Ask a trans person!

[The Oopster]

Originally Posted by Thinker

Hey... Can I assume you have not taken any steps toward a medical/physical transition?

And please, please know there is NO judgment in asking that question. And please know it makes no difference to me and most others *here*.

However, if there aren't physical changes for them to *see* then it's most likely a very abstract thing for them so they're really struggling.

Society in general sees who they perceive to be "female" and use she/her, and they see who they perceive to be "male" and use he/him. And that's pretty much all they see and know. It doesn't make it right or good or bad or whatever......it's just the way it is in the mind's eye of most people you will encounter.

Based on my experiences, there's a pretty fine line between those who "slip up" and those who are being shitty. Most of us want to give people the benefit of the doubt. When you don't and you call them out on it, then they can always cop to just making a mistake and then all of a sudden *you* are the jerk. It's a tough road to navigate.

If these people are important to you, then just keep at it and give 'em a little more time. If you feel they are deliberately disrespecting you, then I would cut 'em loose.

Originally Posted by Thinker

I totally understand, J. I hope you know that. And I hope you know we support you here!!

I was just trying to figure out why this might be so damn challenging for your pals. Like I said, it doesn't excuse it or make it better; but sometimes it helps to think about it at a different level......like what goes on with *most* people with regard to this topic and not just those in our immediate circle.

Like Linus said, a sit-down-heart-to-heart is definitely in order.

I experience what thinker is talking about sort of in the reverse. Now that I have had top surgery and been on T for awhile despite the F on my drivers license and my feminine birth name(although it is more unique) I am most often sir'd. The only exception is on the phone and there it's about 50/50.

In fact i had an accident recently and the officer sir'd me and started to correct himself and I told him he had it right the first time. And he said he wondered but wasn't sure.

I have also found that the more confident I am in my masculinity the more I am also perceived that way. Again not implying anything on your part. The few times I think I am mammed, i am not even sure if that has happened it's where my mind space is.

As far as family and friends go. Family still she me and like linus said there are a few that just get a pass. My dad tries, even my mom has been better then expected. In fact if they run into a some of the peeps here with me in arkansas it will be interesting how that will effect them. Dad I think it will help seal the deal. Mom hopefully won't have a break down!

People on my periphel sometimes slip and now I correct them or just look at them and they correct themselves. I have given them a few years and now it's time to get it right.

Another thing to bring up and i'm not implying this with you at all it's just another observation I have made. Are we sometimes over sensitive to what people use as far as gender markers? Like I said sometimes I'm not sure what others have used and think it's where my brain is at. The reason I bring this up is because of a situation I had about a month ago. I approached these people for an interview. I saw 2 younger boys and two woman (masculine woman but yet at the same time I completely perceived them as female) I asked them if they would be willing? We have this method of who we are to ask and I said "So are you still willing to do the interview" All of a sudden two of the party landed on me for calling the one sir. I was blind sided. I didn't know where or how they thought I said that. It happened that the one woman was mtf. I apologized and said I don't know where or how sir came out becaust i'm trans and I totally saw her as a her. I hadn't even perceived her as trans until the others jumped on me. Later I realized that when I said "So are you" they thought I said "sir".

Hence I just wondered how often are we and those close to us over sensitive to what is used? Maybe react when there is no need to react?

[EnderD_503]

Originally Posted by The Oopster

I apologized and said I don't know where or how sir came out becaust i'm trans and I totally saw her as a her. I hadn't even perceived her as trans until the others jumped on me. Later I realized that when I said "So are you" they thought I said "sir".

Hence I just wondered how often are we and those close to us over sensitive to what is used? Maybe react when there is no need to react?

I don't think transpeople are too sensitive when it comes to what people use as gender markers. I think bringing it down to oversensitivity opens us up to that being broadened to: "Well, that's not really transphobic, you're just too sensitive."

I think that the situation you described is one that doesn't occur frequently even if it might on a rare occasion, and so I don't think can constitute an oversensitivity, but the result of a reality. When we hear people are using the incorrect marker (even if, on a very slim chance, we've misheard), it's for a reason. Society does it consistently, and so I could see how even mishearing people can occur because of that consistency (you've come to expect it through experience, which can result on mishearing on a rare occasion).

[The Oopster]

Originally Posted by EnderD_503

I don't think transpeople are too sensitive when it comes to what people use as gender markers. I think bringing it down to oversensitivity opens us up to that being broadened to: "Well, that's not really transphobic, you're just too sensitive."

I think that the situation you described is one that doesn't occur frequently even if it might on a rare occasion, and so I don't think can constitute an oversensitivity, but the result of a reality. When we hear people are using the incorrect marker (even if, on a very slim chance, we've misheard), it's for a reason. Society does it consistently, and so I could see how even mishearing people can occur because of that consistency (you've come to expect it through experience, which can result on mishearing on a rare occasion).

i can see that but i know for me when I tend to mishear happens to be when I'm more sensitive to stuff!

Since then I have taken notice and I think there are times I over react. Likewise it's easy to justify overreaction beacuse of consistent experience. I don't think that is fair either to those that really are trying.

Like I said it really hit me off guard and they were adminent that I call her sir. I knew I hadn't but it took me awhile to figure out how they thought it. I didn't even perceive her as trans until they did that!

It actually wasn't the transperson, it was the people with her. I know for a fact it bothers my room mate more when people use the wrong pronouns then it does for me. I don't like it but it boils his skin.

[kannon]

I've had the "transitioning" discussion with my mom but she has difficulties acknowledging my masculinity. I can sense how uncomfortable she is when people call me sir. I've decided to give her a pass, even when women are hitting on me and she outs me and runs them off. *shaking head*

I have a straight woman that appears to be attracted to me. She does not know I'm trans. She came to my work the other day and asked for Kris the man. Luckily most of my co-workers are understanding and they use male pronouns. I think I'm going to have to talk with all of them. Even the ones that I fear will be ugly about it.

Anyway, I fear that it will scare her quite a bit when and if she discovers that I'm trans. Regardless, I've decided to ask her out as friends. I'm really a little nervous about it because 1.This is uncharted territory for me. 2. I don't pass all the time (I don't want to have that conversation upfront) I think it's important for her to get to know me as a person and a friend before I bust out initiate details about myself.

How have you guys dealt with this?

[Ebon]

Originally Posted by The Oopster

i can see that but i know for me when I tend to mishear happens to be when I'm more sensitive to stuff!

Since then I have taken notice and I think there are times I over react. Likewise it's easy to justify overreaction beacuse of consistent experience. I don't think that is fair either to those that really are trying.

Like I said it really hit me off guard and they were adminent that I call her sir. I knew I hadn't but it took me awhile to figure out how they thought it. I didn't even perceive her as trans until they did that!

It actually wasn't the transperson, it was the people with her. I know for a fact it bothers my room mate more when people use the wrong pronouns then it does for me. I don't like it but it boils his skin.

My best friend is the same way. He gives people dirty looks if they use the wrong pronoun but I explained to him that it doesn't bother me anymore because I have no illusions that I am still in a female body and I know it's not easy for some people. Hell I've even used the wrong pronoun with friends of mine. If someone is trying then I appreciate that but if someone slips then I won't get mad over it.

[CockyDude]

Kannon, I have been living as a straight man for over 35 years. Other than this sight, there are less than a handful of people that know I am trans. There are plenty of women whom I dated that don't know. The "reveal" is a delicate situation. For me personally, I don't want people knowing. My family has been supportive of me since my teens, but I don't feel the need for people I won't be involved with long term to know. Because of the type of lifestyle I lead this is just safer for me, in my opinion. Ultimately, only you can make those decisions for yourself within your own comfort zones and mindsets.

[kannon]

Thanks Cocky. It really is up to each individual to decide for themselves. I guess I'll play it by ear and wait for the right moment to reveal that part of myself.

[J. Mason]

I agree with Cocky, you have to do what you think is right and comfortable to you.

I am upfront about being trans, I believe in honesty and if women run off, well as my friends say often, it's their loss.

[DapperButch]

Originally Posted by J. Mason

I agree with Cocky, you have to do what you think is right and comfortable to you.

I am upfront about being trans, I believe in honesty and if women run off, well as my friends say often, it's their loss.

Hey, J. Mason. I am just thinking out loud here....but, I am wondering if it would be different for you if you were taking hormones and were read as male?

Isn't it kind of a different situation from those who are taking hormones? They are read as male and have to tell someone that they were assigned female at birth. You are seen as female and have to tell someone that inside you are male. The women that each of you are coming out to are coming from opposite places.

Make sense? No disrespect meant, I am just thinking outloud here and wondering your thoughts on this.

[J. Mason]

Originally Posted by DapperButch

Hey, J. Mason. I am just thinking out loud here....but, I am wondering if it would be different for you if you were taking hormones and were read as male?

Isn't it kind of a different situation from those who are taking hormones? They are read as male and have to tell someone that they were assigned female at birth. You are seen as female and have to tell someone that inside you are male. The women that each of you are coming out to are coming from opposite places.

Make sense? No disrespect meant, I am just thinking outloud here and wondering your thoughts on this.

I am read as male to most people, to some I am not. It would prolly be a different situation but I can only speak for myself, when I do get everything done (surgeries and hormones, etc) I will still be open and honest about who I am, no holds barred.

The ladies that I have told about myself knew me when I ID'ed as butch, have been pretty accepting about it, maybe it is because they have taken it upon themselves to educate themselves about transmen and the things it encompasses.

Again I can only speak for myself.

[DapperButch]

Originally Posted by J. Mason

I am read as male to most people, to some I am not. It would prolly be a different situation but I can only speak for myself, when I do get everything done (surgeries and hormones, etc) I will still be open and honest about who I am, no holds barred.

The ladies that I have told about myself knew me when I ID'ed as butch, have been pretty accepting about it, maybe it is because they have taken it upon themselves to educate themselves about transmen and the things it encompasses.

Again I can only speak for myself.

Got it. Thanks for your thoughts.

[kannon]

Originally Posted by J. Mason

I agree with Cocky, you have to do what you think is right and comfortable to you.

I am upfront about being trans, I believe in honesty and if women run off, well as my friends say often, it's their loss.

I believe in honesty as well. I'm not sure what you mean by being upfront. Do you tell women the day you meet them?

For me, I will not share personal information with someone until I've developed a certain level of trust. I've met some women that proved to be very untrustworthy. I've learned to take my time and watch people's behavior rather than listen to their words. After a period of time I really get to know what that person is made of. I don't listen to what other people say about them. I base my opinions on my own observations and experiences with them.

I will share this aspect of myself after I've developed a bond with someone.

[Quintease]

I've always wondered about that! (the guys 'revealing' themselves bit)

My husband met all his women online where they were able to discuss his gender before meeting, so has no idea how other guys do it.

Not long before my current relationship began, a friend of mine had a similar experience with an MTF who wasn't honest prior to them falling into bed. At the time I was shocked, wondering why anyone would deceive another human being in such a way. Now I can kinda understand how hard it would be to say the words, 'I like you but..'

[J. Mason]

Originally Posted by DapperButch

Got it. Thanks for your thoughts.

You are welcome!

Originally Posted by kannon

I believe in honesty as well. I'm not sure what you mean by being upfront. Do you tell women the day you meet them?

For me, I will not share personal information with someone until I've developed a certain level of trust. I've met some women that proved to be very untrustworthy. I've learned to take my time and watch people's behavior rather than listen to their words. After a period of time I really get to know what that person is made of. I don't listen to what other people say about them. I base my opinions on my own observations and experiences with them.

I will share this aspect of myself after I've developed a bond with someone.

Yeah pretty much I tell em upfront so I do not have to deal with any issues that may arise from not telling them sooner. I have heard many horror stories from some transguys about how the ladies react if they are not told sooner.

[EnderD_503]

I guess it depends if you continue to maintain ties with the lgbtq community/if that's where you're looking for relationships/sex or not, or how you view your own status as a trans person. Personally, I don't see it as something that one would go out of their way to hide from someone unless you might be putting your safety at risk, as it's nothing to be ashamed of.

I can understand if someone is strictly living stealth as some choose to and is looking for relationships with straight women rather than queer women. That would make it more difficult, imo, since often straight women don't have the same experiences and are pretty tied to certain rigid worldviews. I guess it all depends on the person you're interested in.

[kannon]

Originally Posted by EnderD_503

I guess it depends if you continue to maintain ties with the lgbtq community/if that's where you're looking for relationships/sex or not, or how you view your own status as a trans person. Personally, I don't see it as something that one would go out of their way to hide from someone unless you might be putting your safety at risk, as it's nothing to be ashamed of.

I can understand if someone is strictly living stealth as some choose to and is looking for relationships with straight women rather than queer women. That would make it more difficult, imo, since often straight women don't have the same experiences and are pretty tied to certain rigid worldviews. I guess it all depends on the person you're interested in.

It really depends on a lot of different factors.

For my personal situation, I'm not going out of my way to hide and I'm not going out of my way to reveal it. I'm being me. I don't think I need to tell strangers that I'm trans just like I don't feel compelled to tell them that I'm of Scottish decent or any thing else that's not relevant to the moment. The "moment" being the early stages of a relationship. I choose to introduce acquaintances to my sense of humor and my laid back nature. I reveal more as I develop trust and feel more comfortable around them.

[Logicaly]

So I was recently in a situation at work, that I felt was some what relevant to the current topic at hand about revealing yourself to another person. Now I am in no way pursuing anything with this woman at my work, just to put that out there, so it makes it slightly different.

I had noticed a few times that this woman had made a reference to the men's room and my having the right parts to go in there (she wanted me to go in there for one reason or another), and it finally occurred to me, was she just referring to me in the way she felt I wanted, or did she really not know? So yesterday I worked up the courage to ask her, and well, I can be pretty direct at times, so I simply asked..."You do know that I am not a biological male right?" She looked very shocked to say the least, her and I had been working right next to each other for at least 3 months, and she had no idea that I was not born with male parts. She apologized of course, I let her know that was not necessary, and explained my situation to her. Sure, it was awkward, but for me personally, I feel it needed to be done. I didn't want her to get the wrong idea, especially since I do not use the men's room at work for a multitude of reasons and I did not want her to be uncomfortable if we ran into each other in the restroom.

So, while it does make me uncomfortable to have to out myself to people, I think there is also times where it might be necessary to do so. I don't think its deceiving to not tell someone right up front, or dishonest. I think depending upon the situation, especially if there is going to be any sort of intimacy involved though, that it is only right I tell the person before it gets to the point of us being intimate. That is just how I feel though, and what I feel is right for me. It of course could be very different for someone else and they may not feel it necessary at all to tell someone, and that is their choice as well.

[J. Mason]

Ok guys need opinions, should I start a thread of images of transguys, like the images of women thread on here? Who would yall want to see pics of and in any particular stages of transitioning?

Any suggestion and such are welcome.

[SelfMadeMan]

Originally Posted by J. Mason

Ok guys need opinions, should I start a thread of images of transguys, like the images of women thread on here? Who would yall want to see pics of and in any particular stages of transitioning?

Any suggestion and such are welcome.

I don't see why not I think it'd be great to celebrate the beauty & diversity that exists in the trans community!

[J. Mason]

I agree with you as well, I just wanted to get some more opinions on the matter.