Men with boobs.

[Toughy]

Originally Posted by Bad_boi

I think she was kidding.

I have jokingly referred to myself as a guy with boobs. Lets face it, butches are just like men in many ways. Its kind of like saying she is a guy and a girl rolled into one.

First I did not mean to thank you............I clicked the wrong button.

Let me be perfectly clear..............

I am NOT like a man in any way period. full stop. I am a masculine woman. Not a man.

It's stuff like this that really chaps my ass..............makes me wonder if you actually read the thread............

[JustJo]

I promised myself I was gonna stay out of this thread *sigh*

I have read every single post here, and given this a great deal of thought and, as usual, am not entirely sure what I think about all of this. It's not just about this thread...that's my normal state of being.

Truly, I do get that the conversation isn't about what CN said or the context or whatever. I think we can all agree that partners say things about each other in affection or jest that could be taken as disrespectful or even misogynistic by those outside of the relationship. Scoote calls me a hot little bitch...among other things...and while I would not tolerate that from anyone else on earth, from her it I like it...and it makes me giggle and get that warm, fuzzy thing going.

I'm rather new to this whole BF dynamic...hence the "newly hatched" in my profile...so I will apologize in advance if I unintentionally step on anyone's toes. My point of view comes from a whole adult lifetime spent in relationships with bio-men (I'm slow...took me for-freakin-ever to figure myself out), my relationship with a female-id'ed butch, and friendships both online and in real time with both male-id'ed and female-id'ed butches. So....perhaps like Cynthia Nixon, I'm a bit new to this community and these ideas....

I get hung up on the pronouns alot. I always try to remember who ID's in what way and use the appropriate she/he/hy....but admit that in my own head I default to she. I think the reason for that is that "masculine" and "butch" energy feel very, very different to me. I haven't yet met or spoken to a male-ID'ed butch that felt like a man to me. I'm willing to be wrong on this...it just hasn't happened yet. I don't look at the pic in this thread and say "man"....I look and say "butch" (and also "cute couple").

One of the (several) things that bothered me on the dash site was the automatic default to the male pronoun. My partner is not "he." She does not want to be a man, or any approximation of a man. She is, in my view, magnificent, gorgeous, female, and butch. She doesn't have "masculine" energy....she has butch energy. It feels different to me...and better.

I've got nothing at all against men, masculine energy, or anyone who chooses to identify male. That's their right and bravo for them. Just as it's my right to be femme in my own way....intelligent, headstrong, stubborn, silly and girly.

Long way around...sorry....I think we get hung up, as a community and as a larger society, because none of the words we have quite fit. If I am trying to describe "butch" to my mother or her friends or my straight co-workers who have never had any exposure to this community....I have a problem. If I say masculine, then they think male. Those two words are tied together in their brains...and in mine. If people don't understand "butch" then I run out of words to describe it to them. I've spent alot of time fumbling for the right words with friends...and many of them are probably still left with the idea that Scoote is some approximation of a man. It's not because they value maleness more highly (I guarantee they don't)...it's a lack of personal exposure on their part, and the words to describe it well on mine.