A friend of Dorothys- how important is community?

[Rockinonahigh]

I do live where there is some what of a gay community bit for some reason over the years I find I fit less and less within it.When I bought this place there were srveral gay families hear and I have been to a fue of there partys tho not many.I really thing as we age things change,what we expect inlife changes as well.I use to be at the gbar nearly everytime they door opened just to hang out with my community but have long gotten tired of bar mentality,noise ect.We do have a pflag hear but its dosent do very much beond a once a month meeting wich is not well attended.Last year we held a pride event hear for the first time since ive been hear,tho they didnt let on about it till the day before it happened so I wasnt able to attend on such short notice.
I have thought about moveing over the years but know ppl who have done so,what I get from them is that its was ok in the begaining but ended up as solitary as before.For me I will do my best to just visit a fue places then injoy the visits while im there.

[Converse]

Originally Posted by Rockinonahigh

I do live where there is some what of a gay community bit for some reason over the years I find I fit less and less within it.When I bought this place there were srveral gay families hear and I have been to a fue of there partys tho not many.I really thing as we age things change,what we expect inlife changes as well.I use to be at the gbar nearly everytime they door opened just to hang out with my community but have long gotten tired of bar mentality,noise ect.We do have a pflag hear but its dosent do very much beond a once a month meeting wich is not well attended.Last year we held a pride event hear for the first time since ive been hear,tho they didnt let on about it till the day before it happened so I wasnt able to attend on such short notice.
I have thought about moveing over the years but know ppl who have done so,what I get from them is that its was ok in the begaining but ended up as solitary as before.For me I will do my best to just visit a fue places then injoy the visits while im there.

I think “connecting” is a little different to “being among”. I don’t think I would be as settled in my new location if I hadn’t made the few b-f friends that I have. Do you think that having signs of a community around you doesn’t make any difference if you aren’t actively involved or if you haven’t formed any ties?

[TenderKnight]

Nice thread

I am from the South as well, North Carolina, to be exact. When I moved out here to California, it was a HUGE culture shock to be somewhere and there were GLBT folks walking around, holding hands.. In broad daylight! There were rainbow flags up YEAR ROUND and there wasn't a rebel flag anywhere to be seen.

Is living in a place where I see gay people and Pride all the time helpful to me as a person? I think it is.. I don't go to bars to hang with people in the communities, we have a GLBT Center here that has groups and functions year round and weekly. I know that I will be moving back to the South at some point.. But it will be very hard to adjust back to living somewhere where even the other queers are scared to have other queers openly hold hands in broad day light.. I will miss this realtime queer community that I am living in.

Thanks for the topic, look forward to following it.

-Tony

[Converse]

Originally Posted by TenderKnight

Nice thread

I am from the South as well, North Carolina, to be exact. When I moved out here to California, it was a HUGE culture shock to be somewhere and there were GLBT folks walking around, holding hands.. In broad daylight! There were rainbow flags up YEAR ROUND and there wasn't a rebel flag anywhere to be seen.

Is living in a place where I see gay people and Pride all the time helpful to me as a person? I think it is.. I don't go to bars to hang with people in the communities, we have a GLBT Center here that has groups and functions year round and weekly. I know that I will be moving back to the South at some point.. But it will be very hard to adjust back to living somewhere where even the other queers are scared to have other queers openly hold hands in broad day light.. I will miss this realtime queer community that I am living in.

Thanks for the topic, look forward to following it.

-Tony

Thank you for this TenderKnight- It is going to be interesting to see how and if your tolerance level and need for visual signs of a community are going to be altered when you return to the South after being exposed to a very alternative social “norm”.

I knew of one person closeted before she came to a very large gay friendly city, and after a year of being out, was forced due to family circumstances to return to her home town.

She struggled; I recall her going through some extreme emotions. But within a month of going back- she came out to her family, and scoured and hunted until she found some gay connections. 3 years later, her situation again changed and she was finally able to leave.

She said that the exposure that she had the 3 years prior was so important in allowing her to know who she was and to know that it was ok. She said it helped make her braver so now she was the big rainbow colored fish in a small but friendly bowl. She said the giant fish tank although is was colorful- was just too big for her, so she never moved back to the city.

Have you been back to visit since you relocated?

[TenderKnight]

Converse, thank you for your kind words No, I haven't went back in the past three years.. It will be interesting when I do go to visit, which will be (hopefully) sometime this late summer, early fall. I'm out to my family, except for my nephew.. He's known me from when he was 18 months or so when he moved in with my family. He's not seen me since he was 6.. He's nine now.. I'm kinda nervous, to be honest.. In any case, that is one of the things that has me a lil worried about going back.

I do actually have some friends that live around there that are queer, so may get to spend sometime out and about in the local scene, will see how it goes. Will also be diffrent because this is the first time I'll be there as a transguy that passes for biomale. lol.. I'm sure that it could be fun though!

Will be sure to post about it when the time comes. Thanks again for the thread and the topic

-Tony

[Converse]

Originally Posted by TenderKnight

Converse, thank you for your kind words No, I haven't went back in the past three years.. It will be interesting when I do go to visit, which will be (hopefully) sometime this late summer, early fall. I'm out to my family, except for my nephew.. He's known me from when he was 18 months or so when he moved in with my family. He's not seen me since he was 6.. He's nine now.. I'm kinda nervous, to be honest.. In any case, that is one of the things that has me a lil worried about going back.

I do actually have some friends that live around there that are queer, so may get to spend sometime out and about in the local scene, will see how it goes. Will also be diffrent because this is the first time I'll be there as a transguy that passes for biomale. lol.. I'm sure that it could be fun though!

Will be sure to post about it when the time comes. Thanks again for the thread and the topic

-Tony

Oh that is definitely a set of posts I will be watching out for. 9 year olds still process through their hearts ( and not yet through other peoples prejudices). I'm sure your nephew is going to be excited to spend time with you. Good luck

[ravfem]

i'm in the south too. Many years ago, there was a group of friends (lesbians & one TG guy) who would get together every Friday night for dinner & socialization. We advertised the group in the one & only hole-in-the-wall gay store, but never got new faces. As people moved away or whatever, the group just sort of vanished. i missed it tremendously, and still long for a group of like-minded people just to hang out with and do fun things.

Besides that though, there is no r/t community here. We have a gay bar, but really...i am so over it.

Many years ago i spent several weeks in Portland, OR. i asked to go to the "gay neighborhood" every day, just so i could sit and watch and smile. It was fascinating to me....all these people walking around, holding hands & just being. i LOVED it. The same when i got the opportunity to visit SF a few years ago. i went to the Castro daily just to people watch.

i go to Atlanta Pride every year, as much to be surrounded by 'my people' as anything else.

i love the thought of retiring in an exclusively women only community.

[Nat]

I really yearn for rt community and it's very depressing when I have gone too long without it. Thankfully I live near Austin.

I realized recently I would really like a good gay male friend. I actually do have some treasured gay male friends, but they have scattered to the four winds.

I think it would just be really comforting somehow. I guess I am feeling like gay male energy is missing from my life lately.

I did very much enjoy the recent Austin femme tea party - it was quite comforting being around a couple of smartypants positive femme energy - I hope some of it rubbed off on me

[Martina]

i have been spoiled for the last 25 years. Ann Arbor and now the Bay Area.

i would not mind being more out in the country in California. i would lose some community, but i wouldn't really be in a homophobic area unless i went WAY out in the country.

If i moved to someplace truly remote, i am sure i would miss queer community, but what i would miss more is the progressive atmosphere i have gotten used to. i don't want to hear a lot of conservative bullshit on a daily basis.

i like all kinds of people, but i don't want to work THAT hard to get over their politics and prejudices. It's tiring.

[Converse]

Originally Posted by Martina

i have been spoiled for the last 25 years. Ann Arbor and now the Bay Area.

i would not mind being more out in the country in California. i would lose some community, but i wouldn't really be in a homophobic area unless i went WAY out in the country.

If i moved to someplace truly remote, i am sure i would miss queer community, but what i would miss more is the progressive atmosphere i have gotten used to. i don't want to hear a lot of conservative bullshit on a daily basis.

i like all kinds of people, but i don't want to work THAT hard to get over their politics and prejudices. It's tiring.

Did you choose those locations because of community? Or at least was that a consideration, and if so, do you think that your willingness to move to somewhere where it isn’t so prevalent is because you are in a different head space now- a different phase in your life?

I’m trying to get my head around whether “community” is more important for us at certain life stages

[Martina]

i chose Ann Arbor because i was going to graduate school there.

i chose the Bay Area in part because of community (including leather), but also because it was a big city and near the ocean.

Yeah, as i get older, a really good grocery store becomes more important than a good gay bar.

Also, i am happier in my work. That is very enriching. i was bored back in Ann Arbor -- underemployed -- so my social and cultural life was way more important.

i do want a simpler life as i get older. Being near the Important People in my life is the first consideration. Job second. And then i just want peace and tranquility. Nature gives you that. The city -- it's possible, but you have to work at it.

[Converse]

Originally Posted by Nat

I really yearn for rt community and it's very depressing when I have gone too long without it. Thankfully I live near Austin.

I realized recently I would really like a good gay male friend. I actually do have some treasured gay male friends, but they have scattered to the four winds.

I think it would just be really comforting somehow. I guess I am feeling like gay male energy is missing from my life lately.

I did very much enjoy the recent Austin femme tea party - it was quite comforting being around a couple of smartypants positive femme energy - I hope some of it rubbed off on me

I don’t know anything about smartypant femmes but I really get the gay boy thing, its an energy I miss too. When I first moved I was definitely needing some Butch-bonding (which was something I hadn’t ever really considered before), just a friend that knew where you were coming from- someone that you could nod to, and they knew what that nod meant. I have found that now- and it made all the difference.

In the same light, do you think its important for femmes to have close femme friends?

[Converse]

Originally Posted by ravfem

i'm in the south too. Many years ago, there was a group of friends (lesbians & one TG guy) who would get together every Friday night for dinner & socialization. We advertised the group in the one & only hole-in-the-wall gay store, but never got new faces. As people moved away or whatever, the group just sort of vanished. i missed it tremendously, and still long for a group of like-minded people just to hang out with and do fun things.

Besides that though, there is no r/t community here. We have a gay bar, but really...i am so over it.

Many years ago i spent several weeks in Portland, OR. i asked to go to the "gay neighborhood" every day, just so i could sit and watch and smile. It was fascinating to me....all these people walking around, holding hands & just being. i LOVED it. The same when i got the opportunity to visit SF a few years ago. i went to the Castro daily just to people watch.

i go to Atlanta Pride every year, as much to be surrounded by 'my people' as anything else.

i love the thought of retiring in an exclusively women only community.

rav- there is a place near where I grew up in Australia, called Amazon Acres- a women’s only land where all male children once they hit the age of 12years have to leave. On the gate leading to the compound is a giant penis with an axe through it.

Now I can tell you, for a packing Butch- that can make you feel mighty uncomfortable. I always moved along extremely fast when I was getting near that gate.

Do you think it is the friendships, or the environment of seeing "your people" just being- that you are looking for?

[ravfem]

Originally Posted by Converse

rav- there is a place near where I grew up in Australia, called Amazon Acres- a women’s only land where all male children once they hit the age of 12years have to leave. On the gate leading to the compound is a giant penis with an axe through it.

Now I can tell you, for a packing Butch- that can make you feel mighty uncomfortable. I always moved along extremely fast when I was getting near that gate.

Do you think it is the friendships, or the environment of seeing "your people" just being- that you are looking for?

ok, i don't think i want it that anti-male! i don't hate males at all! *thinking* in fact, now that i think about it...if there are "alternative" communities that aren't quite so exclusive as women-only...that would be an even nicer space for me, i think. i remember years ago Vi Johnson talking about a Kinky retirement village, but i don't believe that has transpired yet.

i've seen a few articles, websites & videos about women-only retirement communities, and i think it's the fellowship aspects, mainly. i've always loved the idea of commune living in general.

[Gemme]

It's only natural, of course, to seek like minded and bodied individuals as youngsters. It's built into our intrinsic bits and pieces. Every animal is born with this primal urging. Similar company provides warmth on cold nights, shelter from the storm, a higher likelihood of obtaining enough food and safety in numbers.

For me, no matter my age and status in life, that will not change. I am a very social creature and, though I may not go out and party like crazy all of the time, I need personal interaction with voices that come from OUTside of my head.

I've lived in areas of high and low tolerance and acceptance of our community. I feel stifled...smothered even...when I am not able to freely communication, face to face, with other members. It's more than validation (although that can be important) and acceptance (also important); it's an invisible hug that keeps my mental meter running right. It's the communal sigh after a large meal and the weight of breath caught when a group sees and shares something beautiful and brilliant together.

I don't need specific words or actions from members of our community. I just need them to exist and exist near me, where I can see them, feel them, hear them at will.

[Gayla]

I came out in an area with almost no gay community at all, then I moved to the "big city" that seemed like a gay mecca to me. In reality, the community was only slightly larger but much more active so it seemed to me, based on my reference points, as this huge thing. I was very involved on many different levels for a very long time. Almost every night of the week I was at some meeting or function or event. Weekends revolved around the groups I was a member of and bars where I hung out. This went on for more then 15 years.

I remember how we often talked about what it would be like to live in a place with a thriving community and how much fun we had visiting Austin, San Francisco, Seattle, etc. Even though we had a lot, it was always a little disappointing to go home.

Seven years ago, I left that town and moved to the Seattle area. I can count on one hand the number of times I've stepped foot in a queer bar since I moved here. The majority of my socializing is done with straight people I know from work. I have never been to Seattle Pride.

I don't know if it's my age or the fact that I just got so burned out but I'm really enjoying my lack of community involvement right now. That may change at some point, and I'm grateful that I have such an amazing community so close by, but these days I'm not really feeling the need for much more then my easy chair, laptop and the TV remote.

[Converse]

Originally Posted by Gemme

It's only natural, of course, to seek like minded and bodied individuals as youngsters. It's built into our intrinsic bits and pieces. Every animal is born with this primal urging. Similar company provides warmth on cold nights, shelter from the storm, a higher likelihood of obtaining enough food and safety in numbers.

For me, no matter my age and status in life, that will not change. I am a very social creature and, though I may not go out and party like crazy all of the time, I need personal interaction with voices that come from OUTside of my head.

I've lived in areas of high and low tolerance and acceptance of our community. I feel stifled...smothered even...when I am not able to freely communication, face to face, with other members. It's more than validation (although that can be important) and acceptance (also important); it's an invisible hug that keeps my mental meter running right. It's the communal sigh after a large meal and the weight of breath caught when a group sees and shares something beautiful and brilliant together.

I don't need specific words or actions from members of our community. I just need them to exist and exist near me, where I can see them, feel them, hear them at will.

Gemme

I really enjoyed reading your post – it resonated with me. Thank you

I think one of the key differences that exists within this thread is that some are living in places where homophobia is so blatant that they are forced to be closeted or risk alienation and even physical harm as opposed to others where although they may not be in a location where there is a predominant “community” they can still find it if they wish and are able to live without compromise.

I think that is one of the areas that sites like this have helped. In locations where physical buildings don’t exist, the sites create a virtual community drop in centre, coffee shop, bar, etc, so that others within accessible proximity can be found. I think the success of these sites support the argument that community is important.

But I wonder if having these sites will over time, replace our need to relocate and cluster geographically. Do you think that the want to find like minded people who can provide “interaction with voices that come from OUTside” could be someday completely satisfied through on-line communities alone?