transition is the most important selfish thing you have determined you need to do. Everything else will come or not but it doesn't change your core self.

[greeneyedgrrl]

Originally Posted by atomiczombie

I feel invisible. It's painful.

i can definitely identify with that! i am invisible in the queer community as well as the hetero community.

Originally Posted by atomiczombie

That being said, I worry about how I will be perceived after transition. Will I be shunned but the queer community as no longer being part of the tribe? Will femmes no longer be interested? Will my queerness be invisible? I don't consider myself straight- no because I am attracted to masculine people. I am not. But because I am attracted to femmes. Femmes aren't straight women. I have little interest in straight women. Does that make me a jerk? I hope not. But will I trade being seen as a female for no longer being seen as queer when I go on T?? What is your experiences guys? Do any of you feel the same?

i think all this depends on where you are and who you are interacting with. i hope that the queer community is are evolved enough that you find acceptance more often than not. i know we have both here, althugh i like to think we are moving in a trans-positive direction. and no i don't think it makes you a jerk...we can't help who we're attracted to.. but (being a queer femme) maybe i'm biased!

[greeneyedgrrl]

Originally Posted by Greyson

In my profile I use the I.D. Transmasculine Butch. In other instances I also refer to myself as a Transman, Transguy.

this is a new id for me... would you mind explaining what it means to you? i could guess... but no guarantees i'd be right!
thanks in advance!