It Hurts Me.

[Beloved]

Originally Posted by thedivahrrrself

I can relate, Fire, and thank you for saying it.

"I can handle being invisible. I have coming out to strangers down to an art form. I have a 30 second, two minute, and 20 minute version of my own gender-education/dynamic-education talk that I deliver to strangers, acquaintances, and friends regularly. "

This made me laugh out loud, because I have the same 3 versions, depending on the audience!

I'd like to hear all of these, please! Or does it need it's own thread?

[JAGG]

Originally Posted by Beloved

I'd like to hear all of these, please! Or does it need it's own thread?

Please don't encourage her..... you will create a monster. Lol

[thedivahrrrself]

Originally Posted by JAGG

Please don't encourage her..... you will create a monster. Lol

LOL Yes, JAGG knows it's hard to pull me down from a soapbox!!



That would be a good thread for the Femme Zone! We all have to be experts in coming out, over and over again, because we are somewhat invisible. I used to don uber-short hair just to try to look more "lesbian" LOL It still didn't work.

[Apocalipstic]

Originally Posted by thedivahrrrself

LOL Yes, JAGG knows it's hard to pull me down from a soapbox!!



That would be a good thread for the Femme Zone! We all have to be experts in coming out, over and over again, because we are somewhat invisible. I used to don uber-short hair just to try to look more "lesbian" LOL It still didn't work.

Showing up with a BullDyke is the only thing that really says it for me. I am not, and I repeat not. wearing. rainbow. earrings.

I really don't explain much any more....but when I do, its "pass the salsa, I'm a Lesbian". If they ask why Butches rather than bio men? I ask how graphic they want my reply to be.

[thedivahrrrself]

Originally Posted by Apocalipstic

I am not, and I repeat not. wearing. rainbow. earrings.

ROFL I would draw the line there too. I've worn rainbow necklaces, but people still ask me if I'm at the pride parade to support my gay brother or something. I want to yell, "Not all queer women have mullets, you know!" but alas, I'm usually much more polite....

[Apocalipstic]

Originally Posted by thedivahrrrself

ROFL I would draw the line there too. I've worn rainbow necklaces, but people still ask me if I'm at the pride parade to support my gay brother or something. I want to yell, "Not all queer women have mullets, you know!" but alas, I'm usually much more polite....

OMG, people are idiots.

[Firedance]

Originally Posted by Apocalipstic

Showing up with a BullDyke is the only thing that really says it for me. I am not, and I repeat not. wearing. rainbow. earrings.

Amen. Amen. And again I say Amen!!!

Originally Posted by Apocalipstic

I really don't explain much any more....but when I do, its "pass the salsa, I'm a Lesbian". If they ask why Butches rather than bio men? I ask how graphic they want my reply to be.

Grin... Smirk... I am feeling the Femme-Sista Love on this one!!

[Quintease]

Reading this I realise I've been told a lot that I can 'flirt with men to get blah blah done' except no, I don't and never have flirted with men for anything.

I think it's the expectation that we have straight privilege and therefore will be comfortable to 'trick' people into thinking we're sexually available and therefore eligible for free favours from heterosexual men. Forgetting of course that we don't want it. Just like we don't want attention from men.

[~ocean]

I can totaly understand y a butch would ask hys femme to deal with the male ego in a situation that hy ( ur lover/partner ) might be challenged in.. No one has ever asked me on a date to use my femmine charms . That's just "Bad Manners"...There wouldn't be a second date .. Now this is where being an attractive femme woman comes in to play, In the past, (this past saturday even ) and in my future I do and will use my femmine ways to get what I want from the male ego. Bash me if u want, if the shoe was on the other foot, u know a man would take advantage as well,they have and the will. Soo sry Fire it happened to you on a date.
~ocean

[SweetJane]

Firedance, I'm sorry this keeps happening to you. It truly isn't respectful.

But I so understand and resonate when you wrote:
You know, we Femme's are only truly seen by those of us who can hear the music of, "The Dance". We are both, inexplicably more fully alive when in the presence of the other, even if we are strangers, even if there is no attraction, and yes, even if we are simply friends.

It isn't just being invisible. It is being who we are. We need our counterparts in the dance to validate who we are, to let us relax and just be, and know we are femme. When they try to trade what we are into a currency that benefits them, that's exploitation. And it's truly very sad.

[Mtn]

I cannot IMAGINE ever suggesting that my girl "go get something done" via her femininity. That's crass and feeds into some heteronormative, "women are pretty so let's use them" mindset that I cannot begin to understand. It's disrespectful.

[Viola]

Sensing tone from your message firedance, so responding in tone

Dance... Will my soul spirit dance also?

I'm sorry to hear you firedance go through this...

I have different challenges then you, where I don't know how to connect in a social way, I'm autistic an autistic femme,

So as me who's drawn toward butches, I don't go to social anything...

So I'm not known in social.

I fear social, I couldn't go where you went -

those butches were, who demanded from you - this wasn't a dance - this was greed so empty shallow, asking a body of empty pleasures.

I wish I had the abilities to verbally socialize.

But as hard as I tried to over come, I'm realizing I'll have this challenge for the rest of my life, so I'm learning a pain of sadness of acceptance a loss that I'll never be socially and so I morn a loss that I thought maybe I could over come,

but in my morn of loss and my deep challenges I still go through, I can't be only body.

And I think the reason why is cause my body is unkind toward me, the challenges has made me turn to my soul spirit for my purpose in a deeper understanding a dance where share a simple word share, sounds simple, but share is a relationship and not an exchange.

I sense those butches thought in exchange and expected you to approach the exchange, I sense this tone from your message.

I read your message as these butches wants you to approach and actually if I were in your shoes and these butches said this to me, how would I feel?

First I probably feel empty, cause it sounds more like these butches wants to be entertain and wants you to just entertain them and expects you to, .

I'm very shy and hidden where I won't show off body parts cause I feel shallow... So if butches wants me to show, I will question their motives. Who do they really want? I'm not only body.

Maybe thats it, this that is in the air when they demand you, they're shallow and wants you to be shallow.

and this is why you feel this, I'm guessing, what bugs you.

I'm analyzing this ok...

I'm not just a body, I have a soul and spirit, plus what if I have a body that is what a butch wants, what would happen if months later, I get in a car accident and I end up burnt and injured and or what if I get cancer or what if, I can't walk, then what...

Can we still dance?

If its not shallow I say yes...

will these butches who demand from you be there, or is it shallow...

and visa versa, femmes can be shallow and only be there when body is...

but that is only a body, plus if only body and of course there's not such thing as only body cause if there was only body it will be a dead body,

so what then is going on if only body, what's going on to the spirit and soul then if only body, is it only what?

An exchange but what's being exchange of what, if only body but what's moving the body, and only exchange of, with in shallow, if dance in this, is spirit soul then being sold, but sold to what?

I went through so much the challenges my body has given me, I can't be only my body, I can't...

if butches acted like this to me: I will question who am I really, I would say to these butches, who are you - the body is a house, are you a house only how shallow.

even if you speak of dance, what is dance, isn't dance energy...

what is femme and butch actually?

I read at here BFP about friendship before lover...

I'm really thinking of this more and more and more...

Who am I?

I'm soul spirit so in dance will my soul and spirit also dance too?

To whom approach at what time isn't the question or even the dance, for there's no rules when in relationship, for what rules can there be when dance is of soul and spirit?

If rules were only, its an exchange performance that's sold to an ability that's fragile and will die

Laws dance high in pride condemns empty and dies.

[jessiel]

...fire, I like the fact that you also say that you don´t mind cover up when needed to ignorante ppl. But I can relate to your words far to much and think its a topic that is more common than spoken about.

[Apocalipstic]

Originally Posted by Hack

I don't disagree, my friend. But I will push back just a bit and say that I have always been a respectful, well-mannered guy. It comes from how I was raised and who raised me. I was raised around Old World/Old School gentlemen who treated women like goddesses. That is imprinted on me, and always has been.



Jake

Originally Posted by durrrrrrrr

first of all. FireDance, I am sorry to hear that happened to you.

as for myself, I taught myself ( cuz my Dad was and is an ass , my Mother passed away when i was young ) to treat ALL ladies with respect.

not only treat the ladies with respect, treat EVERYONE with respect. I try to and dont have to work at that to hard, to practice that every day.

I offer my chair if i see a lady standing, I will offer my chair if i see a butch standing.

if i see a lady who is walkin behind me, I will open and leave the door open for her. I will do that also for anyone walkin behind me.

It's the simple things that can make anyone's day

Would that every Butch were as gallant as you two!

[Kobi]

It saddens me to read things about people with questionable manners who make illogical assumptions and demands on other people.

It makes me think things like people are not seen as people but as objects. That it is ok to use others to get things....even something as simple as a piece of toast. That it is a power and privilege thing. That it is a game of unhealthy interpersonal dynamics.

I dont see it as a butch thing or a femme thing or a spectrum thing. I see it as a people thing. People do weird shit for even weirder reasons.

I also dont necessarily see this behavior as a character issue tho it does raise some red flags. Sometimes, the behavior has a malacious intent. Sometimes it may be inexperience or role confusion or other things.

Regardless of where it comes from, dont hesitate to stand up for yourself. There is nothing sexier than a woman who demands the respect she deserves.

[Viola]

This is a long long message... Not really knowing how to be breif...

Firedance this is me thinking about your message more ok, so this isn't me attacking you in any way, I'm just analyzing that's all...

I want to add to this thought of dance, as believe it or not, after I wrote the other message, I kept saying to myself no that wasn't all of it...

It was as if I left out some things ok...

Firedance you got me on a roll here by your message, um, I feel for you going through this however as I read what you wrote which is basically about timing...

Firedance you expected to be seen, well I was thinking after I wrote my other message, actually as you expect, I'm feeling that that then is more of an exchange as well...

To expect anything from strangers is an exchange...

According to the scene that you have place, which is I'll put me in the scene ok...

Me femme, sitting alone and near at another table are a few butches sitting at a table...

First of all, I wouldn't expect anything at all... Nor have any plans, for isn't plans an exchange as well?

Also about timing who shall approach who and when, is it Femme's first or Butches first

Um, I'm into chess ok, so actually as I have difficulties with social there's a flip side of me, where I'm focus on interests, and boldly I might as the butches sitting at their table, ask if any of you play chess...

If whom ever said yes, I would say would you like to play chess later, um, and perhaps get a chess game going at a later day, and its just chess...

I mean the idea of this instant date and instant me, instantly being in a set of rules and an instant going out: the problem I have is, if it goes to fast, I can't digest analyze each step, which this creates not of rules but creates unique self with a unique situation.

So now lets say I said nothing to the butches at the other table, but I kept quiet, would I expect them to approach me, no,

would I expect to be seen no...

so what I gather from your message firedance is this dance between strangers, you be seen they approach,

so what were you feeling then when the butches wanted you to approach;

maybe you identify important in being seen and approach being taken from you, and you're going through an identification crisis.

Actually if I were sitting there quiet and the few butches at their table announce to me that I should approach them, I wouldn't approach them at all, cause how dare anyone tell me how to be with strangers.

I don't abide to any rules which includes any Butch Femme rules and so I don't even know all these rules actually so actually maybe or is it a culture...

Like ok if I visit China and I went to a small rice farm to stay for a month, would I cross rules with out knowing and why is this?

Cause I'll not know them, but I'm still me right?

Well cause I hadn't been in so call social Butch Femme areas offline, I'm not knowing the culture, so actually then I really don't have any expectations of any...

and maybe I be like this same if I stay at the rice farm, crossing rules and not even knowing,

By how I look, I really don't look of anything also, so if there's a look of a femme where a butch can tell from miles and miles away that there's a femme who's attracted toward butches, and you've figure how to do this and so then displeased when the butches hadn't approach; as if rules of expectations

or if there's a place where butches and femmes meets publicly and they all sit around, and like the farm in China there's a set of rules: then there is this social dance of exchange.

And I'm starting to realize something here as I'd been thinking about this?

its the exchange social I have difficulties with with all people,

every time I leave my home its so difficult for me... but what's difficult is the exchanges...

so if I have difficulties in life already, how could I even step up to another level and be looking for a date and sit in a room and this exchange of timing will appear and I'll know already what my part is? I will be a mess.

In living life I get approach by men.

What it actually feels like is I'm being approach by a sells person...

and the male sells person won't lay off...

I'm warn out, drain, by a sells person male, its as if all my energy is drain from me and I'm a dead battery...

I fear could the same happen if I be around butches, would my energy level will be drain,

this is the unique me though, its energy and how will my energy level rise and how will my energy level be drain...

well due to my experience being drain energy by men approaching me in life, I question it all,

this idea of strangers approaching and I'm wondering if two things...

Perhaps what my complaints are about men and fearing this from butches will I have the same draining effect energy due to a sells approach;

what if some people get a high off the sales approach and their energy rises while others gets drain,

yet in social its expected to go through this weather being approach or waiting to be approach (I'm realizing both areas isn't me, social isn't me, its all draining, meaning would I be drain there where you were awaiting to be seen...)

as I'm long winded here, writing... I guess I'm learning and I'm actually learning when reading your message and I thought it over more, and will continue thinking this more...

social exchange rules what about energy levels...

I keep saying I hate dating and I really never want to date; what is that really saying then...

however in your case you want to be seen and approach...

you want an exchange to be expected, I've notice in your message any other dynamic that you speak your drain for needing to explain yourself and you feel relax at the idea that there's no explaining when it comes to you and butches...

so you got me thinking, is it that in exchange in social that drains me does the opposite for you - you feed on the being seen in your expecting social exchange and this is your feeding energy risen in hoping to gain from as before many times you've drank from a social exchange dance, so then hoping to get again a repeat?

this can be understandable as you gain from the energy being charged in you,

but to expect is where I'm wondering about. What would happen if there's no expectations?

I read on-line, about there's more then one language of love...

To reach to the level of love from the beginning of a stranger and if there's a set of rules to abide by, like in your case I hear butches must approach first.

maybe these butches were fed up about exchanges rules.

so if there's a rules of exchange for real in the Butch Femme social, I'm naive,

I sense you know the social exchange and have your drawn toward a type of social exchange and these butches attack what you're drawn to of social exchange.

I avoid social exchanges of all kinds, and actually resent social exchanges,

I'll be thinking more on this;

still I think the ideal way what I read some where here on BFP is friends first then lover...

Something about friendship is appealing for me cause its being self with out any social exchange expectation dance...

[BullDog]

Hmmm, well all the talk about being courteous and polite to femmes and opening doors and such is all well and good, but to me what the OP was talking about was quite a bit deeper than that. I think she is talking about being honored and valued for who she is as a femme- she is just as lesbian and/or queer as her butch counterpart, so why would a butch ask her to go flirt with a male? She is not straight. Femmes are just as lesbian and/or queer as butches. Treat them as such and respect them for who they are.

[Abigail Crabby]

I know someone this happened to - and I shake my head that she didn't realize she was being disrespected so.

I tell her over and over - you don't have to *work any magic* just be yourself and never let anyone use you.

I think it's starting to sink in -

I myself hate being reduced to Honey, Sugar, Sweetie Pie, Babe.... I have a name - to reduce me to some name because you can't remember mine or you just are lazy then we don't have enough in common to stay friends.

Da Schmooze and I have consentual familiars and we enjoy them because we are partnered, but that doesn't give anyone else the right.

I'm lucky in the respect that I only got that other kind of treatment in the straight world by cis men. I didn't realize at the time it was wrong as I wasn't a feminist I was young and rather stupid lol

Again, I'm treated to Missy, Lil Lady honey etc by straight men on the phone when we are talking about their cable products. I can't countermand them and demand they call me Sunny (my chosen name) as my calls are recorded and I have to put up with it - just another day in paradise at my job lol

[JustJo]

So I have to pop in and confess that I have a terrible "hun" habit from years and years of bartending and waitressing....as in "what can I get for you hun?"

You're all giving me something to think about.....thanks.

[Apocalipstic]

Originally Posted by Sue

Hi Apocalipstic,

This is true how can anyone know, however I'm wondering about a few things.

This is me analyzing OK: the word natural and the word practice.

I'm making up words in order to see if it helps me articulate.

True no one knows, however when naturally needs are met with out practicing,

About the party you were with a date and butch text you -

Let me share with you something I recently discover OK...

Space...

each of us has space. each of us has needs with in our space, either to share, or to have privacy.

Then there's abandonment, invasion, in space...

what I hear from your message is this sense of both...

I'm going to read tones ok:

The tone I'm getting from your message is this sense of abandonment with in your space and yet now your wondering if you're invasion in butch's space due to expectation with in your needs in space...

I'm learning too OK, and actually I'm learning alot from this thread...

I feel expectations when you sense a need, isn't the same of when I was writing earlier about expectations in exchange...

I see needs as more a relationship, vs when exchange even though one could see this also as needs, (you know what I think I need more range of vocabulary here...)

I sense you need from your butch and text was abandoning your need with the space you're sharing with butch.

Now yes if you communicate to butch about your need, a couple of things could happen.

Butch listens and applies however this is where tone is read.

Is it practice or natural...

However another question what is error?

or is error info about language of needs, cause to correct error how can correction be natural? so maybe need to read tone here as well...

If its practice and not natural then its not in the same language of needs...

Long term relationships: years of being together: I observe relationships around me: what ever been practice never becomes apart of but only has to be work, and its work...

Its not natural...

I'll share me: OK for example I love playing chess. so I'm an extreme visual analytical person OK...

So I could say I'm a visual analytical femme.

Now lets say (I'm making this up ok) lets say I went out with a butch who finds my visual analytical mind slow and boring, cause this part of me effects other areas such as verbal speed socail...

Now if I ask the butch to practice allowing my slow analytical digesting each stage to practice around me to allow me space in the butch's fast environment as I can be slow and inward and quiet as I observe, and the butch was willing to practice this,, how long will this last, this practice when its probably so heavy for the butch to carry and its work then..., as well as its work for me too...

So what I'm wondering even though there's text and who knows what other kind of devises someday we will have: listening to your message to the tone, if you do make your needs known - sense the tone - if the butch is naturally or practising...

Some times we want so badly that we'll settle for practice, but how long can a relationship be working full time,

see in your situation you're on a date, then in a date is sensing natural or practice...

practice is exchange, natural is relationship.

I'm learning this too OK, about space, and the different languages there are about space.

it can happen the other way around, a butch can being doing things for a femme that doesn't even need those things, yet she might find herself practicing to need those things, that's not natural...

I saw this on line about maybe its 5 different language of love, forgiveness, and... not sure what else, but it got me thinking, if there's 5 languages and maybe even more.,

what is your language and is it the same language as to the butch your dating or is this a sign there's different language in this sign that you felt when butch text you....

if you could write the ideal butch for you what would this language look like, and if you go a step further and write the errors the butch would make, how would those errors look, for you then to communicate to to make known for natural to continue...

cause what is errors really ...

if long term relationship practice its stress,

the more natural is in a relationship the more ease relaxing and harmony.

this is me analyzing,

practice vs natural...

what is your language of love, forgiveness and... is it the same as your date? or so different that how can see and understand and if can see and understand, still can ever be natural or will it always be work...

This really resonated with me Sue. especially the part about relationships being stressful and how our entire existence is a language and we all speak different ones.

As a teenager I was not allowed to leave the house with a date who did not come to the door, so my expectation now is that someone will do that now too, though there is no set rule that says it will happen.

I was not really interested in the person I went to the party with anyway and was only going out because my roommate and friends said I was being lazy not dating more and that I should go. I was not in the right frame of mind to start with, which I am sure influenced how I felt about her manners.

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

No it doesn't help, it's enabling the shenanigans that you can cross boundaries.

I don't want to walk into a place of business and be spoken to like I'm in pre-school.

The feminist in me SCREAMS when someone dumbs me down or dismisses my wajt with a sugar or a sweetie after I've asked for something 60 x's...

I am fabulous at customer service (and waiting tables) and never ever use words like that to excuse poor performance. Unprofessional indeed!

Originally Posted by *Anya*

I totally agree!

Unless you are my lover or my mother, do not call me honey or sweetie or any other term that intimates a level of familiarity that we do not possess!

I particularly hate it at the doctor or dentist office.

I particularly hate everything at the dentists office, but somehow find it comforting when my hygienist calls me sweetie .

Originally Posted by Sue

Hello Apocalipstic and Firedance,

Maybe I need to clarifications many times - from other message I wrote,

Please don't take my messages as facts, its only me sensing tones and growing myself...

Also I'm thinking more...

Ok, perhaps even cycling...

Firedance you wanted to be seen and approach by butches...

Apocalipstic you wanted your butch date to approach you in space you two share through connection share and not abandonment, text felt like abandonment.

Actually oh and please forgive me if I don't accurately describe your situation please use interpretation OK if needed...

Perhaps what I was sensing is language needs also dance, and is it including spirit soul in dance vs shallow...

Firedance your language is valid: you wanting to be seen and approach, and you were emotional when butches spoken their language, reversing approach.

so I didn't want to sound I was dismissing your language needs. Maybe it sounded this way as I was describing the tone of dance.

Its that some times we focus more on human worship through perfecting laws that then denies the spirit soul, and a dance can inter human worship through perfecting through shallow exchange.

so maybe I'm cycling here,

Apocalipstic please I hope not to dismiss your language of needs,

which I was sharing in another message about tones of shallow dance that dismiss spirit soul when I was responding to message in relations of butches demanding femme to approach them for once...

Actually in this tone I sense a shallow dance, not really sure if the butches were speaking of their language of needs but more speaking of being fed up...

that's another area of writing is when we're unbalance and how that effects our projection outwardly that even language of needs aren't even clear, but its more a shallow of greed a dance of shallow of blind toward pleasures empty pride follows condemnation death. or another word depart from each other, through the death of pride from the growth of condemnation...

two things I think I'm speaking about with tones, and now add third which is unbalance that effects projection that can confuse language needs even to self...

One is about dance and is it shallow or includes the spirit soul,

the other is languages and to learn your own need language and to able read other need languages so then can sense either practice or natural.

and now is the third tone: about butches wants femme to approach is that from their unbalance unclear language that they don't even know they're own language of needs that then led to their being fed up, I'm referring to message that firedance wrote and how the butches were toward her...

and or if butches wants femmes to approach them, if this is their language need then express it to a femme who wants to approach butches, I'm sure this can happen and a dance of spirit soul however in clear need language that harmony ...

So I think what's going on is articulating more then one tones...

To clarify...

Tone one: does the dance include spirit soul or is the dance shallow?

Tone two: Femme Butch is the need language natural or a form of practice work

Tone three: how does the unbalance project their unclear language of needs that's not clear to themselves that led them to feel fed up.

I want more than anything for the dance to include spirit and soul! I love how you put that.

Originally Posted by Jess

Y'all can excuse me or decide to discharge me now, but I am one of those Southerners who do use the familiars allowed me by the gracious women in my life, such as but not limited to: Darlin, Hon, Sugah, Sweetheart, Dearest, etc. AND by all means, when I do say, "you ladies, or "dear lady" I mean it from the deepest sense of respect, as "those" ladies have shown me that they are, indeed, Ladies.

I am only speaking for myself when I say that I am more than a little tired of hearing the ongoing bashing of manners and mannerisms that seem to be all but lost in today's society, save living alive and and well in the hearts of well intended Southern folk and moreover, country folk . It does my heart good to put a smile on a "lady's" face by addressing her as Miss__________ and tipping my hat. More often than not, I am met with a gracious smile or a soft blush and I very VERY much am pleased to have spent one ample millisecond of my energy adding a smidge of charm to an otherwise unextraordinary , uneventful day.

If a woman does not wish to be referred to as Lady, or any other familiars, it becomes very clear within about 13 seconds. I will forevermore, refrain from doing so. However, I don't think that woman should get to speak for any other women who actually find it endearing. That to me, is what makes a Lady a Lady. It is her ability to discern for herself and NOT impose upon others.


My 2 cents for what it's worth.

Ladies.. Gents.. Folks.. tips hat...

I have always been called Miss and my last name, even whe I was little. I am used to it. I also have no problem with being called a "lady", though I am not one really unless I need to be. lol.

Maybe it is our Food and Beverage background?

Originally Posted by desd

Are you saying that us Upstate New Yorkers have undesirable manners Apocalipstic?

Just wayyyy different expectations of what is and is not good manners and how to communicate. What I think is rude is wayy different than in other parts of the country and I always try to keep Cultural differences in mind when engaging in conversation within people from other places...even inside the US.

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

Female bodied does NOT equate to "Lady" don't matter if you're in Mississippi or New York its NOT OK to impose sugary words on them (female bodied folk)

Not everyone is a:

"little lady"

"missy"

"sweetie"

"honey pie"

Familiars are not something that we should have to endure to be seen "as proper folk"

This isn't the 1800's

OMG, I like Little Missy, but for some reason Little Lady irks me.

Really, honestly...and I've thought about this a lot...it mostly irks me if a man calls me one of those names, but not always. It depends on who it is and context.


Whewwwwww!