Law and Order: SVU with Special Guest Kathy Griffin as lesbian

[Dylan]

Originally Posted by cybersuebee

They're called "actors". Because they act. Nobody here would criticize a gay actor for portraying a straight person. C'mon!

By having the dominant group portray the oppressed group by 'acting', a number of oppressed groups have been misportrayed throughout centuries.

It was done with women (men playing women, aka drag); it was done with Black people (black face); it's done with differently abled people all the time; and it's now the rage to do it with queers. It's another subtle form of privilege and oppression. It plays off of stereotypes and perpetuates a negative image. It also keeps 'real' queers oppressed, by telling real queers they're not 'good enough' to even play queer. So, now we have hets exploiting and making money off of the queer community even more.




Dylan

[Dylan]

Originally Posted by Rufusboi

So what happens when queers play straights? David Hyde Pierce played a straight guy for years. Should he give up that part to a straight guy? Portia de Rossi plays straight parts? Should she refuse these? Jodie Foster? Vin Diesel? Neil Patrick Harris? Should they all refuse straight parts because they are gay?

I don't have a problem with straight people playing gay parts. It wasn't that long ago that straight people were scared to take gay roles because they were afraid of their careers. Famous straight actors taking on high profile gay parts, I think, helps all queers all over the world. Actors are no longer afraid to take on this role. Middle America gets their eyes opened a bit. You don't think Tom Hanks playing that role in Philadelphia helped us all lurch forward politically a few steps? And many of these actors use their time, money and position to support gay rights. I am in no way offended when any straight actor takes a queer role.


Rufus

The power structure and oppression dynamics are not the same when queers play straight.


Dylan

[suebee]

Originally Posted by Dylan

By having the dominant group portray the oppressed group by 'acting', a number of oppressed groups have been misportrayed throughout centuries.

It was done with women (men playing women, aka drag); it was done with Black people (black face); it's done with differently abled people all the time; and it's now the rage to do it with queers. It's another subtle form of privilege and oppression. It plays off of stereotypes and perpetuates a negative image. It also keeps 'real' queers oppressed, by telling real queers they're not 'good enough' to even play queer. So, now we have hets exploiting and making money off of the queer community even more.




Dylan

Dylan, they are actors. They act. Inject political agenda into it if you want, but it just doesn't cut it. If Law and Order wants to turn a well-established, well-loved character into an openly gay person, then I'm all for it. It tells people that we're out there. Whether they KNOW they know queer people or not, we're out there, and we're in their lives. It tells them MUCH more than if they introduce another character that they DON'T already know, they DON'T already love, and shows them that our sexual orientation is but ONE aspect of who we are. It's an important aspect, but it makes ABSOLUTELY NO DIFFERENCE in how we do our jobs.

Now if you want to argue that an actor shouldn't be discriminated against BECAUSE he or she is gay, then that's a whole 'nother matter. But this thread is about an established character in one of the most popular shows on U.S. television possibly coming out as a lesbian. I fail to see how that's a bad thing, unless she grows a mullet and starts wearing Birkinstocks and insists that her squad car be only a Subaru or a Volvo.

End of mini rant.

[Write14u]

Dylan, I understand what you're saying, but to me, it makes more sense to get the message out (ie, make queers more visibile in positive ways ) -- regardless of with whom.

Do you think Milk would have been as good without someone as dynamic as Penn in that role? I can't think of a queer actor that could have done it that justice.

From that clip of Olivia, it looks like she has a bad reaction, and who knows if she will come out. I don't think she will, but Sue is right -- it will make more of a lasting impression on viewers if it's someone you already know rather than a one-show wonder that you don't invest yourself in. I also think regardless of whether Olivia comes out, I think her attitude will be less hostile because her character is not geared that way.

One example that sticks out for me was in Buffy the Vampire Slayer, which had two lesbians on it. Willow was a main character from the inception and people went right along with it when she came out and started dating a woman. It meant more than if they had just dropped a dyke in there for a one-two espisode arc.
(On a side note: I would have rather seen the Buffy/Faith characters have at it. *grin* But that's just me having the hots for Eliza Dushku (Faith). )

[Martina]

Originally Posted by Write14u

(On a side note: I would have rather seen the Buffy/Faith characters have at it. *grin* But that's just me having the hots for Eliza Dushku (Faith). )

Faith was way hot. The bdsm Spike/Buffy dynamic was much hotter then the sweet lesbians cuddling on their lacy bed. So dull.

[suebee]

Something that occured to me after I posted: It would be more important in this situation IMO if there were a gay or lesbian writer than actor.

[Write14u]

Originally Posted by Martina

Faith was way hot. The bdsm Spike/Buffy dynamic was much hotter then the sweet lesbians cuddling on their lacy bed. So dull.

I agree on both counts. But it was at least progress having two lesbians in prime time that weren't nutso.

[Miss Scarlett]

I don't watch Law & Order. The addition of Kathy Griffin will not change my mind - especially since I just cannot stand her. Never liked her, doubt I ever will.

[Rook]

It's kind of touchy to have a gay/lesbian portray a gay character on primetime...
Ask Ellen...
btw..

B.D. Wong portrays a gay Psychiatrist on Law & Order {Dr. Huang}...
If I understand his pvt life correctly..
He's openly gay in real-life

David Hyde Pierce came out Recently, in support related to Prop 8.. He portrayed Niles Crane on Frasier, a neurotic Hetero psychiatrist constantly the butt of jokes regarding his true sexuality...

Neil Patrick Harris JR, portrays a Promiscuous heterosexual Womanizer on "How I met your Mother"

Wanda Sykes recently came out, for the same reason as David, she's one of the couples that married before Prop 8 passed...

The list can keep growing...
But, I dont think that's the point...

Tom Hanks portrayed an AIDS-afflicted Lawyer.. Was he belittling the character? Nope..On the contrary.. He created a much more mainstream Awareness...

So did Hillary Swank as Brandon Teena

And Sean Penn as Harvey Milk

Each one recieving a well deserved Acadamy Award...Each giving credit to their Character, and our Struggle for awareness/Equality

[suebee]

Let's not forget T.D. Knight, a gay actor who portrayed George, a heterosexual doctor on Grey's Anatomy. Although he was completely out in his private life, his sexuality became mainstream news when one of his cooworkers, Issah Washington got into fight with one of the other actors on the set of the show over Washington's use of the "f" word to characterize Knight. Washington was subsequently dropped from the hit show. He didn't help his cause when he repeatedly tried to justify his used of the "f" word, saying that where he grew up it meant "weak" (oh, and here we thought you we being insulting! WTF?). I saw him and his wife doing the "some of our best friends are gay" routine on a couple of interviews.

Yup. We need more mainstream gay and lesbian characters on television and in the movies.

Has anyone noticed that the last couple of times that Kathy Bates has played a secondary role in a movie her character has been lesbian - and her orientation played no part at all in the plot. Just like a "normal" person!

[Gemme]

What night is this airing? My memory is pretty much shot now.

[Hudson]

Jesus, that clip sounds and looks like it was written by the
National Organization for Marriage, the makers of the
'Gathering Storm' ads. People will tune in just to see if Kathy
Griffin gets her toaster.

[MsMerrick]

Originally Posted by T D

I don't think I like the way that clip ended, but interesting for sure.

There's also a lesbian on Desperate Housewives now. She's an ex stripper/exotic dancer/lap dancer. I found this especially interesting because I've known a number of lesbians who were or are into this same profession. I've never quite understood how that happens, but I know for sure that it does.

We really are in every walk of life

Yeah I just saw that ! I had the same thoughts
It looks to me, like relationship time for ..whatsherface Nice !

[Semantics]

Originally Posted by T D

I don't think I like the way that clip ended, but interesting for sure.

There's also a lesbian on Desperate Housewives now. She's an ex stripper/exotic dancer/lap dancer. I found this especially interesting because I've known a number of lesbians who were or are into this same profession. I've never quite understood how that happens, but I know for sure that it does.
We really are in every walk of life

Well, I don't think that many women, queer or straight, go into that profession to find potential dates so I'm not sure what sexuality has to do with it.

[Mister Bent]

I read this whole thread hoping to find out what might be at all compelling in this as a topic.

Maybe we could just talk some more about Meredith Baxter Birney.

[Write14u]

Originally Posted by Mister Bent

I read this whole thread hoping to find out what might be at all compelling in this as a topic.

Maybe we could just talk some more about Meredith Baxter Birney.

Oh god... let's give the dude his money back (and all 10 minutes it took to flip through this). If you aren't interested...find another thread. It's not rocket science.

[Mister Bent]

Originally Posted by Write14u

Oh god... let's give the dude his money back (and all 10 minutes it took to flip through this). If you aren't interested...find another thread. It's not rocket science.

O look, it's the cops.

Rocket science, yuk yuk.

[Dylan]

Originally Posted by Write14u

I can't think of a queer actor that could have done it that justice.

Do you think that you not being able to name a dynamic queer actor on the level of Sean Penn has to do with the fact that A) a queer actor like that doesn't exist or B) queer actors aren't getting hired to play major roles, because they're gay?


I'm Going With B,
Dylan

[Write14u]

Originally Posted by Dylan

Do you think that you not being able to name a dynamic queer actor on the level of Sean Penn has to do with the fact that A) a queer actor like that doesn't exist or B) queer actors aren't getting hired to play major roles, because they're gay?


I'm Going With B,
Dylan

I don't think it's the way it used to be where actors were blackballed for being queer. I'm not saying a queer actor of Penn's caliber doesn't exist. Just that I'm not able to think of one.

[Write14u]

Originally Posted by Mister Bent

O look, it's the cops.

Rocket science, yuk yuk.

Nahh, the cops are the subject we're discussing. You know, the one that bores you but makes you want to comment on it anyway. Thanks for your two cents. It added much.