What makes a Butch "Butch"

[StrongButch]

I was born butch! Its my energy.

[Wolfsong]

Originally Posted by psykbutch

Dang what a writer! lol but you brought something to mind mind which is great for me with this 'what makes a butch' topic. It would kill me for someone to call me feminine, as to why? The best I can come up with is it is not me.
I know labels suck, but since I'm working on trying to figure out who I am, I love them as descriptions.

Know what? I used to have this friend that whenever anyone ever asked her whether she was butch or not she would smile and say, "I'm not anything. I'm just me." At the time I guess you can say I didn't get it completely. The truth is I wasn't thinking about it anymore than if someone had asked her, "Why do you like that shirt?" and she replied; "I dunno. I just do."

That all changed when I started contemplating my own labels. Lord there were a lot of them. I always knew that my destiny was not to eventually transition, but I was set free when I had arrived in a place where people actually used male pronouns for me. Once that gate was open I was off through like a wolf that had been caught in a pen it's whole life. I let myself become a little of that Neanderthal asshole that everyone dislikes. *Shrugs.....learning curve.

What I would tell you is this. When I stopped looking for the perfect label I found myself. That perfect label, the perfect description for others, will stop you from being all of who you are. Don't waste time. There will be a moment when, for the very first time, you are able to look in the mirror and genuinely like the whole person looking back at you. I'm telling you the truth. That is the moment when you really start living.

Originally Posted by psykbutch

So my question comes from this scenario as written above "the way her arm encircles my waist when we are walking through a crowd." Now if my butch girlfriend did that to me, that would be hot!

Tell her. If you are challenged to find the right words, print that post and show it to her.

Originally Posted by psykbutch

Being in a butch-butch relationship has turned up some threats to masculinity, like in pictures, she doesn't like it when I have my arm over her shoulder, because it makes her feel less butch. Well then I feel less butch.
I'm sure this is why someone would question a butch-butch relationship, but its so worth it lol!

I don't want to say I have a submissive side. I might, but it can't be considered feminine. I wanna know how other butches feel about these tight areas (if I have described it enough)...hopefully this is all still on topic

take care

So I'm not the best person to give advice on butch-butch relationships but consider this....



What I would say is that once you become more secure in yourself some of that shit won't matter anymore. There are so many things in every day life that do not need gender assignment but we force them anyway because we feel like it what we need to have to establish our own identities.

What you are really talking about right there is this right?.....The refusal of a common gesture of love and tenderness, the feeling of belonging to and giving of one heart to another because it violates some ingrained belief of male and femaleness?

*Blinks

Originally Posted by psykbutch

Funny we just got into it yesterday over this and my girlfriend said I make her feel like more of a femme, which is upsetting to her as a butch. I'm thinking it's due to my insecurities, because the second you try to 'pin' submissiveness on me lol, my mind goes "hey now wait a minute". Who knows maybe I just don't know how to be a dom. Or maybe I am submissive, or both...its going to be a freakin enigma to me for awhile it looks like.

Maybe I missed it someplace in your posts. Are the two of you in a BDSM relationship? Because that is where the terms Dominant and submissive come from in the way that you are using them. D/s is not for everyone nor is it a naturally progressive state from one type of relationship to another. Neither role is specific to a gender.

[psykftm]

Heya you said:

Originally Posted by Wolfsong

Know what? I used to have this friend that whenever anyone ever asked her whether she was butch or not she would smile and say, "I'm not anything. I'm just me." At the time I guess you can say I didn't get it completely. The truth is I wasn't thinking about it anymore than if someone had asked her, "Why do you like that shirt?" and she replied; "I dunno. I just do."

lol my girlfriend is like that. "I'm just Dee".

You said:
"I was set free when I had arrived in a place where people actually used male pronouns for me. Once that gate was open I was off through like a wolf that had been caught in a pen it's whole life."

You're probably right, I have this guy at work that calls me sir, and that kinda thing helps, I don't really know why though.

You said:
"What I would tell you is this. When I stopped looking for the perfect label I found myself. That perfect label, the perfect description for others, will stop you from being all of who you are. Don't waste time. There will be a moment when, for the very first time, you are able to look in the mirror and genuinely like the whole person looking back at you. I'm telling you the truth. That is the moment when you really start living."

Really good description. I mean my girlfriend was really into femmes, but I don't think she looked to label me as butch, she liked who I was. I want to somehow balance being proud to be a butch with not relying on the label so much

You said:
Tell her. If you are challenged to find the right words, print that post and show it to her.

and you also said:
Maybe I missed it someplace in your posts. Are the two of you in a BDSM relationship? Because that is where the terms Dominant and submissive come from in the way that you are using them. D/s is not for everyone nor is it a naturally progressive state from one type of relationship to another. Neither role is specific to a gender.

Well....I don't think she likes anything to do with bdsm, we might run into a compatibility issue. The only way I could really get that hotness off of being walked through the crowd is if the person...liked to dominate? Dee is really gentle...I don't think I am, and would rather be handled roughly myself. Oye...


Thanks for the advice...I do tend to just blend butch/femme sub/dom all together

[Ascot]

I've been thinking a bit about this since I saw this topic on the front page the other day. Rare is it that I actually consider what makes me butch because like anything other aspect, it is inextricably woven into my very fiber. Butchness is simply another thread in my tapestry. When a straight female friend was talking about wanting me in her wedding, sans any prompting from me she said, "And of course you can wear a tux." So a part of who I am is my butchness that it seems my being anything but doesn't even occur to anyone else. A couple of friends' kids who are certainly old enough to know I am female refer to me as Uncle Lise on their own accord and it just makes sense to everyone even though I am not male identified. Perhaps I'm fortunate in that I've known I was butch since I was really young and my parents were open minded enough to let me be who I was. My mother knew enough to buy me the jeans with the reinforced knees and the Converse chucks with no pink on them. She did clamp a bit on the sound that I made while playing shooting games with my buddies, but that was only because I was running around the neighborhood shouting "douche douche!" (you must admit, with enough emphasis, it makes a pretty good gun noise) Everything I do is imbued with female masculinity because I am. The way I smoke a cigar, the way I arrange flowers, that I love to cook, the way I fuck. Do those things make me butch? I don't know. I just know they make me, me.

[Wolfsong]

Originally Posted by psykbutch

Heya you said:


Well....I don't think she likes anything to do with bdsm, we might run into a compatibility issue. The only way I could really get that hotness off of being walked through the crowd is if the person...liked to dominate? Dee is really gentle...I don't think I am, and would rather be handled roughly myself. Oye...


Thanks for the advice...I do tend to just blend butch/femme sub/dom all together

Listen, there are plenty of people here with a lot of experience with BDSM (I am not one of them) that can help you with that and they are typically very open to people that are interested.

Originally Posted by AscotButch

I've been thinking a bit about this since I saw this topic on the front page the other day. Rare is it that I actually consider what makes me butch because like anything other aspect, it is inextricably woven into my very fiber. Butchness is simply another thread in my tapestry. When a straight female friend was talking about wanting me in her wedding, sans any prompting from me she said, "And of course you can wear a tux." So a part of who I am is my butchness that it seems my being anything but doesn't even occur to anyone else. A couple of friends' kids who are certainly old enough to know I am female refer to me as Uncle Lise on their own accord and it just makes sense to everyone even though I am not male identified. Perhaps I'm fortunate in that I've known I was butch since I was really young and my parents were open minded enough to let me be who I was. My mother knew enough to buy me the jeans with the reinforced knees and the Converse chucks with no pink on them. She did clamp a bit on the sound that I made while playing shooting games with my buddies, but that was only because I was running around the neighborhood shouting "douche douche!" (you must admit, with enough emphasis, it makes a pretty good gun noise) Everything I do is imbued with female masculinity because I am. The way I smoke a cigar, the way I arrange flowers, that I love to cook, the way I fuck. Do those things make me butch? I don't know. I just know they make me, me.

I was not quite so fortunate. My mom was forever and up until about 7th grade when I finally put my boots down about it trying to femmify me. In 6th grade she picked a bra for me that was probably not the best choice as it had a padded liner. Now, I mentioned previously that these things were big enough for their own zip code. It wasn't much different back then except......back then it was painful and humiliating. That bra ruined me for about a week. One of those cheerleading bitches yelled out over the lunch room for everyone to look at my boobage because I had clearly stuffed my bra. No real way to prove that at the short length I was willing to go at the time. I stomped out of there humiliated, and angry with hot tears running down my face. I didn't know at the time it would only last until the next unwitting target presented itself.

[Wolfsong]

Originally Posted by Wolfsong

Listen, there are plenty of people here with a lot of experience with BDSM (I am not one of them) that can help you with that and they are typically very open to people that are interested.

Psky -

Ok ......some of them. One thing is certain, if you step on someone's label around here you can be sure that several someones will let you know about it.



Don't sweat the small stuff in any case. Know what the real truth is? Being butch to you is whatever the hell you want it to be. Yesterday some guy called me Sir 5 times in a 4 minute conversation AFTER I stopped him and said Sir my name is Margherita.

What I really wanted to say is "Listen pencil-dick, my name is "Margherita Natalia Luisa panty-wearing Wolferelli. Did you not hear me or are you just really that stupid?" I didn't say anything............I wear boxers.

[psykftm]

I just got back from sawmill..its a gay community in florida that allows lesbians to come and camp every now and then.

I saw a lot of couples that you would call butch/butch couples via appearance...makes me feel like its not as rare as it seems. However, the couple who comes to mind with this...no way would I walk up to them and be all "hey, your in a butch/butch relationship?" I think they met each othewr and liked each other, and that was it...I get the feeling that they reject labels altogether..sounding more and more like the way to go..but at the same time I have pride in being butch.

I guess how this all relates to what defines a butch for me....part of it for me is my admiration/love for butches. Dammit I had a thought but I got drunk

[Corkey]

Originally Posted by psykbutch

Heya you said:


Well....I don't think she likes anything to do with bdsm, we might run into a compatibility issue. The only way I could really get that hotness off of being walked through the crowd is if the person...liked to dominate? Dee is really gentle...I don't think I am, and would rather be handled roughly myself. Oye...


Thanks for the advice...I do tend to just blend butch/femme sub/dom all together

Here's a bit of information, unsolicited...Never assume Identities, relationships and or Domance, within a community. We have Femmes who are Doms, and boi's/boys who are subs. This whole subject has it's own thread.

Here is one. Click on Forums on the front page and happy exploring, and welcome to the Planet. http://www.butchfemmeplanet.com/foru...read.php?t=970